What ifs and Whys.......Need some input

Old 06-01-2009, 07:58 AM
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What ifs and Whys.......Need some input

Thanks to all of those who responded to my last post. It is funny how I don't even see my own insane behavior until it is pointed out to me by someone else.
One of my biggest problems is that I don't think, and what I mean by that is that I can't seem to think. I am a single mom and work FT, I also have a disabled mother who I take care of. At the end of the day-which is non stop from 530 to 830pm, I literally collapse from exhaustion most days. I never take time or have time to just sit and really think about what I am doing or why-and I think that attributes to a lot of my over reacting at times, and also keeps me focusing on everything BUT me.
I realized this weekend when I was reading my AlAnon books, (which I do make time for daily-I have 5 daily readers I read daily) that the What Ifs and the Whys are pretty much me not trusting my HP to take care of my life for me. I have HUGE issues with control (quit laughing-lol) and have always felt that I had to keep everything going and see to it that things got done. Being a single mom I'm sure has attributed to that, I knew what needs done and when and it is up to me to make sure it gets taken care of. I've also been caring for my disabled mother for years, and again, there are things there that I have to take care of and see to it that things get done when they need to. She doesn't go out of the house-hasn't been out in years, and I do all her errands, banking, marketing, etc. So in so many areas of my life I've always felt like I had to take control and get things done, and of course done right. Help from anyone else, paid or family is not an option.
It is MONUMENTAL for me to LET GO and just let it all up to HP and trust that He will know what needs done. Silly I know, who am I NOT to trust God,who am I to think I know better than He does, but I'm being honest.
So my main goal right now is to try to find a way to just try to THINK and REALLY FOCUS on my thoughts and what I am feeling and why. To somehow clear my head long enough, while I am awake, and learn to ask myself some of the questions that you all ask me here. I need to find a way to trigger my own thoughts like so many of you have helped me to trigger them. I think that is a big step in putting down the magnifying glass and picking up the mirror......
thanks for listening
spirit
Any suggestions would be wonderful and appreciated as always.......
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Old 06-01-2009, 08:38 AM
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My own mind was the thing that caused me so much pain and so many problems. So, how in the world could the same mind that got me into this mess "think" my way out of it? It couldn't. I needed help. I needed someone to gently point me in another direction where I could see things from a different angle. If I hadn't found someone to help me with this, I would still be stuck in my old ways.

The most life-changing thing I ever did was therapy. The time and money invested in one-on-one personal counseling has reaped more rewards than I could have ever imagined. I could not "think" my way out of my dysfunction. I had to be shown another way.

L
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Old 06-01-2009, 09:04 AM
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I , too, can't afford a professional's guidance in this process, and I'm really not one to go to Al-Anon meetings, too much of a recluse, I guess.

A method I find helpful is to use the time I'm alone in my car as my processing time. Through the day I write problems down on post-its or on my phone's notepad and I read them before heading out for errands. I find quite a few of the issues that I put on the backburner the day before, resolve themselves before I can spend any time pondering them. The ones that remain relavent are the ones I work on.

It's also the way I "let go and let God." I write him notes.

One post-it read..."Lord, please review {my cat}'s vomit issue. I've given him a hair ball remedy, but he's remaining mum on why he's nauseous." Love, Alice.

The next morning when I went through the notes...I realized the cat wasn't sick anymore so I said a prayer thanking God for fielding that one for me.

May sound silly, but it worked. I did what I could for my little fuzzy love and let go of some worry for the day.

You could try organizing your points of worry more formally in order of what you truly have control over, meaning worrying about the actions of others have to come off the list since you can't control people. Maybe listing a few here (1 through 10) for input would be helpful to you.

best wishes,

Alice
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Old 06-01-2009, 09:09 AM
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I agree with La TeeDa 150%. I don't really see any other way.

This appears evident by your threads over the last week or so, where you are asking the same question in different words, or perhaps you just don't like getting the answers you are getting.

I think Ago provided a terrific suggestion yesterday for you, but maybe you don't want to do the work. There isn't any magic wand Spirited. You aren't going to wake up one morning and have it all figured out. Sorry.
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Old 06-01-2009, 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by LaTeeDa View Post
My own mind was the thing that caused me so much pain and so many problems. So, how in the world could the same mind that got me into this mess "think" my way out of it? It couldn't. I needed help. I needed someone to gently point me in another direction where I could see things from a different angle. If I hadn't found someone to help me with this, I would still be stuck in my old ways.

The most life-changing thing I ever did was therapy. The time and money invested in one-on-one personal counseling has reaped more rewards than I could have ever imagined. I could not "think" my way out of my dysfunction. I had to be shown another way.

L
The way I finally understood that concept is the counselor drew a circle on a blackboard, filled it with "stuff" and said "this is your brain and everything that has ever happened to you, and every one of your thoughts. It only holds so much. Much of it is learned in childhood and actual "habit patterns" are literally "burned" into your nuerons.

No matter how many different way the "question" comes at us, faced with the same question, and the same information, your brain will ALWAYS give you the same "answer"

It can't not give you the same answer, it's a "closed system", no matter how much "alone time" or reading you do, your habit patterns are "burned in" and no matter how much you try, given the same set of variables, your mind will always give you the same answer it always has.

The "answer" that leads to our choices in partners. The answer that leads us to end up in places like this.

There are scientific studies that show groups of at least 3 or more people suffering from the same dilemma can "brainstorm" their way out of their situation (AA/Al-anon), or one person lead by someone with experience (therapist) can heal, if repeated frequently you can begin to burn new pathways.

If not, your brain will automatically go to old and familiar "habit pathways" and once again you will end up back in the same place. Every time.

This is whats meant by having an "open mind".

Thats why Honesty, open mindedness, and willingness are indispensible to recovery.

Open to new ideas from other people

This is the latest crap coming out of the scientific community being taught to therapists anyway, and it matches my experience.

You can't "think" yourself better, thats just how that is
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Old 06-01-2009, 06:22 PM
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Spirit,

Have you considered trying to get some help to lighten your load?

It was important in my recovery to have time each day to just sit and be still. I was the World's Worst Meditator, but I worked on that until I could just sit there and listen to that small, still voice of guidance for at least fifteen minutes a day. I also made a pact with myself that I wouldn't take any rash decisions until I'd had time to just sit with it in my Stillness Time and let my real feelings, fears, sadnesses, etc. come to the surface.

For me, I was trying to do too much. Full time work, full time student, volunteering, trying to exercise and have a semblance of a social life. There was no time for me to just STOP. SIT. JOURNAL. Let the guidance come.

I was also afraid of making this time. I was terrified of facing myself and facing my mistakes and flaws.

Are any of these things true for you?

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Old 06-02-2009, 02:51 AM
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This is my take on it. I think you probably do have a little time to stop, meditate, think, focus on recovery. My feeling is that rather than it be a time issue it is because it is a difficult thing to do: to stop and pick up the mirror etc.

Let me put it this way... You found time to do 'unhealthy' behaviours, to focus on destructive and hurtful things (for you), to put a magnifying glass on the A, to set up elaborate stings etc. Imagine that time spent focussing on you and your recovery.

I suspect we've all done it.. you're not alone.. the hardest thing about this is probably not dealing with the A but dealing with ourself. :ghug
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Old 06-02-2009, 03:34 AM
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I am reading The Power of Now by Eckard Tolle. It is really fascinating and makes me realize that my mind is really the cause of all my difficult situations. I am REALLY attached to the mind and all of its insanity, but I am going to give the principles of this book a good try.

I'm not meditating yet, but as soon as I've finished the book I will.

I agree with Tallulah that it's about making the time. All of the energy that we focus outward just drains us, spiritually. Letting go of the unhealthy, painful constructs of the mind--sounds impossible, but I am beginning to sense that the energy could be used for much more positive, peaceful living.
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Old 06-02-2009, 05:10 AM
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Thanks for the ESH, as always it is appreciated. I however, believe that the same mind that thought me here, can also think me back out of it all. After all a lot of what we do here is simply reversing thought process's we have developed over years, many do this without therapy, as many can't afford it, o rhave had bad experiences with it in the past.
I believe our mind is our most powerful tool, but only when we can use it right, if not it can be our own worst enemy.
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Old 06-02-2009, 06:50 AM
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I can certainly understand your resistance. I had to get absolutely desperate before I picked up that phone and made an appointment. Even then, I considered not going. It's much like the A who tries to quit on their own. Some can do it, but most have to admit they need help. I also notice that what I can afford or what I have time for is directly connected to how bad I want it.

We all have to find our own way. Best wishes to you on your journey. I hope you find a way that works for you.

L
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Old 06-02-2009, 08:25 AM
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Oh, and the other thing I wanted to say is when it comes to my own behavior, I am the QUEEN of rationalization and justification. I really needed someone to call me on that in order to move forward.

L
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Old 06-02-2009, 08:35 AM
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According to Einstein, "Problems cannot be solved at the same level of consciousness that created them." The mind easily gets caught up in its own bias and its own limits.

So while I don't disagree that we can think our way out of certain situations, it takes a radically different kind of thinking that doesn't come easy.

And it takes action. Physical, concrete action that brings the thoughts to life.

I could think up great solutions. But until I developed the strength to "just say no" when my mind & body wanted to do damaging things, all that thinking did precisely jack for me.

I like that you're journaling - it always unearths concrete things we can DO to change our behavior and make ourselves happier. But then we have to do them (or not do them). SR's great for me for helping me keep DOING the things that keep me on the right track - if I listen

You're making good progress. Way to go.

Good luck, spirit!
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Old 06-02-2009, 09:12 AM
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Well, as they say on TV detective shows, "lets look at the evidence"

You state you have 5 daily readings, and frequent many alanon boards

If you go back, and reread all your posts while you were doing your reading and frequenting these forums, there is what your thinking looks like by doing what you are doing.

I mean, there it is. Can't really argue with it, it's in black and white, you wrote all of it.

Keep doing what you are doing, you will keep getting what you are getting, and if nothing changes, nothing changes.

"Old timers" always nod when I justify what I am doing and say two things, "Hows that working out for you...what you are doing?"

then they listen,....smile and nod, and pat me on the head and say "keep doing what you are doing"
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Old 06-02-2009, 09:54 AM
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I read a book recently called You can be happy by Richard Carlson. Really helped me to see that my own mind could be my worst enemy at times. I horrifically overthink EVERYTHING! The book says to see thoughts for what they are - a running commentary in your head. They only have weight if you give it the attention. You can think something, understand it, let the thought move on, then you move on. Or, you can let it go around and around and let it fester, even if it didn't merit that kind of attention.

The key to my recovery has been to stop the hamster going in the wheel in my head at all times. I have learned to stop analyzing absolutely everything. Stopping that freight train takes practice but it has helped me to focus, to simplify and to start having peace in my life. Also the motto 'one day at a time' helps. AH recently has been stressed at work and I told him this. I said not to tackle the burden of future stuff at work and focus just on the day. Get through this one day. Yesterday he told me he was able to do this and had a good and productive day at work. The reality is that you have a full life. But it all doesn't have to be lived each day. Tackle only the things you need to do today, and leave the rest for tomorrow.

The power of now is a good book too, and I find myself being able to live more in the present through my young daughter. I used to sit on the floor with her, but I'd be lost in thought about AH, about this, that, the other. Now I reel in the thoughts and focus on HER and what we're doing that very moment. Really helpful!
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Old 06-02-2009, 10:50 AM
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Originally Posted by spiritedgrl123 View Post
I however, believe that the same mind that thought me here, can also think me back out of it all. After all a lot of what we do here is simply reversing thought process's we have developed over years, many do this without therapy, as many can't afford it, o rhave had bad experiences with it in the past.
I used to think like this...but it was my best thinking that got me into the mess my life became. What I discovered was no matter how hard I tried I could not change certain deep rooted behavior on my own. I couldn't because, as I discovered through my therapist, many of my behaviors were driven by my subconscious....I had to do a lot of work to help myself.

I too, couldn't afford counseling until I couldn't afford not to go. I just said to myself, "I am worth this and I will help myself so I can be a healthy model for my kids." I found a counselor that specialized in addictions through a center that offered a sliding scale. I should rephrase that to, "My HP led me to a counselor...."
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Old 06-02-2009, 11:14 AM
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I believe our mind is our most powerful tool, but only when we can use it right, if not it can be our own worst enemy.

I believe our heart is our most powerful tool, and our mind is to be of service to our heart. Otherwise, it will wander to the darkest places aimlessly. And as Ago said, since our childhood, we create connections that are constantly reinforced until they are almost "hard'-coded".

That is why we need constant reassurance of our new ideas, these new perspectives are very vulnerable and fragile compared to (in my case) 27 years of the same A->B->C flow of ideas that have dictated my life so far. Making me miserable!

Yoga helps to silence this endless, constant chatter in my mind that now I consider "old school". I hope you get around a video or yoga class soon! I find it is the only time of the day I truly rest.

Good luck in your journey!!
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Old 06-02-2009, 11:36 AM
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"once again, i needed the wisdom of experienced others to point out my faulty thinking.......and help give me tried and true suggestions and advice on how to get back on my own side of the fence and deal with MY OWN crap and let hank do whatever he was gonna do. they educated me on DETACHMENT and BOUNDARIES. and how nothing else mattered unless and until i had secured my own recovery, put my own oxygen mask on FIRST. "

No disrespect intended but the FIRST thing I was told in my very FIRST F2F meeting was that we do NOT give advice. We can offer ESH from what we have learned in our own experiences but none of us are trained counselors/psychologists and not capable of giving advice to anyone and should refrain from doing so. I was also told and agree with having to many people giving conflicting advice often makes a situation even harder on the one seeking help.
Secondly I do agree that left to our own devices most of us, me included, would sink, which is why we post and reach out to those with more experience on this journey. However I have seen and heard on several boards, as I have been going to different boards for sometime now, that one can usually tell by the response to your post whether the responder is an addict or codie by the response.
Back to the beginning my response was NOT that we should go it alone but that not all of us could afford, etc, one on one therapy like La suggested and that Therapy isn't always a neccessary option as the biggest part of recovery-for me-is changing my stinking thinking. And therapy, posts, boards, F2F, reading, meditating and praying is NOT going to change a person's thought process UNTIL they can step back and witness first hand their own stinking thinking.
Ago, if you go back and re read your posts, it seems to me like you weren't always in such a good place, and were quite a mess at one point yourself over a relationship too. I hope that one of the "old timers" showed you some compassion and wern't so judgemental when you came to the boards or F2F for help.
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Old 06-02-2009, 11:46 AM
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My experience on this board has been that EVERY SINGLE TIME a reply has upset me, it has turned out to be MY PROBLEM. An issue that makes me uncomfortable, or something I just don't want to look at in myself.

Also, when I post a thread asking for input, I must be prepared to take what people give. And many times it's not what I wanted to hear.....

L

Last edited by LaTeeDa; 06-02-2009 at 11:51 AM. Reason: typo
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Old 06-02-2009, 12:04 PM
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Ago, if you go back and re read your posts, it seems to me like you weren't always in such a good place, and were quite a mess at one point yourself over a relationship. I hope that one of the "old timers" showed you some compassion and wern't so judgemental when you came to the boards or F2F for help.
I absolutely was a mess when I got here, thank God I got the help and support I did.

What helped me was people here and at F2f being blunt and telling me the truth.

What I write IS my experience, I am sorry you see it as judgmental.
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Old 06-02-2009, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by LaTeeDa View Post
My experience on this board has been that EVERY SINGLE TIME a reply has upset me, it has turned out to be MY PROBLEM. An issue that makes me uncomfortable, or something I just don't want to look at in myself.

Also, when I post a thread asking for input, I must be prepared to take what people give. And many times it's not what I wanted to hear.....

L
Yep. Now if something someone posts makes me feel a little defensive.. I take a big old look at why.
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