Behavior question

Old 06-10-2010, 06:28 PM
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Behavior question

I have read alot of A's who deny the problem, hide it. But what about if they admit it? Mine will look you dead in the eye and say "i am an alcoholic" whether he is sober or drunk. He doesnt hide it. He leaves the bottles out, he drinks in front of anyone and he will tell you "i got a drinking problem" or "i need to detox". Even when he dumped me two weeks ago, he said "i need to work on my issues cuz I have a ton of them". Its not like he is bragging about it, he just admits it and makes no excuses for it.

This is very confusing to me. Growing up with an A father, it was hid. He did not drink in front of us nor did he leave the booze sitting out. He would never, ever admit he had a problem either which is how i always thought most A's were.

Has anyone experienced this? How does a person who doesnt hide it differ from one who does, meaning the manipulation and games that most A's play? I have caught him in so many lies so I know he is not "honest" about everything. But i find it interesting as to why some hide it and some dont?
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Old 06-10-2010, 06:36 PM
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Well its good that he admits it, but now you have to change his focus (if you can) to "what are you going to do about it?". Have you asked him this and if so what was his response?
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Old 06-10-2010, 06:42 PM
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Well, I would tell him that i would support him in it. but the next night, he was drinking again. When i confronted him on it he would say "i know" or "i just dont think i can" or " i am scared of going into seizures".

Looking back, I dont think he was serious about quitting. He has done the rehab thing for two weeks before and hit the store for vodka on the way home.

I just find it interesting how "open" he was with it. Most A's hide it and hardly ever admit it.
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Old 06-10-2010, 06:50 PM
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I have never met such A, who does not hide his bottle. Very interesting thread but no idea from me.
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Old 06-10-2010, 07:27 PM
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My AH told me, our families, and friends that he is an alcoholic. But when it came down to all seriousness and I was walking out the door he said to me, "I'm not that bad. I go to work, I support 6 of us, yadda, yadda, yadda." If he weren't an alcoholic he wouldn't have done XYZ or said some of the things he said. Especially to the kids. He drank to get drunk every time he drank. So while he might admit it, he may just be saying it so you agree, but he thinks otherwise.
I honestly don't know what goes on in their minds. If it's anything like mine, there is one heck of a roller coaster ride!
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Old 06-10-2010, 07:34 PM
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yeah, he admits it but follows it with "i do it cuz i cant sleep at night and the only way i get rest is to pass out"....so what you are saying makes sense to me.

i am starting to realize that analyzing the behavior is a never ending process. its drinking, depression, social issues, etc. it seems like one questions leads to 5 more. but i feel in order to defeat it, i need to understand it...if that makes sense.

your right...it is a rollar coaster ride. one that i am glad to be off of!
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Old 06-10-2010, 07:55 PM
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My xabf hasn't denied his addiction for many, many years. He just says it's a monster, it's the devil, it brings him to his knees. He never did drugs in front of me, and did minimize the extent of it, so I guess that's hiding. I suspect he (yours) tells a partial truth, and hides some of it to a degree, so it doesn't look as bad, but I could be wrong.
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Old 06-10-2010, 08:15 PM
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i am scared of going into seizures
That was my XA's favorite. It was just another reason to delay the inevitable.
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Old 06-10-2010, 08:15 PM
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I think I can help with this one. I'm coming up on five years sober and I think I must be the one alcoholic out of 1,000 who had to argue with their doctor that I -did- have a problem. I knew that I didn't drink the same way other people did, and that I had no control after the first drink. It scared me. I made my first appearance at an AA meeting 10 years ago. Sat in the back, quiet as a mouse. Kept drinking. Two years later I went back and identified as an alcoholic. Took another three years before it stuck.

I knew that I had a problem. Knowing that you have the problem isn't the problem. For anyone who isn't an alcoholic - the simple answer is "just don't drink." And it is, ironically, just that simple. Accepting that you're an alcoholic isn't hard when there's mounting evidence that the stuff is starting to ruin your life and your health. Accepting the next part - that you can't drink again, ever, is the hard part. And almost every alcoholic tries to do this by themselves - for most it doesn't work. It didn't for me.

Always knew I had a problem - had to really hit bottom before I was willing to live my life, my whole life, around addressing that problem.

SL.
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Old 06-10-2010, 08:24 PM
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My ABF is/was very open about his alcoholism and drinking. Never made a single attempt to hide it, always said it was a problem. Did not lie about it, ever. Never made a single promise to quit. He did say that he was very scared of detox, but he did it.

He's now got 3 months sobriety and is attending meetings. From what I've read, he's a bit of an outlier, but I mustn't let myself think that he's any different from any other alcoholic.
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Old 06-11-2010, 03:31 AM
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I guess defeat was probably the wrong word to use. What i mean is to get out of this pattern of dating someone with addictions issues. I have been through hell with him and do not want to go back to that at all.

stilllearning: thanks for shedding some light for me. what you said does make sense. I cant imagine that he has not hit rock bottom yet (job loss, promotion loss, jail, probation, relationship issues, and now health problems) but I have never been addicted so I dont know the feeling. thanks for the input!
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Old 06-11-2010, 04:17 AM
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Originally Posted by spinwc View Post
I have read alot of A's who deny the problem, hide it. But what about if they admit it? Mine will look you dead in the eye and say "i am an alcoholic" whether he is sober or drunk. He doesnt hide it. He leaves the bottles out, he drinks in front of anyone and he will tell you "i got a drinking problem" or "i need to detox". Even when he dumped me two weeks ago, he said "i need to work on my issues cuz I have a ton of them". Its not like he is bragging about it, he just admits it and makes no excuses for it.

This is very confusing to me. Growing up with an A father, it was hid. He did not drink in front of us nor did he leave the booze sitting out. He would never, ever admit he had a problem either which is how i always thought most A's were.

Has anyone experienced this? How does a person who doesnt hide it differ from one who does, meaning the manipulation and games that most A's play? I have caught him in so many lies so I know he is not "honest" about everything. But i find it interesting as to why some hide it and some dont?
I think this is one of those areas where we get lost, and can't see the forest for the trees. It's in essence a useless debate in semantics.

Some alkies spend years debating whether they are "alcoholics" or "alcohol abusers" or "problem drinkers" - as if it makes any difference. Likewise for us codies, what difference does it make, if the alcoholic drinks uncontrollably out in the open, or dark in the closet; whether they announce to the world with words or not, their actions speak the same message: drinking alcohol cannot be controlled, the effects are harmful, and either they do more of the same, or change.

He drinks. You watch. You have a choice of doing more of the same, or changing.

CLMI
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Old 06-11-2010, 07:34 AM
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My XA admitted he was an alcoholic in tears one night. He also said he drank to help him fall asleep.
Then after the admittance came the justifying...."but I cut out beer and only drink wine. But I cut out wine and only drink beer. But I drink a lot of water. I'm fine, I just need to detox and then I can control it."
It's sad, he said he wanted to stop. Inside he knows he should stop. But he places himself around the people who he knows he can drink and "be himself" around. So he said.
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Old 06-11-2010, 09:15 AM
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My AH knows he's alcoholic and he loves it. It's part of his identity. He's Scottish and he tells all kinds of jokes about his drinking. Get this--a couple of years ago he bought HIMSELF, for Christmas, the book "Drinking--A Love Story"--he wrapped it, put it under the tree and then gave it to himself to open, which he did in front of all of us. To which my DS30 asked jokingly, "Well, Dad, do you like the gift?"

His favorite picture on the wall in his office is one that he bought at a consignment shop of an old 18th century illustration of a guy sitting on a stump under a tree, bottle in one hand, pipe in the other, gut sticking out, happy as a clam. That's his aspiration in life.

At least I can't say I wasn't warned...
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Old 06-11-2010, 10:27 AM
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Hi Spin,

I think the thing to remember here, no offense to anyone, is that A's tend to be manipulative. Sooooo, whatever it is that they say - if they're not in recovery with no excuses - they're manipulating.

My Xabf told me that he was an A. After his 4-day disappearance/binge, he printed up signs that said "I am an A, I will always be an A..." and some other stuff that he said he got from rehab. He still came home smelling of alcohol. He was either trying to fool himself, me, or both of us, into thinking that he was "doing something about it". The "something" turned out to be printing up signs to put on my walls and doors.

In the end, he still drank until he moved out of my apartment. He calls himself a "binge drinker" since he just binges. But he drank on a regular basis while at work (he was a waiter).

I guess the question now is - what do you, Spin, want to do? What's your response to his behavior?

On this wonderful message board, with these wonderful people, you will learn - you must take care of yourself first.

Great post, Catlovermi and Anvilhead. Solomio, at least there's no issue of denial...

Ready.
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Old 06-11-2010, 03:54 PM
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To me it seems you KNOW he is an alcoholic. He knows it. You know he lies to you.
Is that what you want?

Hugs,
Peace
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Old 06-11-2010, 05:34 PM
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"I cant imagine that he has not hit rock bottom yet (job loss, promotion loss, jail, probation, relationship issues, and now health problems) but I have never been addicted so I dont know the feeling. thanks for the input!"

Spin, I hit a pretty hard physical bottom (withdrawal for me was terrible) and I almost "missed" my XA's alcoholism (he never drank in front of me) despite all of the above having happened to him as a result of his drinking. He lost a long term relationship, his home, his job, has had multiple DUIs, jail time and was arrested, again, while we were together. Did I know all of this going in? No. And my bottom was a pretty "high" bottom so when I did start to see the trees, I missed the forest because ... it didn't even occur to me that after that list of losses and pain, someone could/would keep trying to drink responsibly.

And how stupid do I feel because ... I'm an alcoholic. Turns out I'm also tragically codependent because even having walked the walk, I honestly thought that having addressed my alcoholism, I could help him address his. It just doesn't work that way. Getting sober is an entirely personal prospect and there is nothing logical about this disease. That's why the "restore us to sanity" part of 12 step programs is so important - it is, literally, insane to keep drinking while the consequences get more and more serious. And it is, literally, insane to keep trying to "get" a loved one sober while the consequences get more and more serious. None of it makes sense.
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Old 06-11-2010, 06:16 PM
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I have been very hurt and angry for the last 3 weeks over this. For some reason today (and i hope every day from now on) and am at peace with this. I woke up this morning and just had this feeling of "its over and I am ok". I didnt marry the guy, i dont have children with the guy, i dont own property with him so i am very lucky the ties can be cut so easily. I sickens me to think that i was allowing him to continue to manipulate me-and we are not even communicating!

I have decided to put all this passion in trying to figure him out and try to figure me out. I know all i need to know about him-he is a loser and its time for me to fly.

I really hope i maintain this attitude and strength....if i dont, ya'll give me a swift kick in the ass!
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Old 06-11-2010, 07:53 PM
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Bottom is different for every one. I know those who only needed a short time and a tap on the shoulder, and others who couldn't hit bottom if they leapt into the Grand Canyon.

Concentrate your energy on someone who deserves your attention most...YOU and let him go wander off in a boozy haze.

God bless
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Old 06-11-2010, 08:06 PM
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L told me he was an alcoholic. He told my family he was an alcoholic. He hid his drinking from me and my family, but openly did it in front of some of his friends. Now he does it in front of all his friends. Does it make sense? No. Is it consistent? No. Will I/we ever understand it? No. Will it make sense if we analyze it? No. This is where the accepting things I cannot change comes into play.
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