JustAYak

I really don't think that's possible, but I still wonder, can you be codependent after they die? I think by then it would just be considered grief... but I find myself having a very hard time functioning without my dad here.. or my mom for that matter. Those who know me/my situation (so what is that, like 5 of you? those who wandered over to the SA forum), why the hxll is this happening? I mean it should be insanely easier right? My dad isn't nodding off behind me high on heroin anymore, and my mom isn't screaming at me. So wtf is going on? Did I just get so used to it that I can't see myself living without it? I hate that I miss him so much... my life has been filled with enough pain, I'm ready for the good

SlvrMag

Jason, I wish I could say something that would just take your pain away, I think we all do. I have followed your story but I have no similar experiences. Only advice I have for you is DON'T USE, NO MATTER WHAT, NO MATTER HOW HARD IT GETS. No matter how hard things get, using will make it all worse.


Sorry, didn't mean to 'yell'

SlvrMag

P.S.

Life WILL get good for you, I truly believe it will.

SlvrMag

Oops, double post.

itisatruth

Slvrmag is right....the good can/will come. It's hard to say this without sounding patronizing, but life changes so much from when you are young. You sound like a kind and sensitive young man, give yourself time to work through your pain, your grief - and find the good life has to offer. I've read some of your posts before but I don't think we've "met". I hadn't read about your dad....I'm so sorry.

To answer your question...yes we can be codependent even when they're gone - it's something that is inside...so compounding the pain you are feeling from him being gone, you may also be feeling the added stuff about trying to fix him and all that, to take care of him....way more than anyone should have to deal with. Please take it easy on yourself....you are going through so much....but you can find your way to a better place. Your dad will always be a part of you....and you can carry on his spirit each day.....through you.

Rica

SistersHelp

Jay,
Tonight my niece was crying in my arms. Her mom's still alive, but dying day by day. She said no matter how happy she is, there's always a piece of glass stabbing her in the heart, and that piece is her mother.

My niece isn't codependent. She's a loving soul who was raised by a drug addict.

She loves her mother. That's not codie. It's just normal. We love our parents almost instinctually, for better or for worse.

She's getting stronger. So are you.

Loving them, missing them, hurting because of everything that's happened, it's all normal. It's all part of your process. Parent/child relationships are powerful and complicated.

Please don't be hard on yourself, Jason. You can't go through everything you've been through and be all better in a few weeks. You're going to have to go through the hell of missing and loving and hurting and all that crap. My niece too. All I can do for her is put my arms around her and hold her.

And hey, maybe you don't want or need that... but I'm offering anyway. Holding onto you as long as you need. Virtual hugs. Not so warm, but just as sincere.

You have a lot of adopted moms here, so I'll just be a friend, k?

Hugs,
Lisa

Lenina

(((((Jason))))

If it's at all possible, please see a counselor who specializes in grief counseling. Some hospitals offer free or low cost "Life Transition" counseling. Grieving takes its own time and believe me, it's very helpful to have someone to talk to who really understands the process.

Sometimes there's a lot of guilt that's hard to get through on your own. Also a lot of anger. The sooner you can get help, the easier it will be. I've lost quite a few family members in a short period of time. I had a lot of mixed feelings that really needed sorting out. I learned how to handle the feelings in a safe place. Your feelings may be up and down. It's not an even experience. Good days and bad days.

After some time, the good days are more often than the bad ones. Truthfully, I don't know if I ever really got "over" it. I did learn to cope. And I did learn to trust and love again.

I wish I were better at explaining. Just know it does get better. And you have some very wise people here who can lend their support.

Much love,

Lenina

lilmami

Hi we haven't ever met either bit I went through a similar situation.My father overdosed from heroin when I was 9 and I am now 29 with 3 of my own kids(I have never used) and at times I still feel like a child that just wants her daddy.Please work through it,there is no "right" way to act when greiving,it comes and goes like a wave so just let it wash over you don't fight it, accept it and let it go.Don't fight it though Jason,my brother did this and has fought addiction since he was 13 and is so so angry at the world and it breaks my heart to see him let our fathers mistakes affect what could be his life.Lot's of hugs.

Ann

If I was codependent before any event, you can be sure that I will remain codependent after. It's not the event that "made" me codependent and even if the event is about what triggered my codependency, it will still be there, waiting to attach itself to another loved one (that's how it is for me).

The only thing that helps me function in a happy healthy way is to work my recovery every day. That doesn't mean all day every day I must mantra the steps or sit in prayer, it means I need to be aware of the recovery tools I have and use them when needed.

Jason, losing a parent brings profound grief to most children, no matter how old, no matter how dysfunctional the relationship. When I lost my mother (who was one of God's special angels here when she lived), finding a quiet place and "talking" to her, out loud or just through my heart and thoughts, helped me walk through my grief when she passed.

Keep taking care of you and the rest will all fall into place. You will heal from this grief, and one day your memories of them will be perhaps of the good times and the times of their sickness will fade.

Hugs

sleepygoat

just wanted to say it's OK to feel/think whatever you do - who says what's OK, what's codie, what's not, really? I went to a counselor once who told me when he works as a grief counselor (one of his hats), he won't even see anyone who's loved one has been dead less than 6 months. Why? He says you don't need a grief counselor unless the grieving becomes dysfuncitonal in that it goes on longer than 6 months or a year and is interfering with normal responsiblities.

Our feelings for family are so complex, unless we grew up on some 60's TV show. We're going to feel love, anger, sadness, relief.... Just roll with it and practice acceptance of the feelings and of yourself for a while. I heard this at an NA meeting: "Let the feeling pierce you and cleanse you...." stuck with me for some reason.

Seren

Hey Jason,

I must agree that everything you are feeling is not unusual...just complicated as all human emotions can be!

Have you tried the whole "journaling" technique. I find that when I am confronted with very complicated emotions that I'm trying to sort out, I write them down in a journal for about 20 minutes each day....really works great!

You are doing a wonderful job, Jason. Keep up the good work!!! Huge cyber hugs! HG

gowest

I once read that no matter how old you are when you've lost both parents (does not have to happen at the same time) that one feels truly alone and "orphaned".

It doesn't matter what your relationship was with those parents or whether the relationship was 'healthy" and if they were "good" parents.

Death is hard, death is permanent, and I believe often the end of the kernel of hope many of us keep alive deep inside that the people we have in our life might "change" or give us what we need/want.

My most beloved relatives (all the "problem ones" are still around) have all been dead for about 15-20 years (I'm only 41) and I still miss them.

Don't beat yourself up -- allow yourself some serious time to grieve.

sisterofD

Jason,
I lost my brother to a drug overdose on Jan 30 this year, I miss him so much I think my heart is breaking on a daily basis, I spend lots of time just wishing I could talk to him one more time.
He was in ICu unresponsive for 8 day of the longest days of my life, he was a addict for as long as I can remember all of our adult life, he was 45.
I think its gonna take a long time, for me I know for sure, I want my brother back, even though I know full well he is not coming back, I can not think of good times from the past, there were good times with lots of bad times, that to I think takes times, I see him in that hospital bed, the funeral, people tell me that will subside. I hope so.
The codependant thing I believe is true to, I have a half brother that I am not close to, he is a addict, i think I was trying to "help" again, he is in jail, but I stopped myself real quick as I dont want to do that.
This post is about you, but I wanted you to know how another feels, I lost my brother not my father, but I lost my father when I was 14 to divorce, he lives in the same town as me but has never been a part of my life, unless I went to him, he doesnt come to me. I hope this helps, you are not alone, there are others dealing with things like this, trying to figure it out each day. Hang in there ok!

hugs to you,
sisofD

ItsmeAlice

Don't they say that if you take away what you're addicted to without recovery the behaviors can live on. You life was about living with an addict. That life defined you as it does for so many of us.
You need to work your recovery for you own substance use AND the life you've lived with an addict. Both parts of you need care, time, and attention.

The fact that you see the dependency you have on your life with your father, is the first step in the journey.

Give yourself the love and patience that not only you deserve, Jason, but that only you can give yourself.

Peace.
Alice

kelsh

Hi Jason,

My parents are both gone too. My Mom died in 1996 & my Dad in 2000. I was talking with my Brother about what I would really miss with them both gone...which is buying Mother & Father's Day cards. I lived an eight hour drive away over two mountain passes so only made it over to see them 2 or 3times a year. We did talk every week on the phone though.

My Dad was so special a man...loved the simple things in life & his family was so important to him. My brother was divorced so sold his house & moved in with Dad after our Mom died. I had not been told how involved he was in alcohol and did not know he used drugs but did eventually find out.

Both my Brother & Dad had gone to in-patient alcohol treatment...both in a hospital setting & Dad never drank again...my Brother quit for 14 years & then started in again.

But when my Brother told me what he would miss most about our parents was no one to depend on...I was shocked...I knew by then that they had bailed him out of jail many times & had paid bills & given him cash...so it was a truly co-dependent relationship and my Brother really suffered after Dad died. Somehow he got started on drugs then...he is 67 & I am 68. We are not young but maybe young to be in trouble with alcoholism.

It has been 20 years since I sobered up and my Brother started detoxing at home in March of 2008 using alcohol to get off the drugs. But then he was way into the alcohol again & had a heart attack but no residual effects. He finally told a doc the truth about his addictions and wanted help. I talked with him a month ago & he has been clean & sober since October 2008. He was medically detoxed for six days...was very sick at home...had to be taken to the hospital by ambulance...very dehydrated.

I love my Brother more than words can say...When I saw him last April he said: "When I look into your face I am seeing my Mom & Dad together in your face...I will never forget that one moment in time...priceless."

So Dear Jason...their are a lot of Brother & Sisters out in this world that miss their parents...even the addicted parents...we love our parents unconditionally unless there has been abuse of some kind...still there can be a love/hate relationship. I do look up & say a few words to my parents & a special alcoholic grandma that just up & quit the year I graduated from High School. I just think maybe their spirits, which are in my heart, lets them know how we are doing.

kelsh

Chino

When my father died in 2005, any semblance of unity in my already fractured family completely disappeared. I speak to my mom once or twice a month and usually not longer than ten minutes. I haven't spoken with or seen my sister in three years and that's the way it's going to stay, unless something miraculous happens and she stops taking prisoners.

My mother is respecting my boundaries and that's why we're able to maintain this relationship. It's not the one I'd like to have but it's all I've got.

My sister respects no one's boundaries and it's taken me all of these three years to detach from her. No anger and pain any more, just acceptance of both of our limitations and respecting my own boundaries.

I was co-dependent before my dad died and will always be, but because of my daughter's addiction, I'm finally in recovery. I've spent this past year in some pretty intense psychotherapy and it's definitely paying off.

I'm not cured and never will be, but I finally have all the tools to deal with life and I'll always need to use them. My therapist reminded me that if something creeps up from the past, it doesn't mean I didn't deal with it, I just have to deal with it again. The more I work it, the quicker my recovery from that event.

Sending you hugs Jason.

PeaceTrain

Hello Jason,
I did get caught up on your situation on the other board and I offer many hugs to you.
Regardless of the fact that your Dad took drugs, he was still your Dad and the bond between children and their parents is quite deep. I think you are now feeling a profound grief for him, which is very normal. Perhaps your expression of grief was delayed since you were in a chaotic environment and you had to resort to survival mode to just live day by day. Now that things are calm, you have more time to reflect and feel.
My own Father died when I was 5 and sometimes I still feel grief (Im old too!!)-- all so normal.
One counsellor I went to years ago, asked me to write letters to my loved ones, expressing how I felt about them and me and in the case of my Dad, to bring him up to date on my life. I wrote all of those letters and felt lighter and freer than I had before.
All the Best to You and Your Sister...

PacNorwesterner

I love that. Thanks.

outtolunch

The addict in my life is my daughter, not much older than you. Her DOC is heroin. Therefore, I probably better relate to your mother, than I can to you.

Reading between the lines, it sounds like her dreams were shattered by her husband's addiction and she feared you were following in the same footsteps.

No one other than your mom knows what it was like to have her husband and the father of her children become addicted to heroin. She knows better than anyone that heroin will not accept second place. It enslaves its victims.

It sounds like she had to kick him out to preserve her own sanity or have the whole family be dragged down into the spiral.

Reading between the lines, it sounds like she is extremely fearful that you will go down the same path and so she reacts. And then you used the conflict to rationalize the ole, F-it and went out and got high. Funny how that works.

Yeah, there are probably a million different ways she could handle this situation. No doubt she is doing the best she can, given the cards she has been dealt.

You need your mom as much as she needs you, right now. I wonder her reaction if you posed this dilema to her.

Chino

If you read Jason's threads in the Addiction forum, you'll get the whole story. The courts removed Jason and his sister from his mom.... thank God!