Mattcake

I'm extremely interested in getting some input on the topic of honesty. I had a thunderbolt realisation today, while PMing with a member I very much respect but had never approached before.

I realised I'm not honest.

Whenever anyone says that honesty is the hardcore foundation of recovery, I always think to myself "oh, I'm honest"... because I dislike lying intensely and I'm never less than forthcoming... and move on quite merrily. Talk about Ego! Today I realised that not lying does not necessarily make someone honest I also realised that I've been lying to myself for a long time, in many, many ways.

I'm not making much sense, I truly am in shock.. so I'll try to sit with this for a while.. For now, I'd really appreciate reading experiences, points of view, input regarding honesty. How it relates to fear... How do you know you're not lying to yourself... Just, anything...

Thanks so much.
m.

suki44883

Honesty is such a lonely word.

Anna

Hi Matty,

I think a lot about the issue of honesty too.

For me, lying did relate totally to fear. I learned, around age 5 that I needed to lie in order to survive and I became a master. The funny thing is, that when I moved away from home, I continued to lie, even though there was no obvious reason for it. It was a habit, so ingrained, that I wasn't even sure what the truth was anymore.

Then, I realized that it was still tied to fear. I lied because I wasn't sure what I thought or felt would be acceptable, so I would say what I thought people wanted to hear.

I do think that honesty is the basis of recovery. It was something I knew I had to deal with on day one and it wasn't easy. I think lying to yourself can serve a purpose. I think, in recovery, it's a process, an unfolding. Not everything can be revealed at once. It would be too much, too hard to bear. So, the mind holds onto some things we believe to be true, until we are ready to deal with the real truth.

Matt, it sounds like you have had a breakthrough because you're ready to move onto the next level of recovery.

Astro

Yep, bring up the topic of honesty....it gets really quiet.....crickets start chirping

It's something I always struggled with Matt. My first two marriages, I was a compulsive/chronic liar about almost everything. How much I drank, whether I'd been chewing tobacco or not, whether I put my hand over the baby's mouth when they were crying, and on and on and on. It was all fear based, not wanting to admit my faults and accept the consequences, and the fear of being judged, and "found out". It's like building a house of cards though, sooner or later it's gonna come crashing down.

I really need to pause and think before I speak most of the time, especially in relationship issues, because I'm not about to go down that road again. So I guess that's my simple thought on honesty. I am capable of being honest, but it's not my nature, so I need to consider what I'm going to say before I verbalize it.

In AA, honesty is the principle that goes along with Step 1. Getting honest with myself meant admitting I was powerless over alcohol, that my life was unmanageable. Every day begins with that Step, so I guess I start each day with a little honesty too.

Reese321

No one can ever blame another person for being honest, therefore, technically, no shame should be tied to it. It's like blaming a person for being blonde, or black or any other thing that cannot be changed. That's why honesty is so great. It just is what it is. Very pure and almost incontrovertable. It is the greatest ally you will ever have.

Hevyn

A tough one, Matt. Like right now, I'm struggling to think of something I'm not entirely honest about - yet I know there must be many things. For years I was so defensive, partly due to my drinking, partly because I felt I didn't measure up to other's achievements and always made excuses for that. I also didn't think I was interesting enough, so lied about myself to appear more appealing. I think many of us become so used to saying what we think people want to hear, we don't even realize we're not giving an honest response.

Wolfchild

Honesty, like any other principle, must work it's way to the inner core of our being. That is why it is called a process of progress! It does not happen overnight! As i continue to be honest in thought, action, & attitude, it leads to a more substantial asset of character called Integrity. This in turn, helps myself and others to see that i am dependable in what i do and say. Consistency comes into play as more and more time goes by. This is how trust gets built, by both people working to rely on each other no matter what. It's a combined effort to heal, recovery must come from within and from without! In this way, we do recover each and every day.

Take it easy on yourself and call your sponsor. This might be a result of the Step you may be working on.
Thank you for sharing this new spiritual awakening!

Dee74

One of the unexpected benefits of my recovery is I'm learning it's ok to be me - to think what I think and to feel what I feel.

I spent a lot of years lying to myself and to others - not only with what I said, but who I was - I was a chameleon really - I became quite a people pleaser, partly because I had so little self esteem and partly 'anything for a quiet life'.

I'm still a work in progress, but it's nice to be 'me' - in words and action

It's nice to have the perspective and clarity to be able to call myself on my own BS too

thanks Matt
D

socialismislost

I read somewhere that the average person lies three times a day. Big or small. Even when we dont have to lie. I think its just a human trait.

OddSpot80

Thank you so much for this topic. I don't have anything wise to say but yesterday I realised I am no where near as far down the road as I thought I was. I think I have been using arrogance to cover up the lies I tell myself. And the lies I tell others, well that's for their protection, yeah right
Thanks again.

Firehazard

My experience with Honesty is something new to me and I has taken a

constant effort (day by day) to remain there. For me It seems as if I can only

get Honest when I have the Humility to look at what I say, do and think. This is

because when I lie even not knowing it I am trying to make myself

bigger/more important than what I really am. You know trying to change

things to suit the way I think they should be instead of the way they are.

Yes, many times when I am dishonest I am fearful. I am forgetting that

everything is all right as it is and doesn't need my tweaking. Sure, I knew

the definition of honesty coming into sobriety but I didn't know what it meant

to me. Now we are starting to get that.

Mattcake

Thank you so, so much my friends. Your advice, support and experience are priceless to me. I still feel scrambled... shaken, in a way... I'll check in tomorrow, hopefully with a clear head after a good night's sleep. Love to you all

Quote:

Originally Posted by suki44883

Honesty is such a lonely word.

And mostly what I need from you.

suki44883

Zencat

fOR ME HONESTY IS BREAKING THROUGH ALL MY COGNITIVE DISTORTIONS AND SEEING.....WITHOUT JUDGMENT.....WHERE i NEED TO MAKE CHANGES.

penny74

The truth can sometime hurt beyond belief.
Somethings you can better not know because they will hurt you too much.
And nobody is always 100% honest.


If you truly want honesty, don't ask questions you don't really want the answer to”

yeahgr8

I was the biggest liar and cheat out there. Through AA and the program i am now being honest in my life, the feeling of having that weight lifted is amazing! I can't remember, since being sober, the last time i lied to someone else.

However to be honest with myself and be honest about my feelings is a different matter. This is something i am just being able to do, being able to be honest about really how i am feeling and how i feel about a situation is new to me and one that i am now starting to do. It is a very odd feeling indeed to share exactly how you feel with another man (i'm not even going to think about sharing them with another woman?!), 'taking it on the chin off the grin' doesn't really apply to the way i am working the program lol

Had a coffee with my sponsor yesterday and he asked how are you doing? I replied honestly, couldn't even look him in the eye...i felt like i should not be talking about my feelings, y'know opening up. I then said that i don't mean to be a misery guts and he just laughed (for a while i might add?!), i then asked if this was normal and he said yes cliff you should talk about how you feel it's what normal people do...well new territory for me and it felt good actually, might start a new trend of being honest with myself;-)

Sounds like you had a breakthrough to me:-)

stone

I was thinking about honesty the other day, I don't lie to others but do I lie to myself? How would I know? Why would I think I might? lol

Sometimes being less than honest is a way to avoid confrontation, or to avoid hurting people.

But things like people pleasing show a lack being honest with myself I think. I wasn't aware how much I did it until recently.

I tend to wear my heart on my sleeve but I don't see the need to bare my soul to everyone.

keen2bclean

Yep I reckon sometimes it goes hand in hand with good old tact...I guess if we went around being brutally honest to all and sundry, the world would be an interesting (coff) place to say the least lol. Being honest with yourself, now there's a thing....

Rusty Zipper

awe hell,

one less lie today towards others and ourselves,

is one more truth for tomorrow...

for me,

i had to break down loads of walls,

ego, self-righteousness, prejudice, self-sastifaction,

and the Great Wall of China more...

good wishes on your quest matty...

and some great replys here...

mikel60

The biggest lie that I tell is to myself. I say I'm not good enough, I'm a drunk, I'm worthless, and that I do not deserve the love and respect of God and other people.

That's dishonesty and that's my disease speaking. I battle this daily, but now know that it is not true.

Mike