Farang

I'm quite impressed reading this forum, but the more i read the more i'm confused at this point so here's my situation :

- male, 35 yrs, 180cm height and 90kg weight, self-employed, living alone, unmarried.
- i usually only drink on weekends and it's only either beer or wine, no liquors etc, sometimes i drink also on wednesday nights on social occasions but it's never more than 3-4 beers.
- high tolerance, i can drink 12 bottles of 66cc beer and feel almost drunk but not wasted or blacked out ... i also drink quite slowly compared to my drinking buddies as i'm also a chain smoker.
- with wine i can get ********* drunk but it's a very long this doesn't happen anymore.
my biggest drank was when i was 18 and i drank 4 liters of wine in 20 hours without vomiting but feeling like **** for three days.
- when i was 16 to 25 i drank really like crazy during parties and dinners, often making troubles, rarely feeling sick but once in a bluemoon i had to throw up, i blacked out many times without remembering anything the next day, a few times i also smashed stuff around, but never got involved in fights despite the booze can sometimes makes me a bit loud and violent i can still control myself so to say ...
- never ever in my life touched booze in the morning, and it's hard to me to even think about drinking at lunch in most of the cases.
- if i get drunk it's impossible for me to drink again before at least a couple days, it's just repulsing to think about it and i can't stand the smell or simply the whole idea of drinking more.
- if i drink a single beer or wine i don't feel a strong urge to ingest a second one, it depends how fast or slow i drink the first .. let's say i like to drink for "meditation" slowly and with some good music and a pack of cigarettes.
- if i feel the need to go forwards i've usually 4 options : drinking more, or waiting 20 minutes for the craving to fade away, drinking a coffee, or eating something.
if i eat something the need for more booze immediately goes away and if i have some beer
left i often don't like to finish it.
- after i was 25 i definetely realized i was drinking a bit too much, or maybe i was just attending too many parties ? i've been always surrounded by drinking people anyways and i can't even imagine going sober into a discoteque or sitting a few hours in a pub drinking **** or orange juice, i would rather stay home thanks.
- during my youth i had a crash while drunk on my scooter and had not a single wound, no idea how i missed a wall nearby, i could be dead by now probably and this incident made me think twice before driving while getting smashed on booze again.
- so, slowly and step by step i lowered my boozing and limited it to weekends, and in any case i was getting old for discoteques and wild parties, even now i only go in pubs or places with decent live music where you can talk and chat instead of hammering your hears surrounded by drunks and druggies.
- when i'm not drinking i never think about booze, quite the opposite, i think i must drink less as i'm bored of wasting my saturdays or sundays with hangover or feeling weak and ****** for a couple or more days.


and now to the point : planning.

i've read a few interesting discussions here where somebody wrote that if you need to plan your drinking then you're an alcoholic in denial.

excuse me, but don't we all plan our life anyways ? if i work monday to friday it's obvious i'll plan to go out and drink on friday night or saturday, not certainly during the week unless it's just for a couple drinks.

and what about people following a diet, and don't we all wake up in the morning at a planned time, don't we go to the supermarket in the same days, don't we meet friends only in the weekend apart rare cases ?

i mean, i don't see anything abnormal in planning to drink just 2 beers, all my friends and colleagues do the same when the next day they have to show up in the office, and of course if they could they would probably drink more... but it's simply not in their plan for that night.

i don't plan anything when getting drunk on weekends, but it's getting so boring recently that i almost prefer to drink at home with music etc .. i started drinking home in my 20's when i got more and more afraid of myself ... sort of jekill and mr hyde ... black outs... troubles... rants and raves ... lost friends .. i had to control myself somehow and it helped me quite a bit ... drinking home i never made troubles outside and in the end i drank a lot less and reached a sort of balance where i know how and when to stop.

now i rarely drink alone at home, but i also never make a mess of myself, nor i get violent or black out like in my youth.

so this is getting confusing for me as it seems i'm managing my drinking a lot better than in the past, not to say i'm just social drinker as i obviously drink a lot more than many others, but neither to say i'm an addict or a alcoholic, unless i'm in denial ..?

so what you think, is it borderline alcoholism, heavy drinking, or what ?
all i can tell you is that it took me years to moderate my drinking and i'm horrified at the idea that one day i could again black out or making troubles (never been arrested or had a DUI, anyways).

if you ask me if boozing made my life worse, yes it did and it also made me lose my face many times, it made **** scared of my very self and it made me think that if i couldn't control myself i would soon die in a car accident or beaten up by bouncers or whatever other crazy things i would do while drunk.

(my life was a mess at the time and i'm also a bit crazy by nature even when sober)

on the other side, if you ask me if i can see myself living the rest of my life without ever drinking again i don't think so ... i like to drink, in moderation and slowly, i'm no more drinking heavy **** or liquors (they make me crazy), nor i feel any need to put down a beer after another just to get the buzz ... the opposite maybe true actually ... the slower the better ...

so this is my demon.
do you think it will "progress" and kill me, or maybe i won the battle, so to say ?

SSIL75

All I can say is that you're putting a tremendous amount of thought and effort into something that should be effortless.

IME, Normal drinkers could take or leave alcohol. It's just not a big deal to them either way.

Seeing as you asked my opinion I would simply say.. you are not a normal drinker.

JackNWA

So you're asking if we think your drinking will "progress"" and kill you or do we think you've "won the battle"?

I for one, have no idea. I can't see the future. I know that for me, I thought I had won the battle. But for me, alcoholism was a progressive illness. Always getting worse never better. Sometimes it would remain unchanged for years at a time, but eventually, my drinking increased. Time and Time again.

Farang

yes, indeed i'm not a normal drinker, that's why i'm here.
it never was a mistery for me i was always the one drinking more than my buddies
and so on, but i would like to hear some opinions about my actual situation.

(i've no problems staying sober for three weeks, i did it months ago and i also
felt a lot better, but i also felt it's quite boring too and that's why i'm back to
usual routine)

Farang

that's exactly my fear : will i manage to keep it under control like now, or will i start drinking twice and start drinking even during weekdays ?

i mean, if at 35 i never drink outside weekends and i can manage a single or a couple drink without craving too much, is it a sign that i'm just a heavy drinker or that i'm a borderline and that sooner or later i'll increase ?

you all say it's progressive but in my case it seems downgressive, that's what's puzzling me but at the same time i can't forget all the sh-it i did in the past because of boozing and i'm still scared by it.

SSIL75

I can only speak from my own experience.

I think when you choose to engage in a battle with alcohol like that then you've already lost. And I don't mean that in some kind of puritanical way. I mean it from my own experience. I definitely went from being kind of blackout drunk a few nights a week. To drinking more slowly (but for more hours). But it was all BS. It was bad for my health, for my anxiety, for my children. It ate up hours and hours of my week. Hours that I could have spent bettering my life or the lives of other people. It contributed to a low-level depression that has bogged me down for years.

The other person I know who has engaged in a long term battle with alcohol is my dad. Growing up he was a horrible drinker. Drinking for days on end (disappearing). Now he's older and I'm sure he'd tell you he's mastered moderation. 2 glasses (1/2 bottle) of wine at lunch. The same at dinner. A glass before bed. His day literally revolves around alcohol. Did he win? He sure thinks he did. But it sure sucked to have to tell his 4 year old grandchild that grandpa was too 'relaxed' to go to the park after lunch and play.

doggonecarl

Someone on this forum once posted "If you have to CONTROL something, it's out of control."

Or something to that nature.

Only you can determine if you are an alcoholic. But say you knew with absolute fact that you weren't, that you were merely a problem drinker or heavy drinker or whatever other term fits. There are risks associated with such drinking. Is it worth the health risks to continue? Will you be able to maintain hyper vigilance over your drinking to avoid all harm. Or are you going to roll the dice and see if it progresses?

The very fact that you are concerned enough to post to a site called Sober Recovery says something about your drinking.

If you decide you need us, we'll be here. Good luck.

shegirl

If you have to try that hard to control it then its a problem. I use to drink everyday but I stopped drinking everyday but it got to a point when I did drink, I drank way too much. Sometimes I could control it but sometimes I couldnt. I havent drank in two months and it feels like a huge weight has been lifted.

jamdls

I can't see the future for you either but I had a similar path as you. I drank heavily starting at 17 stopped completely around 23 then started again around 26 I just drank on the weekends, I always drank more than others but I didn't have a problem just controlling my drinking to the weekends or a special occassion mid week; in my mid 30s I again quit drinking not because I thought I had a problem, I was on a "health kick" for several years and had no interest in drinking; in my early 40s I was once again single and started partying again, again I only drank on the weekends and only drank wine, I did drank more than most but no one seemed concerned, this went on for several years then I started drinking a couple of glasses of wine in the evening a couple of times a week in addition to the weekends and then it got to be a bottle of wine alone a couple of times a week...I often had blackouts when I drank and the more I drank the more blackouts I had. I never drank in the mornings and rarely drank 2 days in a row because I would feel so lousy from drinking. During my last blackout while home alone I overdosed on prescription drugs, I have absolutely no memory of even taking the first glass of wine that day nor of taking the meds, and I spent a week in the hospital near death as the drugs had burned a hole in my liver. Alcohol scares the heck out of me as well, and I never want to be near it again and haven't touch a drop since that fateful night over 3 yrs ago. I was able to just stop drinking, never had a craving before nor since, did not need any type of formal program to quit, I may or may not have been alcoholic. I think if alcohol causes someone at any time to blackout then that is something that should not be risked.

Farang

well my father wakes up in the morning and first thing he does is drinking a half glass of wine or making a coffee adding some liquor.
he drinks very very slow, at the end of the day he usually drank one liter of wine, sometimes a bit less, with a nap in the afternoon.
this is his routine since 15 years, while when he was still working he only drank after coming back from job (first thing he did, always!).

i don't know if it's all hereditary but i definetely took something from him.
he told me many times to drink less and to drink slow, like him, claiming that "that's the secret" (drinking slow).

i don't know it that's really the secret but i never liked drinking fast apart when i was a teenager doing drinking sessions with my pals, it simply has no taste and makes me sick.

booze is maybe more like a drug to me that makes me more in touch with music, it makes me inspired and dreaming.
as an artist that's something i really enjoy, and that's also part of the problem.
but nowadays that's all i enjoy, no more blackouts or hard drinking, i've really had enough of that ****.

i never boozed for 3-4 days straight, i couldn't do it, the max i did was 20 hours and then i fell asleep in a public park and woken up by a cop in the morning ...

one thing is sure.
i don't want to end up like my father, drinking EVERY day, no matter if slowly or what.
if one day i'll be no more able to manage my drink i will rather stop alltogether, and that's actually no big deal but you see it's always on and off, up and down, and then if i don't drink then i start drinking a lot of coffees and getting nervous and anxious ... same old viscious cycle.

Farang

well, nowadays when i drink i take it very easy, almost like any other social drinker, with the difference that i can go on and on for hours if i drink beer ... in fact i drink beer instead of something stronger or i could get drunk too fast with wine or liquors while with beer you really need a lot.

i've quit many times for weeks, feeling much better, clearer, etc but really missing the buzz when i'm in social situations or listening to music.

music in particular is meaningless without booze, unless we talk about classical music or religious choirs and similar.

reality when sober is also quite ugly, after a hard week at work i really to let loose a bit
and relax... and drinking a soda isn't an option.

SSIL75

I used to LOVE drinking all day. Like if it was a day where I had some 'cause' to have a mimosa with breakfast. Champagne all morning. Wine with lunch. Cocktails in the afternoon. Wine with dinner. Cocktails after dinner. Like a drink per hour, all day long. It was my favorite thing to do.

I don't even know what my point is. Just that it's insane, maybe? To think that kind of thing is normal?

I guess I'd ask yourself why you want to keep drinking. I mean there are lots of ways to relax.. to relate to other people. Why are you fighting so hard?

Farang

yes, i've read that discussion too and it made me think.

it sounds good but we all have to control many things in our lives.
food, diet, coffees, speed limits, the list goes on.

years ago i drank too many coffees, then i had enough and cut
coffee altogether, now i only drink one in the morning and sometimes
not even that, and feel great.

will i do the same with booze ? never say never.
when i really have enough of something it's usually "all or nothing".

doggonecarl

That, my friend, is an alcoholic mindset. If you find you have to drink, for whatever reason, one day, you will drink for one reason only. Cause you HAVE to!

Farang

i'm not fighting anything, i'm proud of where i am now.
compared to what i drank years ago and the many times i risked my neck and all the face-loss i had to endure i'm pretty happy at the moment.

drinking for me is getting more and more boring in fact.
when you drink every weekend of your life it couldn't be otherwise.
sometimes i'm inspired, other times i'm just tired and drink for relax.

i don't always drink 10 or 12 beers, it depends on the mood, if it's
there's nothing new or interesting to do i can just drink 4 or 5 and go to sleep.

but give me wine and things get a little more dangerous.
give me liquors and i really get crazy, i mean really i must be allergic to liquors, that's really poison to me.

Farang

yes, that's the mindset, and that's why i'm here.
but my question is : as medicine consider "moderate drinker" someone who drink
just one glass a day or just drink at weekend/social-occasions, where do i fit ?

i've read dozens of threads in this forum but at the end of the story if i don't drink
i've no cravings, no nightmares, no obsessions, no urges for beer-runs in the middle
of the night, and i can manage to only drink one glass without getting overboard.

so, i don't see any of the typical symptoms of the average alcoholic, but i see something bordering it ... i'm not scared about the present, but about the future.

Farang

it seems your story is very similar to mine apart the final hospitalization.
yes i'm scared and i probably always will because it happened too many times
in the past, no matter if 10 yrs ago or what, i know i can happen next friday if i want or 50 yrs from now... if i drink liquors i'm simply powerless after a while, beers and wine are under control let's say but reading all the horror stories in this forum is really and eye opener.

SSIL75

See, even just reading your thread I would disagree with some of that. No obsessions? No cravings? I mean surely there is some obses sin or craving underlying drinking 10-12 beers, no?

And honestly I've been known to roll my eyes at people who drink 2 drinks with dinner every night and wonder if they are an alcoholic. I think in the US people are really quick to call people alcoholics. But to me there are so many red flags in your posts. And I've TOTALLy done the whole denial thing. So I can relate.

Farang

no.
it's not insane, artists especially were renowned for abuse of alcohol and/or drugs
even in ancient times.

if i wasn't an artist probably i would think it's wasted time, in my case instead when i drink at home i always draw and get inspired to new ideas that later i refine when sober.

i don't know how to explain, there's somewhat religious in the sinergy between alcohol and music, especially if you listen to ambient or classical music.

sort of self-meditation, feeling in harmony with yourself, higher state of consciousness as some say...

you simply can't replace it with anything else, either take it or leave it, as with drugs.
i never liked drugs, tried some, but never been a fan, i'm all for boozing and always will.

SSIL75

Eh. I had all kinds of reasons I was special enough for my alcoholism to be acceptable.

Turns out I'm just a garden variety alcoholic. Fancy that