Having friends who drink after XAH

Old 02-03-2010, 12:13 PM
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Having friends who drink after XAH

I don't know how to feel about this...I have a friend that I recently got back in touch with after years of no contact. The lack of contact was enforced by XAH who demanded that I have no male friends. Anyhow, I really enjoy this friend's company, but I know for a fact that he enjoys drinking. I don't know if it's a cultural thing (he's half Irish and half Italian), but at dinner, his family always has wine. When we went to university together, we had quite a few outings where we got plastered together. In fact, many of the funny stories he tells revolve around him horsing around with his best friends after they've drank. This friend has also told me that twice a year, he goes for a month without drinking and does a cleanse with supplements and all. I don't know that this changes anything.

Now I realize that whether I'm talking about a friend, a husband, a father or a child, I simply cannot control that person's behavior. I also know it's not a crime to drink, but it's hard for me to understand because both my father and I are highly intolerant with regards to alcohol (yay for being Asian). My father is borderline allergic, and can't have a sip of alcohol without bloating, getting all red and sometimes having his airways swell. I'm not that bad, but I do have a reaction that I don't always enjoy, hence I don't enjoy drinking much that much because the resulting migraine or blackouts are always a high price to pay. I don't mind if other people drink, but maybe right now, the mention of alcohol is a bit of a trigger for me...

So, regarding this friend, should I state some kind of boundary with him, like "I don't want to be around you when you are drunk?" I'm feeling like I need to make certain that the boundaries I so painstakingly explored and then clung to with XAH don't suddenly fall by the wayside with friends. I know I tend to be a people-pleaser and push-over so I really want to think this through and make certain I don't repeat old patterns.

What are your thoughts on this?
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Old 02-03-2010, 12:22 PM
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For about a year after I separated from my AH, I was angry at alcohol. It had taken away my husband, my dreams, the life I so desperately wanted. I couldn't stand to be around it in any way, shape or form for awhile.

After some time, I found I could tolerate going for drinks after work with friends, or to a dinner or party where there was alcohol. I still didn't want any myself, but I wasn't too angry to even be around it anymore. These days, I enjoy a glass of wine or a cocktail on occasion.

So, my anger at alcohol has diminished, but I still am quite uncomfortable being around anyone who is more than a little buzzed. If I find myself in that situation, I remove myself quickly.

What I'm saying is, maybe you don't have to have a "line in the sand" kind of boundary that you announce to your friend. Maybe you only need to discuss that with yourself, and make sure you remove yourself from any situation that you are not comfortable with. No explanation needed.

L
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Old 02-03-2010, 01:45 PM
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I agree w/ LTD. I have found strength in having boundaries - knowing what my limits are in any situation - when I practice them for me - when I keep my cards close to my chest and protect myself!

If instead I develop the habit of going around stating my boundaries to loved ones then I (because of my old codie habits of mind) am probably setting myself up for an expectation that my boundaries will be respected,and putting the power in someone else's hands and then, if I really forget all I've learned, feeling resentful or p.o.'d when my boundaries are "violated" or "not repected."

My boundaries are for me - and as I quietly stay true to myself my borders are quite well guarded but allow free passage to all non-hostile travelers! Leaving heavy drinkers to their drinking is an easy one! "Byeeeeeee, gotta go! Love ya!" I don't think they miss me much, and I have spared myself pain & discomfort and gone off to do better things!

peace-
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Old 02-04-2010, 08:46 PM
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I've never been afflicted with alcoholism, but my dad's a severe alkie. I've found that I'm extremely uncomfortable in situations that involve drinking, and go out of my way to avoid drinking scenarios, like eating with friends at lunch instead of dinner, not joining in bar crawls, avoiding anyone who's obviously over the limit, etc.

Generally speaking, only expose yourself to what you're 100% comfortable with.
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Old 02-05-2010, 02:04 AM
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I don't know how to feel about this...
this just struck me, because of where I am at the moment, and what I've been working on.

do you mean this? or do you mean you are unsure of how you feel, or have mixed emotions and/or are unsure what to do about it.

I'm told there is no right or wrong way to feel about a situation, and you can't choose it, you feel what you feel. You can decide how to approach a situation and over time, by examining thoughts and feelings and training your self to think in certain ways you can start to influence how you feel about situations when they occur.

If you feel uneasy about the behaviour of others, then limit your time with them, completely if necessary. You don't have to be "fair" to them, it doesn't matter if every other single person in the universe would see their behaviour as ok, if you are uncomfortable around it you are the only one who has to live inside you.

The caveat to that is that I try to do a cost/benefit analysis on situations where I am uncomfortable to make sure that I am not losing more than I am gaining by removing myself, otherwise I (not saying this applies to you, or this situation) can end up isolating and limiting my life in an unhelpful way.

FWIW I ahve no problem with alcohol, in me or others, I am not particularly fond of lots of drunk people if I am stone cold sober, there are some people (mostly big, tall men) though who start to drink and exhibit some behaviours (almost all of which remind me of H) and I begin to feel uncomfortable, anxious, so I remove myself. No big deal, and if they remember (LOL) they can draw whatever conclusions they want from that.
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Old 02-05-2010, 03:09 AM
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I cannot advise you, however, as an Alcoholic in recovery for almost 29 years continously now, and an Al-Anoner for almost 26 I can say that there is a BIG difference between aother enjoying a 'glass of wine, or whatever with a meal and a someone getting 'drunk.'

Only you can make the finale decision. Only you can decide if the 'quanity and actions" are something you can life with or not.

J M HO

Love and hugs,
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Old 02-05-2010, 07:05 AM
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All excellent responses and good food for thought.

With regards to this specific friend, our renewed friendship has made me realize that a lot of his funny stories revolve around him being drunk and doing silly stuff with his friends. It used to make me laugh, but now, strangely, I feel a bit weirded out by it. I wonder if he knows how much he drinks, but then I quickly stop myself from being concerned, because I don't want to go all codie/control freak. So far, my contact with this individual has been limited to coffee/lunch/afternoon stuff, mostly because of my lack of availability in the evenings due to having a toddler...but perhaps it's better that way, at least for now. I'm still rather mad at alcohol in general...

If I examine myself honestly, I think I'm ok with people having a few drinks at dinner, and I'd be alright with having a cocktail myself once in a blue moon, but I have no interest in cavorting around town drunk (which I used to do a lot in my university days). There's simply no room/desire in my life for that kind of stuff anymore.
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Old 02-05-2010, 09:06 AM
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Originally Posted by LaTeeDa View Post
For about a year after I separated from my AH, I was angry at alcohol. It had taken away my husband, my dreams, the life I so desperately wanted. I couldn't stand to be around it in any way, shape or form for awhile.

After some time, I found I could tolerate going for drinks after work with friends, or to a dinner or party where there was alcohol. I still didn't want any myself, but I wasn't too angry to even be around it anymore. These days, I enjoy a glass of wine or a cocktail on occasion.

So, my anger at alcohol has diminished, but I still am quite uncomfortable being around anyone who is more than a little buzzed. If I find myself in that situation, I remove myself quickly.

What I'm saying is, maybe you don't have to have a "line in the sand" kind of boundary that you announce to your friend. Maybe you only need to discuss that with yourself, and make sure you remove yourself from any situation that you are not comfortable with. No explanation needed.

L
I found everyone's input so helpful!

I get in your question, "What's the RIGHT thing to do?"

LTD's post showed a progression of feelings and action, which I really appreciate.

I am still learning (and reminding myself) that we can only be where we are at. I say that because I will do this thing where I say, "How SHOULD I feel/do about this? What would be the HEALTHY thing to feel/do in this situation?" Then I judge my current feeling/action based on what I THINK I SHOULD feel or do or try to FORCE myself to be where I think I SHOULD be. Aaaacckk!

This thread is a great reminider - we can only be where we are an that is where we should be. (what do they say about what you tell others, you really need to tell yourself? I'm telling myself!) If you want to be around drinkers - that's okay. If it weirds you out, that's okay. If heavy drinking feels bad - that's okay, too.

Trust your gut.

Hugs,

w
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Old 02-05-2010, 03:59 PM
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Originally Posted by nodaybut2day View Post
If I examine myself honestly, I think I'm ok with people having a few drinks at dinner, and I'd be alright with having a cocktail myself once in a blue moon, but I have no interest in cavorting around town drunk (which I used to do a lot in my university days). There's simply no room/desire in my life for that kind of stuff anymore.
I'd say that's an excellent summary and the basis for a good, solid boundary. Bear in mind that boundaries aren't about one other person's behaviour - they're about our own behaviour. I'm much the same as you now. I find that I am comfortable being around people who have had a couple of drinks but not around people who are noticeably drunk. I'm not sure I could articulate where that line exactly is apart from "If I start to feel uncomfortable, the line's been crossed." And I think that's ok. I'm not even attempting to stop anyone from drinking, it's just that once I start to feel uncomfortable then I'll make my polite excuses and leave.

That is important for me because when I was with my AXGF there were hundreds of times where she'd be drunk, I'd be excrutiatingly uncomfortable about the situation, I'd know it was just going to get worse, but I'd stay there out of some misguided sense of loyalty. I know better now.
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Old 02-05-2010, 04:57 PM
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When I first (consciously) started doing boundary work, I realized that I had been (unknowingly) TRYING to set boundaries with people in my life but that I had gone about it in the wrong way, that is, by stating my preferences or my feelings to them (usually through tears) and hoping they would honor and protect me. I would say something like, "I don't want to be around you when you are drunk," or "When you do that it makes me uncomfortable." Or the usual, "When you do that, it reeeeeeeeally hurts my feelings."

Of course another person is never going to be able to meet all of my expectations, desires, or wishes and so I always wound up getting hurt. In most cases I'd say it hurt more that they BROKE the boundary than the actual boundary-crossing itself. That's because I would always interpret the behavior as, "He doesn't care about me..." or "He doesn't really love me...otherwise he would not have done that." Most of the time, though, I never verbalized what I preferred (what my boundaries were) and just would get hurt and hysterical reacting to everyone else's behavior.

So, now that I am better-practiced at boundary-setting and communicating, I see that, in large part, boundaries are less about the specific things I want my partner (or whomever) to do or not do, and more about the way I think, every day of my life. The biggest difference between then and now is that now I: Take 100% of the responsibility for my life; I know what I want and what I don't want; and I know what is acceptable and unacceptable in the behavior of others in my life. I have made MYSELF responsible for my own feelings and for maintaining my own peace and serenity. I hand these things over to NO ONE now. EVERY day I take responsibility for who I will let in and who I will not (getting better at this as I age and learn). These are the KEYS to my boundaries.

The setting of INDIVIDUAL, specific boundaries such as the "When you come home drunk it upsets me...therefore if you come home drunk again I will leave you" kind, are more an OUTCROPPING of my taking full responsibility for me. Funny thing is, though, I did not become strong in my boundaries until I practiced one of the more specific boundaries with someone who I had known for a LONG time, and who I KNEW loved me even though his alcoholic behavior indicated otherwise.

Sounds like this guy is someone you also have known for a long time; perhaps someone "safe" to practice individual boundary-setting with. Give it a try. Set the parameters for your relationship with this guy, and see what happens. Just the act of DOING it will show you just how strong you really are.
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Old 02-05-2010, 05:55 PM
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noday,

it seems as though you have already come to some conclusions about this situation.

for me, i have not been comfortable around people drinking in more than just a social kind of way, for a long, long time. i do not like going into bars - now, a restaurant that serves is fine, or a quiet lounge for a visit with someone, or even a nightclub to hear some good music - all fine in my book. but a loud, smelly BAR - not gonna find me in one. but that's me - i'm over 40. if there are people in my peer group who are still goin to bars, hmmm, i think something smells bad.

i thought that learn2live had some great insights.
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