ACT10Npack

Didn't know where to put this so I put it here. If you have read some of my post then you know I have some legal issues going on and I'm here for some support like most of you guys. Would like to know how to deal with being an atheist and having a drinking problem? This was a big issue for myself and one of the reason I didn't like to go to AA. I'm willing to change and drinking for good now that my legal issues are showing me that alcohol can use for me anymore. But my thinking through god and reason has not change because of it. Anyone have this problem too?

FSquared

Read the AA book 12 steps and 12 traditions, step 2. We don't have to even know what it is, just believing and knowing there is a power greater than ourselves. Funny that step 2 is, no kidding, what is on my computer screen at this very moment.

I am an ardent atheist, myself. I will tell you that I do not believe in any form of "God" as I have been taught or understood in all my years, despite even being a church-going person for a long period of my adult life. I never really believed that. After a divorce, I redoubled my efforts to reject any form of power in my life except my own ability to control life and all in it. And all that thinking got me was a one-way ticket to the selfish, self-centered, egotistical, selfish life of an alcoholic *******.

But I can tell you that I believe today, without a shadow of a doubt that there is SOME POWER which is not me, nor any other singular alcoholic, which in fact is working in the lives of countless alcoholics living a true recovery. I have seen it in others close to me, even as I observed it from afar in my own "moral superiority" of denial. I spent years willfully determined to NOT say "God" in front of the serenity prayer and to stand silently protesting at the end of Al Anon meetings during the "Lord's Prayer" because in my mind I equated saying such things as professing a belief in the entity "God" of my childhood that I do not remotely believe in.

Reading the 12/12 on step 2, I read that we don't have to have a name, form or even understand what that power is. We simply need to put aside our outsized ego, resign from the debating society, and stop fighting. We don't need to understand it. In fact, I read last night that not only do we not need to understand it, but for many long time sober AA people, they transition over the years from having or trying to understand this "God" or Higher Power entity, to simply relying on the fact that their Higher Power understands them.

"God", "god", "higher power", etc...these are just words to enumerate the thing that is NOT US which we can surrender to and which can restore us to sanity. We just have to let go. And apparently it starts with giving up the fight in being right about all these "God"s we're so damned determined to deny are out there. I guess what I read means that it doesn't really matter whether "God" as we may have previously been taught in life exists or not.

Frankly, I can't believe I just wrote all that, but today, that is what I now understand.

I hope you find the answer that helps you stay sober.

P.S. You can find the 12 and 12 in .pdf form several places on the internet for free if you don't have the actual book.

Antiderivative

Find a meeting that you like. Find a sponsor that has something you want and I am not talking about a nice car, a good job, or a pretty girlfriend/wife. Work the suggested program to the best of your ability.

In a condensed form, AA is about:

1. Staying away from that first drink.
1a. (Trusting God for those who believe).
2. Cleaning house.
3. Coming to terms with your past.
4. Learning how to maintain your sobriety.
5. Helping others.

It is about having a 'physic change'--a whole new attitude and outlook on life. Its about finding peace and serenity through sobriety rather than the bottle. It is about living a life that is happy, joyous, and free instead taking yourself hostage and inflicting pain and misery onto your life (and others).

I was told that the only two prayers that I had to do was "Help" and "Thank You". Even as an atheist, I can do that.

I can relate to alcoholics who say "God comes from within". It is about getting in tune with yourself, developing a deeper awareness of yourself, others, and your surroundings. It is a feeling of interconnectedness. When I listen to alcoholics who talk about God a lot, I take God out of their sentences and see if I can relate to them. Surprisingly, I more often relate to them than not. I find that they carry a strong message. It is about find common ground rather than differences.

I don't carry around hostile of antagonistic feelings towards God since that is not spiritual. I just don't believe and I respect others who do. I realize that it works for them and happy for it. On the rare occasion that someone tries to force a belief down my throat, I realize that they are not spiritually fit and I certainly do not force my non-belief down anyone's throat. I simply share my ES&H and listen to others share theirs.

PaleMale

I too am an Atheist, and found it a bit of hard work initially to translate the words to words meaningful to me.

Initially, seeing my sensitivity to the same issue, my sponsor suggested I just use the AA fellowship as my HP. Since then my concept of Higher Power has evolved into genetic memory of our species and thousands of ancestors alive in each of us right now. The same 'ancestral spirits' that taught your heart to beat, see in color, and speak to others. The hero with a thousand faces lives right NOW inside all of us.

The voices of my ancestors, aka "the Great Spirit", wills me to return to sanity, for the betterment of my immediate family and friends, my neighborhood, and my world.

By turning my will over to this ideal, I inspire a psychic change, from negativity to optimism.

In truth, it can be even simpler than this.

ISPYSOBRIETY

Santa Claus, Unicorns, Leprichans, Mr. Rogers... I don't understand why people are offended to the point they would rather drink. If AA were teaching addition, one God plus one God would equal two Gods.

I think they help more than they offend and are worth letting the insult to ones self slide, focussing on alcohol addiction recovery.

RobbyRobot

Its all about our own understanding of Higher Power. What that Higher power is or is not is entirely for each of us to understand for ourselves. That does not mean we create or not create our own HP. It simply means that how we understand our HP is perfectly okay and totally our own business.

So, if I was an atheist, my understanding would be that my HP does not exist. Can I get my head around that? Yeah, I could if that was my rigorous honest understanding. Really. I can't say enough how powerful is our own understanding. That is key. The rest is just our own personal beliefs and has only to do with our personal recovery experiences and not the resolvement of our alcoholism, IMO.

I know of atheists who have absolutely no problem with AA Higher Power understandings and have wonderful sobrieties just as valid as any one else.

Rob

ISPYSOBRIETY

Other peoples beleif in a higher power, to you, may appear as an imperfection. Forgive them their imperfection while we all jointly focus on the greater common imperfection, alcohol addiction.

californiaguy

I have the SAME exact problem as you do, no god or religion. I do believe as stated about that the newer version of the big book addresses this and I look forward to the steps and learning a little bit more about a higher power.

You don't have to go all Pat Robertson from what i understand, you just need to know that there is a god, maybe a redwood tree, maybe the ocean. I'm struggling on this concept myself. Day 2 for me.

Boleo

Don't worry about it for now. I know plenty of AA members who are/were atheists.
However, many of them changed their minds after experiencing the promises.

Openmindedness and trust in the process are more important initially.

bellakeller

I just got too desperate and ran out of the time to mess around with the God thing and so just jumped into AA. Been sober more than a year now.

CrackQuack

The problem is to stop focusing on what you do not believe and focus on what you do believe. So what do you believe?
Stop worrying about the whole "god" thing. That's your addiction trying to block you from recovery. Believe that there IS a power greater than yourself and that power is alcohol (and/or drugs) and addiction. How long are you going to let something "silly" like being religious or spiritual bar (no pun) your path to recovery?
You do not have to believe in God. You do not have to believe in a god, goddess, or any other worldly being. Believe in the power of addiction and how it wants you so bad it's willing to kill you. Believe that there is power in numbers and share your time and strength with other recovering addicts. Let the rest fall in line.
Don't let anything get in the way of your recovery. I went to meetings, I came here. I got clean, I started working the steps and figured out they were not for me. Instead I got out and got back into rebuilding my life, which is what I wanted in the first place. I have a crappy job, a hobby that makes a little money now and again, going to school full time, and a loving boyfriend, family, and friends for support. It's all I need. Your path may differ, but if the steps and this whole "god" thing distracts you, get away from it. Go to meetings. Listen. Take what you need and leave the rest. Give back and allow newcomers to take what they need and keep the cycle going.

keithj

Here's my first hand experience with it. I was a life-long, staunch atheist who thought the idea of a 'higher power' was a crutch for weak-minded people. Booze took me to a place of desperation and hopelessness that I could not get out of. I tried with all my might and exhausted all the resources available to me, and still I was a hopeless drunk. And there was a room full of people who talked about a spiritual awakening as being the solution for a hopeless alcoholic like me. Those self-righteous, religious mother f**kers claimed that if I was willing to keep an open mind, and take the 12 Steps, I could be free of alcohol forever.

And I was just hopeless enough to have nothing much to lose by trying. I took the 12 Steps, with a sponsor, to the best of my ability. Where the BB said pray, I prayed. Where it said write, I wrote.

And the result was that I had a spiritual awakening which removed the drink problem. Gone. I rely on a higher power for which I have neither name nor image, and it works beautifully.

The last thing I wanted out of AA was any kind of 'god-consciousness', and it's become the most important thing in my life.

My experience is textbook for atheists coming to AA. It's described on page 25 of the BB, as well as a lot of Chapter 4.

Zencat

I'm an non-theist member of AA and have found an Higher Power(s) of my understanding that has allowed me to implement the 12 Steps into my life. As a Buddhist inclined person I found the direction I needed in approved AA literature.
So that whats I do. My understanding of "good" is inserted everywhere there is the mention of God in the Steps and the Big Book. I'm also a Poly-Higher Power person. So another understanding of God is AA as a whole.
My Higher Power(s) may or may not have anything to do with the supernatural...I really don't care. All that I do know is that they helped me solve my alcohol problem.

bigred95

try SMART recovery.

SMART Recovery® - Frequently Asked Questions

newby1961

I do believe in God because no human power could have saved my sorry a** from the self induced hell that I was in. I have been sober 7 years in a row so if there wasn't a God I truly believe I would be either in Jail, an institution or dead. I also believe that just cause some believe that doesn't mean everyone has to. God = Group of Drunks some use the group because all those people are more powerful. I think its just the willingness to know that if left to your own devices you are spent. And to disagree with another post you certainly can make up what you want your HP to be like? I know lots of sponsors that have their sponsee's (sp?) write down how they want their HP to be like? Like a loving, nonjudgemental, forgiving. This is what makes AA so great, no one is right or wrong, its your concept or lack of one and its okay whatever you choose to believe. If someone tells you what you have to believe I say RUN. Keep The Faith Judy M

cabledude

Clear from the answers you've gotten already that this is not a block if you want to do the AA stuff. If you don't want to stay sober in AA then jump through whatever hoops the authorities demand you do and then walk.

Or if they will accept it just do some Smart online meetings. Better for everyone if you find some way you can get the heat off without taking up space in AA. That would allow the sober people there use their time and effort to help someone who wants to do AA.

On the other hand, if you want to be one of the many atheists sober in AA, it's certainly available to you too, as you can see. Pretty much depends on what you actually want to use AA for.

nogard

I am an Aethist and have been an NA member for over 5 1/2 years. My Higher Power is simply something beyond me, I dont need to understand it or definme it. I just know that it is and that its a loving caring guidance in my life. My faith and Trust in my HP grows as I grow.

reggiewayne

I have been told that God can simply mean (Group Of Drunks). You can use the group to serve as your higher power until you find another one. This is what I like so much about AA. I have my own concept of my higher power / God. It has nothing to do with any organized religion. It is my own concept.

I can say that I have found my HP / God. I can't really explain what it is but I do believe in it (seems odd I know). What I try to do is think less and do more. I spent 20 years trying to think / analyze this topic and it has never gotten me anywhere. I am now willing to be open to my higher power. One thing I always keep in mind is a saying that is said quite a bit in AA, "More will be revealed"... Just keep an open mind... Best of luck to you!

Kjell

This has been a great thread. I actually do believe in God, but my idea of God is ever changing since I started in AA.

Reading all these responses has got me thinking - thank you.

LaFemme

This is also an interesting thread for me. I'm a deep believer in God and always have been but I don't use AA so I'm going to come at it from a slightly different approach.

Forget about God getting you sober for a minute...think about the love you feel for another...a spouse, child parent or dog. Let that feeling of love fill you up until it encompasses every cell in your body...feel so full of it that it feels like it is spilling out of you. That's God....if you can feel love you can feel God...regardless of whether you believe in Him or not