I am still here: UpDATE and cautionary tale
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,175
I am still here: UpDATE and cautionary tale
HI. I wrote at the end of last month that my ex-ish A was going to move in for financial reasons, that I had written a list of guidelines, and that my older friend had given me some money to stash to feel like I had options.
here is what has happened...
Well. He moved in on March 3, and he was fine for that night; supportive, nice, not acting ancy, not acting like it was KILLING him to be in a nice house with his son. He also insisted on paying a $200 cable bill, so "his son
doesn't have to feel like a poor child."
On March 4, I made dinner, we ate. My son was in bed by 9 and trying to sleep in spite of the excitement of his daddy being in the house..Its a small house, and he will stay awake if he hears a lot of noise, so I keep pretty quiet for about 40 minutes after I tuck him in. We went over that in the guidelines. We can watch TV, etc, just no big sounds for a bit. After boy sleeps he is like a rock, but getting there requires some quiet.
Well, A started acting ancy. Would not take off his coat after smoking outside, I knew he was going to say he had to go out. I agreed that that would be fine, if he did not stay late, and stayed in the neighborhood. He was waiting for his ride, but had on clacky boots, and was walking...well, pacing. Everytime he clacked by, my son would yell, "daddy?"
I gently reminded him, that son was already kind of jazzed up, and could he either not pace, go downstairs, or take off the boots. I was calm, light hearted, even, just reminded him that our day could not end until child sleeps.
He felt that was petty. Then he left. HE called me stupid, and told me to shut up. Both were violations of the guidelines.
He only stayed out for an hour. He came home, attempted to bed down on the couch with a six pack. That is not OK, I said, as per the guidelines. The reason for this, is that when my son wakes up for school, I do not feel it appropriate for him to try to rouse his dad and not be able to. It is upsetting for him, and I just dont want that in his world as normal. Beer cans strewn about,passed out daddy etc...yuck.
I told him, we will have to re discuss the guidelines in the morning, and I was feeling a little annoyed.
In the morning I said we need to talk this through. He said, "print the list out. I dont want to sit and talk." HE also said he was going to block me on facebook so he did not have to see my "inane" posts. I said if that is what you are about you might need to go, that we need to discuss this stuff, we need to be on the same team. He sat quietly, and I said, look, I dont want you to go. I just want to discuss the list again. HE refused.
In about an hour, he put on his clothes, took his beer, and said, as he left," I would rather live in my van than deal with this NAzi bull.I am leaving."
I knew he had used his last money on the rent here, and the cable bill, which was foolish.
He drove off. I called him several times, and offered to meet and discuss the guidelines.
He refused, and it only took an hour before he was claiming that I "Threw him out on his a$$, again, for no reason."
I continued to offer to meet.
At 9pm. I called, and I said, "Look, it is hard for both of us to adjust. We need to have rules for our sons' sake. I will meet you and discuss this if you are willing, but without talking about it, I cannot have you back. "
He said he would meet me in the morning. OK, I said, "BUT...if you go to another womans' house or apartment to stay, there is going to be a serious problem. I am not willing, under any circumstance, to deal with ONE MORE female on the other end of this thing. If you choose to stay with a woman, it is going to be really hard for you to come back here, at all. " The guidelines were clear about other women.
He said, "of course."
That night, I had several missed calls. I saw him next morning. He looked terrible. He had missed work. He told his boss, who is his cousin that he had been thrown out for no reason.
He refused to talk. blamed me for missing work, and informed me that he had had to begin staying with a 21 year old college girl that was his "friend".
She drives him to and from the bar. He claims she is just friend. I did not speak to him for a week.
After a week, he called suicidal. Begged for me to help him. I asked if he was ready for in patient. he said yes. He came to my house, slept in the basement, and the next day, I drove him to an in patient dual diagnosis clinic. He made it into the evaluation, but when security came to check him for weapons, the staff had not informed him why they were there, and he ran. He was agitated, paranoid. He thought I had called security, and that I was trying to lock him down.
He is now staying with his 21 year old. No one knows where she lives, who she is..etc.
His boss gave him a few weeks to get treatment...but now he is angry since he did not actually go. A is now saying that he is going to train himself to get well by running, he ran 2 miles yesterday. He will cut back his alcohol intake alone, and maybe he will get medicated via a psychiatrist, he said yesterday morning. Then later in the afternoon, he was feeling so good, he decided he could do it all alone, no meds, no psych.
Then I got 2 calls yesterday saying it was the pressure that I put on him to provide for our son that broke him, and since I want him to be healthy and not kill himself so much, then I would be glad to hear that he would not be returning to work, and that he hopes I have good luck finding another way to pay for our child.
As for me...I though I was doing relatively OK. Even though I have had a real ugly mood, and I am angry. He has told anyone who will listen that I "conned him into paying my rent, before tossing him out"
I felt pretty detached until yesterday late afternoon...
I was at the park with my son, enjoying the sunshine. I guess I was wound up a little tighter than I thought. I was watching him play, and feeling OK, when I turned around, and saw a familiar figure walking toward the swings, where we were.
She was the Russian girl that had initially driven the major wedge between A and I back when he lived with her secretly. It had lasted on and off for years. She was an especially wounded person, and had enabled him in ways that you may not believe if I told you. She would nurse him with vodka.. She was raised in Russia by an alcoholic father, and she acted essentially as a maid to him. She was obviously acting out her own crap, but she drove him so far back from progress. I know it is really his blame , but this woman was not kind, or embarrassed when I discovered them, and he came back home.
It was a very dark and sick time for me. SHe had emailed me after the fact calling me an old disgusting pig, saying that she had heard how psycho I was from him, and that with a mother like me, my child would commit suicide by the time he was 10 years old.
She lives in an entirely other part of town. I have not seen her for years. She is a model. She weighs 95 pounds. She is some one that I thought many times about confronting, setting her straight...I had even felt sorry for her at times, since he had filled her with so much bull about what our life was about.
And there I was, at the park with my son, and she was walking over to get onto a swing next to him.
I am not proud of this, but, I snapped. I grabbed my child, picked him up. I yelled at her to stay the F&ck away from us. I yelled that she was a sick person for trying to approach us, here, at a park!! WTF!! She sat there, on the swing, smirking at me smugly.
I took my son and went home. I had to explain to him that I acted badly, and that she was someone who hurt my feelings long ago, and that I should have just quietly walked away.
Life sucks right now for me. My sons dad has one relatively decent and sane brother who lives across the country. He has been calling and discussing how to deal with him...He does not want to hear "gory details" He does not want to be my psychologist, he just wants to "get his brother the help he needs."
I cannot save him. I am scared he is going to turn up dead.
here is what has happened...
Well. He moved in on March 3, and he was fine for that night; supportive, nice, not acting ancy, not acting like it was KILLING him to be in a nice house with his son. He also insisted on paying a $200 cable bill, so "his son
doesn't have to feel like a poor child."
On March 4, I made dinner, we ate. My son was in bed by 9 and trying to sleep in spite of the excitement of his daddy being in the house..Its a small house, and he will stay awake if he hears a lot of noise, so I keep pretty quiet for about 40 minutes after I tuck him in. We went over that in the guidelines. We can watch TV, etc, just no big sounds for a bit. After boy sleeps he is like a rock, but getting there requires some quiet.
Well, A started acting ancy. Would not take off his coat after smoking outside, I knew he was going to say he had to go out. I agreed that that would be fine, if he did not stay late, and stayed in the neighborhood. He was waiting for his ride, but had on clacky boots, and was walking...well, pacing. Everytime he clacked by, my son would yell, "daddy?"
I gently reminded him, that son was already kind of jazzed up, and could he either not pace, go downstairs, or take off the boots. I was calm, light hearted, even, just reminded him that our day could not end until child sleeps.
He felt that was petty. Then he left. HE called me stupid, and told me to shut up. Both were violations of the guidelines.
He only stayed out for an hour. He came home, attempted to bed down on the couch with a six pack. That is not OK, I said, as per the guidelines. The reason for this, is that when my son wakes up for school, I do not feel it appropriate for him to try to rouse his dad and not be able to. It is upsetting for him, and I just dont want that in his world as normal. Beer cans strewn about,passed out daddy etc...yuck.
I told him, we will have to re discuss the guidelines in the morning, and I was feeling a little annoyed.
In the morning I said we need to talk this through. He said, "print the list out. I dont want to sit and talk." HE also said he was going to block me on facebook so he did not have to see my "inane" posts. I said if that is what you are about you might need to go, that we need to discuss this stuff, we need to be on the same team. He sat quietly, and I said, look, I dont want you to go. I just want to discuss the list again. HE refused.
In about an hour, he put on his clothes, took his beer, and said, as he left," I would rather live in my van than deal with this NAzi bull.I am leaving."
I knew he had used his last money on the rent here, and the cable bill, which was foolish.
He drove off. I called him several times, and offered to meet and discuss the guidelines.
He refused, and it only took an hour before he was claiming that I "Threw him out on his a$$, again, for no reason."
I continued to offer to meet.
At 9pm. I called, and I said, "Look, it is hard for both of us to adjust. We need to have rules for our sons' sake. I will meet you and discuss this if you are willing, but without talking about it, I cannot have you back. "
He said he would meet me in the morning. OK, I said, "BUT...if you go to another womans' house or apartment to stay, there is going to be a serious problem. I am not willing, under any circumstance, to deal with ONE MORE female on the other end of this thing. If you choose to stay with a woman, it is going to be really hard for you to come back here, at all. " The guidelines were clear about other women.
He said, "of course."
That night, I had several missed calls. I saw him next morning. He looked terrible. He had missed work. He told his boss, who is his cousin that he had been thrown out for no reason.
He refused to talk. blamed me for missing work, and informed me that he had had to begin staying with a 21 year old college girl that was his "friend".
She drives him to and from the bar. He claims she is just friend. I did not speak to him for a week.
After a week, he called suicidal. Begged for me to help him. I asked if he was ready for in patient. he said yes. He came to my house, slept in the basement, and the next day, I drove him to an in patient dual diagnosis clinic. He made it into the evaluation, but when security came to check him for weapons, the staff had not informed him why they were there, and he ran. He was agitated, paranoid. He thought I had called security, and that I was trying to lock him down.
He is now staying with his 21 year old. No one knows where she lives, who she is..etc.
His boss gave him a few weeks to get treatment...but now he is angry since he did not actually go. A is now saying that he is going to train himself to get well by running, he ran 2 miles yesterday. He will cut back his alcohol intake alone, and maybe he will get medicated via a psychiatrist, he said yesterday morning. Then later in the afternoon, he was feeling so good, he decided he could do it all alone, no meds, no psych.
Then I got 2 calls yesterday saying it was the pressure that I put on him to provide for our son that broke him, and since I want him to be healthy and not kill himself so much, then I would be glad to hear that he would not be returning to work, and that he hopes I have good luck finding another way to pay for our child.
As for me...I though I was doing relatively OK. Even though I have had a real ugly mood, and I am angry. He has told anyone who will listen that I "conned him into paying my rent, before tossing him out"
I felt pretty detached until yesterday late afternoon...
I was at the park with my son, enjoying the sunshine. I guess I was wound up a little tighter than I thought. I was watching him play, and feeling OK, when I turned around, and saw a familiar figure walking toward the swings, where we were.
She was the Russian girl that had initially driven the major wedge between A and I back when he lived with her secretly. It had lasted on and off for years. She was an especially wounded person, and had enabled him in ways that you may not believe if I told you. She would nurse him with vodka.. She was raised in Russia by an alcoholic father, and she acted essentially as a maid to him. She was obviously acting out her own crap, but she drove him so far back from progress. I know it is really his blame , but this woman was not kind, or embarrassed when I discovered them, and he came back home.
It was a very dark and sick time for me. SHe had emailed me after the fact calling me an old disgusting pig, saying that she had heard how psycho I was from him, and that with a mother like me, my child would commit suicide by the time he was 10 years old.
She lives in an entirely other part of town. I have not seen her for years. She is a model. She weighs 95 pounds. She is some one that I thought many times about confronting, setting her straight...I had even felt sorry for her at times, since he had filled her with so much bull about what our life was about.
And there I was, at the park with my son, and she was walking over to get onto a swing next to him.
I am not proud of this, but, I snapped. I grabbed my child, picked him up. I yelled at her to stay the F&ck away from us. I yelled that she was a sick person for trying to approach us, here, at a park!! WTF!! She sat there, on the swing, smirking at me smugly.
I took my son and went home. I had to explain to him that I acted badly, and that she was someone who hurt my feelings long ago, and that I should have just quietly walked away.
Life sucks right now for me. My sons dad has one relatively decent and sane brother who lives across the country. He has been calling and discussing how to deal with him...He does not want to hear "gory details" He does not want to be my psychologist, he just wants to "get his brother the help he needs."
I cannot save him. I am scared he is going to turn up dead.
RIP Sweet Suki
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: In my sanctuary, my home
Posts: 39,894
Sorry he crapped all over your guidelines. It's obvious he has no desire to abide by them. I hope you have scrapped the idea of him living with you and your son. All it's going to do is confuse and hurt your son in the long run.
He obviously has other options so far as having a place to stay goes. Let him exercise those options and you direct your energy in areas where you have control. He's a big boy and can take care of himself. Your son can't, so concentrate on what is best for him and yourself. ((((HUGS))))
He obviously has other options so far as having a place to stay goes. Let him exercise those options and you direct your energy in areas where you have control. He's a big boy and can take care of himself. Your son can't, so concentrate on what is best for him and yourself. ((((HUGS))))
Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 1,149
(()) although I have no crystal ball BG, he is no more likely than the average person to turn up dead right now, he is still skillfully bringing a host of people to his aid; young women, his boss, his brother, spinning them round, creating drama, still ending up able to disapear from home/work/social responsibilities and then somehow waltz back in as if normal rules don't apply to him, all the while scattering blame, confusion and abuse as he goes. We can leave him to himself, and to them if they wish.
forgive yourself the outburst, you don't owe her courtesy and you are in pain, but try not to hang responsibility for his actions on her, she is an easy target, you never loved or counted on her, if you give her responsibility (mentally) for his actions, you risk not seeing him clearly.
What do you need right now? xx
forgive yourself the outburst, you don't owe her courtesy and you are in pain, but try not to hang responsibility for his actions on her, she is an easy target, you never loved or counted on her, if you give her responsibility (mentally) for his actions, you risk not seeing him clearly.
What do you need right now? xx
Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 534
I'm sorry Buffalo. Hugs to you. You sound like you're really down and worn out, but you still sound really strong. Your son is really lucky to have a mom like you. My kids woke up too many mornings to a passed out dad and a living room full of beer cans. Stay strong, and please take care of yourself.
Member
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Sweden
Posts: 1,649
Oh, that all sounds so hard to deal with!
I have never had to deal with an alcoholic husband. I always looked for non-drinking men because I am the drinker, and I always hoped they would help me stay on the straight and narrow. (!!!!!)
But, I have been codependent to 3 alcoholic brothers and am trying to break the ties of enabling in my own recovery.
ALL the enabling issues I have with my 3 active alcoholic brothers are financial. I really can relate to your post and I know how you feel about having to deal with active drinkers regarding money.
The only thing that really sent off some warning bells in your post was the "guidelines".
That shifts so much onto your plate: it turns you into keeper, warden, supervisor, parent, discipliner....etcetera.
Putting yourself into the role of making rules for him goes a lot beyond setting boundaries for yourself. Frankly, I would be exhausted if I had to keep that many tabs on anyone. Any adult. What a lot of work!
It sounds like things may have worked out in your favor despite all his dramatic behavior. Because he left.
I wouldn't feel bad at all about any money he may have contributed to the family finances. Fine. He should have been doing that anyway without having to trade that money off for doing what he should have been doing anyway!
I have never had to deal with an alcoholic husband. I always looked for non-drinking men because I am the drinker, and I always hoped they would help me stay on the straight and narrow. (!!!!!)
But, I have been codependent to 3 alcoholic brothers and am trying to break the ties of enabling in my own recovery.
HI. I wrote at the end of last month that my ex-ish A was going to move in for financial reasons, that I had written a list of guidelines,
The only thing that really sent off some warning bells in your post was the "guidelines".
That shifts so much onto your plate: it turns you into keeper, warden, supervisor, parent, discipliner....etcetera.
Putting yourself into the role of making rules for him goes a lot beyond setting boundaries for yourself. Frankly, I would be exhausted if I had to keep that many tabs on anyone. Any adult. What a lot of work!
It sounds like things may have worked out in your favor despite all his dramatic behavior. Because he left.
I wouldn't feel bad at all about any money he may have contributed to the family finances. Fine. He should have been doing that anyway without having to trade that money off for doing what he should have been doing anyway!
Member
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: PM me
Posts: 324
Originally Posted by JenT1968 
(()) although I have no crystal ball BG, he is no more likely than the average person to turn up dead right now, he is still skillfully bringing a host of people to his aid; young women, his boss, his brother, spinning them round, creating drama, still ending up able to disapear from home/work/social responsibilities and then somehow waltz back in as if normal rules don't apply to him, all the while scattering blame, confusion and abuse as he goes. We can leave him to himself, and to them if they wish.
xx
xx
Hang in there Buff. And I agree, you have no reason to feel bad for loosing your cool! What the hell was she trying to do? Crazzzy.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,582
Buffalo,
Hugs. We live and we learn, you know? He has shown you that you cannot trust this man, he is dangerous and unstable. He has proven that he is a liability in your life.
What can you do from here to remove the liability?
Miss
Hugs. We live and we learn, you know? He has shown you that you cannot trust this man, he is dangerous and unstable. He has proven that he is a liability in your life.
What can you do from here to remove the liability?
Miss
Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Wizard Land Downunder
Posts: 2,615
Buffalo, he didn't take long to crap on your guidelines and upset your home, did he?
I guess he has gotten away with this dumb behavior so often before, as is shown by his boss and bro still "helping", that he believes he is 10 ft tall and bulletproof.
Please scrub handing him guidelines, or expecting him to follow them or any acceptable rules of behavior.....he is nothing but a rebel without a cause...a pain in the butt.
Your son needs his dad's quacking, boozing and general stupid actions like a hole in the head, and that applies to you as well.
He has too many folk running after him, taking on care and concern for him, and besides, he is enjoying himself blaming you for it all, you almighty and powerful being, you. So count his suicide comments as more flapping of his lips, and leave him be, to live where he wants, and staying out of your home, hair and life.
Concentrate on yourself and your son, pamper yourselves and don't give old Grumpy drawers another thought.
God bless
I guess he has gotten away with this dumb behavior so often before, as is shown by his boss and bro still "helping", that he believes he is 10 ft tall and bulletproof.
Please scrub handing him guidelines, or expecting him to follow them or any acceptable rules of behavior.....he is nothing but a rebel without a cause...a pain in the butt.
Your son needs his dad's quacking, boozing and general stupid actions like a hole in the head, and that applies to you as well.
He has too many folk running after him, taking on care and concern for him, and besides, he is enjoying himself blaming you for it all, you almighty and powerful being, you. So count his suicide comments as more flapping of his lips, and leave him be, to live where he wants, and staying out of your home, hair and life.
Concentrate on yourself and your son, pamper yourselves and don't give old Grumpy drawers another thought.
God bless
Member
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 223
Guidelines
You might have more success with guidelines if you make them for yourself rather than for him.
What might be some good guidelines for you? I'm thinking maybe starting with something like: 1. Never let him spend the night in your house again, etc...
You can enforce your guidelines for yourself, you cannot enforce your guidelines for him.
HE called me stupid, and told me to shut up.
How dare he do this to you in your own house when you are doing him a favor? Did your son hear this? Outrageous. If he were the father of my child, he'd never step beyond the front porch after that.
I would rather live in my van than deal with this NAzi bull.
Good, he has options. Next time he whines about not having any place to stay, remind him he would be happier in his van.
He refused to talk.
Smart man. Consider following his example. Do you need to know what lies he's telling his boss about missing work? Do you need to know where he is and with whom and if he looks good or bad? Imagine how much simpler your life would be if you didn't talk to him.
After a week, he called suicidal. Begged for me to help him. I asked if he was ready for in patient.
You can't help him. If he was really suicidal and wanted help, he could call 911. My guess is 911 is easier to dial than ###-###-#### whatever your number is. Why does he need you to take him to inpatient? Why not his boss-cousin or his brother or his codependent girlfriend? Why does it have to be you? Why do you want it to be you?
I knew he had used his last money on the rent here, and the cable bill, which was foolish.
I don't think it was foolish at all. Far better the money is spent on you and your son than on liquor. At least you got something out of all the aggravation he put you through. My guess is if he had a little self discipline, he'd have enough money for rent and cable. Not your fault he has no self discipline.
His boss gave him a few weeks to get treatment...but now he is angry since he did not actually go. A is now saying that he is going to train himself to get well by running, he ran 2 miles yesterday. He will cut back his alcohol intake alone, and maybe he will get medicated via a psychiatrist, he said yesterday morning. Then later in the afternoon, he was feeling so good, he decided he could do it all alone, no meds, no psych.
Well, of course this is all stupid. It will fail, but what does any of it have to do with you. I knew a guy who thought he could cure himself of alcoholism (not that he had it mind you) by eating only tuna. Need I tell you it didn't work?
Wouldn't it be easier on you not to get so involved in him fixing himself? You have no control. It's just futile and frustrating.
Last night I saw this program about hoarders. A woman loved her boyfriend very much, then she went over to his house and saw every bit of floor covered with at least 3 feet of trash, some of it stacked in piles six and seven feet high. He was neat as a pin at her house, so it didn't affect her. But she looked at it and said she was going to have to break it off with him. She loved him but she had her own life and she liked it and this was a problem so big, and deep, and severe, she just wasn't willing to take it on. She wasn't willing to go down with him. She had that much self respect.
Let him do whatever he wants to get well--or not. When he's been sober for 15 months you'll talk again. But until then, let it go for your own sake and your son's. You aren't helping him any more than that Russian girl is helping him...and you are hurting yourself. She thinks she loves him too.
... it was the pressure that I put on him to provide for our son that broke him, and since I want him to be healthy and not kill himself so much, then I would be glad to hear that he would not be returning to work, and that he hopes I have good luck finding another way to pay for our child.
What an ass. Let's let our 5 year old starve to death and be homeless so Daddy doesn't have to stress himself out to provide. Better yet, maybe your 5year old should be put out to work to support Daddy (sarcasm).
File for child support and whatever else you are entitled to and ask the judge to impute income to him. He's a young, healthy male capable of working who got himself fired for irresponsible behavior.
Then set up your life to support your child yourself. Let the arrearages in support accumulate, someday you'll get the money, even if you have to get it from disability or social security, or by putting a lien on any property he might acquire in the future (perhaps from a future wife or a lawuit or an inheritance).
When the arrearages hit $5000, they'll take his driver's license, put him in treatment programs, take professional licenses, passports, etc... Let it get up to about $50,000 and states start looking at felony charges. Also, when your child support arrearages get high enough, judges stop upholding deadbeat daddy's rights. It's easier to get supervised visitation (which all drunks should have) when daddy owes $25,000 than when daddy owes nothing. Let arrearages hit a certain level, judges let you take your child out of state for new marriages, jobs, or educational opportunities.
He might be feeling smug and powerful right now telling you eff off and support our kid yourself, but it will be short-lived.
Per Federal law you can file for child support, married, separated, single or whatever status for about $25. Every state has a way to do this; states' Federal funding depends on this. Apply and let the process start. It's slow, but steady, and inexorable. So don't count on it to provide income for a while. But eventually it will pay off. And the sooner you start, the sooner it will pay off.
It will make you feel less powerless as well.
I grabbed my child, picked him up. I yelled at her to stay the F&ck away from us. I yelled that she was a sick person for trying to approach us, here, at a park!! WTF!! She sat there, on the swing, smirking at me smugly.
It's hard to understand right now, maybe, but she's not the problem. She's a victim too. Just like you. A victim of alcoholic inadequate parents, a victim of the same con artist who has ensnared you.
There's nothing wrong with you yelling at her. She set the situation up in such a way that it was very likely to end badly. I know you like to think you have more class than to yell at her, but she brought out the mamma bear in you. Forgive yourself for it. And stay away from her and block her emails. Her future is your life and worse. She's to be pitied. She hasn't won anything, that smirking smugness is nothing but ignorance that when she looks at your, she's looking at her own future...and likely her future will be worse.
My sons dad has one relatively decent and sane brother who lives across the country. He has been calling and discussing how to deal with him...He does not want to hear "gory details" He does not want to be my psychologist, he just wants to "get his brother the help he needs."
This makes me angry on your behalf. This brother is not your friend. He doesn't care what injustices and outrages his brother perpetrates on you or your child (the 'gory details'). He doesn't care about your hurt feelings, confusion, or pain ('being your psychologist'). He wants to use you--even at the detriment to you and your son--to help his brother. You are a tool for him, one that will be discarded once brother is fixed or you break. You don't matter.
If the relatively sane brother really cared about your XA, he'd jump on a plane and sort it out in person. But he doesn't want to get too involved, he doesn't want to mess up his own life with the 'gory details'--he's got you for that. Please consider cutting off this brother. He can deal with his brother directly instead of doing the dysfunctional thing in pulling you into triangulation. Why isn't he talking to XA and cousin-boss and leaving you alone?
I cannot save him. I am scared he is going to turn up dead.
You are right, you cannot save him. And we are all going to turn up dead some day. Focus on your life and your son's life and let him work out the details of his own. Everyone will be better off for it.
Good luck to you and lots of hugs. Drop the rope and walk away. You'll be so much happier.
What might be some good guidelines for you? I'm thinking maybe starting with something like: 1. Never let him spend the night in your house again, etc...
You can enforce your guidelines for yourself, you cannot enforce your guidelines for him.
HE called me stupid, and told me to shut up.
How dare he do this to you in your own house when you are doing him a favor? Did your son hear this? Outrageous. If he were the father of my child, he'd never step beyond the front porch after that.
I would rather live in my van than deal with this NAzi bull.
Good, he has options. Next time he whines about not having any place to stay, remind him he would be happier in his van.
He refused to talk.
Smart man. Consider following his example. Do you need to know what lies he's telling his boss about missing work? Do you need to know where he is and with whom and if he looks good or bad? Imagine how much simpler your life would be if you didn't talk to him.
After a week, he called suicidal. Begged for me to help him. I asked if he was ready for in patient.
You can't help him. If he was really suicidal and wanted help, he could call 911. My guess is 911 is easier to dial than ###-###-#### whatever your number is. Why does he need you to take him to inpatient? Why not his boss-cousin or his brother or his codependent girlfriend? Why does it have to be you? Why do you want it to be you?
I knew he had used his last money on the rent here, and the cable bill, which was foolish.
I don't think it was foolish at all. Far better the money is spent on you and your son than on liquor. At least you got something out of all the aggravation he put you through. My guess is if he had a little self discipline, he'd have enough money for rent and cable. Not your fault he has no self discipline.
His boss gave him a few weeks to get treatment...but now he is angry since he did not actually go. A is now saying that he is going to train himself to get well by running, he ran 2 miles yesterday. He will cut back his alcohol intake alone, and maybe he will get medicated via a psychiatrist, he said yesterday morning. Then later in the afternoon, he was feeling so good, he decided he could do it all alone, no meds, no psych.
Well, of course this is all stupid. It will fail, but what does any of it have to do with you. I knew a guy who thought he could cure himself of alcoholism (not that he had it mind you) by eating only tuna. Need I tell you it didn't work?
Wouldn't it be easier on you not to get so involved in him fixing himself? You have no control. It's just futile and frustrating.
Last night I saw this program about hoarders. A woman loved her boyfriend very much, then she went over to his house and saw every bit of floor covered with at least 3 feet of trash, some of it stacked in piles six and seven feet high. He was neat as a pin at her house, so it didn't affect her. But she looked at it and said she was going to have to break it off with him. She loved him but she had her own life and she liked it and this was a problem so big, and deep, and severe, she just wasn't willing to take it on. She wasn't willing to go down with him. She had that much self respect.
Let him do whatever he wants to get well--or not. When he's been sober for 15 months you'll talk again. But until then, let it go for your own sake and your son's. You aren't helping him any more than that Russian girl is helping him...and you are hurting yourself. She thinks she loves him too.
... it was the pressure that I put on him to provide for our son that broke him, and since I want him to be healthy and not kill himself so much, then I would be glad to hear that he would not be returning to work, and that he hopes I have good luck finding another way to pay for our child.
What an ass. Let's let our 5 year old starve to death and be homeless so Daddy doesn't have to stress himself out to provide. Better yet, maybe your 5year old should be put out to work to support Daddy (sarcasm).
File for child support and whatever else you are entitled to and ask the judge to impute income to him. He's a young, healthy male capable of working who got himself fired for irresponsible behavior.
Then set up your life to support your child yourself. Let the arrearages in support accumulate, someday you'll get the money, even if you have to get it from disability or social security, or by putting a lien on any property he might acquire in the future (perhaps from a future wife or a lawuit or an inheritance).
When the arrearages hit $5000, they'll take his driver's license, put him in treatment programs, take professional licenses, passports, etc... Let it get up to about $50,000 and states start looking at felony charges. Also, when your child support arrearages get high enough, judges stop upholding deadbeat daddy's rights. It's easier to get supervised visitation (which all drunks should have) when daddy owes $25,000 than when daddy owes nothing. Let arrearages hit a certain level, judges let you take your child out of state for new marriages, jobs, or educational opportunities.
He might be feeling smug and powerful right now telling you eff off and support our kid yourself, but it will be short-lived.
Per Federal law you can file for child support, married, separated, single or whatever status for about $25. Every state has a way to do this; states' Federal funding depends on this. Apply and let the process start. It's slow, but steady, and inexorable. So don't count on it to provide income for a while. But eventually it will pay off. And the sooner you start, the sooner it will pay off.
It will make you feel less powerless as well.
I grabbed my child, picked him up. I yelled at her to stay the F&ck away from us. I yelled that she was a sick person for trying to approach us, here, at a park!! WTF!! She sat there, on the swing, smirking at me smugly.
It's hard to understand right now, maybe, but she's not the problem. She's a victim too. Just like you. A victim of alcoholic inadequate parents, a victim of the same con artist who has ensnared you.
There's nothing wrong with you yelling at her. She set the situation up in such a way that it was very likely to end badly. I know you like to think you have more class than to yell at her, but she brought out the mamma bear in you. Forgive yourself for it. And stay away from her and block her emails. Her future is your life and worse. She's to be pitied. She hasn't won anything, that smirking smugness is nothing but ignorance that when she looks at your, she's looking at her own future...and likely her future will be worse.
My sons dad has one relatively decent and sane brother who lives across the country. He has been calling and discussing how to deal with him...He does not want to hear "gory details" He does not want to be my psychologist, he just wants to "get his brother the help he needs."
This makes me angry on your behalf. This brother is not your friend. He doesn't care what injustices and outrages his brother perpetrates on you or your child (the 'gory details'). He doesn't care about your hurt feelings, confusion, or pain ('being your psychologist'). He wants to use you--even at the detriment to you and your son--to help his brother. You are a tool for him, one that will be discarded once brother is fixed or you break. You don't matter.
If the relatively sane brother really cared about your XA, he'd jump on a plane and sort it out in person. But he doesn't want to get too involved, he doesn't want to mess up his own life with the 'gory details'--he's got you for that. Please consider cutting off this brother. He can deal with his brother directly instead of doing the dysfunctional thing in pulling you into triangulation. Why isn't he talking to XA and cousin-boss and leaving you alone?
I cannot save him. I am scared he is going to turn up dead.
You are right, you cannot save him. And we are all going to turn up dead some day. Focus on your life and your son's life and let him work out the details of his own. Everyone will be better off for it.
Good luck to you and lots of hugs. Drop the rope and walk away. You'll be so much happier.
I Love Who I Am
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Midwest
Posts: 3,210
I'm sorry. What a nightmare. You tried, in good faith, to do a helpful thing. The trick now is detaching. Have you gone no contact with him? In your brain and thoughts as well? Have you ever done that before. At first it's really hard, but then you will truly have freedom.
How old is your son? For some reason I think he's four?
What a jerkwad. Tell him bite your butt and come get his loser brother and let him live in his house.
Sorry. I've had it with idiots.
How old is your son? For some reason I think he's four?
My sons dad has one relatively decent and sane brother who lives across the country. He has been calling and discussing how to deal with him...He does not want to hear "gory details" He does not want to be my psychologist, he just wants to "get his brother the help he needs."
Sorry. I've had it with idiots.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Waterford MI
Posts: 4,202
What a jerkwad. Tell him bite your butt and come get his loser brother and let him live in his house.
beth
Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Racine, WI
Posts: 33
Guidelines to an alcoholic? You and I and other co-dependant women trick ourselves that we are setting a respectable list of what we want out AH or ABF to do, but essentially and subconciously what this is our way trying to control them. Mold him into someone you want him to be. No wonder the "guidelines" don't work. To most adults they would be a given, standard way of living. To put them on paper for an A to follow is being a parent to an unruling child. He is your "kid" and you are his "mother". This is not about your son needing a father, this is about you establishing a home that is safe for your son. Many many children over the generations turned out very healthy and stable with one loving parent. It is detrimental to you and your son, he is young enough to not be so effected, that you think about letting the A out of your life, from your home and cut your losses. It will be hard. But by reading your post you are so absorbed into what he is doing, going to do and how others are thinking. Start taking care of you and the rest will follow. I learned this the hard way. I would talk to anyone who would listen about all he has done and what I was doing for him or asking of him. Finally I woke up and said I wanted to stop being a Martyr. Removed those around me that were not healthy and began work on me. You will feel so much better when you are not in his world with his family, boss and friends. The cycle will end and then you will wonder why you ever stayed in the first place. I know it will be hard, beleve me, I have mortgage, car payment, two kids, and utility bills and to mention his medical bills exceeding over $50,000 of which were rehabs (I call false promises to apease me to allow him to stay) but I can say with a smile on my face I would rather that anyday than an alcoholic in my life making me crazy, malipulating me and calling me names. I finally decided to not be my AH mother and friend. I wanted me to be my friend and mother to my kids. A grown man/woman should not be acting in a manner of a selfish child stuck in an adults body. I am not telling you what to do but honey, things don't change unless something changes. Laying the law on an alcoholic is not going to change the alcoholic.
To thine own self be true.
Join Date: May 2009
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 5,924
Your Guidelines are your Boundaries and he walks all over them. I don't know how ANY of that mess is worth having him continue to be in your life. Sorry this is happening; I hope you and your son get away from it soon. Be good to yourself and take care.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,443
Originally Posted by Trying2BeMe
Guidelines to an alcoholic? You and I and other co-dependant women trick ourselves that we are setting a respectable list of what we want out AH or ABF to do, but essentially and subconciously what this is our way trying to control them. Mold him into someone you want him to be. No wonder the "guidelines" don't work.
A jug fills drop by drop
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 6,784
Hi Buffalo, what a stressful week for you, I am sorry you had to live all that.
Have you gone no contact? Al anon? Got a therapist?
This alcoholic is a sinking ship... those comments on "good luck looking for child support" are designed to hurt you and manipulate you into thinking you need to keep him happy... well child support is NOT OPTIONAL.
I know Moms don't file for child support often (at least in my country) but please seek legal counseling... here when the dad starts working, if he owes child support they will take it directly from the paycheck to the mom's account, he has no say.
Take care of you and give your son a hug for me... you two need each other and I am very very glad you are taking this Raging Alcoholic out of your life. The guidelines in general, not only the ones you wrote down... do not apply to them you know.... terminal uniqueness.
One step at a time.. we are with you
Have you gone no contact? Al anon? Got a therapist?
This alcoholic is a sinking ship... those comments on "good luck looking for child support" are designed to hurt you and manipulate you into thinking you need to keep him happy... well child support is NOT OPTIONAL.
I know Moms don't file for child support often (at least in my country) but please seek legal counseling... here when the dad starts working, if he owes child support they will take it directly from the paycheck to the mom's account, he has no say.
Take care of you and give your son a hug for me... you two need each other and I am very very glad you are taking this Raging Alcoholic out of your life. The guidelines in general, not only the ones you wrote down... do not apply to them you know.... terminal uniqueness.
One step at a time.. we are with you
same planet...different world
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Butte, America
Posts: 10,946
I raised two sons with NO support from their father.
If I could get it - He's in for about 60grand.
Do NOT sit around waiting for a ticket, hon.
And tell the brother if he wants to get his bro help -
COME GET HIM OUT OF YOUR HOUSE.
or please mail bail.
whadda maroon.
If I could get it - He's in for about 60grand.
Do NOT sit around waiting for a ticket, hon.
And tell the brother if he wants to get his bro help -
COME GET HIM OUT OF YOUR HOUSE.
or please mail bail.
whadda maroon.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: minneapolis, mn
Posts: 2,762
Buffalo,
You tried to do the right thing. Here's the deal: you are sane. he is not.
No way is he going to accept your "guidelines" - as these are simply the way that reasonable people live. He is (as you know) not a reasonable person, living in a respectable way.
This sounds like an absolute nightmare. And you know what I think the worst part is? That you had set up a list of rules for normal, sane, respectful living, and that you would then have to be the enforcer of the rules. Following him, guessing what he's going to do, hoping he'll behave "right" - oh my gosh, you have a young son - those kinds of rules and regs are supposed to be reserved for the relationship you have with him, not this grown up who can't show you the decency and respect to abide by your wishes.
Please, please, do what you can to stop spinning. Your life will not be at all peaceful until you do. Your son needs this.
You tried to do the right thing. Here's the deal: you are sane. he is not.
No way is he going to accept your "guidelines" - as these are simply the way that reasonable people live. He is (as you know) not a reasonable person, living in a respectable way.
This sounds like an absolute nightmare. And you know what I think the worst part is? That you had set up a list of rules for normal, sane, respectful living, and that you would then have to be the enforcer of the rules. Following him, guessing what he's going to do, hoping he'll behave "right" - oh my gosh, you have a young son - those kinds of rules and regs are supposed to be reserved for the relationship you have with him, not this grown up who can't show you the decency and respect to abide by your wishes.
Please, please, do what you can to stop spinning. Your life will not be at all peaceful until you do. Your son needs this.
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
