Steps
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Midwest
Posts: 247
Steps
RAH went into rehab Sept 27, and got home Oct 16. Yes it was a short stay...21 days. Can someone please explain a few things:
1. Exactly when does someone get an AA sponsor? Right away? After a few months? He does not have a sponsor, yet.
2. How long does it take to work thru the steps? Is it feasible that he is done with the steps? He says he is done. I asked about the make amends one. He backtracked and said he is done with all of them but that.
1. Exactly when does someone get an AA sponsor? Right away? After a few months? He does not have a sponsor, yet.
2. How long does it take to work thru the steps? Is it feasible that he is done with the steps? He says he is done. I asked about the make amends one. He backtracked and said he is done with all of them but that.
Being Silent so I can Hear
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 2,521
The timetable for getting a sponsor varies. I believe they are told to get a sponsor within a certain timeframe though.
My AH worked the steps while in rehab also, I never heard anything from him about making amends, but I never asked.
Something I noticed after rehab: My AH suddenly became an expert on recovery.
My AH worked the steps while in rehab also, I never heard anything from him about making amends, but I never asked.
Something I noticed after rehab: My AH suddenly became an expert on recovery.
Recovering Codependant
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Liverpool, Great Britain
Posts: 1,335
Hey there!
2. How long does it take to work thru the steps? Is it feasible that he is done with the steps? He says he is done. I asked about the make amends one. He backtracked and said he is done with all of them but that
Hmmmm, 21 days in rehab and 'He says he is done' with the steps?? My gut instinct on that one is that unless your partner has had some hugh epiphany and realisation, it is not (in my experience and witness to others stories) possible to work through the steps, giving them the attention they require, in that time period. I've read accounts from folks who have taken a year on just one step!
That said, it takes as long as it takes and is different for different people.
Lily xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
2. How long does it take to work thru the steps? Is it feasible that he is done with the steps? He says he is done. I asked about the make amends one. He backtracked and said he is done with all of them but that
Hmmmm, 21 days in rehab and 'He says he is done' with the steps?? My gut instinct on that one is that unless your partner has had some hugh epiphany and realisation, it is not (in my experience and witness to others stories) possible to work through the steps, giving them the attention they require, in that time period. I've read accounts from folks who have taken a year on just one step!
That said, it takes as long as it takes and is different for different people.
Lily xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Midwest
Posts: 247
Thanks for your input, everyone! I am really confused here because I, too, feel that not enough time has passed for him to be done with the steps. And there were people I know that were on his make amends to list that I know he hasn't talked to. So when I asked about the steps, and he said he was done...I said...what about the making amends step?
And he said something about needing to make amends with me before he can make them with anyone else. And I won't accept it.
Of course. It would be my fault.
And he said something about needing to make amends with me before he can make them with anyone else. And I won't accept it.
Of course. It would be my fault.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Midwest
Posts: 247
Oh you can laugh. It is funny. He also told me that I still love him, he can see it in my eyes. And he wants to believe what my eyes say, instead of my mouth.
I had told him that I wasn't in love with him anymore. I was still chuckling about that a couple of days later...my eyes...sheesh.
On a serious note, my therapist says that I should no longer be alone with him...he is delusional.
I had told him that I wasn't in love with him anymore. I was still chuckling about that a couple of days later...my eyes...sheesh.
On a serious note, my therapist says that I should no longer be alone with him...he is delusional.
Being Silent so I can Hear
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 2,521
Please, trust your therapist. Unfortunately, it doesn't take much for that delusion to turn to anger and violence.
My AH is delusional also, profoundly so. And he refuses to give up, a year after I left. I'm in the process of getting a restraining order on him.
My AH is delusional also, profoundly so. And he refuses to give up, a year after I left. I'm in the process of getting a restraining order on him.
mergirl
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Paradise
Posts: 4,161
Originally Posted by Still Waters 
I would avoid any and all conversation with an insane person.
I've been going to AA for about 2 months, haven't found a sponsor yet, and I was only able to puzzle out 1-3 on my own (and I intend to redo them with a sponsor). I have heard of crash courses in the steps. and I reckon in a rehab you have nothing but time, but the "fast way" I think is meant as a stepping stone to understand them so that you can delve deeper into them.
My (ex) husband is a very sick man. I'd like to think if he had a spiritual awakening I would see it in him. If your AH still looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, chances are hes still a duck.
So sorry, I hope you can be safe.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Pewaukee, WI
Posts: 22
My alcoholic boyfriend was in rehab for 28 days. He transitioned to a sober house last Friday. He had a temporary sponsor on Saturday, that he is very encouraged will become his regular sponsor. He is working on steps 2 and 3 right now....
Forum Leader
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: In my little piece of heaven
Posts: 2,870
My ex husband claimed to have worked all 12 steps in 8 days. He didn't bother to get a sponsor as he knew more than any of them could have known, and to the best of my knowledge he only attended one meeting , just so he could get a list of the steps and go to work.
That is but one of a multitude of reasons he is now my EX husband. I made the decision to get happy, healthy and whole regardless of what he did. And I am... to the best of my knowledge my ex is still living a rather miserable existence.
It's all in the motives and expectations. If someone is working the steps to make someone else happy, it doesn't usually work very well. Successful step work and recovery comes from acknowledging one's own problems and making significant changes in order to clean up the wreckage of the past and move forward in a healthier way.
If Steps 1 - 7 have been worked diligently, honestly, thoroughly with a sponsor and a plan, then steps 8 and 9 are incredibly important and healing. In the 9th step, a person makes amends to those s/he has harmed except when to do so would injure them or others. The reaction of the harmed person is out of his/her control. Some people take it well, others don't. That's not the point. The point is to make the amends. It normally takes awhile - not something that you can do in 8 days.
That is but one of a multitude of reasons he is now my EX husband. I made the decision to get happy, healthy and whole regardless of what he did. And I am... to the best of my knowledge my ex is still living a rather miserable existence.
It's all in the motives and expectations. If someone is working the steps to make someone else happy, it doesn't usually work very well. Successful step work and recovery comes from acknowledging one's own problems and making significant changes in order to clean up the wreckage of the past and move forward in a healthier way.
If Steps 1 - 7 have been worked diligently, honestly, thoroughly with a sponsor and a plan, then steps 8 and 9 are incredibly important and healing. In the 9th step, a person makes amends to those s/he has harmed except when to do so would injure them or others. The reaction of the harmed person is out of his/her control. Some people take it well, others don't. That's not the point. The point is to make the amends. It normally takes awhile - not something that you can do in 8 days.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 234
In the Know...what are you doing for yourself? Personally I'm a fan of Al Anon. My husband is in recovery (still in rehab), and what I"m working on is focusing on me as much as possible. I've spend WAY too much time focusing on him in the past, and there's really not much I can do about his recovery. Hard to accept, but true.
The New Me starting 1/11/09
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: California
Posts: 678
Hi All -
You can get a sponsor on your first day or when you are ready to. (It took me 6 months of sobriety before I got one, as I didn't want one until then.)
The 12 steps - time will vary. It took me 10 months, but I suppose for some it could be done much quicker.
... but let me put it this way.
A recovering alcoholic is "recovering" because they are always working the steps. The steps give you a way to live your life and a set of tools to work on the problems of life (such as fear, anger, anxiety, stress, etc.) that caused the alcoholic to drink.
Remember that the alcohol is the solution to the problem. So, if the steps are "worked" in a really short time period, then I normally think that the person "just went through the motions, but didn't believe any of it".
Here is what I look for in myself to see if I am in recovery (vs. abstinence):
- Am I being more caring of others (thinking of them first) and less selfish?
- Am I trying to actively work with other alcoholics?
- Do I speak with my sponsor regularly?
- When I do something that I regret, do I make an amends immediately?
- Are my life tools for managing stress, control, anxiety, fear, etc. working effectively?
- Am I being more self aware of my emotions and how this could trigger my desire to drink?
From your brief statement, it doesn't say if he did any amends to you. If not, and my guess is that he owes you one, I'm not sure which 12 steps he did.
As far as I know, there isn't a light version of the 12-steps. Just some thoughts.
Abstinence is not drinking and feeling bad about it.
Recovery is not drinking and feeling good about it.
Abstinence alone generally leads to relapse.
While I am not there every day, I generally am now happy not to drink. But, I have to work at it every day. I am never done and only one drink away from being back where I started.
You can get a sponsor on your first day or when you are ready to. (It took me 6 months of sobriety before I got one, as I didn't want one until then.)
The 12 steps - time will vary. It took me 10 months, but I suppose for some it could be done much quicker.
... but let me put it this way.
A recovering alcoholic is "recovering" because they are always working the steps. The steps give you a way to live your life and a set of tools to work on the problems of life (such as fear, anger, anxiety, stress, etc.) that caused the alcoholic to drink.
Remember that the alcohol is the solution to the problem. So, if the steps are "worked" in a really short time period, then I normally think that the person "just went through the motions, but didn't believe any of it".
Here is what I look for in myself to see if I am in recovery (vs. abstinence):
- Am I being more caring of others (thinking of them first) and less selfish?
- Am I trying to actively work with other alcoholics?
- Do I speak with my sponsor regularly?
- When I do something that I regret, do I make an amends immediately?
- Are my life tools for managing stress, control, anxiety, fear, etc. working effectively?
- Am I being more self aware of my emotions and how this could trigger my desire to drink?
From your brief statement, it doesn't say if he did any amends to you. If not, and my guess is that he owes you one, I'm not sure which 12 steps he did.
As far as I know, there isn't a light version of the 12-steps. Just some thoughts.
Abstinence is not drinking and feeling bad about it.
Recovery is not drinking and feeling good about it.
Abstinence alone generally leads to relapse.
While I am not there every day, I generally am now happy not to drink. But, I have to work at it every day. I am never done and only one drink away from being back where I started.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Midwest
Posts: 247
I have already decided that we are not continuing, fixing or reliving our marriage. After the holidays, we are filing for divorce and remaining separated until that time. I don't want my kids to remember for the rest of their lives this as the Christmas that mom and dad gave us a divorce. I have told him all along that we are not continuing our relationship, he is just in denial.
I am going to Al-Anon and a therapist. I am being kind to myself, doing the things I want to do and generally trying to avoid him at all costs.
Since he was at work last night, and unable to have a phone conversation, he and I had a rather long text conversation wherein he denied being in denial.
I only heard quacking after that.
He demanded to know what I decided about the future of our marriage, and I kept telling him it was an in person conversation and not one to be had thru a text message. I could just hear him saying...she ended our 20 year marriage by text messages...and decided that it wasn't going to happen that way.
He is adamant that he worked his steps, is serious about his recovery, and is looking for a sponsor...but is just waiting for the guy to get back to him on it. Quack, quack, quack.
He is telling me he will be serious about going to meetings as soon as he gets back from this work trip...since he has only been attending 1-2 meetings per week. He just feels really good, so he gets lazy about going. Quack, quack, quack.
He is telling me that he will finally put his foot down and end his 40 year long affair with the other woman. Only problem is that other woman is his mom. And she won't be so happy about this. But he is going to tell her that she either loses him and the kids, or stays out of our relationship - the relationship in his head, since we don't have one. Quack, quack, quack.
He is telling me that after 20 years of ignoring me and my needs completely, treating me like crap, leaving me when I needed him most in my life*, cheating on me, manipulating and lying to me - that I am the person he wants to spend the rest of his life with. He had an epiphany in rehab in which he realized what he had done. Doesn't really want to talk about what he did, how it needs to change or make amends for it - just wants to get back to the good part of being married and sleeping together. Quack, quack, quack.
*Footnote about the above...last March, I had an accident wherein I broke my foot, my ankle and my arm. I was in a wheelchair, and had a cast on my arm and my leg. I needed help showering, making food, getting dressed...about the only thing I could do by myself was go to the bathroom. Our house has nothing but stairs, so I was confined to about four rooms of my house. He came home from work one day and told me he had been talking to the guys, and none of them would do what he had been doing to help me. He told me he wouldn't help me anymore. My switch flipped off that day, and has never come back on.
This duck is truly whacked.
I am going to Al-Anon and a therapist. I am being kind to myself, doing the things I want to do and generally trying to avoid him at all costs.
Since he was at work last night, and unable to have a phone conversation, he and I had a rather long text conversation wherein he denied being in denial.
I only heard quacking after that.
He demanded to know what I decided about the future of our marriage, and I kept telling him it was an in person conversation and not one to be had thru a text message. I could just hear him saying...she ended our 20 year marriage by text messages...and decided that it wasn't going to happen that way.
He is adamant that he worked his steps, is serious about his recovery, and is looking for a sponsor...but is just waiting for the guy to get back to him on it. Quack, quack, quack.
He is telling me he will be serious about going to meetings as soon as he gets back from this work trip...since he has only been attending 1-2 meetings per week. He just feels really good, so he gets lazy about going. Quack, quack, quack.
He is telling me that he will finally put his foot down and end his 40 year long affair with the other woman. Only problem is that other woman is his mom. And she won't be so happy about this. But he is going to tell her that she either loses him and the kids, or stays out of our relationship - the relationship in his head, since we don't have one. Quack, quack, quack.
He is telling me that after 20 years of ignoring me and my needs completely, treating me like crap, leaving me when I needed him most in my life*, cheating on me, manipulating and lying to me - that I am the person he wants to spend the rest of his life with. He had an epiphany in rehab in which he realized what he had done. Doesn't really want to talk about what he did, how it needs to change or make amends for it - just wants to get back to the good part of being married and sleeping together. Quack, quack, quack.
*Footnote about the above...last March, I had an accident wherein I broke my foot, my ankle and my arm. I was in a wheelchair, and had a cast on my arm and my leg. I needed help showering, making food, getting dressed...about the only thing I could do by myself was go to the bathroom. Our house has nothing but stairs, so I was confined to about four rooms of my house. He came home from work one day and told me he had been talking to the guys, and none of them would do what he had been doing to help me. He told me he wouldn't help me anymore. My switch flipped off that day, and has never come back on.
This duck is truly whacked.
Recovering Codependant
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Liverpool, Great Britain
Posts: 1,335
Originally Posted by intheknow
Oh you can laugh. It is funny. He also told me that I still love him, he can see it in my eyes. And he wants to believe what my eyes say, instead of my mouth.
I had told him that I wasn't in love with him anymore. I was still chuckling about that a couple of days later...my eyes...sheesh.
On a serious note, my therapist says that I should no longer be alone with him...he is delusional.
I had told him that I wasn't in love with him anymore. I was still chuckling about that a couple of days later...my eyes...sheesh.
On a serious note, my therapist says that I should no longer be alone with him...he is delusional.
Thought for you - he is not in denial, he knows what he is doing and is playing you. A person who doesn't necessarily admit their part is not necessarily in denial. I think it is sometimes easier for the partner to think denial is at play rather than confront the possibility that there is a deeper psychology at work or that their partners moral values are in question.
Lily xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
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