Going to try again...I think
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Going to try again...I think
I haven't seen my xabf for a few months. Last time I saw him was the day he started drinking. He's now back in school and sober.
I talked to him last night. I think I am going to see him this week and I am leaning toward giving it another try, which is problematic for two reasons:
-It's risky (for me emotionally)
-I have to tell everyone who believed that I would never look back
I'm wondering if there is a way to just put my toe in the water completely jumping in. He knows if he drinks, I won't be in his life, which is exactly what happened.
So how to tread carefully? I don't know. Maybe I only see him once a week for awhile? Maybe I pay more attention to our behavior - am I becoming overly helpful? Is he being manipulative?
I feel strong. I believe in him. It feels ok to see him. I'm sure I'll know if it becomes not ok.
I talked to him last night. I think I am going to see him this week and I am leaning toward giving it another try, which is problematic for two reasons:
-It's risky (for me emotionally)
-I have to tell everyone who believed that I would never look back
I'm wondering if there is a way to just put my toe in the water completely jumping in. He knows if he drinks, I won't be in his life, which is exactly what happened.
So how to tread carefully? I don't know. Maybe I only see him once a week for awhile? Maybe I pay more attention to our behavior - am I becoming overly helpful? Is he being manipulative?
I feel strong. I believe in him. It feels ok to see him. I'm sure I'll know if it becomes not ok.
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I do hope everything works out for you, KP! Don't worry about what other people think -- this is YOUR life and you are entitled to make your own decisions without justifying or explaining yourself to anyone. I think that I would not make any big commitments (like cohabitation or marriage) until he's got a solid recovery working, y'know?
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tjp - I totally agree. No way to live together or get married at this point. That's definitely not treading lightly. 
I really want to learn how to keep things balanced, you know? How do I focus mostly on me and my life and only some on him? So difficult not to get totally sucked in to "helping".
I really want to learn how to keep things balanced, you know? How do I focus mostly on me and my life and only some on him? So difficult not to get totally sucked in to "helping".
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Read Codependent No More over and over again until the pages are falling out of the book! That...and doing things that make YOU happy: your own friends, your own hobbies, your own studies... Live Your Life.
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Location: minneapolis, mn
Posts: 2,762
you have been searching both your heart and your brain, and both are telling you he seems to off to a good start, and also to move cautiously. that is good. do you attend al-anon? if not yet, that would be a great place to keep that focus on you thing going, and i'm thinking if you had a sponsor, she might be able to recognize something that you need to look at, regarding your process with the boyfriend.
my therapist says that there are two things that are the most important qualities in a healthy relationship: mutual respect, and lust.
my therapist says that there are two things that are the most important qualities in a healthy relationship: mutual respect, and lust.
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Join Date: Jan 2009
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I'm sure I'll know if it becomes not ok.
This is what scares me. None of us saw it coming in the first place. How do we keep an open mind when it comes to a loved one withiut closing our hearts as well?
I'm working on these things myself these days. Trying to seek out healthy friendships and I hope down the line healthy romantic relationships again. I'm still stumbling and realizing after the fact that I still get taking advantage of or emotionally manipulated. I wish I could see these things in others from the start, but how do you even open yourself up to meeting other people at all if you question every breath they take.
Oh, I'm rambling here. You're pondering has got me pondering...
KP, you have to follow your heart. Do what's right for you and such, but also think about his health. Is it too soon for him? Maybe you're instinct of trying limited contact with him would be better. Don't rush into romance and maybe try couples counseling or workshops to give you both some tools to use going in, maybe a new way to communicate.
Instead of going back to the old relationship, you could take what you loved about your romance and make something new from it.
Best wishes!
Alice
This is what scares me. None of us saw it coming in the first place. How do we keep an open mind when it comes to a loved one withiut closing our hearts as well?
I'm working on these things myself these days. Trying to seek out healthy friendships and I hope down the line healthy romantic relationships again. I'm still stumbling and realizing after the fact that I still get taking advantage of or emotionally manipulated. I wish I could see these things in others from the start, but how do you even open yourself up to meeting other people at all if you question every breath they take.
Oh, I'm rambling here. You're pondering has got me pondering...
KP, you have to follow your heart. Do what's right for you and such, but also think about his health. Is it too soon for him? Maybe you're instinct of trying limited contact with him would be better. Don't rush into romance and maybe try couples counseling or workshops to give you both some tools to use going in, maybe a new way to communicate.
Instead of going back to the old relationship, you could take what you loved about your romance and make something new from it.
Best wishes!
Alice
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Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 2,059
hi kp-
like everyone else says, it's your life.
if i was going to do what you're doing, i would spend some time working out my boundaries clearly on paper.
it would be important to me that he continues his recovery work. i would pay attention to if he was emotionally available. and i certainly would not give him any money, no matter what hardship story he came up with.
i remind myself often that the line between helping and enabling is "to do for them what they can and should do themselves."
we're here for you, however it turns out.
naive
like everyone else says, it's your life.
if i was going to do what you're doing, i would spend some time working out my boundaries clearly on paper.
it would be important to me that he continues his recovery work. i would pay attention to if he was emotionally available. and i certainly would not give him any money, no matter what hardship story he came up with.
i remind myself often that the line between helping and enabling is "to do for them what they can and should do themselves."
we're here for you, however it turns out.
naive
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: uk
Posts: 124
I went 'back in' to a relationship with my xabf because he put down the drink and started attending AA; eight weeks later he relapsed. First he stopped going to meetings, then his attitude changed toward me, and then came the drink. That is the point the relationship ended and he showed me who he really is. It nearly finished me off; I think the high of thinking he was in recovery was equal and opposite to the low I endured. As a RA myself, I put myself in great peril. Luckily I used the tools I had been given and stayed sober. I wish you well but tread carefully with caution; I wouldn't want you to have to go through what I have.
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 144
KP-None of us can tell you what is right for your situation. I also 'dreamed' of a time when I could put my life back together with my AH. Your desire to be back with him isn't unnatural...
I would say to tread lightly though. A heart is a strange thing...it can make you forget some of the worst things that have happened to you in the past. Please don't let yourself get sucked back into something that may not be right for you. Think frog in the pot of water...
Go S L O W L Y!
(((hugs)))
Set your boundaries and stick to them.
I would say to tread lightly though. A heart is a strange thing...it can make you forget some of the worst things that have happened to you in the past. Please don't let yourself get sucked back into something that may not be right for you. Think frog in the pot of water...
Go S L O W L Y!
(((hugs)))
Set your boundaries and stick to them.
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Southwest
Posts: 1,207
Here's a different take:
MY STBXAH left me and our 3 children on vacation in Florida.
He said it was over, over, over.
When we got home, he wanted to reconcile.
Our MC said that if I was at all willing, we should try to reconcile.
Our job was to be as nice to each other as possible and put the other one first.
So I let him move back in.
On Day 5 he wanted to go out hunting with a friend.
In the interest of being really nice to him, I said that was fine.
He completely f&*%ed it up.
And THEN I knew what to do. For certain. Without hesitation.
So my experience tells me that if you and he "reconcile" or forge a new path together or start a friendship or whatever, and he were to relapse, you might be able to be more decisive at that time.
And then, you would know that you didn't give up too soon.
And you really did try everything.
But don't check your recovery at the door. Keep your materials handy and keep working your own program. Self-awareness is the key to keeping your own self intact.
(((hugs)))
MY STBXAH left me and our 3 children on vacation in Florida.
He said it was over, over, over.
When we got home, he wanted to reconcile.
Our MC said that if I was at all willing, we should try to reconcile.
Our job was to be as nice to each other as possible and put the other one first.
So I let him move back in.
On Day 5 he wanted to go out hunting with a friend.
In the interest of being really nice to him, I said that was fine.
He completely f&*%ed it up.
And THEN I knew what to do. For certain. Without hesitation.
So my experience tells me that if you and he "reconcile" or forge a new path together or start a friendship or whatever, and he were to relapse, you might be able to be more decisive at that time.
And then, you would know that you didn't give up too soon.
And you really did try everything.
But don't check your recovery at the door. Keep your materials handy and keep working your own program. Self-awareness is the key to keeping your own self intact.
(((hugs)))
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 594
Originally Posted by naive 
hi kp-
like everyone else says, it's your life.
if i was going to do what you're doing, i would spend some time working out my boundaries clearly on paper.
it would be important to me that he continues his recovery work. i would pay attention to if he was emotionally available. and i certainly would not give him any money, no matter what hardship story he came up with.
i remind myself often that the line between helping and enabling is "to do for them what they can and should do themselves."
we're here for you, however it turns out.
naive
like everyone else says, it's your life.
if i was going to do what you're doing, i would spend some time working out my boundaries clearly on paper.
it would be important to me that he continues his recovery work. i would pay attention to if he was emotionally available. and i certainly would not give him any money, no matter what hardship story he came up with.
i remind myself often that the line between helping and enabling is "to do for them what they can and should do themselves."
we're here for you, however it turns out.
naive
A jug fills drop by drop
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 6,784
Self-awareness is the key to keeping your own self intact
Great phrase!! thanks stella.
KP, I can only speak of my experience. I offered my friendship afterwards. It was weird. For a few months I thought we could at least talk.. and that is what we did. We had agreed on trying again after some time. Well one day a friend tells me he had a girlfriend and had just celebrated their 2 month anniversary.
As stella says that is when the pain was truly horrible and I was decisive, asked him not to talk to me again and kept my no contact. That is the thing, really, that you are on a certain "wavelength" and think the other person is the same, that you agreed on something, then the lies, manipulation once again. And then the pain of willingly going back to his hell and having believed in someone who showed many times he was not to be trusted. I wouldn't want you to go through something similar.
Keep your eyes open, mute the movie and see the actions only. His and yours...
We'll be here..
Great phrase!! thanks stella.
KP, I can only speak of my experience. I offered my friendship afterwards. It was weird. For a few months I thought we could at least talk.. and that is what we did. We had agreed on trying again after some time. Well one day a friend tells me he had a girlfriend and had just celebrated their 2 month anniversary.
As stella says that is when the pain was truly horrible and I was decisive, asked him not to talk to me again and kept my no contact. That is the thing, really, that you are on a certain "wavelength" and think the other person is the same, that you agreed on something, then the lies, manipulation once again. And then the pain of willingly going back to his hell and having believed in someone who showed many times he was not to be trusted. I wouldn't want you to go through something similar.
Keep your eyes open, mute the movie and see the actions only. His and yours...
We'll be here..
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 594
Originally Posted by ItsmeAlice
I'm sure I'll know if it becomes not ok.
This is what scares me. None of us saw it coming in the first place. How do we keep an open mind when it comes to a loved one withiut closing our hearts as well?
This is what scares me. None of us saw it coming in the first place. How do we keep an open mind when it comes to a loved one withiut closing our hearts as well?
I definitely have my homework assignment for the weekend.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 594
Originally Posted by TakingCharge999
We had agreed on trying again after some time. Well one day a friend tells me he had a girlfriend and had just celebrated their 2 month anniversary.
As stella says that is when the pain was truly horrible and I was decisive, asked him not to talk to me again and kept my no contact.
Keep your eyes open, mute the movie and see the actions only. His and yours...
We'll be here..
I really feel like I need to give it one more shot to be truly at peace with a decision to walk away if he drinks again. Why isn't ONCE enough? Why do I, and many others, need twice or more? It's that hope thing. I really have a lot of hope that he DID learn and he HAS made the decision to make healthier choices. Because we all make mistakes right?
ponder ponder ponder....
A jug fills drop by drop
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 6,784
KP, I went back because I didn't know about the nature of addictions and because I believed his tears and promises "it won't happen again". Because I often made empty promises to myself so I was used to that.
And because I didnt' know it was a progressive and chronic disease, I thought it was just a decision and "if only" he could see the light. I posted a lot in the Alcoholics forum and went to AA as it was closer to my home and I wanted to see "his side". For the ones with decades of sobriety..they had to lose everything.. many times...almost die.
No one of the veterans were "I had a girlfriend and I loved her and I changed for her" lol nope, most of the stories were "I created hell for numerous girlfriends and my poor first ex wife really took all my fury, I don't know why she stayed so long... after she left and my kids hated me and I hit the smallest...I started to realize perhaps it was not them but me... ".
Maybe it would be illustrative for you to attend AA meetings and post in the Alcoholics forum? they welcome Alanoners too.
It was very helpful to see what real recovery looks like, and even for the stronger ones.. there are days where they are struggling a lot to hit the bottle..... so that is why when I hear of someone not drinking for a day or a week or a month or a few months... I am skeptical something relevant changed.
Just like us, true relevant change is a matter of daily effort and commitment to oneself and takes years.....
Please take a look at
Dependency - Relationship
NEED IS MISTAKEN FOR LOVE
If we have been in a dependent situation for a long period of time, our emotional and mental faculties will have become brainwashed into not being able to distinguish the difference between “need & love.” A perfect balance of love has to be 50% - 50% in the act of sharing. Once we start to give our power away, in any form or manner, we are no longer sharing in a like 50% -50% relationship, whether it is our mates, families or friends.
If you strike an animal with a stick at exactly 12:00 noon everyday for weeks at a time, that poor animal will become dependent on being struck. After several weeks, if one day you stop, that poor animal will go berserk in need of being struck. There is something missing and it can’t handle this. It has mistaken abuse for attention or love. Everyone knows this example, yet we do not see it in our own lives. Once this starts to occur, by becoming the victim, the next step that follows
is, that the victim takes on the role of being a martyr of a lost cause.
NEED BRINGS ON MARTYRDOM
When a victim goes through this role of dependency along with the alcoholic or addict, they will keep saying that when this individual is sober or in their right mind, they are very loving and do give love. We must wake up to this farce and
masquerade!
Alcohol and drug addiction is a selfish act within the Law of Self. The Law of Self is a self serving frequency which cannot give of its life force, much less, share it with anyone, unless, it is self serving to the parasite. You have been deceived, what you feel as love coming from them is a portion of your own love that you previously gave to them. You are in such a bad state of need that you do not recognize it as being your own energy, your own force, and your own power. You must wake up!
We must also remember that the alcoholic or drug addict is not necessarily conscious of the mechanics of how this works. They, in their own selfish way, will sense what feels good and is self serving, and in giving, they only give in small portions, even with the love that is yours which they feed back to you, in a self serving manner to keep you victimized. You are their food source
. The perfect example of this is the story of Dracula who must bite and take of his victim’s blood
(life force)
at three separate times
(The physical, mental, and emotional bodies)
in order to have complete control of their victims. But the irony to this is that, the alcoholic or drug addict does not have to look for a victim or a martyr, they come to them by their own accord in a state of need.
Martyrdom comes into the picture when the victim starts receiving these small portions of their own love that is being rationed back to them by the parasite. The victim feels warmth from this love, and being deceived, they believe it to be from the parasite as some sort of true love. There must be more in there! I will dedicate my life, my soul to bring it out in them! My love will do it! Famous lost words of
martyrdom, which is “illusion & fantasy.”
When we ask a person, who is already a victim in a relationship with a drug addict or an alcoholic, “Why do you stay with this person? You could have a better life away from all the heartache and pain?” They are quick to respond, “inside this person is a very loving, giving, human being that needs help, and I am here to help this person. This person needs me. They would be in a terrible mess without me. I could not live with myself if something was to happen to them or if I abandon them. I could not do that to them, as deep inside they need me.” The self-proclaimed martyr has spoken. You will notice that the underlying message is that of need and is not love. Where there is love there is no need as all is balanced.
And because I didnt' know it was a progressive and chronic disease, I thought it was just a decision and "if only" he could see the light. I posted a lot in the Alcoholics forum and went to AA as it was closer to my home and I wanted to see "his side". For the ones with decades of sobriety..they had to lose everything.. many times...almost die.
No one of the veterans were "I had a girlfriend and I loved her and I changed for her" lol nope, most of the stories were "I created hell for numerous girlfriends and my poor first ex wife really took all my fury, I don't know why she stayed so long... after she left and my kids hated me and I hit the smallest...I started to realize perhaps it was not them but me... ".
Maybe it would be illustrative for you to attend AA meetings and post in the Alcoholics forum? they welcome Alanoners too.
It was very helpful to see what real recovery looks like, and even for the stronger ones.. there are days where they are struggling a lot to hit the bottle..... so that is why when I hear of someone not drinking for a day or a week or a month or a few months... I am skeptical something relevant changed.
Just like us, true relevant change is a matter of daily effort and commitment to oneself and takes years.....
Please take a look at
Dependency - Relationship
NEED IS MISTAKEN FOR LOVE
If we have been in a dependent situation for a long period of time, our emotional and mental faculties will have become brainwashed into not being able to distinguish the difference between “need & love.” A perfect balance of love has to be 50% - 50% in the act of sharing. Once we start to give our power away, in any form or manner, we are no longer sharing in a like 50% -50% relationship, whether it is our mates, families or friends.
If you strike an animal with a stick at exactly 12:00 noon everyday for weeks at a time, that poor animal will become dependent on being struck. After several weeks, if one day you stop, that poor animal will go berserk in need of being struck. There is something missing and it can’t handle this. It has mistaken abuse for attention or love. Everyone knows this example, yet we do not see it in our own lives. Once this starts to occur, by becoming the victim, the next step that follows
is, that the victim takes on the role of being a martyr of a lost cause.
NEED BRINGS ON MARTYRDOM
When a victim goes through this role of dependency along with the alcoholic or addict, they will keep saying that when this individual is sober or in their right mind, they are very loving and do give love. We must wake up to this farce and
masquerade!
Alcohol and drug addiction is a selfish act within the Law of Self. The Law of Self is a self serving frequency which cannot give of its life force, much less, share it with anyone, unless, it is self serving to the parasite. You have been deceived, what you feel as love coming from them is a portion of your own love that you previously gave to them. You are in such a bad state of need that you do not recognize it as being your own energy, your own force, and your own power. You must wake up!
We must also remember that the alcoholic or drug addict is not necessarily conscious of the mechanics of how this works. They, in their own selfish way, will sense what feels good and is self serving, and in giving, they only give in small portions, even with the love that is yours which they feed back to you, in a self serving manner to keep you victimized. You are their food source
. The perfect example of this is the story of Dracula who must bite and take of his victim’s blood
(life force)
at three separate times
(The physical, mental, and emotional bodies)
in order to have complete control of their victims. But the irony to this is that, the alcoholic or drug addict does not have to look for a victim or a martyr, they come to them by their own accord in a state of need.
Martyrdom comes into the picture when the victim starts receiving these small portions of their own love that is being rationed back to them by the parasite. The victim feels warmth from this love, and being deceived, they believe it to be from the parasite as some sort of true love. There must be more in there! I will dedicate my life, my soul to bring it out in them! My love will do it! Famous lost words of
martyrdom, which is “illusion & fantasy.”
When we ask a person, who is already a victim in a relationship with a drug addict or an alcoholic, “Why do you stay with this person? You could have a better life away from all the heartache and pain?” They are quick to respond, “inside this person is a very loving, giving, human being that needs help, and I am here to help this person. This person needs me. They would be in a terrible mess without me. I could not live with myself if something was to happen to them or if I abandon them. I could not do that to them, as deep inside they need me.” The self-proclaimed martyr has spoken. You will notice that the underlying message is that of need and is not love. Where there is love there is no need as all is balanced.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 133
Keepedaling, I went back over and over and over again!! Heck, I lost count girl!! I believe each time I went back and he ef'd up, it got me closer to where I am right now..not wanting to go back to all that pain!! This took time, it was a process for me! You will do what you need to do, and with love and respect, all of us will be here for you, no matter what! You are not alone, and just speaking for myself, each time I went back I sooo wanted to protect that part of me that was so hurt. I didn't want to give all that back to him so soon, yet each time, I felt myself settling in and it was like an old, comfortable shoe. Heck, my mom used to say "better the devil you know", which to me was like, you know him, you've been with him forever, so don't act surprised when he checks out again. What changed was the way I felt inside for him, and I think that every story has a different ending. Mine did not end good. Your's may end very well. I learned that while with him, there were certain things I stopped doing...going to Alanon, writing, taking time for me, getting away from him to just be. I stopped working on myself when with him, and it was a slow slide, just kind of happened, day by day.
Please know that no one here knows what's right for you or your man. Only you can make the decision. Take the experience, strength and hope that is offered here, and no matter what, we aren't going anywhere!!!
Hugs!!!
Please know that no one here knows what's right for you or your man. Only you can make the decision. Take the experience, strength and hope that is offered here, and no matter what, we aren't going anywhere!!!
Hugs!!!
Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Ontario
Posts: 85
Hi KP
You may remember I keep waffling about my relationship with my BF too. I wanted to be friends for a while and see how things went. Every time he came over it turned into him trying to grope me and me trying to escape. He told me that he gets so aroused when he's with me that he needs to have sex. Ick. At least we seems to be able to talk on the phone sensibly.
My therapist helped me think about what I would tolerate and what I would not tolerate if/when I went back to him. And what things are really deal breakers. And the techniques he might use to get me back. I was prepared. However, that last time he got me to come back to him it was because he was (or seemed to be) finally coping with his life. Unfortunately it didn't last.
Right now I am concentrating on being strong in myself. It's amazing how much better I feel without his crises and problems.
I wish you the best.
Spinner
You may remember I keep waffling about my relationship with my BF too. I wanted to be friends for a while and see how things went. Every time he came over it turned into him trying to grope me and me trying to escape. He told me that he gets so aroused when he's with me that he needs to have sex. Ick. At least we seems to be able to talk on the phone sensibly.
My therapist helped me think about what I would tolerate and what I would not tolerate if/when I went back to him. And what things are really deal breakers. And the techniques he might use to get me back. I was prepared. However, that last time he got me to come back to him it was because he was (or seemed to be) finally coping with his life. Unfortunately it didn't last.
Right now I am concentrating on being strong in myself. It's amazing how much better I feel without his crises and problems.
I wish you the best.
Spinner
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