That chicken is drunk!
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: California
Posts: 377
That chicken is drunk!
I was just commenting on a post about what food you crave since you been sober and what not.
Well it brought up a question for me after I posted on it.
See I love to cook. I'm the type of person who will spend hours and hours preparing a awesome meal for people, and present it in a fashion where some say it to pretty to eat. Cooking has always been a passion of mine.
So heres my question. Would cooking with a wine, or a bourbon be considered relapsing (after eating it of course)? Like a nice bourbon chicken, or making a red wine sauce of sorts? What are your thoughts on this? I ask because some of the best food uses alcohol in the mix with it. Not in a way that your going to get drunk while eating it lol, but ya know.
-Ryan
Well it brought up a question for me after I posted on it.
See I love to cook. I'm the type of person who will spend hours and hours preparing a awesome meal for people, and present it in a fashion where some say it to pretty to eat. Cooking has always been a passion of mine.
So heres my question. Would cooking with a wine, or a bourbon be considered relapsing (after eating it of course)? Like a nice bourbon chicken, or making a red wine sauce of sorts? What are your thoughts on this? I ask because some of the best food uses alcohol in the mix with it. Not in a way that your going to get drunk while eating it lol, but ya know.
-Ryan
Member
Join Date: May 2011
Location: TN
Posts: 162
In regards to "relapsing", I would say that it depends on your true motive? Does it enhance the meal? Is there any other way to accomplish the same? Are you attempting to change the way that you feel by consuming alcohol in any form? I think that most of the meals prepared with some alcohol (cooked, not served with) has such little concentration that it likely would have no effect... here's the always lurking BUT...
Why chance it? I make it a point not to order foods that are prepared with alcohol of any form. I don't cook them (partially b/c I don't cook) and I don't order them off the menu if it's obvious. I'm sure I've ate something that had alcohol w/o my knowledge, but then it doesn't hurt me, does it? My fear is that my old compulsive thinking will kick in...
"Well, I ate that bourbon steak the other night and it didn't bother me at all...so, I can have a beer with my meal tonight. No problem."
Yes, it is a problem and it may sound crazy to some, but that is exactly the way that my alcoholic mind works, if I let it.
Why chance it? I make it a point not to order foods that are prepared with alcohol of any form. I don't cook them (partially b/c I don't cook) and I don't order them off the menu if it's obvious. I'm sure I've ate something that had alcohol w/o my knowledge, but then it doesn't hurt me, does it? My fear is that my old compulsive thinking will kick in...
"Well, I ate that bourbon steak the other night and it didn't bother me at all...so, I can have a beer with my meal tonight. No problem."
Yes, it is a problem and it may sound crazy to some, but that is exactly the way that my alcoholic mind works, if I let it.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Portland
Posts: 1,631
Ahh, but the alcohol cooks out right? So the flavorings are irrelevant. I hope. I will wait for an expert to chime in, but I know the alcohol cooks out. It does!
I will want coq au vin. And I would love your bourbon chicken recipe. I suppose we could us an abstract, but heck, vanilla has alcohol in it.
I will want coq au vin. And I would love your bourbon chicken recipe. I suppose we could us an abstract, but heck, vanilla has alcohol in it.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: near London, UK
Posts: 582
IMO using wine or similar as an ingredient to cook with wouldnt be a relapse. Im going to avoid using it when cooking at home myself for a while simply as I dont want the rest of the bottle hanging around in the house but I wouldnt worry about eating food with it in at a restaurant - the reason I drink booze is to get drunk - ive never got drunk after eating mussels in white wine or a spag bol with a dolop of red in it.
Perhaps sherry trifle might be risky for some if its heavily laced as its not cooked out - not sure if I would risk that for a while but if I had some at Christmas I wouldnt think I am relapsing.
I expect there are many varied views on this - thanks for starting an interesting thread.
Perhaps sherry trifle might be risky for some if its heavily laced as its not cooked out - not sure if I would risk that for a while but if I had some at Christmas I wouldnt think I am relapsing.
I expect there are many varied views on this - thanks for starting an interesting thread.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Texas
Posts: 478
I had to give up cooking all together when I stopped because I associated it too much with drinking! I hope to go back to it some day (I was actually a caterer at one point and cooking was a MAJOR center point of my life AND identity). I personally am not able to cook with wine as it was my favorite thing to drink--if I popped the cork to make a sauce with it, there would be too many triggers for me...
Member
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Ontario Canada
Posts: 91
For the most part alcohol is burned off when you cook with it. Still not a great idea as you have to have open bottles in your kitchen. I would suggest just making something different. Great thing about cooking is there are always other options.
SoberOutlook
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 3,089
RR...I also am a closet chef, and wonder if I missed my calling. Someday, when I'm a fantastically wealthy entrepreneur, I'll have an eclectic restaurant serving my fancies without regard to economics...only culinary satisfactions of diners. Yeah...right.
Food tastes and preferences have changed for me when refraining from tobacco, alcohol and/or drugs.
With regard to alcohol cooking out, there was a link attached on SR a month or two ago that was to an article that the cook out is a myth, up to 80% of alcohol stays in the dish. Hate to burst your bubble, but it doesn't stop me from putting a beer in my famous chili, as long as it all gets in the chili, and none is served "on the side".
Food tastes and preferences have changed for me when refraining from tobacco, alcohol and/or drugs.
With regard to alcohol cooking out, there was a link attached on SR a month or two ago that was to an article that the cook out is a myth, up to 80% of alcohol stays in the dish. Hate to burst your bubble, but it doesn't stop me from putting a beer in my famous chili, as long as it all gets in the chili, and none is served "on the side".
Member
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 453
I guess it depends on how sensitive your body is. For some people, I know it doesn't bother them.
But the alcohol doesn't completely cook out.
I've accidentally eaten food that had been cooked in alcohol. I felt a really strong physical reaction and immediately started thinking about drinking--like I really, really needed a drink. I could feel the mental obsession coming back. When I asked if there was alcohol in it and realized that's what the reaction was about, I was able to breathe and find someone to talk to and stay focused. But it was hard.
I don't consider it a relapse, but it easily could have turned into one.
I know some people don't react so powerfully, but I absolutely avoid anything cooked in alcohol or that has alcohol in it (like cold medicine or mouthwash). It could potentially turn into a relapse for me and that could easily turn deadly. So I don't mess with it. There are plenty of wonderful ways to cook food that have absolutely zero percent alcohol.
But the alcohol doesn't completely cook out.
I've accidentally eaten food that had been cooked in alcohol. I felt a really strong physical reaction and immediately started thinking about drinking--like I really, really needed a drink. I could feel the mental obsession coming back. When I asked if there was alcohol in it and realized that's what the reaction was about, I was able to breathe and find someone to talk to and stay focused. But it was hard.
I don't consider it a relapse, but it easily could have turned into one.
I know some people don't react so powerfully, but I absolutely avoid anything cooked in alcohol or that has alcohol in it (like cold medicine or mouthwash). It could potentially turn into a relapse for me and that could easily turn deadly. So I don't mess with it. There are plenty of wonderful ways to cook food that have absolutely zero percent alcohol.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Portland
Posts: 1,631
Oh, cold medicine! Lots to think about.
We cook around my world (one of us was major at Morton's) and I love, love, love red wine. But I've never had a "hit" from anything cooked with wine. So while I am not planning any big meals any time soon, next time I need to cook with alcohol, I will. Then I will get an ice cube tray and freeze all the leftovers to use in the future.
Cause that bottle on the counter is irresistible to me. Absolutely.
We cook around my world (one of us was major at Morton's) and I love, love, love red wine. But I've never had a "hit" from anything cooked with wine. So while I am not planning any big meals any time soon, next time I need to cook with alcohol, I will. Then I will get an ice cube tray and freeze all the leftovers to use in the future.
Cause that bottle on the counter is irresistible to me. Absolutely.
bona fido dog-lover
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: SF Bay area, CA
Posts: 99,777
No, the alcohol does not cook out completely. CarolD has info on how much of it cooks off. But it's still there. It wouldn't bother me to eat food cooked in wine or something as I no longer have the desire to drink at all. But it's up to the individual whether or not they eat such foods.
Administrator
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Dancing in the Light
Posts: 61,502
Preparation Method Percent of Alcohol Retained
alcohol added to boiling liquid & removed from heat 85%
alcohol flamed 75%
no heat, stored overnight 70%
baked, 25 minutes, alcohol not stirred into mixture 45%
baked/simmered, alcohol stirred into mixture:
15 minutes 40%
30 minutes 35%
1 hour 25%
1.5 hours 20%
2 hours 10%
2.5 hours 5%
alcohol added to boiling liquid & removed from heat 85%
alcohol flamed 75%
no heat, stored overnight 70%
baked, 25 minutes, alcohol not stirred into mixture 45%
baked/simmered, alcohol stirred into mixture:
15 minutes 40%
30 minutes 35%
1 hour 25%
1.5 hours 20%
2 hours 10%
2.5 hours 5%
Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,435
it's alcohol retained.
this is the link:
Alcohol Burn-off Chart
here are some nifty non alcoholic substitutes for cooking.
Alcohol Cooking Substitutions - Alcohol Substitute Recipes
D
this is the link:
Alcohol Burn-off Chart
here are some nifty non alcoholic substitutes for cooking.
Alcohol Cooking Substitutions - Alcohol Substitute Recipes
D
Sobriety date April 19th 2011
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Salem, VA
Posts: 157
A couple of things.....
I wouldn't consider it a relapse if it's for the right purpose under these conditions :
A: The end product does not end up with more alcohol than the ingredients call for ( Like the Rum balls a guy brought to a pot luck at work )
B: The bottle is not missing more than the ingredients call for ( the 'ol sip to taste quality of the drink routine )
C: The alcohol actually makes it INTO the recipe ( Not as a time passer while mixing )
I'll ask an analogical question....
Would you consider weed brownies a relapse ? I mean it is a recipe after all. Just not as socially acceptable.
Only you can answer if you think that would be a relapse... but truthfully if you are having to ask I'm guessing in your heart you already know that it "Could put you at risk".
There was a pretty good joke I heard about cooking with alcohol a while back but I can't seem to find it.
I wouldn't consider it a relapse if it's for the right purpose under these conditions :
A: The end product does not end up with more alcohol than the ingredients call for ( Like the Rum balls a guy brought to a pot luck at work )
B: The bottle is not missing more than the ingredients call for ( the 'ol sip to taste quality of the drink routine )
C: The alcohol actually makes it INTO the recipe ( Not as a time passer while mixing )
I'll ask an analogical question....
Would you consider weed brownies a relapse ? I mean it is a recipe after all. Just not as socially acceptable.
Only you can answer if you think that would be a relapse... but truthfully if you are having to ask I'm guessing in your heart you already know that it "Could put you at risk".
There was a pretty good joke I heard about cooking with alcohol a while back but I can't seem to find it.
Sobriety date April 19th 2011
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Salem, VA
Posts: 157
Here it is.....
I DO NOT RECOMMEND THIS:
Ingredients:
1 cup of water
1 tsp baking soda
1 cup of sugar
1 tsp salt
1 cup of brown sugar
lemon juice
4 large eggs
lots of nuts
1 bottle Vodka
2 cups of dried fruit
Sample the vodka to check quality. Take a large bowl, check the vodka again. To be sure it is the highest quality, pour one level cup and drink.
Repeat.
Turn on the electric mixer. Beat one cup of butter in a large fluffy bowl.
Add one teaspoon of sugar. Beat again. At this point it's best to make sure the vodka is shtill OK.
Try another cup .... just in case. Turn off the mixerer.
Break 2 leggs and add to the bowl and chuck in the cup of dried fruit.
Pick fruit off floor.
Mix on the turner.
If the fried druit gets stuck in the beaterers pry it loose with a sdrewscriver.
Sample the vodka to check for tonsisticity.
Next, sift two cups of salt. Or something. Who careshz.
Check the vodka.
Now shift the lemon juice and strain your nuts.
Add one table.
Add a spoon of sugar, or somefink. Whatever you can find.
Greash the oven and wee in the fridge.
Turn the cake tin 360 degrees and try not to fall over.
Don't forget to beat off the turner.
Finally, throw the bowl through the window, finish the vodka
Fall into bed.
I DO NOT RECOMMEND THIS:
Ingredients:
1 cup of water
1 tsp baking soda
1 cup of sugar
1 tsp salt
1 cup of brown sugar
lemon juice
4 large eggs
lots of nuts
1 bottle Vodka
2 cups of dried fruit
Sample the vodka to check quality. Take a large bowl, check the vodka again. To be sure it is the highest quality, pour one level cup and drink.
Repeat.
Turn on the electric mixer. Beat one cup of butter in a large fluffy bowl.
Add one teaspoon of sugar. Beat again. At this point it's best to make sure the vodka is shtill OK.
Try another cup .... just in case. Turn off the mixerer.
Break 2 leggs and add to the bowl and chuck in the cup of dried fruit.
Pick fruit off floor.
Mix on the turner.
If the fried druit gets stuck in the beaterers pry it loose with a sdrewscriver.
Sample the vodka to check for tonsisticity.
Next, sift two cups of salt. Or something. Who careshz.
Check the vodka.
Now shift the lemon juice and strain your nuts.
Add one table.
Add a spoon of sugar, or somefink. Whatever you can find.
Greash the oven and wee in the fridge.
Turn the cake tin 360 degrees and try not to fall over.
Don't forget to beat off the turner.
Finally, throw the bowl through the window, finish the vodka
Fall into bed.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Land down under
Posts: 433
I work in Food & Hospitality Industry and train underage students to cook. We never use alcohol and always replace the alcohol in the recipe with a substitute. I have never had a complaint of the food tasting "bad".
In my opinion, anything that tastes like alcohol could cause a relapse and again in my opinion, anything that retains alcohol at the percentages that Anna posted is a relapse. (thanks Anna btw... very helpful for me)
Abstaining is what it is. Via whatever method i ingest it, I would consider any conscious consumption of alcohol a relapse...
In my opinion, anything that tastes like alcohol could cause a relapse and again in my opinion, anything that retains alcohol at the percentages that Anna posted is a relapse. (thanks Anna btw... very helpful for me)
Abstaining is what it is. Via whatever method i ingest it, I would consider any conscious consumption of alcohol a relapse...
Sobriety date April 19th 2011
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Salem, VA
Posts: 157
For me , I don't think I would have any kind of problem with ordering something that contained alcohol in a restruant. Especially since I most likely wouldn't know it contained it.
But I don't trust myself to make something myself..... Or to even have it in the house.
At the same time , I'm not afraid to use mouthwash but then I hadn't quite gotten to that level yet before I quit.
But I don't trust myself to make something myself..... Or to even have it in the house.
At the same time , I'm not afraid to use mouthwash but then I hadn't quite gotten to that level yet before I quit.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: I'm exactly where I should be.
Posts: 1,889
I could never cook with alcohol because I'd be right back where I was by the time I was doing dishes. Yikes.
ALTHOUGH, yesterday I did buy mouthwash and new dental floss because I can't get into see my dentist this month as I planned (maternity leave -not me...her! LOL)
Reading the ingredients AFTER I got home I realized there is 21% alcohol. Jeeeze.
I'm assuming that mouthwash is 'safe' if used as directed -swish and spit. I'm not planning on doing shots. But I had an overwhelming feeling after I read it.
ALTHOUGH, yesterday I did buy mouthwash and new dental floss because I can't get into see my dentist this month as I planned (maternity leave -not me...her! LOL)
Reading the ingredients AFTER I got home I realized there is 21% alcohol. Jeeeze.
I'm assuming that mouthwash is 'safe' if used as directed -swish and spit. I'm not planning on doing shots. But I had an overwhelming feeling after I read it.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: New England
Posts: 5,285
This is a pretty common question on here and I think its a question people need to answer for themselves. Since getting sober I have consumed dishes with alcohol in them...it hasn't caused a craving in me to go out and drink. I'm also a pretty good chef and enjoy it. I haven't cooked with alcohol since getting sober because I don't want to buy it...not because I think it will cause a relapse but because I don't want to support an industry I believe is disingenuous at best.
There are plenty of recipes out there that don't require alcohol.
There are plenty of recipes out there that don't require alcohol.
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
