First night after telling AH we need to separate
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 42
First night after telling AH we need to separate
Hi,
I've been reading threads on this site for the past week, and finding them both heartbreaking and scary and inspiring and incredibly helpful. Thank you.
Tonight I would like to share my story.
I've been married for 5 years - had our anniversary this past week. I knew when we got married that my husband's father and brother were both alcoholics, and that my husband smoked a pack or two of cigarettes and at least two joints of marijuana every day. I didn't worry about his drinking until a couple of years in, and for a while I found all sorts of wonderful excuses to justify and explain it away: "He is very tall - he can absorb more"; "It's part of North American culture"; "He drinks at home and does no harm;" "he's nowhere near as bad as his brother."
On some level, I convinced myself that "if I just love him enough, and make a safe home for him, and show him how wonderful life can be" - he won't _need_ to do those things. He only does them because he is in pain. (I know now how delusional all that is; I realize that I've been Queen of Denial for some time).
The wake-up call began when he started drinking in the mornings. First just on weekends, then on weekdays before work as well. Just a little whiskey in his coffee. Then a little more. Then came the times when he would get through 2 to 3 litres of Jack Daniels in under a week.
He also seemed more and more absent. He spent more and more time outside, smoking (and often drinking at the same time), or inside, playing online fantasy games. I felt more and more disconnected,
lonely and afraid. When I finally confronted him and spoke the words out loud - "I am terrified about your drinking" he replied that he "had been worried about it for some time and was surprised I hadn't said anything earlier."
That was four weeks ago. We have been to counselling a few times (all appointments made by me) and he spent most of our sessions arguing about how expensive counselling is, how it doesn't work, and how hard it is to make it to the appointment on time after a long day at work. He also claims that "his soul is so damaged it can never be healed." And he repeatedly points out that I have flaws too and he loves me in spite of them, couldn't I do the same?
I know I have many problems and flaws - just discovered how codependent I am, for one... So I thought, maybe he has a point, and clung on a bit longer to the idea that "things might not be that bad" - after all, he is rarely visibly drunk, he just slurs his words a bit, becomes a bit clumsy, with bloodshot eyes (sounds attractive, doesn't it...) But he still goes to work every day; he is still kind, and funny, and affectionate; he cooks and helps with laundry and tells me he loves me often. He is still at the functional stage.
But he continues to drink, every day. He seems to think that just going to the counsellor is enough; he has said he needs to "think about all this," and mustn't be rushed. Meanwhile every instinct I have tells me we are at crisis point and need to take drastic action - I have almost stopped sleeping, developed stomach problems, started finding it incredibly difficult to do the job I usually love (teaching), and got so desperate that I went to see an Addictions specialist (in addition to the counselling). The specialist asked me point blank "how far down the rabbit hole I wanted to go." I can barely stand how far down I already am.
But, according to my husband, it's only been a month since I "woke up" and nothing bad has actually happened. So when I told him today that I couldn't live like this any more, and thought we needed a temporary separation, he was astonished. He said I had betrayed him, that he could never trust me again; that if I "forced him out of our home" he would never come back. He said I was rushing him, and underestimating how "huge" it was for him to come to counselling at all. He said that if he moved out, there would be no incentive for him to change. And just before driving out into the night with a small bottle of Jack Daniels and his laptop, he started sobbing and said now he "didn't have a home." (But would I please leave some bedding out on the couch for him).
It's almost funny when I write it out.
One more complication - as an ACOA, he has already been through addictions treatment, 15 years ago, and even attended some AA meetings - so he knows all the language, and claims he has tried it and it didn't work. On the other hand, he never got a sponsor at AA because he "couldn't find anyone who was his intellectual equal." (Seems to me that's not actually doing the program).
I think I did what I had to, but of course I am also afraid that I have been cruel and harsh and unfair. I know that from his perspective, as the little boy who was very badly wounded and never quite grew up, I have just become one more person who hurt and abandoned him.
I'm not sure what happens next. I'm not sure if I just ended my marriage or possibly took the first real step towards saving it (though that would be a long, hard, uncertain road).
Any words of comfort or advice would be warmly welcomed.
I've been reading threads on this site for the past week, and finding them both heartbreaking and scary and inspiring and incredibly helpful. Thank you.
Tonight I would like to share my story.
I've been married for 5 years - had our anniversary this past week. I knew when we got married that my husband's father and brother were both alcoholics, and that my husband smoked a pack or two of cigarettes and at least two joints of marijuana every day. I didn't worry about his drinking until a couple of years in, and for a while I found all sorts of wonderful excuses to justify and explain it away: "He is very tall - he can absorb more"; "It's part of North American culture"; "He drinks at home and does no harm;" "he's nowhere near as bad as his brother."
On some level, I convinced myself that "if I just love him enough, and make a safe home for him, and show him how wonderful life can be" - he won't _need_ to do those things. He only does them because he is in pain. (I know now how delusional all that is; I realize that I've been Queen of Denial for some time).
The wake-up call began when he started drinking in the mornings. First just on weekends, then on weekdays before work as well. Just a little whiskey in his coffee. Then a little more. Then came the times when he would get through 2 to 3 litres of Jack Daniels in under a week.
He also seemed more and more absent. He spent more and more time outside, smoking (and often drinking at the same time), or inside, playing online fantasy games. I felt more and more disconnected,
lonely and afraid. When I finally confronted him and spoke the words out loud - "I am terrified about your drinking" he replied that he "had been worried about it for some time and was surprised I hadn't said anything earlier."That was four weeks ago. We have been to counselling a few times (all appointments made by me) and he spent most of our sessions arguing about how expensive counselling is, how it doesn't work, and how hard it is to make it to the appointment on time after a long day at work. He also claims that "his soul is so damaged it can never be healed." And he repeatedly points out that I have flaws too and he loves me in spite of them, couldn't I do the same?
I know I have many problems and flaws - just discovered how codependent I am, for one... So I thought, maybe he has a point, and clung on a bit longer to the idea that "things might not be that bad" - after all, he is rarely visibly drunk, he just slurs his words a bit, becomes a bit clumsy, with bloodshot eyes (sounds attractive, doesn't it...) But he still goes to work every day; he is still kind, and funny, and affectionate; he cooks and helps with laundry and tells me he loves me often. He is still at the functional stage.
But he continues to drink, every day. He seems to think that just going to the counsellor is enough; he has said he needs to "think about all this," and mustn't be rushed. Meanwhile every instinct I have tells me we are at crisis point and need to take drastic action - I have almost stopped sleeping, developed stomach problems, started finding it incredibly difficult to do the job I usually love (teaching), and got so desperate that I went to see an Addictions specialist (in addition to the counselling). The specialist asked me point blank "how far down the rabbit hole I wanted to go." I can barely stand how far down I already am.
But, according to my husband, it's only been a month since I "woke up" and nothing bad has actually happened. So when I told him today that I couldn't live like this any more, and thought we needed a temporary separation, he was astonished. He said I had betrayed him, that he could never trust me again; that if I "forced him out of our home" he would never come back. He said I was rushing him, and underestimating how "huge" it was for him to come to counselling at all. He said that if he moved out, there would be no incentive for him to change. And just before driving out into the night with a small bottle of Jack Daniels and his laptop, he started sobbing and said now he "didn't have a home." (But would I please leave some bedding out on the couch for him).
It's almost funny when I write it out.
One more complication - as an ACOA, he has already been through addictions treatment, 15 years ago, and even attended some AA meetings - so he knows all the language, and claims he has tried it and it didn't work. On the other hand, he never got a sponsor at AA because he "couldn't find anyone who was his intellectual equal." (Seems to me that's not actually doing the program).
I think I did what I had to, but of course I am also afraid that I have been cruel and harsh and unfair. I know that from his perspective, as the little boy who was very badly wounded and never quite grew up, I have just become one more person who hurt and abandoned him.
I'm not sure what happens next. I'm not sure if I just ended my marriage or possibly took the first real step towards saving it (though that would be a long, hard, uncertain road).
Any words of comfort or advice would be warmly welcomed.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 3,095
I think you are incredibly strong, wise, brave and it sounds to me that you are doing the best thing for you.
You are struggling with your work, sleep, etc... You are alarmed about his behavior, he is blaming you for wanting sanity in your home and trying to guilt you into letting him continue with the status quo under your roof. He has all the same excuses/rationalizations/justifications my AH has (AA isn't for him, the "not my intellectual equal" line is one I've heard sooooo often), you've told yourself the same lies I have (he's not as bad as ......, he's still functional etc...)
I wish I had had your strength and wisdom several years ago. Instead I kept telling myself it wasn't that bad and what happened is I became a mess at work, I became physically ill, my H got a lot worse and got physically abusive (while still maintaining the good image to the world which just made it all the harder for me to believe it wasn't just me being crazy)...
You are not being too harsh, you are being wise and smart and breaking the patterns of codependency by putting YOUR needs before his and that's a good thing.
I really appreciated reading your story and thank you for sharing it.
You are struggling with your work, sleep, etc... You are alarmed about his behavior, he is blaming you for wanting sanity in your home and trying to guilt you into letting him continue with the status quo under your roof. He has all the same excuses/rationalizations/justifications my AH has (AA isn't for him, the "not my intellectual equal" line is one I've heard sooooo often), you've told yourself the same lies I have (he's not as bad as ......, he's still functional etc...)
I wish I had had your strength and wisdom several years ago. Instead I kept telling myself it wasn't that bad and what happened is I became a mess at work, I became physically ill, my H got a lot worse and got physically abusive (while still maintaining the good image to the world which just made it all the harder for me to believe it wasn't just me being crazy)...
You are not being too harsh, you are being wise and smart and breaking the patterns of codependency by putting YOUR needs before his and that's a good thing.
I really appreciated reading your story and thank you for sharing it.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Right here, right now!
Posts: 3,424
Oh goodness I can relate to this post. The timing of the relationship and the separation are exactly the same as my own.
Have you tried and Al-anon meeting? Those for me helped significantly in terms of loving, relating and detaching from my loved ones with addiction. They were all for me, but they helped me to realize that I was an important part of my own relationships too....
Thanks for the post.
Have you tried and Al-anon meeting? Those for me helped significantly in terms of loving, relating and detaching from my loved ones with addiction. They were all for me, but they helped me to realize that I was an important part of my own relationships too....
Thanks for the post.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,243
Astolfo,
Welcome to the forum! Your post hit home with me as your A voiced all of the same arguments my XAH would present to manipulate me into acceptance of his behavior... it is amazing how many posters will post the same quotes over and over ... we call it quacking and there is ever a very long quacking thread that is always hovering near the top or first few pages of threads.
Your taking a stand for yourself and your own recovery and creating a healthy space is a great start and his protests that his leaving the marital home removes the need to change is a huge red flag ... until he comes to realize and accept that he is an alcoholic, that he wants to stop drinking (he does not have any desire to stop and his efforts are directed to manipulating you into continuing in a relationship with as little pain as possible for himself) and is willing to go to any lengths to stop drinking there is about zero chance that he will be able to stop drinking!
Statistically this is a fact... the odds are not good at all. 4 years ago my A gave me ALL the same arguments yours did and I fell for it hook line and sinker! We spent years with him trying every recovery method out there that required the least effort (medications, counseling etc) all the while he would closet drink, relapse ad nauseum. When busted he would bargain and negotiate to avoid in patient treatment ... it would almost be a poker game where he would ante up some new thing... at one time he had an addictions counselor, a pastor and an out-patient treatment program for weekly appointments!
Looking back now I am incredulous as to how blind I was and how my actions crippled him by my constant enabling and sheilding him from the necessity to take responsibility for himself and his drinking.
I credit this website and the many wise posters on here with my recovery and giving me the confidence to the right thing for all concerned in curbing my X 4 months ago. While he did crash and burn (he is NOT functioning when drinking and his life becomes scary and completely out of control) he managed to stop drinking on his own TWICE ... something he had never done before. He is sober now and back in AA ... the only recovery program that has ever worked for him long term.
For the FIRST time in his life he did this on his own for himself and not to manipulate me or others. Because he was alone he either drank alone (everyone else stepped away while he was in active addiction) or chose recovery alone for himself. He picked up the phone himself and called the toughest no nonsense sponsor he knew that he cannot bs and is starting all over again at step 1. He has been sober a week now.
Time will tell... more will be revealed. My relationship with him is over ... I am off the addictive crazy train for good but I will be so happy for him and his beautiful little girls if he gets healthy sobriety and stays in real recovery.
Every situation is different but there are some things written in stone that get repeated over and over and over on this website and in alcoholic literature. The disease is progressive and it is fatal... sometimes it takes a long time to kill the addict slowly by poisoning their mind and body and sometimes they die quickly in a drunken accident or taking their own lives.... and a few do recover. The ONLY ones who recover or those who choose to do whatever it takes to recover... and the path of true recovery is not an easy road!
Would a plan of counseling together resulted in his having a Eureka moment and sobriety? Doesn't sound like it and it sure didn't work in my case and that is why I shared my personal story.
Take care of you during this time! Learn all you can about the disease and co-dependency with this website stickies, books recommended, Al-anon... but most importantly try to detach and have some fun. Have you a neglected hobby? Friends you haven't seen in a while? Find something that you love and try to make it a part of your recovery.
It does get better! Really!
Welcome to the forum! Your post hit home with me as your A voiced all of the same arguments my XAH would present to manipulate me into acceptance of his behavior... it is amazing how many posters will post the same quotes over and over ... we call it quacking and there is ever a very long quacking thread that is always hovering near the top or first few pages of threads.
Your taking a stand for yourself and your own recovery and creating a healthy space is a great start and his protests that his leaving the marital home removes the need to change is a huge red flag ... until he comes to realize and accept that he is an alcoholic, that he wants to stop drinking (he does not have any desire to stop and his efforts are directed to manipulating you into continuing in a relationship with as little pain as possible for himself) and is willing to go to any lengths to stop drinking there is about zero chance that he will be able to stop drinking!
Statistically this is a fact... the odds are not good at all. 4 years ago my A gave me ALL the same arguments yours did and I fell for it hook line and sinker! We spent years with him trying every recovery method out there that required the least effort (medications, counseling etc) all the while he would closet drink, relapse ad nauseum. When busted he would bargain and negotiate to avoid in patient treatment ... it would almost be a poker game where he would ante up some new thing... at one time he had an addictions counselor, a pastor and an out-patient treatment program for weekly appointments!
Looking back now I am incredulous as to how blind I was and how my actions crippled him by my constant enabling and sheilding him from the necessity to take responsibility for himself and his drinking.
I credit this website and the many wise posters on here with my recovery and giving me the confidence to the right thing for all concerned in curbing my X 4 months ago. While he did crash and burn (he is NOT functioning when drinking and his life becomes scary and completely out of control) he managed to stop drinking on his own TWICE ... something he had never done before. He is sober now and back in AA ... the only recovery program that has ever worked for him long term.
For the FIRST time in his life he did this on his own for himself and not to manipulate me or others. Because he was alone he either drank alone (everyone else stepped away while he was in active addiction) or chose recovery alone for himself. He picked up the phone himself and called the toughest no nonsense sponsor he knew that he cannot bs and is starting all over again at step 1. He has been sober a week now.
Time will tell... more will be revealed. My relationship with him is over ... I am off the addictive crazy train for good but I will be so happy for him and his beautiful little girls if he gets healthy sobriety and stays in real recovery.
Every situation is different but there are some things written in stone that get repeated over and over and over on this website and in alcoholic literature. The disease is progressive and it is fatal... sometimes it takes a long time to kill the addict slowly by poisoning their mind and body and sometimes they die quickly in a drunken accident or taking their own lives.... and a few do recover. The ONLY ones who recover or those who choose to do whatever it takes to recover... and the path of true recovery is not an easy road!
Would a plan of counseling together resulted in his having a Eureka moment and sobriety? Doesn't sound like it and it sure didn't work in my case and that is why I shared my personal story.
Take care of you during this time! Learn all you can about the disease and co-dependency with this website stickies, books recommended, Al-anon... but most importantly try to detach and have some fun. Have you a neglected hobby? Friends you haven't seen in a while? Find something that you love and try to make it a part of your recovery.
It does get better! Really!
peaceful seabird
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: floating
Posts: 4,822
Welcome to the SR family Astolfo (and gbz)!
You have found a wonderful source of support and information. Please pull out the keyboard and make yourselves at home by reading and posting as much as needed.
I too had doubts and confusion after telling my AH that I wanted to end our marriage. But I had become an expert at self doubt. I had lost faith in myself to make good decisions (part of living with active alcoholism).
In Alanon, and here at SR; I learned that I do make healthy decisions. I can make decisions to take care of myself and my children. I can be trusted to make good choices. SR and Alanon gave me the tools to take better care of myself and my children.
I think the self-doubt after making/announcing my decision to end the marriage was more a feeling of newness. I was unfamiliar with the feeling of stating my intentions in a calm, rational manner. (history or silent treatments, crying, yelling, begging.....) It felt unfamiliar, BUT it felt good to be speaking up for myself and my life.
This is your life too.
Your life matters.
Your happiness is important.
What if they get better......What if they get worse...... What if you gave them one more chance........
Alcoholism is progressive. It gets worse if untreated. It does not get better, no matter how many chances we give them. My AXH's alcoholism progressed to fraud, loss of body functions, foreclosure, debt and more debt.
You have found a wonderful source of support and information. Please pull out the keyboard and make yourselves at home by reading and posting as much as needed.
I too had doubts and confusion after telling my AH that I wanted to end our marriage. But I had become an expert at self doubt. I had lost faith in myself to make good decisions (part of living with active alcoholism).
In Alanon, and here at SR; I learned that I do make healthy decisions. I can make decisions to take care of myself and my children. I can be trusted to make good choices. SR and Alanon gave me the tools to take better care of myself and my children.
I think the self-doubt after making/announcing my decision to end the marriage was more a feeling of newness. I was unfamiliar with the feeling of stating my intentions in a calm, rational manner. (history or silent treatments, crying, yelling, begging.....) It felt unfamiliar, BUT it felt good to be speaking up for myself and my life.
This is your life too.
Your life matters.
Your happiness is important.
What if they get better......What if they get worse...... What if you gave them one more chance........
Alcoholism is progressive. It gets worse if untreated. It does not get better, no matter how many chances we give them. My AXH's alcoholism progressed to fraud, loss of body functions, foreclosure, debt and more debt.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: California
Posts: 693
Hi Astolfo,
I'm sending you a big hug. What you've done is very brave and loving to both yourself and your husband. Good on you for taking action. I can relate to so much of your story!
I told my husband of 16 years I wanted to separate four months ago. I urge you to have a very specific plan for your separation and stick to it, no matter what. For a few weeks this summer, my AH sort of 'oozed' back into our family home. BIG mistake on my part. He was not drinking, or so he said, but as he got more comfortable I could tell that nothing had changed. Separating the second time was far more painful, messy, difficult.
I love your addictions counselor's question about how far down the rabbit hole are you willing to go. That is so right on. Alcoholism is a black hole that sucks all surrounding matter into it, us included. I let myself circle down into that rabbit hole and now I'm working hard to scramble back out. I am reading "Codependent No More" and there is a lot of good stuff there --- highly suggest reading it. In particular, the chapter about detachment has been very helpful.
Hang in there, and take very good care of yourself. Try to put together a few friends who can be supportive and know what is going on. I have a buddy who is a longtime AA member, and I call her often for advice. Al-anon is very helpful. Also read as much as you can get your hands on about alcoholism. I found that being educated helps me a lot as I can see through the craziness a little better.
I'm sending you a big hug. What you've done is very brave and loving to both yourself and your husband. Good on you for taking action. I can relate to so much of your story!
I told my husband of 16 years I wanted to separate four months ago. I urge you to have a very specific plan for your separation and stick to it, no matter what. For a few weeks this summer, my AH sort of 'oozed' back into our family home. BIG mistake on my part. He was not drinking, or so he said, but as he got more comfortable I could tell that nothing had changed. Separating the second time was far more painful, messy, difficult.
I love your addictions counselor's question about how far down the rabbit hole are you willing to go. That is so right on. Alcoholism is a black hole that sucks all surrounding matter into it, us included. I let myself circle down into that rabbit hole and now I'm working hard to scramble back out. I am reading "Codependent No More" and there is a lot of good stuff there --- highly suggest reading it. In particular, the chapter about detachment has been very helpful.
Hang in there, and take very good care of yourself. Try to put together a few friends who can be supportive and know what is going on. I have a buddy who is a longtime AA member, and I call her often for advice. Al-anon is very helpful. Also read as much as you can get your hands on about alcoholism. I found that being educated helps me a lot as I can see through the craziness a little better.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 42
Thank you
Thank you all for your generosity and support. One of the happier things to come out of all the suffering is the realization that when you reach out honestly, people almost always respond with amazing kindness. Although my troubles are far from over, I am feeling oddly blessed today, by the friends and family who are standing by me, and by the new friends I am finding on this site.
It is a humbling and life-affirming experience.
It is a humbling and life-affirming experience.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 42
Thank you soaring spirits!
I am going to my first Al Anon meeting tomorrow night, and I have picked up a bagful of books on addiction and co-dependency from the library - will order "CoDependent No More" as well.
I am going to my first Al Anon meeting tomorrow night, and I have picked up a bagful of books on addiction and co-dependency from the library - will order "CoDependent No More" as well.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Kansas
Posts: 10,182
Originally Posted by Astolfo 
Thank you soaring spirits!
I am going to my first Al Anon meeting tomorrow night, and I have picked up a bagful of books on addiction and co-dependency from the library - will order "CoDependent No More" as well.
I am going to my first Al Anon meeting tomorrow night, and I have picked up a bagful of books on addiction and co-dependency from the library - will order "CoDependent No More" as well.
Sending you hugs of support!
Member
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Memphis, TN
Posts: 2,884
Originally Posted by gbz
with regards to a plan on the separation,
i left suddenly one Monday morning after hours of Sunday night verbal abuse . I went back 1 week after to get more clothes and to check on my cats ( my babies really) and it was like re opening a healing wound. no alcohol around .
I left our apt to him, i walked out and now live in a guest room.
what time frame is reasonable? a month is around the corner, what now? do i get an apt , retrieve my babies or get legal and boot him out . how do i know going back wont be a mistake? can an alcoholic just stop drinking with cpl AA meetings?
im losing my mind on the verge of hiring a PI to surveillance to confirm .
it s just i dont know, now what ??
i left suddenly one Monday morning after hours of Sunday night verbal abuse . I went back 1 week after to get more clothes and to check on my cats ( my babies really) and it was like re opening a healing wound. no alcohol around .
I left our apt to him, i walked out and now live in a guest room.
what time frame is reasonable? a month is around the corner, what now? do i get an apt , retrieve my babies or get legal and boot him out . how do i know going back wont be a mistake? can an alcoholic just stop drinking with cpl AA meetings?
im losing my mind on the verge of hiring a PI to surveillance to confirm .
it s just i dont know, now what ??
What I did was to start working on my recovery. Her life is her's. My life is mine. I continued to read and post here and started attending Al-Anon meetings. I have made a huge effort to clean up my side of the street and not worry about what was happening elsewhere. It worked. I am in a much better place than I was 6 months ago. I am centered, I have a relationship with myself, which I haven't had in a long time, I have a good attitude and life is good. I have given up on trying to control other people places and things and work on controlling what I can. That is how I choose to react to what is going on around and in me and my attitudes. You will hear it here and at Al-anon that happiness is an inside job and for me that is the truth. Al-anon has given me the tools and support on how to use them to get my life back together again and to be happy.
I would strongly recommend reading Codependent No More and starting to attend some Al-anon meetings. Try several as they each have a different flavor and dynamic to them. I have 2 different meetings that I attend on a regular basis.
Be kind to yourself and take it easy. You don't have to make a decision today.
Your friend,
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