Message in a Bottle

Old 09-12-2011, 11:47 AM
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Message in a Bottle

Hi - I am new to this forum so apologies if I overstepped protocol... I was drawn in and responded to another woman's posting about her engagement. I too am engaged, to a currently recovering addict. Frankly, I wanted to put quotes around "recovering," which would have just been sarcastic and not fair. But truth is, a month ago he was using, and six months prior to that he stopped a seven-month relapse. When we met, less than two years ago, he had just come off what I hear was a bad streak, a couple of years' long. And he has been in and out of treatment and programs for maybe 20 years. I may have lost you with the timeframe here, but you get the picture.

Our courtship has been full of promise and other-worldly signs and affirmations. The good times, the connections, have surpassed any other relationship. For all along this ride, there has been something very different and special and spiritual between us, as cliche as that sounds. I am divorced 10 years and dated a lot, but it has been rare that I felt connected this way. And I am absolutely not the type of person who NEEDS a relationship at any time -- in fact, I went for about seven years without anyone in particular, just dating. It always seemed easier to be alone than to deal with someone else's drama. Ironic, no?

He is a crack addict, a weed lover, and not particularly interested in alcohol per se, but during his 7-month relapse with me in his life, i watched him consume it with no off switch. (At that time, he said that pot and alcohol would be ok because they weren't his problem substance, and could actually help him stay away from crack.) Seemed to me that getting baked several days a week was not cool, and my therapist at the time said, "Um... he is RELAPSING, dear," despite my contesting that no, no, he wasn't smoking crack. Turns out he was, though.

I have tried to end it. Who would want to sign on to a life like this? But he is hands-down the most articulate debater on the planet. I would write out bullet points (being a very poor debater, I needed materials). I would gain strength from selected allies. I would refuse contact. Somehow he would get to me and remind me of everything wonderful about what we have, and how things will improve in time, be patient, don't throw out the baby with the bath water, and that no one will love me this way, and what would it hurt to give it just one more try. Eventually I see some glimmer of hope. Or, I tell myself I will walk away next time. I attend open AA meetings with him, listen to tapes, work with him to get his kids back into his house, because I see he is trying to get well, trying to do the next right thing.

He proposed, and I said yes, during a very bright and promising sober stretch this spring. Even as I said yes, I figured that I could always back out, or that we could just remain engaged, for we cared about each other, but how could I sign on to him financially?

He is currently sober, as I said, and going to plenty of meetings and therapy and working hard on his business. But at this point, after the months of the lies (whether or not he had control over them), I am always on edge as to what is real and what is not. He could tell me he had a turkey sandwich for lunch and at my core I would wonder if that was true. I know, I'm losing it. I am going to therapy and reading co-dependent books and trying to see the big picture. I'm trying to understand the disease and not take it personally and detach. I second-guess my defenses and deconstruct my intuition and let me tell you, I'm freaking exhausted. Because in my experience, it’s not just the USING that’s so unpleasant and disappointing. I have found that, weeks before the actual relapse, he becomes moody, secretive, anxious, unpleasant. He shuts down, shuts me out, and when I raise my hand about it, I get a full-on debate. Then I try to leave, then we talk about it, then I get photos and letters and really good sex.

I gave my post the title I did because I feel like a hostage, even though I know, I know, I know, it's up to me. When I am with him his personality is so big and intense and large and moody and manic and overwhelming that I am starting, more and more, to just want to run. At this point, when I start to say anything about taking a break, it becomes an argument about my giving up and my pessimism, and i start to wonder if I am just complaining or it's my abandonment issues or if I am cruel.

Each time we go in another circle, I lose a little bit of that hope, and the future is scaring me now. He says I am a pessimist and a quitter, etc. I say I need some time; he says, sure, we could take a break while I get better -- but wouldn't it make more sense to be together through the process? He says, when two people are in love, they don't leave each other and say "Call me when you are healthy." Then I feel terrible.

So I am sending out this message in a bottle... help. I feel like a hostage, in that I can’t open the door and walk out and never look back. But maybe that is the drama queen in me and reality is staying and fighting the battle for the one you care about.

Please, fire away -- I need your tough love!! <3
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Old 09-12-2011, 12:10 PM
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So sorry to hear all this. I saw your post in the other forum.

You've tried stepping slightly inside the doorway, but still listening. Continue to do that and he'l likely coax you out every time. There's a saying around here (and forgive me if i misquote it) but the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting different results. If you're serious about ending it, try closing the door completely. If you've made the decision that its done, you want out, then you should just leave. I wouldn't discuss it, answer the phone, read texts, make a "move out plan" etc. It sounds to me like hes very good at manipulating you. Addicts typically are 'geniuses' when it comes to arguing and lying etc. etc. If you give him the opportunity to, he will. for sure. and the cycle will continue. You've trained him to bank on the fact that he can be an addict and you won't leave him. So why would he want to get clean when he can have both?

Realize that you're better than that, that detaching doesn't mean you don't love him just like relapsing doesn't mean he doesn't love you.

It sounds like you know that its all in your hands. You have every ability to answer your own distress call. The people here will help you see how.

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Old 09-12-2011, 12:53 PM
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Welcome to SR! Glad you are here!

Originally Posted by bamboo38 View Post
He is currently sober, as I said, and going to plenty of meetings and therapy and working hard on his business. But at this point, after the months of the lies (whether or not he had control over them), I am always on edge as to what is real and what is not. He could tell me he had a turkey sandwich for lunch and at my core I would wonder if that was true. I know, I'm losing it. I am going to therapy and reading co-dependent books and trying to see the big picture. I'm trying to understand the disease and not take it personally and detach. I second-guess my defenses and deconstruct my intuition and let me tell you, I'm freaking exhausted. Because in my experience, it’s not just the USING that’s so unpleasant and disappointing. I have found that, weeks before the actual relapse, he becomes moody, secretive, anxious, unpleasant. He shuts down, shuts me out, and when I raise my hand about it, I get a full-on debate. Then I try to leave, then we talk about it, then I get photos and letters and really good sex.
Trust me when I say that I completely understand what you are going through. For me, the deception, the lies, the pain I feel when the trust I once had for my bf is broken time and time again, is the hardest part of it all. Regardless of how long the addicts in our lives have been sober (or working on getting sober), those feeling of betrayal linger for a very long time, and in all honesty I'm not sure if they will ever go away or if you (or I) will ever be able to forgive or forget all of the lies and broken promises.

And yes, being in a relationship with an addict is emotionally exhausting - it wears you down until you feel like you can't go on. I know the cycle all too well - the few weeks of happiness followed by the mood swings, secretive behavior, anger, and him shutting me out of his life. It's all so overwhelming.

The truth is that until your fiance really wants to change his life and get clean once and for all, the cycle will continue to repeat itself over and over again. There is nothing you can say or do that will make him change - he has to do this when he is ready and on his own. You are not responsible for him, his addiction, or his feelings. All of the guilt he puts on you when you try to leave is a bunch of crap - he's manipulating you into staying and enabling him to continue using. So if you choose to stay, the choice needs to be YOUR choice. Don't make decisions based on his feelings or your guilt - make decisions based on what YOU NEED AND WANT, and if supporting him throughout his recovery is one of them, then by all means stay. But if you are staying in the relationship because you feel GUILTY for leaving him, then you are staying for the wrong reason. You cannot allow guilt to affect your decision making process.

I know you have read this and probably heard it before, but the only person you are responsible for or have control over is YOU. Until you truly believe this and understand that you are powerless over others - their behaviors, feelings, decisions, and reactions - you will continue to feel the same anxiety, stress, and pain that you are feeling right now. You can't begin your own recovery until you have let go of everything you cannot control. You have to let go of all of of your worries, all of your fears, and trust in your Higher Power (whoever or whatever he/she/it may be). You have to let go.

I know it's hard to just walk away, detach emotionally from your fiance's addiction, but it is the best thing for both of you. This was so difficult for me to do, and sometimes I slip and react to my bf's addiction in self-destructive manners, but I'm human and I'm going to make mistakes. But since I have learned how to emotionally detach from my bf's addiction and the behaviors that come along with it, I have become a better, more stable person. I no longer cry, beg, and plead for him to stop - this self-destruction was killing me and I had to make a change - so now I simply go to another place, emotionally speaking. I find peace, go to an emotionally safe place, and block out all of the pain. Sometimes I leave the house because being away from him is the only way I can detach, but when I don't leave I simply do something that makes me happy - I write, read a book, post on my book blog, work on a painting, take my dogs for a walk, log onto this site or other chat rooms, take a bath, and so on. When my mind is off of him and his addiction, I can think things through with a clear mind and make good decisions rather than self-destructing.

No one can tell you what to do - you have to decide what you need and want, decide what is best for you. But if you want to find any peace, you have to accept that you didn't cause your bf's addiction, can't change him, and can't cure him. He needs to have full responsibility for his own recovery as you must take full responsibility for yours.

Hope this helped in some way...

Take care of you!
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Old 09-12-2011, 02:25 PM
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Wow, thank you for all of this. I am looking forward to reading these comments a few dozen times :o) and also the other posts, as cc88 said, seems that people here can help show me the way to be a better listener to myself.

I have heard that insanity reference a thousand times, and I replay it in my head every day. :o) Can't hear it enough, I guess. Do you know the Sheryl Crow song where she says, "I plead insanity, cause I can't leave, but I can't stay"? Yeah.

No, I don't provide for him -- we have separate households (both of us divorced with kids), and actually he is very sensitive about me paying for things when we go out to dinner, for instance. He is very generous, overly so actually. I actually make a conscious effort to avoid financial and logistical entanglements, because I have seen things fall apart in my time with him (commitments not kept, impulsive purchases, credit issues). In our discussions about the future and buying a home, I rationalize that I would do it so, if things went awry, it would simply be my place to keep. Um, red flag?

And artist83, I so appreciate your story and your empathy, and admire your ability to take care of yourself productively, to be able to make the better choices.

I grew up in an addictive household -- my mom an alcoholic, my dad a compulsive gambler, pretty much on my own. When I met my guy, he told me the situation on our third date, which I was impressed with and instead of running I thought, maybe this is my chance to start working through my past challenges. At that time, he was launching his recovery with fervor, and we had a lot of promise. Just saying... I've been around the behaviors all my life, and part of my guilt I guess is not wanting to dump him because he has an illness. And he keeps trying to battle the illness. Until he stops.

There are so many layers to it all... it's not just the act of using. It's the behaviors all around and leading up to it. It's like being cheated on -- the actual act itself sucks. But then there's the obsessing and the phone calls and secret emails and planning to meet and all the attention around the act before it ever happens, and then all the aftermath.
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Old 09-12-2011, 02:33 PM
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It is understood that the most accurate predictor of future behavior is past behavior.

You cannot fight this battle for him.

Is your state a community property state meaning that anything acquired, including debt, while married, is a 50-50 proposition.
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Old 09-12-2011, 02:42 PM
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Common law state.

Terrifying.
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Old 09-12-2011, 02:44 PM
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bamboo-

I definately feel that my relationship to an addict helped me to work out stuff from my childhood....

I also put so much emphasis on what people say that I forget about the behaviors of a person. I don't sense that his behaviors are matching up with what he is saying, or if they do it is not for a very long period of time. That was really hard on me.

I attend Open AA meetings to learn about addiction, but also attend Al-Anon for healing for myself. That program in addition to therapy and codependancy work has been very healing for me.

Welcome, and I am glad you are here.
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Old 09-12-2011, 05:50 PM
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Bamboo,

I had to look twice to make sure that your post wasn't one that I wrote 6 years ago. Of all of the posts that I have read here and all the numerous similarities I seen in other's stories I've never read one that seemed so close to my experience.

There is a saying that addicts do not have relationships, they take hostages. Your analogy of being held hostage really rings true. Even when an addict is sober this can be true if they are not working a recovery program.

My husband (former crack addict) and I were told by counselors that the only way that our relationship would survive was if we both worked a recovery program. I dove in head first and worked the program that I wish that he had worked. Unfortunately, as soon as we married his recovery ground to a halt. He remained sober but the "addict thinking" and mentality ruled his behaviors. I thought that I had protected my finances but it turns out that I was much more vulnerable than I realized. My relationship with my now ex husband has made my life very difficult and cost me dearly - emotionally, physically, spiritually, and financially. He charmed me into believing in him and putting my concerns and worries aside - using many of the same ploys/comments as your fiancee. I left my husband this past May and I've been hearing all of those comments ever since. It is taking every fiber of my being to resist what feels like some snake charming trance.....but I know that if I got pulled back in I would end up back in the same abusive and unhappy situation that I left. I adored this man at one point, our relationship was magic, and I just knew that somehow we were destined to be together.

My past created a lot of co-dependency in me and I found the perfect match for all of that in my husband. I was an unrecovered co-dependent when we got together. Thankfully, I've spent a lot of time in meetings, working the steps, and "doing the deal" and it has really helped me. My need for Alanon and recovery has nothing to do with him and everything to do with me. It took me a long time to get that.

I'm really sad that my husband did not continue to honor his commitment to recovery. I think that had he done that we might have been able to make our marriage work. Unfortunately, you can never predict what another is actually going to do. I believed in his commitment enough to marry him and he let both of us down.

In hindsight, I wish that I had protected my children and myself by not marrying him. It was a huge risk to take....a much greater one than I even realized. If I had not married him it would have left me in such a better position had our relationship not worked out. You really have to look at it practically and figure out what you have to gain or lose if you marry someone. It's not just about love - especially when you have children involved. My husband's children and mine are devastated that our family did not work out. It really is heartbreaking.

Anyhow.....I think that it is a great idea to give it a lot of time to really understand and see what you are getting into. I'm not saying to stay away from him because you are the only one that can make that decision.....just really reconsider whether a legal tie to someone that has a history of crack addiction and is currently using mind altering substances is someone that you want to align your star with......it can easily lead to flaming out and is that really worth the risk?

I hope that you will stick around....no matter what you do it helps to have a community of support. I joined this forum back in the spring of 2005 - back when I was only dating my husband. Everyone warned me to be careful and I definitely did not heed anyone's advice. But.....I've always been welcomed here and supported. I guess what I am trying to say is that no matter what you do we are here for you.
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Old 09-12-2011, 07:30 PM
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Lightseeker,
Thanks so much for sharing your story -- I'm sorry to hear what you have been through, but glad you have found this community -- and glad I have, too. For decades I have been a do-it-yourselfer, lessons learned in childhood, that I could take care of everything myself. I have never been good at asking for help. Like I said, I am at the point where I have been charmed by his adamant reminders of the good times, and my experiences with the bad so persistently downplayed and re-characterized, that I don't know what is what anymore. I don't THINK I have had the illusion that marriage will change him. I guess my illusion was that, maybe, we would continue to grow in understanding and patience and partnership, and that any slip would be a mutual challenge to combat together, as partners. Believe me, as I just typed that out, I wanted to slap myself upside the head.

There is no official wedding to cancel, no deposits or reservations. I have a ring, and all I have to do is hand it back and shut the door. See? Sounds easy, doesn't it? He reminds me there was so much joy and great times to come... and what a loss it would be if he never picks up a drug again and I gave up on him... How it would be my loss.

I am just back, tonight, from an Al-Anon meeting, and it was AMAZING. The only other one I've been to was just over a year ago. At that meeting, I had no patience, thinking that the people in the room were complaining, but that I had the CHOICE to leave my then six-month dating relationship. It annoyed me that I was sitting in an Al-Anon meeting when life is so short -- why did I need to be doing THIS, for some guy I've known six month? In fact, when I left that meeting last year, I went to his house, where he was passed out and, I didn't realize, was just starting out a seven-month relapse. That next morning I told myself I was outta there, and didn't go back to Al-Anon. Here we are, a year later. Engaged. Obviously, I wasn't outta there. Went to a different Al-Anon meeting in my town tonight, and it was fantastic. In many ways, because I knew I wasn't there FOR HIM, but for me, and for my past, and for my present, and my future. In one day, I got this inspiration from this board, and strength from the meeting. And all I had to do was ask.
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Old 09-12-2011, 07:42 PM
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Originally Posted by bamboo38 View Post
And all I had to do was ask.
I share this all the time:

At my daughter's rehab, the patients had to navigate a labyrinth blindfolded. They were told 3 words would get them out, but not told what those words were. One woman immediately said them, "I need help." The rest of the patients kept trying to do it their way before caving in, and my daughter was the last one.

Good for you, and best wishes to you
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Old 09-13-2011, 12:36 PM
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Glad you are going to Alanon! I think it will help you immensely. Work the program for YOU. So you can become a stronger healthier person.

He is going to do what he does. You have no control over that. But you don't have to be miserable because of his choices. His choices don't have to ruin YOUR life.



regarding this:
I have tried to end it. Who would want to sign on to a life like this? But he is hands-down the most articulate debater on the planet.
There's no point debating with an addict. Just say your piece and go. When he opens up his mouth to debate, just picture the sound "Blah blah blah" coming out of his mouth.

Because that's all it is.

Blah blah blah.

It's meaningless manipulative blather designed to confuse you and guilt you and convince you to stay.

It's YOUR choice.
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Old 09-13-2011, 02:07 PM
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Welcome to SR.......I'm sorry you found it necessary to find us but I'm glad you did. I hope you find comfort here. I do.

Good good good for you for getting yourself to an Alanon Meeting! With your background and exposure to addiction, I hope you find that the information you get from those meetings is liberating. It's not unusual to find that you need to go to more than one meeting group before finding one that's a good fit. It took me a few meetings before I found my "fit" and then many many meetings to begin to make heads or tails of the information I was getting there. Keep going back. It really does work if you work it.

Marriage doesn't make those problems go away. Personally, I found that the problems seemed to grow exponentially after marriage. That's when I REALLY began to feel as though I was being held hostage! Threats of "I'll kill myself if you leave me" kept me in the marriage far longer than it should have.

Addicts know how to play with your head.....and they seem to do it without conscience. They have an agenda.

I have found that working the program I wish the addict would work is doing far more for me than just helping me cope with the addict in my life. It is helping me in all aspects of my life and all relationships I have. I'm finding that it's worth it.....for me.

I hope you stick around. Vent. Explore. Ask questions. Read. Post. Learn. Share. We will walk with you. You are not alone.

gentle hugs
ke
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Old 09-13-2011, 06:31 PM
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Bamboo,

so glad to hear that you found an Alanon meeting that you loved. The first Alanon meeting that I went to after leaving my husband was a great feeling....I was there for me and no one else. I remember those feelings of resentment when I first started going....little did I know that I was the problem - not him!

Just remember, you don't have to figure it all out right away. I think that caution is the word of the day and just take the time to figure out what is best for you.

Have a great evenening!
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Old 09-14-2011, 07:15 AM
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You know, even when you don't know you know. You know?

He picked up last night. Even in the midst of AA meetings every day, group therapy, individual therapy, a new sponsor. Even with a fiancee who has one foot out the door. Even with his young daughter newly returned to his house.

At least he called to tell me. It's so sad, really. I know he feels terrible but I know now what I have to do. I was so calm, not one comment was sarcastic or angry or bitter... I just listened, thanked him for telling me, and said I was so sorry he is going through this. Then, in calmness, I explained how I can't be on the ride anymore. And he agreed. In the past I would have asked what I could do, could I help, etc. I knew there's nothing I could do except ask what he thinks he needs to do and if he's safe. But I am clear now. (Let's hope I remain clear...).

I was planning to go to him in a time of calmness and sobriety and discuss it -- didn't want to end it in the midst of a relapse -- but given the course of events, it was the right time. Timing is everything, like they say.

Thanks, you guys, for being there and listening.
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Old 09-14-2011, 07:29 AM
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Prayers coming your way, for ongoing acceptance of what needs to happen in your life and the serenity to see you through.
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Old 09-14-2011, 07:37 AM
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I was planning to go to him in a time of calmness and sobriety and discuss it -- didn't want to end it in the midst of a relapse -- but given the course of events, it was the right time. Timing is everything, like they say.
It's never a good time. But you know when it's the right time. It's when you've had enough.

My ex was constantly in the midst of a relapse. If I had waited for him to be sober to break up with him... it might never have happened. He was either high or he was coming down and begging for another chance. I finally accepted that it was about me, not him.

I wrote down my boundaries. I wrote down the consequences for violating them. And then I held myself accountable to myself. It became clear to me that if I wasn't willing to follow through on my promises to me, why should anyone else.

Be sure to keep us posted on how you are!
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Old 09-14-2011, 09:22 AM
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Originally Posted by hello-kitty View Post
It became clear to me that if I wasn't willing to follow through on my promises to me, why should anyone else.
Brilliant point -- thank you <3
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Old 09-14-2011, 02:59 PM
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amen to that......thinking of you. No matter what - I know that this can't be easy for you. Keep posting -we're here.....
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