Taking what I like...
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Taking what I like...
I'd like to thank everyone who responded to my post yesterday, even though I didn't agree with some, I always appreciate the ESH.
I do not believe I played the martyr role at all by telling EXABF to "just keep it" in reference to my things. Would I like them back? Of course! Am I willing to go another week on this merry go round from hell to get them back? NO....therefore "just keep it"..no need to contact me, no need to "get with me", no need to come by my house yet again....DONE.
EXABF and I split up in November. In Dec/Jan we began talking again on the phone and Jan 1st talked about getting back together in time. Jan 18th he emails me (after talking to me on the phone the night before about movies we needed to see and games we needed to play) and tells me that basically he wants to see other people and isn't ready to try again. Feb 2 he shows up at my job with a B day card for me and in an email two days later tells me that when he is ready to try again and feels like he can give us a fair chance he will find me NO MATTER WHAT. The end of Feb he asks me out for April 20-1st day of Spring. We go out have a blast. Talk on the phone all week and see one another the following Friday after my meeting. Again get along great. Then the next day when talking on the phone he feels, (because I tell him that I wish I had the support system that he does when it comes to us getting back together since my whole support system was pretty much against it)like we might need to take a break. He EMAILS me later that night and tells me we need to take a break. A week later another email to tell me that he really wanted to try again but he couldn't.....he wanted to but just couldn't. Mother's day cards, and emails to let me know he is thinking of me every couple of weeks, then hey I need my stuff.
EXABF has been sober and in AA for 10 1/2 years, he attends weekly meetings and sponsors people in the program, but I'm wondering lately if his prescribed use of Oxycodin (long term for a back injury) could be playing a part in him being all over the place.
I want to get on with my own life. I've accepted the break up, but can NOT understand why for the life of me, he keeps coming back around when he is the one who wanted to end things, and why he just doesn't go away and stay away. I shouldn't have to be cruel and heartless to get him to see how his behavior is affecting me.
I am EXHAUSTED, mentally and physically from the last 6 mths of insanity. I can't do one more second or one more minute in it, let alone another week of scheduling around his needs to get my stuff......it's just not worth it if I am going to go crazy because of it all, and right now I feel like I am.....
spirit
I do not believe I played the martyr role at all by telling EXABF to "just keep it" in reference to my things. Would I like them back? Of course! Am I willing to go another week on this merry go round from hell to get them back? NO....therefore "just keep it"..no need to contact me, no need to "get with me", no need to come by my house yet again....DONE.
EXABF and I split up in November. In Dec/Jan we began talking again on the phone and Jan 1st talked about getting back together in time. Jan 18th he emails me (after talking to me on the phone the night before about movies we needed to see and games we needed to play) and tells me that basically he wants to see other people and isn't ready to try again. Feb 2 he shows up at my job with a B day card for me and in an email two days later tells me that when he is ready to try again and feels like he can give us a fair chance he will find me NO MATTER WHAT. The end of Feb he asks me out for April 20-1st day of Spring. We go out have a blast. Talk on the phone all week and see one another the following Friday after my meeting. Again get along great. Then the next day when talking on the phone he feels, (because I tell him that I wish I had the support system that he does when it comes to us getting back together since my whole support system was pretty much against it)like we might need to take a break. He EMAILS me later that night and tells me we need to take a break. A week later another email to tell me that he really wanted to try again but he couldn't.....he wanted to but just couldn't. Mother's day cards, and emails to let me know he is thinking of me every couple of weeks, then hey I need my stuff.
EXABF has been sober and in AA for 10 1/2 years, he attends weekly meetings and sponsors people in the program, but I'm wondering lately if his prescribed use of Oxycodin (long term for a back injury) could be playing a part in him being all over the place.
I want to get on with my own life. I've accepted the break up, but can NOT understand why for the life of me, he keeps coming back around when he is the one who wanted to end things, and why he just doesn't go away and stay away. I shouldn't have to be cruel and heartless to get him to see how his behavior is affecting me.
I am EXHAUSTED, mentally and physically from the last 6 mths of insanity. I can't do one more second or one more minute in it, let alone another week of scheduling around his needs to get my stuff......it's just not worth it if I am going to go crazy because of it all, and right now I feel like I am.....
spirit
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Originally Posted by spiritedgrl123 
I want to get on with my own life. I've accepted the break up, but can NOT understand why for the life of me, he keeps coming back around when he is the one who wanted to end things, and why he just doesn't go away and stay away.
Originally Posted by spiritedgrl123
I shouldn't have to be cruel and heartless to get him to see how his behavior is affecting me.
Originally Posted by spiritedgrl123
I am EXHAUSTED, mentally and physically from the last 6 mths of insanity. I can't do one more second or one more minute in it,
L
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Push you...pull you...push you...pull you ad infinitum.. Or, until you are no longer there to push or pull.
Don't try and work out why he is like this.. it will only make you crazy.
Don't engage him.. it will only make you crazy.
Don't allow him to live rent free in your head.. it will only make you crazy.
No contact. It is the only way. It doesn't have to be forever but it does have to be long enough to get your head straight from the emotional chess games. If he contacts you.. ignore it.. it is an invitation to make a move and play the game.
If it is any comfort I have been right where you have and I'm sure alot of others have. Get off the rollercoaster and stay off... let him ride alone..
Don't try and work out why he is like this.. it will only make you crazy.
Don't engage him.. it will only make you crazy.
Don't allow him to live rent free in your head.. it will only make you crazy.
No contact. It is the only way. It doesn't have to be forever but it does have to be long enough to get your head straight from the emotional chess games. If he contacts you.. ignore it.. it is an invitation to make a move and play the game.
If it is any comfort I have been right where you have and I'm sure alot of others have. Get off the rollercoaster and stay off... let him ride alone..
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Originally Posted by spiritedgrl123
I want to get on with my own life. I've accepted the break up, but can NOT understand why for the life of me, he keeps coming back around when he is the one who wanted to end things, and why he just doesn't go away and stay away.
So if he told you something that would help you understand why he keeps coming around would that help? Would it change anything? Would you even believe it as truth? Or would it give way to a million more questions that you would NEED to understand? Why does anyone do anything? If you need to do some analysis, look at your own motivations - why do you keep entertaining it, wondering about it, want to figure him out?
You can end it anytime. He can keep coming back, writing, texting, whatever, until he's blue in the face. You don't have to respond, AT ALL. Even if it took him a million years to get it. You have the power to move on, but it seems you are holding yourself back.
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I shouldn't have to be cruel and heartless to get him to see how his behavior is affecting me.
You don't have to be cruel and heartless. You just have to tell him that you don't ever want to hear from him again.
But first, you have to find it in yourself to do that. I know you didn't want to hear this from everybody, but in this case they are right: It's over when YOU say it's over. Until you're ready to put your foot down there, he will keep jerking you around like a toy. Sadly, he does that because you've trained him that way -- it works, so he keeps doing it.
Everybody reaches that breaking point differently, and at different times. Just know that it's right there in front of you whenever you're ready. No-contact was the only thing that made me feel strong again.
Then the healing really started.
But for now, big hugs to you - it's been a wild ride, huh?
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I'll say one little thing about martyrdom. That was our topic this week at my Al-anon meeting.
A martyr I thought.. nope not me.. it was because I didn't do any 'woe is me' that I was in the position I was in.. had I done that and spoken about what was happening maybe I wouldn't have ended up where I am now.
Then I listened to the readings someone did and I thought about it as people shared.
And I stripped away the BS'ing we do so well to ourselves and realised that I was a martyr.. not in the way others may have experienced it.. but in a covert way. Because while I did no hand wringing or gnashing of teeth, I stayed in a position where I was suffering and in torment. That is martyrdom.
You seem like you are suffering and in torment to me.
A martyr I thought.. nope not me.. it was because I didn't do any 'woe is me' that I was in the position I was in.. had I done that and spoken about what was happening maybe I wouldn't have ended up where I am now.
Then I listened to the readings someone did and I thought about it as people shared.
And I stripped away the BS'ing we do so well to ourselves and realised that I was a martyr.. not in the way others may have experienced it.. but in a covert way. Because while I did no hand wringing or gnashing of teeth, I stayed in a position where I was suffering and in torment. That is martyrdom.
You seem like you are suffering and in torment to me.
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"I shouldn't have to be cruel and heartless to get him to see how his behavior is affecting me. "
In early addiction the addict tends to live in the future; in middle and late addiction he begins to dwell more and more in the past. And it is usually an unhappy, bitterly regretted past.
He may or may not acknowledge his behaviour affects you. He may acknowledge it - right on his deathbed. He may never get to that point and die stuck in denial and 'personal expectionalism' hating everybody and thinking no one ever understood him. Ok. That's all between him and HP.
The fact is he affected you, and the good news is that you can recover from it, and work on yourself so no other alcoholic sees you as a good target for an enabler. And when he does, you will be able to laugh out loud until your eyes swell
, then go out with people who are capable of giving you what you need and with whom life is enjoyable, not the twisted hell of alcoholism and codependence.
In early addiction the addict tends to live in the future; in middle and late addiction he begins to dwell more and more in the past. And it is usually an unhappy, bitterly regretted past.
He may or may not acknowledge his behaviour affects you. He may acknowledge it - right on his deathbed. He may never get to that point and die stuck in denial and 'personal expectionalism' hating everybody and thinking no one ever understood him. Ok. That's all between him and HP.
The fact is he affected you, and the good news is that you can recover from it, and work on yourself so no other alcoholic sees you as a good target for an enabler. And when he does, you will be able to laugh out loud until your eyes swell
, then go out with people who are capable of giving you what you need and with whom life is enjoyable, not the twisted hell of alcoholism and codependence.
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Originally Posted by tallulah
I stayed in a position where I was suffering and in torment. That is martyrdom.
When I started seeing a therapist, I wanted someone to 'vent' to. Someone to agree with me and validate what a horrible person he was and what a victim I was. I didn't like it at first when she kept turning it around and pointing out how MY life was MY responsibility. How I had the choice at any time to STOP playing the game. It's much easier to blame others for our pain. But, it's empowering to take responsibility for our choices.
L
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I can see how hurt, sad, frustrated, upset and angry you are because your exabf no longer wishes to have the kind of relationship that you held out and onto for the last 6 months.
You want him to see how hurt and sad and depleted you are, you want him to some how acknowledge your hurt and he’s not doing that. He didn’t acknowledge it in the email and he certainly didn’t acknowledge it when he came to pick up HIS stuff but neglected to leave you yours. I know this is not what you want to hear but sounds like he just doesn’t care about you like you wish him to. You and your things are not important to him no matter what words you have been holding onto from his cards, texts, emails. His actions are telling you everything your heart is not ready to hear.
I tend to agree with LaTeeDa about your “things” and drama. It is how you can keep the insanity going along with the hope that he will see how hurt and sad you are and maybe possible come back out of guilt and comfort you?
Let me ask you this, if these things were important to you then why didn’t you get them sooner seeing that this relationship was fizzling. It sounds like the last 6 months have been phone calls and emails with not many real face to face interactions, not very personal, very distant.
And if you deem these things to be so important that you must have them back then why not have a mutual friend get them for you and be done with this guy.
You want him to see how hurt and sad and depleted you are, you want him to some how acknowledge your hurt and he’s not doing that. He didn’t acknowledge it in the email and he certainly didn’t acknowledge it when he came to pick up HIS stuff but neglected to leave you yours. I know this is not what you want to hear but sounds like he just doesn’t care about you like you wish him to. You and your things are not important to him no matter what words you have been holding onto from his cards, texts, emails. His actions are telling you everything your heart is not ready to hear.
I tend to agree with LaTeeDa about your “things” and drama. It is how you can keep the insanity going along with the hope that he will see how hurt and sad you are and maybe possible come back out of guilt and comfort you?
Let me ask you this, if these things were important to you then why didn’t you get them sooner seeing that this relationship was fizzling. It sounds like the last 6 months have been phone calls and emails with not many real face to face interactions, not very personal, very distant.
And if you deem these things to be so important that you must have them back then why not have a mutual friend get them for you and be done with this guy.
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Originally Posted by LaTeeDa
Me too. And I took no responsibility for it. It was all HIS fault. He was MAKING me suffer. I had nothing to do with it............
When I started seeing a therapist, I wanted someone to 'vent' to. Someone to agree with me and validate what a horrible person he was and what a victim I was. I didn't like it at first when she kept turning it around and pointing out how MY life was MY responsibility. How I had the choice at any time to STOP playing the game. It's much easier to blame others for our pain. But, it's empowering to take responsibility for our choices.
L
When I started seeing a therapist, I wanted someone to 'vent' to. Someone to agree with me and validate what a horrible person he was and what a victim I was. I didn't like it at first when she kept turning it around and pointing out how MY life was MY responsibility. How I had the choice at any time to STOP playing the game. It's much easier to blame others for our pain. But, it's empowering to take responsibility for our choices.
L
My situation morphed a little from martyrdom, but I can't deny it was there in a covert way and particularly before it morphed.
Owning your part can be hard. It is natural to rail against it because it feels like some kind of diminishing of their part. But owning it it isn't about culpability and who has the most or least blame. It is recognising what options you had and what choices you made along the way... and hopefully learning enough about yourself to not repeat them.
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Just my very humble opinion on what I know is a very touchy subject for me!!
spirited had no way to predict the future, I do not believe she is to blame for not asking for the stuff before. I think the main error was to expect an alcoholic to behave like a normal adult, that knows there is stuff he needs to give back, he gives it back and end of story... but then you do not know one, until you know one.
Hugs, spirited!!
spirited had no way to predict the future, I do not believe she is to blame for not asking for the stuff before. I think the main error was to expect an alcoholic to behave like a normal adult, that knows there is stuff he needs to give back, he gives it back and end of story... but then you do not know one, until you know one.
Hugs, spirited!!
Last edited by TakingCharge999; 05-22-2009 at 12:17 PM.
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When I wrote that I shouldn't have to be cruel and heartless to get him to see how his behavior is affecting me.....what I meant was NOT that I want him to SEE how it is affecting me, but that I have VERBALLY told him, so he KNOWS, he was made AWARE, so why just keep dragging it out intentionally or unintentionally. Maybe I just expect normal people to be courteous of other peoples feelings like I am. But it seems to me that more and more and more the whole gammit of A'ism is about control, on one side or the other.....Everyone wants control!! The A wants control, the codie wants control....seems to me like EVERYONE is struggling to get control in one way or another.....own your power, you decide when it ends, and on and on. It's like a never ending power struggle. I don't want control-I just want a normal life again, but now I'm not sure I'd even know how to live it........None of this was about STUFF, it was about EXABF bouncing back in yet again and me NOT wanting to be hateful to him.......
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I have found that they are all too soon to want what is theirs, but will do nothing for what is mine...
In the end, I'm grateful, it remains over & I keep on going.
“Nobody can go back and start a new beginning, but anyone can start today and make a new ending.”
~ Maria Robinson
In the end, I'm grateful, it remains over & I keep on going.
“Nobody can go back and start a new beginning, but anyone can start today and make a new ending.”
~ Maria Robinson
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Kinda knew it had nothing to do with the stuff. The stuff is just the pawns being shuffled around on the board.
He doesn't keep dragging it out. You BOTH keep dragging it out.
Having a 'normal' life requires control. It requires you to control your responses to his actions.
You can't control his actions. Hoping he will be 'courteous' and behave how you would like him to is not going to happen unless he decides it. But, as above, you can control your responses.
He bounces back in because you let him. If there was no door open he'd just bounce right off it and away again.
You can get serenity back. But you are going to have to learn accept the things you can't change, have the courage to change the things you can and gain the wisdom to know the difference.
He doesn't keep dragging it out. You BOTH keep dragging it out.
Having a 'normal' life requires control. It requires you to control your responses to his actions.
You can't control his actions. Hoping he will be 'courteous' and behave how you would like him to is not going to happen unless he decides it. But, as above, you can control your responses.
He bounces back in because you let him. If there was no door open he'd just bounce right off it and away again.
You can get serenity back. But you are going to have to learn accept the things you can't change, have the courage to change the things you can and gain the wisdom to know the difference.
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Oh Spirit....I think the only one who is driving you crazy, is yourself. i really hope you can find some peace from this very soon.
You mentioned in a post that he wasn't showing compassion when he replied with, maybe Thursday after you told him how you were feeling. He may indeed feel badly that you are hurt, but on a more superficial level. He may feel there is nothing he can say to you or do for you. When something is over for us, it's over. i mean when something is really over for us.
It seems to me that both your exchanges of stuff has dragged on far too long anyway. When you texted him, keep it, what is your experience with those kinds of reactions? Only you know that. Will that cause him to call, email, text again to arrange to drop it off? or will he keep it/throw it away. I think he's moved on, not saying that he couldn't have handled this better, but no one has control over you, unless you give them that control.
You mentioned in a post that he wasn't showing compassion when he replied with, maybe Thursday after you told him how you were feeling. He may indeed feel badly that you are hurt, but on a more superficial level. He may feel there is nothing he can say to you or do for you. When something is over for us, it's over. i mean when something is really over for us.
It seems to me that both your exchanges of stuff has dragged on far too long anyway. When you texted him, keep it, what is your experience with those kinds of reactions? Only you know that. Will that cause him to call, email, text again to arrange to drop it off? or will he keep it/throw it away. I think he's moved on, not saying that he couldn't have handled this better, but no one has control over you, unless you give them that control.
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I dunno know about *all* alcoholics can't be expected to act like normal adults. Just think it's a bit of a stretch to pigeon hole anyone. I continue to meet irresponsible social drinkers. Anyway.
I guess he didn't consider returning Spirit's things urgent and that wasn't right, but he seemed to be planning to get them back. I am in no way condoning his behavior and you know what, It really doesn't matter what is going on in his head.
Why would anyone accept being with someone or even remaining in contact someone, who doesn't think you are a treasure and treat you that way 24/7
I guess he didn't consider returning Spirit's things urgent and that wasn't right, but he seemed to be planning to get them back. I am in no way condoning his behavior and you know what, It really doesn't matter what is going on in his head.
Why would anyone accept being with someone or even remaining in contact someone, who doesn't think you are a treasure and treat you that way 24/7
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It's really not about whether some alcoholics can be expected to behave 'normally,' or none of them can. It's about the person who has the expectations. Any time I expect something from someone, I am setting myself of for disappointment, and eventual resentment. There are plenty of 'normal' people who don't behave the way I would like them to. Is it their problem, or mine? Which do I have control over--their behavior or my expectations?
L
L
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