vaya

My 23yr old AS is in court ordered outpatient and was ordered to stay with me. He has/is addicted to heroin. He has been off heroin for about 4 months and has been testing clean, going to group, meetings, drug court.

The problem is I've found him smoking what I am pretty sure is 'Spice' or 'K2 incense' . I've found a pipe on him and empty packets in his pockets. I've told him to stop and told him he can't smoke that in my house.

He's back to the old patterns he was in when he was shooting dope....lying, going through money too quickly, disappearing into the bathroom for extended period and smoking the stuff, etc. I told him that it looks a lot like some of the old stuff, but with a new substance and he should really think about whether of not this will help his recovery.

I also told him I would have to ask him to leave if he keeps doing it. I don't want him to have to leave again and I told him he needs to break out of the old stuff. I really don't know if this program is doing that much for him, in terms of really changing some old habits and ways, or maybe I'm expecting too much too soon.

What is really bugging me is that it's getting to me and messing with my emotions and peace of mind, just like before. I hoped he was more reachable now that he's not using heroin, but he really doesn't want to talk about it. He feels as long as he tests clean he's ok. (This stuff doesn't show up on drug tests, which is what makes it so popular.)

He's in the program for a year, (8 months to go). He's bored to tears, which may have contributed to his using, since he's not allowed to work or take classes until 2 or 3 months have passed, depending on his progress.

It really seems like the same old stuff all over again, but less severe. I know change takes time and I am glad he's not using heroin now, but feel really imposed upon by him by continuing to do this.

It doesn't help that his younger 19yr old brother smokes weed, but respects my rule that he not use it here.

Both kids were with their pot smoking, coke snorting, beer drinking dad for the last five year and were regularly exposed to it. Dad feels pot is ok, So I'm really fighting an uphill battle.

I do have some beer now and then, which I'm even conflicted about doing in his presence.

I have taken away computer use from him when he's smoked this stuff.

I know it doesn't seem like he's fully committed to his recovery right now, but is trying to at least stay off heroin.

There isn't anywhere else he can really go. Inpatient is full. I don't want to tell his counselor's on him. they don't really care that much. They're so inundated with so many court referrals and they mainly track drug tests, meeting attendance, etc.

I hate being in this position. I wish he'd get a sponsor and be honest with himself.

I know I can't control him or make him want to stop, but I am putting my foot down more about this situation. I told him I won't give him any money if he blows his GR early, which he did this month. (Went through about $180 or so in a week!!!)

I know this site is about what I need to do for me, but I still have to deal with the situation at hand.

suki44883

I'm sorry you are still dealing with all this. Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like your son is ready to stop his addictive behaviors, even though he isn't doing heroin at the present time. I imagine the only reason he isn't is because he is being tested on a regular basis. Do you think you can put up with this behavior for another 8 months? What about after that?

tbeit

Ok I don't get it he's 23 and the judge ordered him home to his mom sorry that sounds counterproductive. I understand he's your son and you want to help but ............ You shouldn't have to be in this position. I'm an addict and no offense but my mom was the easiest person for my addiction to take advantage of. He needs to figure all of this out himself if he is cheating and using he is the only one who will ultimately pay.
My mom always wanted to save me too I understand and admire that but it just doesn't work that way. Do you go to alanon? It might be helpful good luck

vaya

Suki...I don't know if I can put up with his behavior that long. There aren't many alternatives though. Since he's an adult the recovery place doesn't talk to me.

He is bored and spends a lot of time at home to avoid 'getting into trouble' and to keep away from his old friends. I don't really understand why he can't work or go to school while in outpatient. It seems like they're setting him up to use. They don't offer much..just regular, random testing, daily group, and meeting requirements.

vaya

tbeit...the drug court program didn't have any beds for him to go to, so they ordered him to outpatient and to stay with me. I had originally understood that inpatient was still an option, but he would wait for that possibility while he was staying with me.

Yes I know he has to figure it out for himself.

suki44883

I don't understand the not being able to work or go to school either. It doesn't make sense to me and I'd like to know their rationale for such a rule. But, if he's been in the program for 4 months, hasn't he gone past the 2-3 month period for not working? I'm assuming his tests are coming back clean. It all just sounds odd to me.

vaya

Suki...He was in in custody treatment for almost 2 months. Then he went to outpatient treatment. It's been 2 months since he's been in the outpatient program. I'm not sure if he has to wait 2 or 3 months from the time he started outpatient to work. They don't provide any literature or information to family members. It's a free County program.

I know if he was working or taking classes he probably wouldn't have started messing with the 'incense' stuff. I hate to see him just languishing and wasting his time. It really sucks!

It doesn't make any sense to me either. Every other outpatient program I'm aware of lets their participants work or go to school.

suki44883

Is there any kind of volunteer work he could do, like at a pet shelter or homeless shelter or something? He really should not be sitting around doing nothing. You know the old adage of idle hands being the devil's workshop, right? In any case, I understand how frustrating it must be for you, but if he isn't willing to consider how to make better use of his time, and if he insists on smoking that stuff in your home, you are the only one who can put a stop to it. I know you don't want to, but it's really not your problem that he has no place to go. If he wants to stay in your home, he needs to abide by your rules. It's really as simple as that.

EJG123

My AD smoked spice but it is expensive and eventually she relapsed to pot which was cheaper. I think your son is setting himself up for failure if he feels that he still needs to get high, but I don't know what your options are except to say that he can't do it in your home.

seacup

Sounds exactly like what I have been going through, although with my 23 yr old AS the ending is not very good. My son spent 6 mo in custody, released home to me and an outpatient program thru Drug Court. Yes, drug tests, daily meetings etc. BUT...he too was very bored (or just not ready), after almost a year clean of heroin, he started smoking the incense stuff "its legal you can buy it at the store mom"...from there he abused the prescriptions he had been on, and lastly back on the street. All this took place over about 3-4 weeks time. My opinion is to call his counselors, case workers who ever he has to answer to within the legal system.

I too was told that my AS could not work or go to school for a couple of months, of course I was told this by my AS. I have since asked the drug court counselor why? and was told that school and work are strongly recommended in the Drug Court treatment.

My heart reaches out to you and your AS, I know it is very painful to watch and see clearly what is happening and not be able to change it. My AS is now in the county jail awaiting a court date to be sentenced for 4-6 years in prison. This makes me very sad, but it is what it is, and today he is clean. I wish I could offer you an answer to change what is happening, but don't allow your AS to control you or your home...that is not fair to you. Be there for him, but don't make it easy for him. Trust me you wont be helping him in the end. I have been learning this myself over the past many years. Prayers to you & your son.

Kindeyes

vaya
When my AS was living in my home after his inpatient treatment, it started out ok but before too long, it became a situation where my serenity was disrupted. It just didn't feel good.

I think that this is a very true statement. A mother's love can take a licking and keep on ticking. At this point, I feel that my son is toxic for me and vice versa. It doesn't mean I don't love him, I just realize that we aren't good for each other. It's sad.

Is there anyone at the drug court program you can call to see if there are alternatives for his living situation while he's doing the outpatient? Perhaps an Oxford House or something?

I'm sorry that you are dealing with this......I know how hard it is.

gentle hugs
ke

vaya

Suki..I agree...he shouldn't just be sitting around. The program is very restrictive. It's ridiculous. I'm going to see if he and I can meet with his counselor and discuss alternatives to his sitting around and see if he can get cleared to work. It's a tremendous financial strain on me to completely support him. I only make minimum wage right now and we're all crowded into a one room studio. I have discussed the possibility of him interning, volunteering, etc, but he says they don't let him do that.

suki44883

I think it's an excellent idea that you and he sit down with his counselor. If your son is with you, they cannot refuse to discuss the situation. There has got to be a logical answer, and I wouldn't leave until I got one.

vaya

thank you Seacup and Kindeyes. I'm glad you realize the challenges of this situation first hand. I'm sorry Seacup for your son, and pray my son doesn't have to go down that road. This drug court program is what has kept him from going to prison. How easily they forget what the possible alternatives are if they slip up.
As I indicated in my reply to Suki, I'm going to go and meet with the counselors this coming Monday, since I'm off work that day. I hope to get some straight answers and find out exactly what the possibilities are that exist.

tbeit

I am so sorry for you but you shouldn't be the one tLking to the counselor that's the reason they won't talk to you. He needs to do the work to keep Him sober. He 23 years old and with all due respect as a recovering addict I feel he is playing you. I realize you only want good things for your son and everyone can see how much you love him but his addiction is stronger than your love.
Again I would like to suggest Alanon meetings. I hope you don't feel like I'm being too hard on you but I was/am your son and know that he is struggling right now and it is a crucial time in his recovery. He needs more then a mothers love can give him. The people at the county program are not going to coddle him but they will put him in jail. Unfortunatly maybe that is what he needs for his sobriety. Good luck to you with your recovery from this

Chino

vaya, I hope you do talk to the counselors and find out what their rules are. It's not ever a good idea to take an addicts word for something. Since there are privacy issues involved, please try not to mention your son at all when you ask. For example, "do you prohibit work or school at any time in this program?" is a specific question that will get you a specific answer.

(((vaya))), he was not ordered to stay with you. He gave an address and it was yours. You are free to tell him and the court at any time that your home is no longer an option.

outtolunch

Your consent to this arrangement was necessary. Your consent appears to have been unconditonal , given he was not required to get a job or volunteer. Putting ourselves in situations like this is right up our codependent alley.

You are giving an unemployed adult addict money and are aware it's disappearing too fast, yet you continue to give him money. He has no reason to consider anything beyond freeloading.

You are rationalizing his behaviors cause he's bored. Rationalizing is codependency.

Sounds like this smoking stuff is likely a violation of the court arrangement and you don't want to report him. That's enabling.

An alternative to focusing on him is to look at your role in all of this. Can you get out of his way and let him fall ? Recovery is not remotely possible until he is up to his eyeballs in the consequences of his choices/behaviors.

Consider it a gift of dignity to allow him to experience the consequences of his choices.

vaya

out to lunch...do you have children, and particularly addict children? Why do you assume I'm giving him money? He does contribute to the household. Yes he has a problem, which is why I reached out about what to do about it. I'm trying not to enable. Maybe I do need to be tougher. I'm not willing to run to the court or the program about what he's doing because I believe prison is not the answer.I'd like to at least try and see if I can reach him, lay down ultimatums, and see if he'll come around. Meanwhile, I gave him a few dollars to get through the next few days. he'll have to walk to drug testing and group for the next two weeks. Also, I didn't tell him to freeload, the court did! They restrict his right to work. He wants to work and help out with rent. Yes he mad a bad choice. That's what addicts do. But, despite the degree to which his old behaviors are definitely operating here, I am grateful he's not shooting heroin.

Maybe it's easier for you to send someone to prison than me. Does that make you a better person? I will consider what you've said, but don't like your delivery.

Justfor1

Vaya, prison is not always an answer for the addict. Prisons are frequently violent, have drugs and alcohol available inside and little to non existing programs to help the offender. Also there is that stigma of having a felony conviction on his record.
That "spice" or whatever is expensive from what I hear. A serious heroin addict will spend 100 bucks or more in a day. Giving him a few dollars to him here and there will not be contributing to his addiction. I know of a very highly recommended treatment program where the addict is not suppose to work/go to school for the first six months.

tbeit

I'm sorry vaya but I think your looking at this wrong. People die from "spice" and it would be really sad if your son had an accidental od. I wouldn't want to see my son go to jail either but I would rather that then what could happen. I really see that you love your son and don't want anything bad to happen to him but that is enabling. Your son is a heroin addict and that disease is progressive and fatal. Once again I am suggesting Alanon f2f meetings with real people you can talk to who you can relate to. I think sometimes on here things come out harsh that were really coming from a good place. I always remember what my sponsor told me "take what you need and leave the rest" and " the suggestions are free the only ones you pay for are the ones you don't take"