My dilemma
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 281
My dilemma
My ex has chronic alcoholism. We have a 4 year old daughter and we separated just over a year ago. Before he left, he'd been mostly sober for 2 years with four one night lapses in that time. He has been to rehab, countless AA meetings and Smart program meetings (where they teach you that you can drink responsibly...what the???...he like these meetings of course). He has a criminal record due to alcohol related incidences. He's been taken to a mental facility twice and assessed. He was diagnosed with social anxiety disorder and alcohol related psychosis.
The problem is, I haven't been able to move on. My heart was broken when he left suddenly. (I came home to find him drinking; he had a psychotic episode in which he became abusive; I called the police and he was arrested and charged). 6 months ago, I met a "nice man". He is completely different than any man I've been with. My father is a recovering alcoholic; my mother is a narcissist and my siblings and I grew up in a lot of violence... due to my mother's violent temper. My father left when I was almost 6. This is also the length of time the three significant relationships I have had in my life have lasted. I am a spiritual person and I've done a lot of work to heal my past and reach forgiveness and I see the link between the abandonment, violence and alcohol from my childhood and my choice in men.
The new man has been patient with me; waiting for me to "get over" my ex and fall in love with him. I have been very honest with him from the beginning telling him I don't believe I'm ready for a relationship, that I'm still in love with my ex and that my heart feels broken into a million pieces. He says we'll take things slowly, but I'm feeling the pressure. The thing is with my ex, he is a horror to be around when he's drinking. (I had very strong boundaries when we were together. The home in which I live and in which I lived with him has always been an alcohol free zone...my ex always respected that over the years until he didn't and was arrested). When my ex isn't drinking, he's very loving, funny, eccentric, somewhat controlling (he acknowledges that) and is the most awesome, devoted dad. When we separated, he cut me out of his life. He continued to see his daughter on and off in between binges, but I felt I had no closure to the relationship as the break up was so sudden.
Around the anniversary of our breakup, (August this year) I wrote a letter to my ex, not expecting to ever send it. (He's read it since). I wrote it in order to get my feelings on paper as I hadn't allowed myself to grieve. I bottled all my feelings in and couldn't cry (crying was not something we were 'allowed' to do as children). In the same week, my ex contacted me and we met. We cried in each others arms for hours. I felt like I could finally let my walls down. We both still love each other and he asked if we can try and make it work, starting as friends first. He is still actively drinking and won't go to AA and thinks he can stop on his own....which I know can happen but won't last for long). I have gone back to Al-Anon after not going for a few years. I had always wanted a stable, committed, nice man, or so I thought, and I know I manifested the new man into my life. It's just that I don't seem to have the connection with him as I do with my ex. I wonder if that's because I'm so stuffed up from my childhood that I don't know how to do a 'normal' relationship or even know what one does or should feel like. Or whether it's because I'm just not ready or over my ex even though I've tried everything I can to get over him.
The new man is nice but I've noticed some things I don't like and sometimes his words and actions are incongruent. He's also lied to me on a few occasions and I can't stand lies. The thing is, I feel like going back to my ex in which ever way we can make it work. I know he loves me and he makes me feel special when I'm with him. I also know drinking is more important to him than me and his daughter (or is it? This is where I get confused, wondering if alcoholism is really a disease or a choice, or both?) And for some reason, I think I am more accepting of his compulsion to drink. I realise he may die drinking and that's something I was in denial about before, always quietly praying or fearful he'd start drinking again. For some reason a lot of that fear has lifted now (maybe due to radical forgiveness worksheets I've been doing) and I'm seriously contemplating whether we could have a relationship that works despite the obvious. I'm in love with an alcoholic and that's how it is...I don't know how to stop loving him. I like the 'nice man' but I'm looking for reasons to justify breaking up with him. I just don't want to be making a mistake letting the 'nice man' go and I'm worried that I may never have a long term relationship that works. I'm almost 40. You'd think I'd have my act together by now....
Any feedback would be greatly appreciated because I'm feeling confused.....thanks....
The problem is, I haven't been able to move on. My heart was broken when he left suddenly. (I came home to find him drinking; he had a psychotic episode in which he became abusive; I called the police and he was arrested and charged). 6 months ago, I met a "nice man". He is completely different than any man I've been with. My father is a recovering alcoholic; my mother is a narcissist and my siblings and I grew up in a lot of violence... due to my mother's violent temper. My father left when I was almost 6. This is also the length of time the three significant relationships I have had in my life have lasted. I am a spiritual person and I've done a lot of work to heal my past and reach forgiveness and I see the link between the abandonment, violence and alcohol from my childhood and my choice in men.
The new man has been patient with me; waiting for me to "get over" my ex and fall in love with him. I have been very honest with him from the beginning telling him I don't believe I'm ready for a relationship, that I'm still in love with my ex and that my heart feels broken into a million pieces. He says we'll take things slowly, but I'm feeling the pressure. The thing is with my ex, he is a horror to be around when he's drinking. (I had very strong boundaries when we were together. The home in which I live and in which I lived with him has always been an alcohol free zone...my ex always respected that over the years until he didn't and was arrested). When my ex isn't drinking, he's very loving, funny, eccentric, somewhat controlling (he acknowledges that) and is the most awesome, devoted dad. When we separated, he cut me out of his life. He continued to see his daughter on and off in between binges, but I felt I had no closure to the relationship as the break up was so sudden.
Around the anniversary of our breakup, (August this year) I wrote a letter to my ex, not expecting to ever send it. (He's read it since). I wrote it in order to get my feelings on paper as I hadn't allowed myself to grieve. I bottled all my feelings in and couldn't cry (crying was not something we were 'allowed' to do as children). In the same week, my ex contacted me and we met. We cried in each others arms for hours. I felt like I could finally let my walls down. We both still love each other and he asked if we can try and make it work, starting as friends first. He is still actively drinking and won't go to AA and thinks he can stop on his own....which I know can happen but won't last for long). I have gone back to Al-Anon after not going for a few years. I had always wanted a stable, committed, nice man, or so I thought, and I know I manifested the new man into my life. It's just that I don't seem to have the connection with him as I do with my ex. I wonder if that's because I'm so stuffed up from my childhood that I don't know how to do a 'normal' relationship or even know what one does or should feel like. Or whether it's because I'm just not ready or over my ex even though I've tried everything I can to get over him.
The new man is nice but I've noticed some things I don't like and sometimes his words and actions are incongruent. He's also lied to me on a few occasions and I can't stand lies. The thing is, I feel like going back to my ex in which ever way we can make it work. I know he loves me and he makes me feel special when I'm with him. I also know drinking is more important to him than me and his daughter (or is it? This is where I get confused, wondering if alcoholism is really a disease or a choice, or both?) And for some reason, I think I am more accepting of his compulsion to drink. I realise he may die drinking and that's something I was in denial about before, always quietly praying or fearful he'd start drinking again. For some reason a lot of that fear has lifted now (maybe due to radical forgiveness worksheets I've been doing) and I'm seriously contemplating whether we could have a relationship that works despite the obvious. I'm in love with an alcoholic and that's how it is...I don't know how to stop loving him. I like the 'nice man' but I'm looking for reasons to justify breaking up with him. I just don't want to be making a mistake letting the 'nice man' go and I'm worried that I may never have a long term relationship that works. I'm almost 40. You'd think I'd have my act together by now....
Any feedback would be greatly appreciated because I'm feeling confused.....thanks....
same planet...different world
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Butte, America
Posts: 10,946
I have lots of thoughts.
Just ... the way this is written ...
I am not so sure you're going to hear me.
I think it's time to go back to Alanon meetings.
That's the long and short of it.
The new guy ... just tell hiim you're not interested.
The 'old' guy ...
honey a leopard don't change his spots.
You say it yourself -
that he loves booze more than your daughter.
SO that tells me you already know the truth.
I think maybe hanging out with and finding an ACOA group near you
will help you put this together in your mind and heart as well.
When we're raised by alcoholics...
we get taught that alcoholism... is love.
Alcoholism ... is not love.
SO when we experience that with another person ...
we think
"oh this is 'it' this is meant to be ..."
when in fact
it's nothing more
than more of the only thing we've ever known.
It's not love
it's simply... recognition.
bailing people out of jail
waiting for them to come up with their part of the rent
watching them with our chiildren
in case they get mean
wondering where they are
where their money went
making excuses to our friends for their absence
is not love.
I think it's time to get on a regular schedule again
with meetings
and working the steps.
And give yourself time to
find out what love ... is.
It says here that you've been apart for a year
but you've never stopped thinking about him
and all that other -
that tells me that
you never moved on
never even really looked past this.
you've already had lessons
on what it isn't.
discover what love IS.
You've got a child right there in front of you waiting to show you.
SO ... that's what I think.
Sorry it's probably not what you want to hear.
Just ... the way this is written ...
I am not so sure you're going to hear me.
I think it's time to go back to Alanon meetings.
That's the long and short of it.
The new guy ... just tell hiim you're not interested.
The 'old' guy ...
honey a leopard don't change his spots.
You say it yourself -
that he loves booze more than your daughter.
SO that tells me you already know the truth.
I think maybe hanging out with and finding an ACOA group near you
will help you put this together in your mind and heart as well.
When we're raised by alcoholics...
we get taught that alcoholism... is love.
Alcoholism ... is not love.
SO when we experience that with another person ...
we think
"oh this is 'it' this is meant to be ..."
when in fact
it's nothing more
than more of the only thing we've ever known.
It's not love
it's simply... recognition.
bailing people out of jail
waiting for them to come up with their part of the rent
watching them with our chiildren
in case they get mean
wondering where they are
where their money went
making excuses to our friends for their absence
is not love.
I think it's time to get on a regular schedule again
with meetings
and working the steps.
And give yourself time to
find out what love ... is.
It says here that you've been apart for a year
but you've never stopped thinking about him
and all that other -
that tells me that
you never moved on
never even really looked past this.
you've already had lessons
on what it isn't.
discover what love IS.
You've got a child right there in front of you waiting to show you.
SO ... that's what I think.
Sorry it's probably not what you want to hear.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 390
My sponsor had told me that even if I left my RAH, I may just end up in a similar spot with someone else, because I will carry my unhealthy behaviours with me to the new relationship. Like the geographic cure, we sometimes use the 'new person' cure.
You know where you've come from - so you likely know where you'll end up if you go back to your relationship. Is he even recovering? Can you be sure he won't be abusive again? If it were just you then it's one thing, but you also have a young daughter and you must keep her (mental and physical) safety as your FIRST priority.
My other thought is that if you haven't moved on, and especially because you have had concerns over this nice man, then it is more honest and forthright to end it with him. Then, take time for yourself and evaluate the reasons for which you want to go back - with the help of places like Al Anon you may learn that they may be unhealthy reasons. For you and your daughter, take the time, 40 or not it doesn't matter (you could be 80!!!) Whatever happens, you don't need to rush it. Take baby steps and see how things go. Maybe some talks, some dates etc. It doesn't need to be drop everything and move back in and act like a married couple.
You know where you've come from - so you likely know where you'll end up if you go back to your relationship. Is he even recovering? Can you be sure he won't be abusive again? If it were just you then it's one thing, but you also have a young daughter and you must keep her (mental and physical) safety as your FIRST priority.
My other thought is that if you haven't moved on, and especially because you have had concerns over this nice man, then it is more honest and forthright to end it with him. Then, take time for yourself and evaluate the reasons for which you want to go back - with the help of places like Al Anon you may learn that they may be unhealthy reasons. For you and your daughter, take the time, 40 or not it doesn't matter (you could be 80!!!) Whatever happens, you don't need to rush it. Take baby steps and see how things go. Maybe some talks, some dates etc. It doesn't need to be drop everything and move back in and act like a married couple.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 2,059
i totally understand, floss.
perhaps best to let the new man go? if it was me, he would be adding unnecessary pressure.
i think if i was you, i would focus on my own recovery...as in get a therapist, go to alanon, post here and see how things go.
i understand that you still love your alcoholic. if it was me, i would keep my distance from him and focus on my own recovery. you've listed some issues from your childhood, why not work on unpeeling these issues with a therapist?
i certainly would not move back in with your husband if he is still actively drinking. it's just too volatile, especially with a little one.
why not give yourself the space and time to focus on your own issues and see where you both stand 6 months to a year from now? i doubt you'll regret this.
naive
perhaps best to let the new man go? if it was me, he would be adding unnecessary pressure.
i think if i was you, i would focus on my own recovery...as in get a therapist, go to alanon, post here and see how things go.
i understand that you still love your alcoholic. if it was me, i would keep my distance from him and focus on my own recovery. you've listed some issues from your childhood, why not work on unpeeling these issues with a therapist?
i certainly would not move back in with your husband if he is still actively drinking. it's just too volatile, especially with a little one.
why not give yourself the space and time to focus on your own issues and see where you both stand 6 months to a year from now? i doubt you'll regret this.
naive
Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: bowling green ky
Posts: 201
I also have that "I just cant let go, move on" issue. I am currently with AH- You sound very much like me. I am sorry you are going thru this- I have no advise, because I live in this every day. Just take care of u nd your daughter ( AH and I also have a 4yr old daughter), and I miss alot of time with her, trying to deal with him. I have lots of regrets
Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 741
There is nothing that says you have to be with either one of these people. You don't HAVE to be in a relationship. Just because you love someone is not necessarily enough reason to have a romantic entanglement if there are other mitigating circumstances - like addiction, lying, emotional dishonesty, etc.
Maybe this is a good time to just concentrate on yourself and on your daughter without all this romance getting in the way. Go to Al-anon, see a quality therapist, exercise, read recovery books, draw.....romance yourself for a while.
Maybe this is a good time to just concentrate on yourself and on your daughter without all this romance getting in the way. Go to Al-anon, see a quality therapist, exercise, read recovery books, draw.....romance yourself for a while.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 281
Hi Barb, Thanks for your post. The good thing is, I've been going to Alanon...and it's a great place for me to be. The new man is coming back from overseas in a couple of days and that's exactly what I'm going to tell him. And the other thing is, I would never move back in with the ex. That won't happen. He doesn't want it and I definately don't. I could never trust him. He stepped over the boundaries in my home and I won't tolerate abuse towards myself and especially in front of my daughter. That's why when he stepped over the line, I called the police. And you're right, it may not be love, but recognition. This is the most confusing thing and I'm not sure if I'll ever know what love is supposed to feel like with a partner.
The good thing is, even during our relationship, there was no alcohol in our house and I've never bought alcohol for him, bailed him out or made excuses for his behaviour. He knows that if I know he's drink driving, I'll call the police because if he killed or hurt someone I'd be just as guilty because I knew. Another reason I won't live with him again is if he loses his job etc, that's his problem. I'm not letting him live here rent free. In any case, his active alcoholic father lets him live at his second property rent free and on his own whenever the need arises which of course enables him.
Finding out what love is.... I know the love I feel for my children and they feel for me. I know how I feel about my friends. Maybe if I keep praying and handing things over to God, I may discover what it is to feel love for a special person in my life and be comfortable in those feelings.
Thanks Barb, I have definately heard what you've said and I really appreciate your wise words and the time you took to post...
The good thing is, even during our relationship, there was no alcohol in our house and I've never bought alcohol for him, bailed him out or made excuses for his behaviour. He knows that if I know he's drink driving, I'll call the police because if he killed or hurt someone I'd be just as guilty because I knew. Another reason I won't live with him again is if he loses his job etc, that's his problem. I'm not letting him live here rent free. In any case, his active alcoholic father lets him live at his second property rent free and on his own whenever the need arises which of course enables him.
Finding out what love is.... I know the love I feel for my children and they feel for me. I know how I feel about my friends. Maybe if I keep praying and handing things over to God, I may discover what it is to feel love for a special person in my life and be comfortable in those feelings.
Thanks Barb, I have definately heard what you've said and I really appreciate your wise words and the time you took to post...
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 281
Hi Silkspin, thanks for your reply. I definately tried the new person cure but chose someone so different from what I'm used to and it still didn't work! And I understand safety is the first priority for my daughter and myself and baby steps it is. There's no way either of us are ready or want to jump into a full on relationship or live together. He like his freedom (of course) and I'm so busy, I don't have the time or the energy to cope with the pressure of living with an alcoholic...I know that would end up in disaster! I think I'll concentrate on my own recovery and my own life and my own responsibilities and see where that takes me...thanks again...
same planet...different world
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Butte, America
Posts: 10,946
Whew!I'm so glad to read that !
yes yes yes!!!!
I can tell you first hand
that you should do everything you can
to learn what love really is =-
when *I* did -
it changed my life completely and...
utterly... and literally!!!!
kewel!!!
I'm chuffed for ya!
yes yes yes!!!!
I can tell you first hand
that you should do everything you can
to learn what love really is =-
when *I* did -
it changed my life completely and...
utterly... and literally!!!!
kewel!!!
I'm chuffed for ya!
Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 218
Hi Floss, no good advice - just a welcome and a big hug. I'm a fellow adult child and I wonder too, often, whether I'll ever get a handle on healthy love. It's a work in progress.
Barb, the thanks button isn't enough for your post. I just had a lightning bolt moment reading what you wrote. Recognition. Alcoholism feeling like love. That feeling of recognition is indescribable - the disease has its own radio frequency and you can feel yourself tuning into the station when you find it. it also has an electric "zing" to it. But the "zing" isn't love. I'm going to save your post and meditate on it.
Love (and not the "zing" kind)
SL
Barb, the thanks button isn't enough for your post. I just had a lightning bolt moment reading what you wrote. Recognition. Alcoholism feeling like love. That feeling of recognition is indescribable - the disease has its own radio frequency and you can feel yourself tuning into the station when you find it. it also has an electric "zing" to it. But the "zing" isn't love. I'm going to save your post and meditate on it.
Love (and not the "zing" kind)
SL
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 281
Hi Naive, yes the pressure of the new man is too much right now. He wants something I can't give. And I need to make my recovery my first priority. I think when I went to Alanon in the past, I wasn't as ready for it as I am now. At my first meeting (which my dad took me to) I said "I don't think my dad's alcoholism has affected me" Ha ha, how's that for complete denial! A therapist would be good too. I've done so much unpeeling of my childhood, and yet look where I am! It's wierd..maybe more denial? I'm definately putting mine and our daughters safety first. In any case I have an AVO in which he is not allowed to be near me or my daughter within 12 hours of consuming alcohol...The AVO runs out in less than a year and I'm going to seek an extension of that....I think I need to take one day at a time and as you said, see where things are in 6 months. I joined this forum months ago but this has been my first post. Thanks for your reply...
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
