vtsister

My nearly-49 year old alcoholic/drug using brother has lived with us "temporarily" for 4 years. During that time, we've had a number of high-drama episodes with him, where I've threatened that he had to leave.

Each time, I haven't had the heart to actually make him leave. (Yes, I know this means that I'm co-dependent with him.)

Now, though, it's not about drama. I'm not angry with him about anything. He hasn't caused any drama for several months now.

We'd just like to have our space back for our own use. I'd like to have the space back so my daughter and my grandchildren will be able to stay with us when they come to visit. There are several plans we put off for that space because my brother needed a place to live, and he's had four years here.

Even though I feel a little bit guilty about asking him to move to his own place, I know that letting him continue living with us is just enabling his drinking/partying lifestyle.

We've never charged him a "real" rent. We've just asked him to throw in a little bit to cover his share of the electricity, heat, water...This was supposed to be helping him "get back on his feet", but it's actually just allowed him to have plenty of money for drinking and drugs.

This arrangement was also supposed to help him "save money", but he hasn't saved anything. He's always broke.

We're not helping him at all, and my sisters and I all agree that he really needs to get on his own two feet and get his life together without us enabling him any more.

I don't want my brother to feel like he's being "kicked out", or "punished" for anything, because he isn't.

I'm not sure what his reaction will be, and I'm not even sure how to tell him that I'd like him to move to his own place.

Do I have to detail the reasons why we want our space back, just to reassure him?

I'm hoping to have a chance to talk to him within the next few days, and will tell him that I'd like him to have his own place by November 1st. My sisters assure me that this should be plenty of time for him to make arrangements to rent a room, share a house, etc.

Part of me feels bad that I want our space back, and another part of me believes that it's time he HAS to start standing on his own two feet in life.

I guess I'm just wondering how to tell him that he needs to move without making him feel bad, and does this kind of thing throw an alcoholic for a loop?

Pelican

It is your house.
It is your life.
It is your future.

I would say:

I need you to find your own place to live.
You have 30 days, from today, to be out.

Your words are not going to cause him to drink or drug more. You are not that powerful.

His reactions to your words are his choices.

Jazzman

This arrangement is no longer working and I want my space back.

I have a feeling he knows exactly why so I'm sure no explanation is really necessary.

vtsister

Thank you for your replies.

I need to clarify--this time it is not because of his drinking/partying that I want him to leave. There have been a few times before this that I HAVE wanted him to leave due to that, and he's even been on the verge of being kicked out immediately.

This time, I'm not angry, and it's not directly due to anything he's doing.

I WANT to allow him until November to find a place.

This is going to come out of the blue on him, so I was just wondering exactly how many details I needed to go into with him to get across that he needs to find his own place, but that I'm not mad at him at all.

Life becomes very complicated when you're living with an alcoholic, that's for sure.

sandrawg

Just tell him the truth, exactly as you told us.

It sounds to me like you're afraid he's going to pitch a fit or something-that's what alcoholics do. They react like little king babies when there's a chance a codie is about to stand up for herself and actually act like normal people do and enforce boundaries. Don't buy into it.

Like someone else said, YOU are not responsible for however he reacts.

It is not healthy for a grown man to sponge off his sister for 4 yrs. It should be totally understandable for you to want your space back, and if he wasn't an alcoholic, it would be.

nodaybut2day

By letting him stay with you, rent-free, for the last 4 years, you've provided him with a soft place to land as he continues to drown in his addiction. You may well be doing him a favour by simply asking him to leave by X date. Hopefully, it leads him to that much needed bottom.

suki44883

Even if he wasn't drinking, partying or whatever, four years is too long to let him live somewhere rent free. I agree that you should explain it to him exactly the way you did with us. You have very good reasons for wanting to reclaim your space. I do think that giving him until November is too long. Chances are good that he won't even start looking for another place until mid-October if he think he has that long. November seems like a long way off. September 1st sounds better and it's still giving him 6 weeks to find something.

hopeful4

It does not really matter why you want him to leave, you want him to leave. Tell him what you just told us. So you have more space, that there are things that you want to do with the house. It really does not matter WHY just that is how it is. He is a grown adult who needs to be out on his own and GROW UP!!!

good luck!

smacked

Geeze I wish my healthy, nonaddict behavior got me free rent.

Stop enabling his addiction and destruction, take your life back (you only have one, ya know?).

An adult sibling sponging off another sibling for 4 years is absolutely ridiculous, but he has had absolutely no reason to change. That would have been heaven in my addict days. Bills paid, warm home.. soft bed. Probably a fridge with food. Hallelujah!!

Luckily, everyone who cared about me in my life completely stopped helping me kill myself. Eventually I got better.. not all addicts do.

I'd hate to see you here in another 4 years, grandbabies so much older, still not visiting.. tearing your hair out that you've had almost a decade to help your brother stay as comfortable as possible as he kills himself with liquor. Your house, your rules. I would give him a MONTH at most to find a place, and in the meantime disallow any drinking/being drunk if he's to stay there for the next 30 days.

akrasia

I think you already know you're entirely justified in asking him to go.

Also, you're wise to wait till you're not angry to do it!

My experience is that it's simpler--and kinder--in situations like these to NOT give reasons. Firstly, as you know, giving reasons can make it seem as though you're open to negotiations, which a manipulative person will jump all over. And secondly, he already knows the reasons. So keep it quick and light: "Hey, we need our room back, so be out by 30 November. Thanks!" Optional: "We've got a moving van lined up for that week if you want."

(I have a sneaking suspicion he can tell you're gearing up to ask him. I bet he's got an alternate place in mind.)

Best of luck to you.

vtsister

I don't think he has any clue I'm going to ask him to leave. Awhile back, I had told him that it was nice having him around, which it is, and that I didn't mind him sharing our house with us. Even *I* thought it would be a permanent arrangement, but I realize now that I'd prefer to be able to use all of my house.

Also, he didn't live here totally free. He put in about $250 a month for his share of the expenses.

We have a little mother in law apartment downstairs, so he has his own rooms, entrance, etc. It's not fancy, but he's got it fixed up pretty decently down there.

My sister has been after me for quite awhile to raise his rent to something more "real", because there's nowhere where you'd be paying only $250 a month.

I've felt bad about possibly raising his rent, and have been thinking about it a lot for the past couple of weeks, then all of a sudden, this morning, the realization hit me that I just want to have our space back.

I don't want to have to worry about the cops mistakenly kicking MY door in some day if he ever does something to get himself into trouble. With him gone, that would be a load off my mind.

Akrasia, I like what you suggested I say: We need our room back, so you need to be gone by..." That's exactly what I was wondering about.

I just need to figure out how to broach the topic. I'm thinking about saying that we have a lot of changes coming up, and we're going to need our space back--but I don't know if that's too goofy or not. I don't know if I need to apologize for not letting him share our house permanently, or what.

I love my brother, and it's hard to know how to handle him sometimes. I don't want to hurt him, or make things harder for him, but I know that I have to look out for my own needs to.

HoopNinja

He's 49 and you are supporting him? I don't think you need to give him an explanation. Regardless of whether his behavior is bad or not, no 49 year old man should be supported by his sister unless there is a really good reason--and I don't think there is one.

I don't mean to sound harsh, but November? Why give him that long if you want your space back. You have already given him 4 years. It is time for him to put on his big boy pants and learn how to take care of himself.

Have you gone to AlAnon? Suggested reading--Codependent No More by Melody Beattie.

Get you house back and start your recovery so when he tries to move back in you know how to say no.

vtsister

My sister and I have been talking recently about this very thing. We know that he'll never change as long as he's living here, with the cheap rent. Why would he? It's pretty comfy having all the drinking/drugging money you want each week.

Thanks for affirming that we're on the right track.

fourmaggie

I had to laugh at that 1st quote....and youre soooo rite....

stop enabling....


I like this POST...you had 100 hits on it...must be others out there in the same boat as you....HOPE everyone gets a light bulb moment


and also...please...try AL ANON....YOU NEED IT!! ITS FOR YOU and also the co-dependent behaviours you have....

akrasia

You wrote: "I just need to figure out how to broach the topic. I'm thinking about saying that we have a lot of changes coming up, and we're going to need our space back--but I don't know if that's too goofy or not. I don't know if I need to apologize for not letting him share our house permanently, or what."

I recommend you rehearse saying, "I'll need you to move out by November 30th," and that's it. If he starts asking why, or if he asks to stay longer, just shake your head with a regretful smile and say, "No, that's not possible. November 30th. Thanks." Pat his hand, smile again, and leave the room.

(On second thought, I wouldn't even say, "Because we need the space," because that gives him an opening to ask what for.)

No reasons, no negotiations.

It reminds me of those women self-defense classes we had to take in college: It's important to remember that you don't owe people explanations. For instance, if some guy you feel skeevy about is asking you out aggressively or insisting on giving you a ride home, you don't get into a whole explanation of why you can't. (Like you're busy, or your friends are waiting for you, whatever.) Because then you're getting into a conversation. Instead it's "No thank you," and that's it.

It's really the same principle here, which is why you're nervous about bringing it up. You know he's going to try and manipulate you. So you say, "Gonna need you to move out then. Thanks."

If he does ask why he has to move out, just say, "That's the date we'll need you to move out. It won't be possible for you to stay after that. Okay, thanks." And move along.

And it might be a good idea to have a plan in place for the end of November, because somehow I can see him waking up on December 1 and going, "Surely you didn't mean..." So if you've been wanting to do some renovations on that room, December 1 might be the day to schedule the contractors to come in.

(And, for yourself, it might make you feel better if you had a private emergency plan in place if he digs in his heels. Of course, to his face, you're going to be calm and confident about his cooperation. But maybe for yourself you could keep notes of the dates you've told him to move out, and if it comes to it you might have to contact the police or an attorney on December 1 if he's still there. I hope it doesn't come to that, but you'll probably feel better if you have a 'worst case scenario' plan in place.)

akrasia

... and then when he's gone, can I move in? That is an incredible deal.

wicked

I'm with smacked and akrasia on this one.
I have been sober since August 18th 1996.
I would gladly pay you $500.00 a month!


Okay, really, I think you just say, you must be out by November.
No reasons, no explanations necessary.
Drunks will want to talk about it endlessly, don't open the door.

Beth

dollydo

November? Does not compute, 30 days notice would be right up my alley.

You are not helping him, he is a big boy and needs to be treated as such. Why are you babying him? What is your pay off?

vtsister

I felt bad for him, and thought I was helping him.

SoloMio

You are not obligated to house him.
He seems to be a "taker."
Giving him 4 months to find an alternate arrangement is entirely fair.
When we "help" folks like your brother, they tend to feed off this "help" like a shark feeds off chum. BTDT. If there's anything I regret in my life, it's being "too nice" to the As in my life.