Need Advice
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Need Advice
I do not contact my xah ever.
I used to contact him every time there was scheduled visitation to arrange it or see if he wanted to have them etc. After yet another onslaught of nasty crap, with one message saying to only contact him if there was a medical emergency with one of the kids, I quit doing that. If he contacts me to arrange a visit I never decline and always do whatever I need to do to make it happen.
So, not surprisingly, visits are never consistent, lots of them are missed and/or cut short. There is no way to put them on the calendar, nothing concrete for the kids. Nothing I can tell them as far as what to expect.
So today my oldest son wants very badly to go to his dad's house this weekend. There is no way his dad is going to contact me to arrange that. My kids know they can call their dad anytime they want (or email - I specifically set them each up with their own email account to do that) but they hardly ever do. They love to see him but on the phone it is difficult and they don't like it. I also don't think my son wants to put himself out there and be declined the visit, because obviously that would be crushing to him.
So, should I call or just tell my son that his dad is in charge of the visits and his dad makes the calls?
I don't want to be put in the position of managing his visitation again but I feel like I should call. It isn't my job to manage his relationship with the kids but I don't want my kid in the middle either. If I call this time, the boys will ask me to call every weekend, and my xah will certainly take it that I am responsible for this again. :sigh:
What would you do?
I used to contact him every time there was scheduled visitation to arrange it or see if he wanted to have them etc. After yet another onslaught of nasty crap, with one message saying to only contact him if there was a medical emergency with one of the kids, I quit doing that. If he contacts me to arrange a visit I never decline and always do whatever I need to do to make it happen.
So, not surprisingly, visits are never consistent, lots of them are missed and/or cut short. There is no way to put them on the calendar, nothing concrete for the kids. Nothing I can tell them as far as what to expect.
So today my oldest son wants very badly to go to his dad's house this weekend. There is no way his dad is going to contact me to arrange that. My kids know they can call their dad anytime they want (or email - I specifically set them each up with their own email account to do that) but they hardly ever do. They love to see him but on the phone it is difficult and they don't like it. I also don't think my son wants to put himself out there and be declined the visit, because obviously that would be crushing to him.
So, should I call or just tell my son that his dad is in charge of the visits and his dad makes the calls?
I don't want to be put in the position of managing his visitation again but I feel like I should call. It isn't my job to manage his relationship with the kids but I don't want my kid in the middle either. If I call this time, the boys will ask me to call every weekend, and my xah will certainly take it that I am responsible for this again. :sigh:
What would you do?
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Kansas
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That's a difficult situation, and I empathize.
My youngest daughter's father has been in AA over 30 years now, and was 12 years sober when I met him and got pregnant.
He had nothing to do with her until she started asking questions about her dad when she was eight. He only lives 35 miles from me.
Even though I was filled with fear and had no idea if he was still sober, I wrote a letter to him asking if he was interested in any sort of relationship with her.
He was very active with that for a year, and it gradually fizzled out. If it weren't for her stepmother, she wouldn't have had visits with him at all after that year. She spent most of her time with her stepmother.
His words, as visitation was fizzling out, was "Have her call me if she wants to see me."
Pardon me? Last time I checked, it was the parent's responsibility for the relationship.
She didn't want to call him. Even at that young age, she figured out that his interest was becoming nil.
I didn't call him either.
That's just my personal experience.
My youngest daughter's father has been in AA over 30 years now, and was 12 years sober when I met him and got pregnant.
He had nothing to do with her until she started asking questions about her dad when she was eight. He only lives 35 miles from me.
Even though I was filled with fear and had no idea if he was still sober, I wrote a letter to him asking if he was interested in any sort of relationship with her.
He was very active with that for a year, and it gradually fizzled out. If it weren't for her stepmother, she wouldn't have had visits with him at all after that year. She spent most of her time with her stepmother.
His words, as visitation was fizzling out, was "Have her call me if she wants to see me."
Pardon me? Last time I checked, it was the parent's responsibility for the relationship.
She didn't want to call him. Even at that young age, she figured out that his interest was becoming nil.
I didn't call him either.
That's just my personal experience.
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Originally Posted by MissFixit 
How old are your kids?
Originally Posted by anvilhead
in the best of cases, calling on FRIDAY to see about THIS weekend is very short notice and an almost guaranteed set up for failure. i would use this a learning experience for your son, that we can't always do what we want exactly when we want to but that if he wants to see his dad and/or spend time with him, you will help him make that contact.....help with the email, or dial the phone number.......for a FUTURE date.
I hear ya on the rest of your post.
xah called me on Wed. morning to say he lost our emails when he moved, which seems impossible - they are in your computer not on a sticky note, and he canceled the Wed. night visit.
So I send him the email addresses. He does not email the boys, but he does email me a link to a song called Pray for You by Jaron. :wtf2 He's a loon. I'm not sure why I shared that....maybe just to say my life would be easier if he'd just disappear to another state.
Psalm 118:24
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your ex is a piece of ****
guys like that give us divorced dads a bad name.
How old are the kids? It's terrible they have to be placed into this awkward situation
There's gong to be many times vcoming up, they'll have their social life and won't even be able to go to their dad's or care to!
I know this is wrong but, ever think of taking off with the kids when he's supposed to pick them up???
Is your husband working or, just doesn't want to spend time with them??
guys like that give us divorced dads a bad name.
How old are the kids? It's terrible they have to be placed into this awkward situation
There's gong to be many times vcoming up, they'll have their social life and won't even be able to go to their dad's or care to!
I know this is wrong but, ever think of taking off with the kids when he's supposed to pick them up???
Is your husband working or, just doesn't want to spend time with them??
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Location: Alaska
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Hi,
I've dealt with the same thing with my AH and 5 yo son. My son refuses to call his dad anymore because "daddy never answers anyway"; I've had to crawl under the bed after my son as he shrieks that "daddy hates me" when he doesn't show up after promising to do so. It's one of the most heartbreaking things I've had to deal since I made the decision to leave.
I don't call any more - it only makes it worse, because the answer is never what would be best for our son, only what is more convenient for AH.
Instead, when his calls don't get answered, I let him know that Daddy just doesn't remember how to be a daddy (because he doesn't). I assure him that he's loved so much and we think of something we can do together, even if it's just making jello or drawing. It doesn't erase the hurt, but it lets him know he is cherished and worth spending time with.
I've dealt with the same thing with my AH and 5 yo son. My son refuses to call his dad anymore because "daddy never answers anyway"; I've had to crawl under the bed after my son as he shrieks that "daddy hates me" when he doesn't show up after promising to do so. It's one of the most heartbreaking things I've had to deal since I made the decision to leave.
I don't call any more - it only makes it worse, because the answer is never what would be best for our son, only what is more convenient for AH.
Instead, when his calls don't get answered, I let him know that Daddy just doesn't remember how to be a daddy (because he doesn't). I assure him that he's loved so much and we think of something we can do together, even if it's just making jello or drawing. It doesn't erase the hurt, but it lets him know he is cherished and worth spending time with.
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Originally Posted by CAPTAINZING2000
I know this is wrong but, ever think of taking off with the kids when he's supposed to pick them up???
Is your husband working or, just doesn't want to spend time with them??
Is your husband working or, just doesn't want to spend time with them??
He just started working a couple of weeks ago. The job he wanted. He has a yard now so it should all be good but he whines about not having moved all his things yet, needing tires on his truck, no time to do anything....quack quack quack. I listen in stone silence until I can hang up or walk away. I can't even stand it.
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Thanks - and I forgot to update. We did call him together and left a message. Actually the kid called him three times - his phone is shut off. He also decided to send an email. Nothing yet.
He might be at work yet - we'll see what happens. We are getting ready to play some games at home. Hopefully it doesn't end in twin homicide, lol. Them and board games - eek.
Thanks for the feed back. I was having such a moment of anxiety about the whole deal.
He might be at work yet - we'll see what happens. We are getting ready to play some games at home. Hopefully it doesn't end in twin homicide, lol. Them and board games - eek.
Thanks for the feed back. I was having such a moment of anxiety about the whole deal.
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wow, what a bummer.
i don't think there's a perfect answer, cuz this situation sucks no matter how you slice it.
the thing i would consider, when in this sitch, is which answer would create the least amount of expectations. broken promises are not only hurtful when they are happening, but with a child who is still growing up, it can impact him very negatively. so, if it seems to be more effective to call for a spontaneous visit, i would do that. if having something set up creates a likelihood that the x will pull a no-show, i'd avoid that one. you know him best. i very well might get involved on the sly, like give a confirmation call a day or so before the arranged visit, so there was a better chance of follow through. stuff like that.
i don't think there's a perfect answer, cuz this situation sucks no matter how you slice it.
the thing i would consider, when in this sitch, is which answer would create the least amount of expectations. broken promises are not only hurtful when they are happening, but with a child who is still growing up, it can impact him very negatively. so, if it seems to be more effective to call for a spontaneous visit, i would do that. if having something set up creates a likelihood that the x will pull a no-show, i'd avoid that one. you know him best. i very well might get involved on the sly, like give a confirmation call a day or so before the arranged visit, so there was a better chance of follow through. stuff like that.
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Update.
No call to the 11yo. No response to the email from the 11yo's account.
Last night he sent an email to me however. "want my family back, stupid question i guess, but let me know what i have to do if your interested, miss you guys, bye xxxxx "
No call to the 11yo. No response to the email from the 11yo's account.
Last night he sent an email to me however. "want my family back, stupid question i guess, but let me know what i have to do if your interested, miss you guys, bye xxxxx "
To thine own self be true.
Join Date: May 2009
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Aw Thumper, I'm really sorry. But try to remember, just because you leave, just because you get divorced, doesn't mean they get better. In fact, they likely get worse. He couldn't handle the responsibility of being a parent BEFORE, right? I mean, wasn't that part of why you left in the first place? He has not changed. We can judge him, we can point our fingers at him all we want, we can tell him and the kids what he SHOULD do, we can antagonize him, but none of that helps, does it? It is healthier for us to accept that he is just not ABLE right now, and keep our selves out of the equation.
You can't protect your children from what they have to go through in order for them to get to where they need to go in their lives. I know they are just kids and you want to protect them but in every situation you have to ask yourself, what can I control? You know you cannot control the outcomes of ANY situation and to be honest, in my experience, whenever I do try to control the outcome, I make it WORSE. Whenever you are confronted with this problem, think of the serenity prayer: God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference.
Just as you pray for your OWN serenity, pray for those of your children, and teach your children also to pray for their own serenity. Of course, the words for them will be different because they are just little but still, you can teach them this, and it will help. Children need a Higher Power just as much as adults do, if not more.
Hope something here has been helpful to you. Take care.
You can't protect your children from what they have to go through in order for them to get to where they need to go in their lives. I know they are just kids and you want to protect them but in every situation you have to ask yourself, what can I control? You know you cannot control the outcomes of ANY situation and to be honest, in my experience, whenever I do try to control the outcome, I make it WORSE. Whenever you are confronted with this problem, think of the serenity prayer: God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference.
Just as you pray for your OWN serenity, pray for those of your children, and teach your children also to pray for their own serenity. Of course, the words for them will be different because they are just little but still, you can teach them this, and it will help. Children need a Higher Power just as much as adults do, if not more.
Hope something here has been helpful to you. Take care.
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Thank you L2L - I need that serenity prayer right now. You gave me a good reminder to put my energy in helping my kids find some serenity.
Stella - I haven't responded at all yet. I'm not sure I will but if I do it will be along the lines of that. It is futile though. Nothing will change. I know that.
It is all so exasperating.
Stella - I haven't responded at all yet. I'm not sure I will but if I do it will be along the lines of that. It is futile though. Nothing will change. I know that.
It is all so exasperating.
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I am triggered by this thread, as well, so I haven't posted yet. Your AH sounds just like mine was in the 5 or so months after I kicked him out. He's since gotten sober, and better about keeping his promises to his kids, but he still bags his responsibilities sometimes.
What I have done is try to manage their expectations. We have created a life without his involvement. It's not how I (or they) want it to be, but it is what it is. If he is to be involved with them, it's up to him. Sometimes, I still catch myself asking them if they have called him lately or made an effort to connect with him. I need to shut up and let them manage their own relationship with him. Granted, my children are older (13 and 17), so I can leave it more up to them.
I hate that they don't have an active, involved father in their lives. But, it's under the "accept the things I cannot change" heading. And, it's really a shame.
L
What I have done is try to manage their expectations. We have created a life without his involvement. It's not how I (or they) want it to be, but it is what it is. If he is to be involved with them, it's up to him. Sometimes, I still catch myself asking them if they have called him lately or made an effort to connect with him. I need to shut up and let them manage their own relationship with him. Granted, my children are older (13 and 17), so I can leave it more up to them.
I hate that they don't have an active, involved father in their lives. But, it's under the "accept the things I cannot change" heading. And, it's really a shame.
L
same planet...different world
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Butte, America
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Hiya Thumper -
Throw me in the 'triggered' batch as well!!!
*oh MAN am i sending prayers*
What you're describing is what I call the 'bottleneck' ...
meaning that -
your husband puts forth no effort to see his own kids.
your KIDS ... KNOW that if they call - it doesn't mean they'll see him.
And what is that junk...
*whiney voice*
I want my family back"
oh yeah?
Dude. PROVE IT.
I already KNOW what you are....
the only thing you're doing right now
is showing THEM what you really are as well...
oops! wordsfor my own ex there, not yours..
toldja it was a trigger.
ok okay... back to it...
Your kids are learning that love for them alone
isn't enough to make him be a father.
That's an important lesson
and in my opinion the earlier learned,
the better.
Because you aren't running yourself crazy
trying to keep an illusion 'for their sake'
which - go over to ACOA-
hardly ever works anyhow.
Kinda like staying up all night
to make sure they will still believe in the Easter Bunny.
We have to let our kids hurt sometimes...
because they have what THEY came here to learn as well.
Children can handle the truth better than we give them credit for.
It's when we learn that our lives have always been a lie
that it screws us up.
This is a time that they are going to need your support and wisdom from life experience more than ever before. The will need your kindness, and gentleness...
but not more illusion.
It will make you a TEAM
they have you - you have them...
and that part of the equation is never going to change.
Throw me in the 'triggered' batch as well!!!
*oh MAN am i sending prayers*
What you're describing is what I call the 'bottleneck' ...
meaning that -
your husband puts forth no effort to see his own kids.
your KIDS ... KNOW that if they call - it doesn't mean they'll see him.
And what is that junk...
*whiney voice*
I want my family back"
oh yeah?
Dude. PROVE IT.
I already KNOW what you are....
the only thing you're doing right now
is showing THEM what you really are as well...
oops! wordsfor my own ex there, not yours..
toldja it was a trigger.
ok okay... back to it...
Your kids are learning that love for them alone
isn't enough to make him be a father.
That's an important lesson
and in my opinion the earlier learned,
the better.
Because you aren't running yourself crazy
trying to keep an illusion 'for their sake'
which - go over to ACOA-
hardly ever works anyhow.
Kinda like staying up all night
to make sure they will still believe in the Easter Bunny.
We have to let our kids hurt sometimes...
because they have what THEY came here to learn as well.
Children can handle the truth better than we give them credit for.
It's when we learn that our lives have always been a lie
that it screws us up.
This is a time that they are going to need your support and wisdom from life experience more than ever before. The will need your kindness, and gentleness...
but not more illusion.
It will make you a TEAM
they have you - you have them...
and that part of the equation is never going to change.
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Thank you Barb. That was a wonderful post for me to read this morning.
Yes it is. Accept the things I cannot change. It is kind of easy to slip back into thinking 'if I do this one thing, or say the magical words' THEN he will get it but I *know* that isn't true. I just have to re-apply the same lessons to a different framework. Not me and him, children and him.
I still haven't responded to the email. If he doesn't 'get' that you consistently see and contact your own small children then nothing I say or do is going to make a difference.
Originally Posted by LaTeeDa
I hate that they don't have an active, involved father in their lives. But, it's under the "accept the things I cannot change" heading. And, it's really a shame.
L
L
I still haven't responded to the email. If he doesn't 'get' that you consistently see and contact your own small children then nothing I say or do is going to make a difference.
To thine own self be true.
Join Date: May 2009
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Lots of fathers, alcoholic and not, do not have relationships with their children, even when they live in the same home. I have heard many women complain about this. I'm not excusing a parent who chooses not to take care of their children, what I am saying is lots of people go through this and grow up to be okay.
I think also, the old school way of raising children was that children are to be raised by the mother, while the father goes to work. This was apparently pretty commonly accepted. Thank goodness this attitude is changing somewhat but we still have a long way to go in this department. My point is, Thumper, you are not alone, you do not have to feel alone. Knowing this is a universal problem also will help you to accept that it is not limited to just your family, and therefore not in your power to "fix" it. Your children are going to be okay.
I think also, the old school way of raising children was that children are to be raised by the mother, while the father goes to work. This was apparently pretty commonly accepted. Thank goodness this attitude is changing somewhat but we still have a long way to go in this department. My point is, Thumper, you are not alone, you do not have to feel alone. Knowing this is a universal problem also will help you to accept that it is not limited to just your family, and therefore not in your power to "fix" it. Your children are going to be okay.
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