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Dude, where's my car?

Old 08-14-2010, 05:28 PM
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Question Dude, where's my car?

This is day 11. Today is particularly tough not because I feel like drinking but because its tough in general. There are situations that I am pondering that maybe you can provide some advice for.

#1. My daughter. She turned 18 in May and still lives with me. She dropped out of school in the 11th grade....pretending to go everyday. She joined me here in Arkansas and got a couple of jobs she has since lost. Needless to say, I am fully supporting her. I got a new/used vehicle before she had quit school so she could use the one I was driving. There is a history of pills and pot usage but I'm not sure if she currently using. I'm guessing, yes, of course. She has had two accidents in the car that I gave her and I can no longer afford to insure both of us so I told her she would be unable to use the car at this time. On Friday, I discovered she stole the clicker for my vehicle so she could get her car key out of my glove box and took her car back. I have not seen her since. This is not the first time she has don't something like this or just plain refuses to abide by house rules. There have been two incidents in the past week in which she got physically aggressive with me. She also lies constantly....con artist style. At what point do I say enough is enough? Do I kick her out? Do I go back to Florida and not look back? After I get my clicker back, I'm going to turn her phone off. Any other suggestions are more than welcome.

#2 Due to the above situation, I have been lurking in the F&F members of A's section. I have noticed that many many people are still very angry AFTER their loved one has gotten sober. Still resentful, still unsatisfied. It may all be justified. Can they truly forgive us? Many will never understand what it takes or is like to quit alcohol and/or drugs. We may never understand what hell we put them through. Are they addicted to trying to fix or manage us? If the lashing out continues toward us, do we depart from them or do we allow the resentful remarks to continue to chip at our self esteem? Just a thought. Have many of you found yourself perhaps starting over with EVERYTHING-people, job, friends, ect?

I have PTSD and am probably going through PAWS. I don't want to be overly dramatic but I'm not sure I'm thinking clearly. I'm DEF not coping well. Nervous freakin wreck here!
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Old 08-14-2010, 05:42 PM
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This is not the first time she has don't something like this or just plain refuses to abide by house rules. There have been two incidents in the past week in which she got physically aggressive with me. She also lies constantly....con artist style. At what point do I say enough is enough?

Now sounds like an excellent time! Disrespecting house rules is bad enough, but when they become physically aggressive? That's the end of the road as far as I'm concerned.

I can't tell you what to do, but having been in a similar situation not too long ago, I'll tell you what I did. I told her to find another place to live. She begged. She cried. She pleaded. She promised she would change. Yes, it tore my heart out, but I remained steadfast and she went to live with her dad in another town about 2 hours away. She never liked her dad and she absolutely HATED living with him, but it was the kick in the butt she needed to straighten herself out.

That was a little over a year ago and now she is stable, working and starting college in a couple of weeks.

Your results may vary, but unless you want to keep going through this crap with her, you need to make some changes.
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Old 08-14-2010, 05:53 PM
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I forgave the alcoholics in my life (two husbands--one sober, one not) long ago, way before my own drinking went out of control. Everyone is different--some people recover from the damage alcoholism causes, some faster than others, and some never do.

You have my sympathies on the daughter. Physical aggression is NEVER acceptable. You might want to sit her down and tell her the next time she is physically aggressive with you, you are calling the police. And you could also tell her that if she ever takes YOUR car again, without permission, you are calling the police. But only if you are actually willing to DO it. Nothing worse than making empty threats.

How long you continue to provide a roof over her head is a decision only you can make.

I suggest you post down at the F&F forum, too.
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Old 08-14-2010, 05:59 PM
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Chakra
I think you already know what you have to do with your daughter.

The point where you say enough is up to you.

I know you deserve better and I think, based on your post, it might do your daughter some good to have to be responsible for herself too.

As for the second bit, I know I caused a lot of people to be angry with me - but I did the work (for me not for them) and I got myself straight.

I also removed myself from some people because their anger, however justified it was, didn't help me in what I was trying to do.

Most people came back - a few didn't, and I have to deal with that.

D
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Old 08-14-2010, 06:04 PM
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Hey Chakra, I'm sorry your daughter is giving you so much grief. I don't have kids myself so I can't offer much advice other than do what you need to stay sober.

Regarding your second question...I've urked a little there myself, since I grew up with an alcoholic mother. I have also been troubled by the negativity on these boards. I wish my parents had dealt with the alcohol issue when I was a kid...obviously I think it had a negative impact on me, but I can't let it effect me.

It is possible she is punishing you (in her own mind) for your problems with alcohol. I think that for me there was an element of wanting them to notice I was self destructing and do something about it.

Don't know if that helps.
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Old 08-14-2010, 06:14 PM
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allow me to chime in? I divorced when my only daughter was in 2nd grade...I bent over backwards, worked 2 jobs to extend our *disposable income*...had my mother babysit every day and gave my daughter all the advantages. Her father and I lived in the same town, she could sleep at anyone's house...we had big vacations, loving family and lots of attention. She went from being an Honors student to almost flunking the 10th grade. She hit me and cracked a rib...she is 5 inches taller than I and has about 50# on me. angry and larger is scary....even from your own child. I couldn't close my eyes at night she would go out the window..she ran away from home 3X in one year...we last found her in Texas and pressed charges against the 22 YO man she was with. I sent her to live with Daddy-dearest full time...she graduated HS, he paid for her first semester at college...which as says "chose to fail".

OY-VEY! i thought my X was going to have a stroke on my front lawn...he actually turned purple....we BOTH told her she was off of our payroll....at age 19.....we all spent saturdays in family counseling since we had 100% insurance coverage...she calmed down went back to school, moved in with a very nice young man that she abused and lived off of....time advances...she turns 25.....I gave her a very nice gift of my diamond engagement ring and about 4K in bonds I had kept for her.....her final words to me were to "go flock myself when I told her not to drink and drive" (i was not drinking all that much during these years, about 3-5 glasses of wine a night).....I changed the locks on my house and refused to give her my coffee table (it is a strange story)....she screamed and pounded on my door until I told her I would call the cops and haveher removed.....my mother gets ill, she shows up at the ER with a water bottle filled with straight vodka, telling me that I should quit my job and "take care of grandma".

She moves to Austin TX with new BF who is a plumber.....life is wonderful she hasn't worked in 3 years....Her father (myX we divorced 23 years prior) dies suddenly....she calls me crying...because she never made ammends with him for telling him to go flock himself.....and can I please buy 2 tix for her and the BF so they can fly home....I told her that it would be best to ask her father's family (who is very wealthy) for the $$. again i was told to go and flock myself, I was selfish???

She's now 30, still doesn't work and of course inh. all of her father's assets which include 2 houses, one is on the beach. She doesn't participate in anything with my family, she rarely visits my mother who she was so close to and is suffering from advanced dementia....if i extend an invite for a holiday she refuses to respond.

my daughter is still a child masquarading as an adult....she blames me for everything. I do not feel guilty at all....I raised her more than well, gave her all the advantages....she still chose the low road.

I did the very best I could and that's all you can do....

i didn't mean to hijack the conversation, but thanks for listening.....if you feel you are losing control with your child after exhausting all possibilities, you might want to consider the tough love approach.

I hope you find a solution.
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Old 08-14-2010, 06:24 PM
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Thank you everyone for your feedback and support. You have all solidified that my thought process is really in the right direction. I often second guess myself where she is concerned and really just need to get some balls here. Sorry if any of you were negatively impacted by that horrid visual. lol

LaFemme-I have thought about my alcoholism affecting her. It most certainly has and I would be lying if I said it didn't. We've talked are were trying to move past that. I was honest with her about the things that happened to me that caused my PTSD so she would understand that she didn't have anything to do with my drinking. She knows I'm a wreck emotionally but of course, it has all taken its toll on her over the years. I've sent her to counseling to try and help her. I told her to be honest...especially with any anger she has toward me. All in all, I feel this is a separate issue. She wants to be independent NOW and wants to hang with her BF who has no car. She knows she is bigger than me and has started to take advantage of it. It has not always been horrible between us. We have fun together a lot. And then crap like this happens. Makes me want to throw her in the Arkansas River. :P

Dee-You told me what I wanted to hear. I want to get better and that doesn't mean I'm forgiven by all so for my own progress, its probably better to detach and let the chips fall where they may.

I didn't post this in the F&F because I didn't want their judgment to be clouded by their anger. I have become very fond of the people I typically interact with here and really value your opinions. Of course, anyone is welcome to fire away.
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Old 08-14-2010, 06:58 PM
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One of my good friends who has one year old twin boys jokes that instead of establishing a college fund she is setting up a fund for future therapy. The truth is there is no such thing as being a perfect parent, I don't care what your upbringing is you can find something to blame on your parents if you want.
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Old 08-14-2010, 07:42 PM
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Fandy-thank you so much for sharing that. That sounds like hell and very similar I might add. With everything going on, I cannot imagine what sort of stress you endured. Its so heartbreaking when things turn out this way. Its so infuriating that there is nothing you can do about it. You spend your time and resources trying to help fix things but nothing helps. I can't look at her photos from when she was a child anymore because they make me cry. I don't cry easily but I know that that little precious girl is gone forever and is not coming back. I can only hope that one day, things work out and we can be close again. I had her when I was 20 so I basically grew up with her. I know we have a strong love for each other but I don't think I can do this anymore. I just got off the phone with my dad which is what took me so long to respond to your post. Every word pulled my heart strings....I'm so sorry that all of this has happened to you.

As I said, I am really fond of the input you fantastic people have here so I'm really glad you "chimed in". Thank you.
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Old 08-14-2010, 07:43 PM
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Originally Posted by LaFemme View Post
One of my good friends who has one year old twin boys jokes that instead of establishing a college fund she is setting up a fund for future therapy. The truth is there is no such thing as being a perfect parent, I don't care what your upbringing is you can find something to blame on your parents if you want.
Now THAT is the best idea I've heard all day. lol Even with insurance, the co-pay over and over is not cheap!
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Old 08-14-2010, 08:36 PM
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Chakra,

I think we all have made people in our lives very angry towards us, and I know I didn't expect the anger to disappear quickly. And, it did take awhile. Fortunately, I am very grateful that my husband and two children have forgiven me. If I was living with someone who could not forgive me, I would not stay. I would not be able to maintain my recovery in that kind of an environment.

For your daughter, I hope and pray that the two of you can work things out. I know that my daughter was 16 - 19 yrs old while I was drinking and she was very angry and unforgiving for a long time. All I can say is that time will help and she may recognize the value of the relationship and decide to heal.
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Old 08-14-2010, 08:48 PM
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I think all roads lead back to: "where am I in my recovery?"

I feel that when I give advice about life things, I am suggesting that someone can actually fix and control external situations that are largely beyond their control.

I can't fix most situations, but I can fix how I view them and process them.

If/when I call my sponsor with complaints about the chaos in my life, he generally hangs up on me. It's tough love, but it sends a loving message.
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Old 08-14-2010, 09:24 PM
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True, there is not a lot of point in complaining, I am grateful for every minute of my journey for bringing me here, where I am right now. But its nice to get opinions and advice from friends too, and sometimes that sounds like complaining.
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Old 08-15-2010, 04:45 AM
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I realized it was Thursday she took the car and I STILL haven't seen her since. I can see by her phone records she used her phone on Friday night but she has not used it at all since. I'm starting to get really really worried now. Just want my daughter to come home so I know she's ok and then deal with all the other stuff later.

That was a total vent post....
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Old 08-15-2010, 06:26 AM
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Oh wow, she's still not back? Has she disappeared like this in the past? I know that even with your difficulties, you are her Mom and that always comes first. Sending positive thoughts your way.
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Old 08-15-2010, 06:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Chakra View Post
I realized it was Thursday she took the car and I STILL haven't seen her since. I can see by her phone records she used her phone on Friday night but she has not used it at all since. I'm starting to get really really worried now. Just want my daughter to come home so I know she's ok and then deal with all the other stuff later.

That was a total vent post....
I just wanted to send you support and hugs from afar.
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Old 08-15-2010, 06:33 AM
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Have you tried calling her phone or texting and just asking if she is okay?
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Old 08-15-2010, 06:43 AM
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If she doesn't have a charger, the phone battery could be dead. Any friends of hers you could check with? You could tell them that your first concern is her safety, and that if you don't talk to her you are going to have to call the police. That might be enough to at least get her to call so you know she is safe.

Otherwise, if she has never done anything like this before, I WOULD call the police. If they won't take a missing persons report (policies vary among departments), then report the car stolen. Once she is found, THEN you can worry about what to do going forward.
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Old 08-15-2010, 06:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Chakra View Post
Thank you everyone for your feedback and support. You have all solidified that my thought process is really in the right direction. I often second guess myself where she is concerned and really just need to get some balls here. Sorry if any of you were negatively impacted by that horrid visual. lol

LaFemme-I have thought about my alcoholism affecting her. It most certainly has and I would be lying if I said it didn't. We've talked are were trying to move past that. I was honest with her about the things that happened to me that caused my PTSD so she would understand that she didn't have anything to do with my drinking. She knows I'm a wreck emotionally but of course, it has all taken its toll on her over the years. I've sent her to counseling to try and help her. I told her to be honest...especially with any anger she has toward me. All in all, I feel this is a separate issue. She wants to be independent NOW and wants to hang with her BF who has no car. She knows she is bigger than me and has started to take advantage of it. It has not always been horrible between us. We have fun together a lot. And then crap like this happens. Makes me want to throw her in the Arkansas River. :P

Dee-You told me what I wanted to hear. I want to get better and that doesn't mean I'm forgiven by all so for my own progress, its probably better to detach and let the chips fall where they may.

I didn't post this in the F&F because I didn't want their judgment to be clouded by their anger. I have become very fond of the people I typically interact with here and really value your opinions. Of course, anyone is welcome to fire away.
Hi Chakra. Two issues. First of all, about you. Have you addressed the PTSD in a treatment setting? Not only does PTSD interact unfavorably with addictions, but like addiction it is virtually incurable....but it IS manageable. dialectic behavioral therapy, which is a program of several months as a rule, seems to be pretty effective. If you don't deal with the PTSD, it will continue to deal with you

Next: daughter dearest. You may want to consider the addictive nature of anger, as a dependency upon adrenaline (the drug of choice of codependents, which is why they favor anger so much). It also goes a long way to explaining why codeps/FF seem to resent our recovery and find all kinds of ways to sabotage or belittle it....and hanging on to anger is perfect. Remember....if I am addicted to adrenaline, then I will need anger, crisis, chaos, self pity, hopelessness, etc. etc. to sustain my own addiction. IMO, this is why Alanon is so critical in "addicrtive" relationships...it is the road to recovery for the adrenalized codependent who cannot live comforably without anger and crisis.

You have nothing to do with it, other than being an avenue for her to access the anger/adrenaline....pretty much like an unwitting drug dealer<G>. Rest assured, if you "cut her off," she'll find her drug elsewhere...unless she finds recovery. Untreated adrenaline addiction, often labeled codependency, is probably far more damaging than untreated alcoholism.

blessings
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Old 08-15-2010, 06:56 AM
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I am sorry of what you are going trough. I have no children myself, so I may not be qualified to give youa dvice. However I think you did everything you could do with your daughter and if she is drugging and using then she needs to hit rock bottom as we all learned and has to find her end of the road. And I know how hard it must be as a parent to watch. You should focus on your recovery as your major priority, sine if you go back to your old ways you cannot help her at all. As she is still missing maybe try to file a missed person report and hope the police will find her? Please let us know and keep us updated.
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