Curious
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 139
Curious
I've thought about posting this for a while now, but everytime I think of it in my head, it always sounds snarky. So, if my post seems that way, or unappreciative, I can assure you, it's not meant that way.
In your experiences with therapy or with al anon or the like, are you being encouraged to stay with your alcoholic partner? Are you encouraged to stick it out and help this person through the tough times, or are you being encouraged to leave this person?
Are there children involved?
I don't suppose there any hard and fast rules, but are there any circumstances where people are encouraged to stay? For example if the alcoholic is trying to quit?
In your experiences with therapy or with al anon or the like, are you being encouraged to stay with your alcoholic partner? Are you encouraged to stick it out and help this person through the tough times, or are you being encouraged to leave this person?
Are there children involved?
I don't suppose there any hard and fast rules, but are there any circumstances where people are encouraged to stay? For example if the alcoholic is trying to quit?
Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Stumbling toward happiness
Posts: 4,706
If I went to a therapist and they advised me to do - or not do - something because it would be better for someone else, I would walk out of their office and find another therapist. A therapist's job is to help you clarify what you want for your life, and hopefully give you the wisdom, courage, and strength to move in that direction.
In Al-Anon, I've been in groups where the majority leaned toward staying, other groups where the majority leaned toward leaving. That's why one always has to remember to "take what you need and leave the rest." Again, it's all about learning as much as we can, clarifying what is best for US, and moving slowly and steadily toward healing...no matter whether that takes us toward, or away from, our alcoholic loved one. Only we can decide which is the right way - other peoples' opinions are just that: opinions.
I would treat all of these healing options as simply clarifying all of the choices you have. Learn all you can, take small steps in the right direction, and remember you're not alone in this. We're all on the same painful learning journey with you
In Al-Anon, I've been in groups where the majority leaned toward staying, other groups where the majority leaned toward leaving. That's why one always has to remember to "take what you need and leave the rest." Again, it's all about learning as much as we can, clarifying what is best for US, and moving slowly and steadily toward healing...no matter whether that takes us toward, or away from, our alcoholic loved one. Only we can decide which is the right way - other peoples' opinions are just that: opinions.
I would treat all of these healing options as simply clarifying all of the choices you have. Learn all you can, take small steps in the right direction, and remember you're not alone in this. We're all on the same painful learning journey with you
Recovering Codependant
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Liverpool, Great Britain
Posts: 1,335
GL is spot on. Therapists should not be giving out advice. A therapist should be non influential; they should not make statements such as 'why don't you just...', 'If I were you...', or 'see it from his side...', 'if you learn how to communicate better...'
these types of sentence show that the therapist has issues with control and judgement. Not something you want in a person who is meant to be helping you clarify your own thoughts. How are they then any better than an A who also thinks he has a right to tell you what you should be thinking or doing?
Lily xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
these types of sentence show that the therapist has issues with control and judgement. Not something you want in a person who is meant to be helping you clarify your own thoughts. How are they then any better than an A who also thinks he has a right to tell you what you should be thinking or doing?
Lily xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: east siiiide
Posts: 254
Mine encouraged me to find a "plan B". She also asked me why I was with AH and asked me to come up with a list of things that I would absolutely NEED in a husband if I were to make a list for a new one. She asked me which of those things AH was giving me.. the answer was nearly none. She asked for a list of the good things and bad things.
She made it clear that my choice to stay was not a good one, without saying so much. Then she told me it was okay to make mistakes and that I was young and not to feel so trapped by a decision I made out of love but to chalk it up as a learning experience. I admit at first I was kind of pissed that she wasn't giving me all the tools and the secret of how to manipulate my AH into benig the kind of husband I wanted. But in time I started to realize how right she was and it gave me more courage to move forwards and see that others could identify what was and wasn't good here.
She made it clear that my choice to stay was not a good one, without saying so much. Then she told me it was okay to make mistakes and that I was young and not to feel so trapped by a decision I made out of love but to chalk it up as a learning experience. I admit at first I was kind of pissed that she wasn't giving me all the tools and the secret of how to manipulate my AH into benig the kind of husband I wanted. But in time I started to realize how right she was and it gave me more courage to move forwards and see that others could identify what was and wasn't good here.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,443
The al-anon group I attended was made up of two parents, and spouses that stayed. One had a spouse that had many years of recovery, one had an active alcoholic, and two had spouses that were in recovery but they were widowers. They never made a single comment any type of advice about me staying or leaving.
My counselor does not give advice on that front. The most she's said is that a) she did think ah and I would be good marriage counseling candidates if we worked hard and b) she would not do marriage counseling unless ah was active in a recovery program.
My counselor does not give advice on that front. The most she's said is that a) she did think ah and I would be good marriage counseling candidates if we worked hard and b) she would not do marriage counseling unless ah was active in a recovery program.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Quebec
Posts: 2,708
I've done a LOT of therapy over the years, for various reasons. Over the years, I've learned that you really have to "interview" your therapist, to make certain you click. I've been to a therapist who only wanted to talk about my relationship with my mother, when I was seeing her for PTSD after being raped. Duh.
A friend of mine in my "due date club" (group of preggo women all due the same month) is also a therapist, and she told that most couple's counselling ends up actually splitting up couples rather than resolving the differences, almost as if the therapy allowed the two individuals to finally pull out what they'd been holding in for so long that once it was out in the open, it couldn't be "taken back". She was an EFT practitioner (emotionally focused therapy), which sounded great in theory, but just didn't work for my XAH, who wasn't able to be honest with himself or with me.
Sadly, the therapist XAH and I saw through my work's EAP was a quack. We only had him for 4 free sessions, after which he'd have to charge us. I think the man felt compelled to *fix* XAH and me in the short time we had, so he completely ignored me when I brought up the fact that XAH had repeatedly made up stories about his past, and that his drinking was causing me immense distress and shame. He chose instead to focus on the fact that breastfeeding my daughter was frustrating XAH (sexually), and told us that we needed to resolve the issue or we "wouldn't make it". Rather ominous. This quack then suggested that since the Danes have the highest happiness index in the world, we should investigate how THEY deal with extended breastfeeding and immitate them. He made me promise that if I discovered that women of Denmark give up breastfeeding early, I'd do it too, for the sake of my marriage. It was craziest thing ever. I had previously hoped that this therapist would help XAH see how damaging his alcohol consumption was to our relationship, but after that last breastfeeding debacle, I cancelled the next appointment and started talking to lawyers.
SR is just about the only place where people never told me what to do...they just asked me how I felt and worked from there.
A friend of mine in my "due date club" (group of preggo women all due the same month) is also a therapist, and she told that most couple's counselling ends up actually splitting up couples rather than resolving the differences, almost as if the therapy allowed the two individuals to finally pull out what they'd been holding in for so long that once it was out in the open, it couldn't be "taken back". She was an EFT practitioner (emotionally focused therapy), which sounded great in theory, but just didn't work for my XAH, who wasn't able to be honest with himself or with me.
Sadly, the therapist XAH and I saw through my work's EAP was a quack. We only had him for 4 free sessions, after which he'd have to charge us. I think the man felt compelled to *fix* XAH and me in the short time we had, so he completely ignored me when I brought up the fact that XAH had repeatedly made up stories about his past, and that his drinking was causing me immense distress and shame. He chose instead to focus on the fact that breastfeeding my daughter was frustrating XAH (sexually), and told us that we needed to resolve the issue or we "wouldn't make it". Rather ominous. This quack then suggested that since the Danes have the highest happiness index in the world, we should investigate how THEY deal with extended breastfeeding and immitate them. He made me promise that if I discovered that women of Denmark give up breastfeeding early, I'd do it too, for the sake of my marriage. It was craziest thing ever. I had previously hoped that this therapist would help XAH see how damaging his alcohol consumption was to our relationship, but after that last breastfeeding debacle, I cancelled the next appointment and started talking to lawyers.
SR is just about the only place where people never told me what to do...they just asked me how I felt and worked from there.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: east siiiide
Posts: 254
wow, noday... that guy sounds like a nutcase! with a boob obsession..lol
I think a lot of times people in Al Anon are those who have stayed with their A's, because probably those that leave end up not going to alanon meetings eventually once the A is out of their lives.
I think a lot of times people in Al Anon are those who have stayed with their A's, because probably those that leave end up not going to alanon meetings eventually once the A is out of their lives.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Wild West, USA
Posts: 407
My original alanon group (I'm looking for a new one due to time conflicts) was neutral- they recommended being in alanon for a year before making any permanent decisions. It was a pretty diverse group: parents, children, boyfriends and girlfriends, married and divorced folks, some gay members.
Our marriage therapist said he thought our marriage could be saved. I'm not sure he was right, but we'll never know, because I told him it was too late and I was over it. He wisely didn't put any pressure on me.
I don't know why he thought that-- he'd had a session alone with my then-husband, but I don't know what they discussed. We have a child. My former husband is able to see the damage his addictions have done to his life, and in stronger moments to accept responsibility for it, but of course he can't stop.
I do regret not giving therapy a try, or alanon a year. I know we still probably would have split... but it might have been a more peaceful, well-considered decision, instead of an unresolved mess that continues to cause both of us pain 2 years later.
Our marriage therapist said he thought our marriage could be saved. I'm not sure he was right, but we'll never know, because I told him it was too late and I was over it. He wisely didn't put any pressure on me.
I don't know why he thought that-- he'd had a session alone with my then-husband, but I don't know what they discussed. We have a child. My former husband is able to see the damage his addictions have done to his life, and in stronger moments to accept responsibility for it, but of course he can't stop.
I do regret not giving therapy a try, or alanon a year. I know we still probably would have split... but it might have been a more peaceful, well-considered decision, instead of an unresolved mess that continues to cause both of us pain 2 years later.
Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 1,149
MY therapist was non-directional, her goal was to help me realise my goals and potential, she would call me out if I said something that was magical thinking (in a "could you explain how that works?" sort of way, never telling me I was wrong etc) and was great on many levels.
I went to 3 marriage counselling sessions years ago, not enough to know where he would have gone with that, but it wasn't working, H and I had entirely different marriages.
My Al-anon group were not overtly stay or go. However, the vast majority had partners in AA in long-term recovery. They would say things about how changing their attitudes and behaviour had led to their H getting into recovery, and other stuff *that I experienced* as advocating staying in a relationship (I am not saying that was their intention, it was my interpretation of their particular mix of experience). I tried one more al-anon group, and it is clear that aound here it was the same group of people at each of the ones I could get to.
what is your reason for asking?
I went to 3 marriage counselling sessions years ago, not enough to know where he would have gone with that, but it wasn't working, H and I had entirely different marriages.
My Al-anon group were not overtly stay or go. However, the vast majority had partners in AA in long-term recovery. They would say things about how changing their attitudes and behaviour had led to their H getting into recovery, and other stuff *that I experienced* as advocating staying in a relationship (I am not saying that was their intention, it was my interpretation of their particular mix of experience). I tried one more al-anon group, and it is clear that aound here it was the same group of people at each of the ones I could get to.
what is your reason for asking?
Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 100
In both cases, they try not to give advice. In alanon they say, unless there is danger involved, don't make any major decisions for a year. I was told that if I didn't get help and I left, I would seek out someone new with the same set of issues. I was told (and rightly so) that I needed to get my own mind straight before I started making major changes.
This was 5 years ago and was very sound advice.
This was 5 years ago and was very sound advice.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 2,126
I hate there not being any 'thanks' button.......grrrrrrr Sooooo, thanks to all, and yes, I agree with all....I have no experience with therapists, except those who are my friends, but al anon.....I never heard anybody being pushed in any direction (to leave or to stay), except, as husandofacoa said, there is danger involved.....
......and to go just a wee bit off-topic.....
OMMAGOSH, nodaybut2day!!!!! Alkies the world over will just love your therapist; a whole new (reason/trigger....all the other fancy terms for) EXCUSE for drinking..........: they can't suckle a teat, so they MUST(?) suckle a bottle 'o booze.......? PERFECT....!!!!! HAH
NoelleR
......and to go just a wee bit off-topic.....
OMMAGOSH, nodaybut2day!!!!! Alkies the world over will just love your therapist; a whole new (reason/trigger....all the other fancy terms for) EXCUSE for drinking..........: they can't suckle a teat, so they MUST(?) suckle a bottle 'o booze.......? PERFECT....!!!!! HAH
NoelleR
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
