Need help with a boundary...
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Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,906
Need help with a boundary...
Chino - you brought this up in a previous thread. It's MIL. I spoke with her the first time in about a week. AH is in jail. We spoke and she goes off on a tangent about how Ah's lawyer didn't call him back, blah, blah, blah. How AH didn't know he had to be in court. Total BS. AH KNEW he had to be to court, but tried to play it off on the lawyer like he didn't know. After AH's 1st no show lawyer didn't return his calls. MIL is trying to flip this like it's not AH's fault 100%. It IS his fault. He's playing everyone and she believes it. Maybe not deep down, but she'll save face to save him.
Anyway, MIL grates on my nerves anyway. She's now trying to play the card that although AH is 'wrong' doesn't deserve what he's getting. BS, total bs. He walked every step of the way to get there. AH would even agree with me if he were here.
So MIL starts to take this 'tone' with me tonight. I don't tolerate it and give it back to her. I try to hold my tongue, but I seriously feel my blood boil. It's everything that I have not to go through the phone. I then say I see we can't have a relationship with your son/ah involved. I'll deal with you when it comes to the kids/grandkids, but I won't subject myself to this anymore. She get's mad and says we're family and you should know me by now. Says I'm sick of everyone saying I'm mad. I say if EVERYONE is telling you this, maybe you should look introspectively. She then says I'm being irrational and hangs up.
My question...Those of you who know me and my struggles with MIL - what do you think is the best way to handle this? She doesn't see that her shining star isn't shining anymore. Do I lay it out that I won't talk about/deal with AH with her? She's ticked that I said I wouldn't go visit him on Sunday for visitation. I could go on and on and on with her, but I need to set a FIRM boundary. Just not sure if it should be strictly about the kids or not. I care about the woman and love her on my terms, but she's screwing with my sanity and I need to figure out what boundary I need to put in place.
I know you guys are probably getting sick of me not seeing the obvious. Maybe I just need validation and a hand holding right now. Lately with everything going on it seems I don't know up from down. Thanks again guys.
Anyway, MIL grates on my nerves anyway. She's now trying to play the card that although AH is 'wrong' doesn't deserve what he's getting. BS, total bs. He walked every step of the way to get there. AH would even agree with me if he were here.
So MIL starts to take this 'tone' with me tonight. I don't tolerate it and give it back to her. I try to hold my tongue, but I seriously feel my blood boil. It's everything that I have not to go through the phone. I then say I see we can't have a relationship with your son/ah involved. I'll deal with you when it comes to the kids/grandkids, but I won't subject myself to this anymore. She get's mad and says we're family and you should know me by now. Says I'm sick of everyone saying I'm mad. I say if EVERYONE is telling you this, maybe you should look introspectively. She then says I'm being irrational and hangs up.
My question...Those of you who know me and my struggles with MIL - what do you think is the best way to handle this? She doesn't see that her shining star isn't shining anymore. Do I lay it out that I won't talk about/deal with AH with her? She's ticked that I said I wouldn't go visit him on Sunday for visitation. I could go on and on and on with her, but I need to set a FIRM boundary. Just not sure if it should be strictly about the kids or not. I care about the woman and love her on my terms, but she's screwing with my sanity and I need to figure out what boundary I need to put in place.
I know you guys are probably getting sick of me not seeing the obvious. Maybe I just need validation and a hand holding right now. Lately with everything going on it seems I don't know up from down. Thanks again guys.
RIP Sweet Suki
Join Date: Apr 2008
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I'll deal with you when it comes to the kids/grandkids, but I won't subject myself to this anymore.
That right there sounds good to me. Reiterate that you will not discuss AH with her. If future conversations head in that direction, simply remind her that you don't want to know about any of that and you need to get off the phone (or leave) if you are talking in person, and then do so. After you do this a few times, she might get the message. If not, then just continue cutting her off when the conversation strays to areas you don't wish to discuss.
Be consistent. That is the most important thing. If you back down and discuss it with her once, she will continue to push. You can do this. Compared to what you've already been through, this is an easy one.
That right there sounds good to me. Reiterate that you will not discuss AH with her. If future conversations head in that direction, simply remind her that you don't want to know about any of that and you need to get off the phone (or leave) if you are talking in person, and then do so. After you do this a few times, she might get the message. If not, then just continue cutting her off when the conversation strays to areas you don't wish to discuss.
Be consistent. That is the most important thing. If you back down and discuss it with her once, she will continue to push. You can do this. Compared to what you've already been through, this is an easy one.
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Kansas
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Originally Posted by suki44883 
I'll deal with you when it comes to the kids/grandkids, but I won't subject myself to this anymore.
That right there sounds good to me.
That right there sounds good to me.
If you want to discuss your grandkids, that's fine. If you want to discuss AH, I will hang up. End of story.
I had to do this with my dad when he was in toxic mode while I was in the middle of a crisis with the youngest daughter.
I made it clear I would hang up if he started in on certain things.
After a couple of times of getting hung up on, he understood I was serious as a heart attack.
Short and sweet. It's the best way to deal with someone in the middle of the chaos.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,906
Thank YOU guys for the ball busting! I so needed that validation. I can, but so cannot believe she's flipping this to be something that was DONE to AH instead of something that HE DID, HE CHOSE!
She flipped it tonight and hung up on me because I was being irrational. Simply because I pointed out that AH needed to own up to his own actions. Where he's @ is not because of someone else, it's because it's the path that HE ChOSE!
OK, I know you guys know that I'm codie, but I guess I needed validation. I'm dealing with a MIL who funded Ah's addiction because she couldn't take him being sick. It's a love/hate relationship. Thanks guys. Just feelin' alone tonight. Movies watched, junk food ingested, right now the kids are rough housing and playing. Thought I'd put my concerns out there on SR.
She flipped it tonight and hung up on me because I was being irrational. Simply because I pointed out that AH needed to own up to his own actions. Where he's @ is not because of someone else, it's because it's the path that HE ChOSE!
OK, I know you guys know that I'm codie, but I guess I needed validation. I'm dealing with a MIL who funded Ah's addiction because she couldn't take him being sick. It's a love/hate relationship. Thanks guys. Just feelin' alone tonight. Movies watched, junk food ingested, right now the kids are rough housing and playing. Thought I'd put my concerns out there on SR.
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Kansas
Posts: 10,182
Callie, remember, she's a sick codependent, and it's just going to be circular, frustrating conversation with her when it comes to AH.
Short and sweet. Keep it that way with her.
You're doing great! :ghug3 :ghug3
Short and sweet. Keep it that way with her.
You're doing great! :ghug3 :ghug3
work in progress
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: the sunshine state
Posts: 623
I second what Freedom said.
Have his parents been going to Alanon? They could sure use the help. It's gotta be frustrating as well as many other dark emotions to have a child that is an addict.
They don't have the tools yet...but you do.
Maybe you can suggest this during your next (short but sweet) conversation.
You're doing great.
Have his parents been going to Alanon? They could sure use the help. It's gotta be frustrating as well as many other dark emotions to have a child that is an addict.
They don't have the tools yet...but you do.
Maybe you can suggest this during your next (short but sweet) conversation.
You're doing great.
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,287
Yep ~ she is incapable of seeing her son as he is ~ she's still in denial and may be for some time. What others said is right on, keep your discussions about your children and draw your boundaries there.
Just wanted to share something that may help in seeing how this might go on into the future.....
My exMIL, who was in denial and blamed me for everything (even the physical abuse), still, TO THIS DAY, cannot openly accept what a screw up her son is. We broke up over 13 years ago. 13 YEARS! He was mean, he was abusive, he was and is sick. But still, she holds some imaginary idea that if I leave my husband, I would/should go back to him.
She is not as bad as she used to be...at least now she shakes her head about what he's up to.....I feel bad for her but.....
13 years!!
Poor lady - she means well - she just doesn't know any better. Seriously.
Do what you need to for your kids, but know that she may never get passed this.
Just wanted to share something that may help in seeing how this might go on into the future.....
My exMIL, who was in denial and blamed me for everything (even the physical abuse), still, TO THIS DAY, cannot openly accept what a screw up her son is. We broke up over 13 years ago. 13 YEARS! He was mean, he was abusive, he was and is sick. But still, she holds some imaginary idea that if I leave my husband, I would/should go back to him.
She is not as bad as she used to be...at least now she shakes her head about what he's up to.....I feel bad for her but.....
13 years!!
Poor lady - she means well - she just doesn't know any better. Seriously.
Do what you need to for your kids, but know that she may never get passed this.
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: new york
Posts: 227
Even with Alanon, there comes a time that a "mommy" will always be a mommy. I've watched my exAB's mom spiral into a dramatic, protective and violent something I've never seen and she's been doing Alanon and Co-dependant no-more for years! I think you said it best when you will only interact because of the children. Stick with your boundaries! You are doing well...God Bless! 
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She flipped it tonight and hung up on me because I was being irrational. Simply because I pointed out that AH needed to own up to his own actions. Where he's @ is not because of someone else, it's because it's the path that HE ChOSE!
I agree with the boundary, but you can't have it both ways and enforce the boundary. You can't have a boundary that you won't talk about AH and then talk about him. See where I am going with this?
You have us to talk to, and meetings? MIL probably doesn't have anyone (her fault) and could use the support of a live meeting. Perhaps give her a schedule of meetings in your area, and maybe a copy of Codependent No More, and then let go of trying to change that which is not yours to change...another person.
Big hugs because I know this is hard, and I said what I said here hoping it may be helpful, not to criticize. You are doing very well.
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Location: Seattle, WA
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I suggest coming up with a short and to the point one sentence statement everytime she starts to talk about her son.
IE. "I've got to go now. Let's chat tomorrow."
If you stick with this every single time she mentions his name, then she will eventually get the picture.
Do not engage Callie. Walk away from the conversation.
My boundary and my consequence "I will not allow people to treat me in a manner that I consider disrespectful. Therefore if I think you are being disrespectful, I will end the conversation immediately."
I do not explain the whos, whats, whys and wheres. I don't try to reason. I just end the conversation. This is my perogitive as a human being.
You get to choose the kind of behavior you will allow in your life.
IE. "I've got to go now. Let's chat tomorrow."
If you stick with this every single time she mentions his name, then she will eventually get the picture.
Do not engage Callie. Walk away from the conversation.
My boundary and my consequence "I will not allow people to treat me in a manner that I consider disrespectful. Therefore if I think you are being disrespectful, I will end the conversation immediately."
I do not explain the whos, whats, whys and wheres. I don't try to reason. I just end the conversation. This is my perogitive as a human being.
You get to choose the kind of behavior you will allow in your life.
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Chicago area
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Originally Posted by Callie
I'm going to say 'MIL, I will not discuss AH with you. I know we don't see eye to eye when it comes to him'. Once I say that I will cut her off with 'gotta go' if she brings him up again.
"I know we don't see eye to eye when it comes to him" opens the door to negotiation. ( Trust me on this. I negotiate for a living)
You do not owe her any explanation.
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Join Date: Feb 2008
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Callie, is this a boundary with all his family members or just MIL?
I ask because you had some discomfort the other night when you were 100% out of the loop for a few hours. If your boundary is with all his family, be prepared for more discomfort.
I had to set the same boundary with my mom about my sister. My mom took it to the extreme and didn't inform me of anything, either. Stuff like my sister moving overseas with my nephews. I had to remind my highly intelligent mother there's a difference between passing along info and discussion.
My sister and I are bound together until death do us part because of inheritance issues. It is imperative that we are able to contact each other, or at least our attorneys, various government agencies, and lessees we have to deal with.
On a good note, the limited contact my sister and I share has become civil and even cordial. We exchange information now, personal and business, but do not discuss it. Neither one of us wants the others opinion or baggage and we know where it will lead.
Because of boundaries, my mother and I are able to enjoy each others company now. We both know our limitations and accept/respect them.
It took four long extremely painful years to get to this point, after going no contact with my sister and severely limited contact with my mother. We're all control freaks and couldn't respect each others boundaries, because we had no personal boundaries.
My daughter's addiction and my recovery, working those steps, has brought about this truce. Someone had to take the first step and it had to be me.
I ask because you had some discomfort the other night when you were 100% out of the loop for a few hours. If your boundary is with all his family, be prepared for more discomfort.
I had to set the same boundary with my mom about my sister. My mom took it to the extreme and didn't inform me of anything, either. Stuff like my sister moving overseas with my nephews. I had to remind my highly intelligent mother there's a difference between passing along info and discussion.
My sister and I are bound together until death do us part because of inheritance issues. It is imperative that we are able to contact each other, or at least our attorneys, various government agencies, and lessees we have to deal with.
On a good note, the limited contact my sister and I share has become civil and even cordial. We exchange information now, personal and business, but do not discuss it. Neither one of us wants the others opinion or baggage and we know where it will lead.
Because of boundaries, my mother and I are able to enjoy each others company now. We both know our limitations and accept/respect them.
It took four long extremely painful years to get to this point, after going no contact with my sister and severely limited contact with my mother. We're all control freaks and couldn't respect each others boundaries, because we had no personal boundaries.
My daughter's addiction and my recovery, working those steps, has brought about this truce. Someone had to take the first step and it had to be me.
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Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,906
I know we don't see eye to eye when it comes to him
Good Point Outto. Thank you for pointing that out.
Anvil, I will limit contact with her especially, but with all of the family as well.
Chino, I will take the discomfort of not knowing, rather than the discomfort of knowing. AH is where he's at and nothing will change, so the contact should drastically change. SIL and I have a good relationship, I do better dealing with MIL through her anyway.
The convo with MIL still has me spinning and I hate the way it makes me feel. Prior to all of this I wanted to know what was going on with AH, but knowing can almost become debilatating. Worry, anxious, shaky, nervous. It's like I can't calm down. From here on out though there should be nothing left to talk about.
Good Point Outto. Thank you for pointing that out.
Anvil, I will limit contact with her especially, but with all of the family as well.
Chino, I will take the discomfort of not knowing, rather than the discomfort of knowing. AH is where he's at and nothing will change, so the contact should drastically change. SIL and I have a good relationship, I do better dealing with MIL through her anyway.
The convo with MIL still has me spinning and I hate the way it makes me feel. Prior to all of this I wanted to know what was going on with AH, but knowing can almost become debilatating. Worry, anxious, shaky, nervous. It's like I can't calm down. From here on out though there should be nothing left to talk about.
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Remember how long it took for you to REALLY see AH for what he "is today" and not for what he "was"? You have had benefit of superior counsel and friendship from SR from people who know and have lived what your husband and you also are experiencing. MIL is flapping in the wind trying to make sense of all this and with him being her son....geeze! If he gets out of jail and chooses to continue his path of distruction, maybe one day, she will see it. Hell, maybe if he gets healthy, HE can explain it to her and maybe then she will come to believe that none of this is Callie's fault.
Does MIL accept that her other son is a heroin addict too or is she the same way about him? I cannot imagine what it must be like and what kind of blame one could place on themselves if they had two addict sons! Someone here knows that pain and it probably took them quite a while to accept that it's not their fault, it's not their's to control or cure...
All you can do is take care of you and the kids Callie. Point her in the right direction but do not engage.
You are doing so well and we are all so proud of you! Praying for you girl!
Does MIL accept that her other son is a heroin addict too or is she the same way about him? I cannot imagine what it must be like and what kind of blame one could place on themselves if they had two addict sons! Someone here knows that pain and it probably took them quite a while to accept that it's not their fault, it's not their's to control or cure...
All you can do is take care of you and the kids Callie. Point her in the right direction but do not engage.
You are doing so well and we are all so proud of you! Praying for you girl!
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Location: Seattle, WA
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I ask because you had some discomfort the other night when you were 100% out of the loop for a few hours. If your boundary is with all his family, be prepared for more discomfort.
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