Clueless in Cali
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: CA
Posts: 1
Clueless in Cali
Several months ago a lady my age (late 40s) moved next door. I'm a widow and she's divorced. We befriended each other and often help each other out. I rarely drink (but I have no lack of other vices) and she only drinks beer, but has a fairly serious alcohol problem that she admits.
She goes through short dry periods, but mostly she's off the wagon, not roaring drunk, but obviously liquored and beer-in-hand most of the time.
This evening when I came home she was liquored again, and we chatted in her yard a while. Then I said I have to go back to feed my cat. She followed me because she wanted to feel how soft my cat's fur is after the rain as I had told her.
I picked the cat up and let her touch the cat, but the cat started to squirm and my neighbor took the cat from me and proceeded to show me how to get a cat to like being held. I told her the cat just doesn't like being held for more than a few moments, but she went on to say how you need to keep holding her until she calms down. The lady has past experience as a rodeo performer and supposedly as a dog trainer, but the cat was starting to panic so the lady held her tighter. I saw a look of great fear on my cat's face, so I told her this isn't a dog, you have to get the cat to trust you. The lady kept insisting she knew all about cats and how to handle them. I was getting mad and told her to let the (now fear petrified) cat go. She insisted you have to never let the cat dominate which is what you do if you let the cat go. I told her it was my cat and to let her go. She didn't, and I repeated it firmly, and finally she let the cat go. I don't think, and I hope, the lady would not have done that if she were sober.
I felt very sorry for my cat. That cat was a feral last summer who would hiss and spit at me, and who took me about two months to tame by gentleness, very gradual steps, a tremendous amount of patience, and lots of kitty treats. After the lady left, the cat luckily came to me for her dinner, but after she ate, she split and didn't want to be touched.
Sorry for the long story and thanks for letting me get this terrible experience off my chest, but I really don't know if I should talk to the lady when she's sober about this incident that really upset me, and if for now on I should shun her when she's liquored. I really, really want to help her or at least to be there for her. I don't know the first thing about helping an alcoholic.
She has been off and on the beer can for many years and has been in every sort of program to cure her problem without sustained luck, so my assumption is that it'll probably be her cross to bear for the rest of her life---and that of those who love her. BTW, she was divorced from a 14 year marriage a few years ago and knows a whole lot of people because she's home all day, rather extroverted, and hangs out in her front yard most of the time, but she doesn't have any close friends (as I don't either, but I enjoy solitude). She moved away from the town where she spent most of her life. She has a 19 year old son who rarely visits; she claims her ex alienated him from her and disapproves of him seeing her. She has a host of other issues, especially a very obvious obsessive/complusive thing about orderliness, cleanliness, and germs; a great fear of heights; a strong reaction to things on her skin--even a single hair; etc.
She bullsh*ts a whole lot, yammering like a great authority, as she did with the cat today, which until now I just listened to patiently because I can easily tear off her mask, but I'm trying to avoid lowering her self esteem even more by not drawing a bit of attention to the fact that there is a very wide gap in our education and ability to reason intelligently. She is a high school dropout who admits she never reads, but instead watches inane TV programs all day and night when she isn't in her front yard, while I have a graduate degree (big deal), I work in a very intellectual field, and I have several distinguished awards and publications (which I never ever mention to her or anybody but employers and you). I don't like caste systems.
There are many fine things to say about her. She is very generous and a greatly entertaining storyteller. The best laugh I'd had in many years, a real belly laugh, was about a month ago thanks to one of her animated tales. Also I'm grateful to feel my property is safe with her on neighborhood watch all day. Her obsession about germs provides her with a spotless home; she's a Felix Unger in the rough while I'm a slob of a female Oscar Madison.
So I'd appreciate hearing your opinions on how to help her, whether or not it's a good idea to shun her when she's liquored, and whether or not I should bring up how upset I was about the cat incident and that for now on I want to her respect my wishes when she's messing with my possessions (well, in this case, a creature under my guardianship).
(BTW, on the net I found an article by a very recognized, well published, and awarded cat behaviorist who explains that a cat who doesn't like to be held can overcome this by trust, gradual steps, and patience. I'm thinking of printing this and showing it to my rodeo queen next door. A recently tamed feral cat is anything but a bucking bronco needing to be broken, for heaven's sake.)
She goes through short dry periods, but mostly she's off the wagon, not roaring drunk, but obviously liquored and beer-in-hand most of the time.
This evening when I came home she was liquored again, and we chatted in her yard a while. Then I said I have to go back to feed my cat. She followed me because she wanted to feel how soft my cat's fur is after the rain as I had told her.
I picked the cat up and let her touch the cat, but the cat started to squirm and my neighbor took the cat from me and proceeded to show me how to get a cat to like being held. I told her the cat just doesn't like being held for more than a few moments, but she went on to say how you need to keep holding her until she calms down. The lady has past experience as a rodeo performer and supposedly as a dog trainer, but the cat was starting to panic so the lady held her tighter. I saw a look of great fear on my cat's face, so I told her this isn't a dog, you have to get the cat to trust you. The lady kept insisting she knew all about cats and how to handle them. I was getting mad and told her to let the (now fear petrified) cat go. She insisted you have to never let the cat dominate which is what you do if you let the cat go. I told her it was my cat and to let her go. She didn't, and I repeated it firmly, and finally she let the cat go. I don't think, and I hope, the lady would not have done that if she were sober.
I felt very sorry for my cat. That cat was a feral last summer who would hiss and spit at me, and who took me about two months to tame by gentleness, very gradual steps, a tremendous amount of patience, and lots of kitty treats. After the lady left, the cat luckily came to me for her dinner, but after she ate, she split and didn't want to be touched.
Sorry for the long story and thanks for letting me get this terrible experience off my chest, but I really don't know if I should talk to the lady when she's sober about this incident that really upset me, and if for now on I should shun her when she's liquored. I really, really want to help her or at least to be there for her. I don't know the first thing about helping an alcoholic.
She has been off and on the beer can for many years and has been in every sort of program to cure her problem without sustained luck, so my assumption is that it'll probably be her cross to bear for the rest of her life---and that of those who love her. BTW, she was divorced from a 14 year marriage a few years ago and knows a whole lot of people because she's home all day, rather extroverted, and hangs out in her front yard most of the time, but she doesn't have any close friends (as I don't either, but I enjoy solitude). She moved away from the town where she spent most of her life. She has a 19 year old son who rarely visits; she claims her ex alienated him from her and disapproves of him seeing her. She has a host of other issues, especially a very obvious obsessive/complusive thing about orderliness, cleanliness, and germs; a great fear of heights; a strong reaction to things on her skin--even a single hair; etc.
She bullsh*ts a whole lot, yammering like a great authority, as she did with the cat today, which until now I just listened to patiently because I can easily tear off her mask, but I'm trying to avoid lowering her self esteem even more by not drawing a bit of attention to the fact that there is a very wide gap in our education and ability to reason intelligently. She is a high school dropout who admits she never reads, but instead watches inane TV programs all day and night when she isn't in her front yard, while I have a graduate degree (big deal), I work in a very intellectual field, and I have several distinguished awards and publications (which I never ever mention to her or anybody but employers and you). I don't like caste systems.
There are many fine things to say about her. She is very generous and a greatly entertaining storyteller. The best laugh I'd had in many years, a real belly laugh, was about a month ago thanks to one of her animated tales. Also I'm grateful to feel my property is safe with her on neighborhood watch all day. Her obsession about germs provides her with a spotless home; she's a Felix Unger in the rough while I'm a slob of a female Oscar Madison.
So I'd appreciate hearing your opinions on how to help her, whether or not it's a good idea to shun her when she's liquored, and whether or not I should bring up how upset I was about the cat incident and that for now on I want to her respect my wishes when she's messing with my possessions (well, in this case, a creature under my guardianship).
(BTW, on the net I found an article by a very recognized, well published, and awarded cat behaviorist who explains that a cat who doesn't like to be held can overcome this by trust, gradual steps, and patience. I'm thinking of printing this and showing it to my rodeo queen next door. A recently tamed feral cat is anything but a bucking bronco needing to be broken, for heaven's sake.)
*~10 YEARS BABY~*
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Hollywood
Posts: 9,369
I wouldn't worry about printing off articles and proving who is right or wrong. Bottom line is that it is your cat so you get to make the decisions, you don't need any paper or anything else to make someone understand how to treat your cat. If she doesn't understand this or it happens again I would have to end the relationship as I would feel my boundaries weren't respected. My animals are like my kids so that is a big boundary.
There is no reason for argument when it comes to my animals. Personally I do try and stay away from the few alcoholics I know when they are drinking.
I had to smile when I read your post picturing my cat, my cat would have taken her hand off if she tried to "Dominate him". Would you like to borrow my 20 pound muscular cat? lol, he's very stubborn.
Good luck I hope things work out for you.
There is no reason for argument when it comes to my animals. Personally I do try and stay away from the few alcoholics I know when they are drinking.
I had to smile when I read your post picturing my cat, my cat would have taken her hand off if she tried to "Dominate him". Would you like to borrow my 20 pound muscular cat? lol, he's very stubborn.
Good luck I hope things work out for you.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Los Angeles, California
Posts: 8,326
Clueless,
If she's been to rehab or in some sort of alcohol recovery program, she knows the drill. If she wanted to be sober, she would be. I don't think there's anything you can do.
As far as avoiding her when she's been drinking, I think that's a good idea. I have feral rescue cats and like you said, they need to be treated with patience and gentleness. I'm sure your cat will recover from her handling but it might take some time. My Fuzz Bucket cat is terribly shy. He gets scared easily and will hide for hours. He's really a sweetheart when left to his own pace but I know if someone tried to snatch him up against his will, they'd be left bleeding. And probably be slow to trust for a while.
You're very kind to ask about helping the lady. I'm a recovering alcoholic myself so I know. I got sober when I was sick of being a drunk.
Love,
Lenina
If she's been to rehab or in some sort of alcohol recovery program, she knows the drill. If she wanted to be sober, she would be. I don't think there's anything you can do.
As far as avoiding her when she's been drinking, I think that's a good idea. I have feral rescue cats and like you said, they need to be treated with patience and gentleness. I'm sure your cat will recover from her handling but it might take some time. My Fuzz Bucket cat is terribly shy. He gets scared easily and will hide for hours. He's really a sweetheart when left to his own pace but I know if someone tried to snatch him up against his will, they'd be left bleeding. And probably be slow to trust for a while.
You're very kind to ask about helping the lady. I'm a recovering alcoholic myself so I know. I got sober when I was sick of being a drunk.
Love,
Lenina
get it, give it, grow in it
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Calif coast
Posts: 3,167
If you are going to be friends... communicate w/ her openly and honestly.
Tell her what ever you think you should.
Tell her (each time ) you don't want to be around her if she's been drinking too much, if that is what you are feeling.
Don't think you are going to- in any way- fix her.
Enjoy her company...sending her on her way when you need to.
Tell her what ever you think you should.
Tell her (each time ) you don't want to be around her if she's been drinking too much, if that is what you are feeling.
Don't think you are going to- in any way- fix her.
Enjoy her company...sending her on her way when you need to.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Buzz-free Zone
Posts: 1,372
Hello Neighbor,
I can almost feel your angst and your story actually appears to be a good pros/cons list about any relationship with this person.
I thought about this saying re: possibly presenting the article to her about how to tame a cat..."Do you want to be happy or do you want to be right?" Sometimes it takes more strength to be silent than to try to prove a point, especially if you're trying to make that point to someone who's not in a stable state of mind (ie, drinking).
My advice: Don't try to make a point or explain that she should get help when she's already been drinking - she'll either get beligerent or she won't remember it or both.
I can honestly from personal experience that it was best for me when my neighbors completely avoided me. I was the same as that woman...sober some days, drunk on others. They did me a favor by avoiding me completely, rather than doing a see-saw back/forth on socializing with me only when I was sober.
My neighbors chose not to let me control their emotions based on what I was doing. Good choice on their part. They weren't being 'nice' by tolerating my BS when I was drunk and letting it slide when I was sober.
Eventually, I got the message. BTW, I was a barrel of laughs too, but only for so long...alcoholism is progressive, after all, and it doesn't get progressively 'better' only worse.
Take care of yourself,
HB
I can almost feel your angst and your story actually appears to be a good pros/cons list about any relationship with this person.
I thought about this saying re: possibly presenting the article to her about how to tame a cat..."Do you want to be happy or do you want to be right?" Sometimes it takes more strength to be silent than to try to prove a point, especially if you're trying to make that point to someone who's not in a stable state of mind (ie, drinking).
My advice: Don't try to make a point or explain that she should get help when she's already been drinking - she'll either get beligerent or she won't remember it or both.
I can honestly from personal experience that it was best for me when my neighbors completely avoided me. I was the same as that woman...sober some days, drunk on others. They did me a favor by avoiding me completely, rather than doing a see-saw back/forth on socializing with me only when I was sober.
My neighbors chose not to let me control their emotions based on what I was doing. Good choice on their part. They weren't being 'nice' by tolerating my BS when I was drunk and letting it slide when I was sober.
Eventually, I got the message. BTW, I was a barrel of laughs too, but only for so long...alcoholism is progressive, after all, and it doesn't get progressively 'better' only worse.
Take care of yourself,
HB
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