CatsnDogs4Me

I may be crazy to even try this, but I feel like I have to give my AH & my marriage one last shot at trying to work out. Quick re-cap on my situation… (I’ve only posted a few times before.) My AH & I have been separated for just over a year (I moved out.) I’ve been in individual therapy for nearly 2 years; he’s been in individual therapy about a year, and we’ve been going to marriage counseling for about 7 months. I’ve always made it quite clear that his drinking is a big issue for me. He’s continued to drink over the past year, though he’s finally now (as of about 3 weeks ago) respecting my boundary to not drink around me, though I believe he’s still drinking when I’m not around. Since he’s (supposedly) working on his drinking , our marriage counselor suggested I entertain the idea of a trial live-together period to see how things go. At first, she suggested a 2 month trial, which sounded overwhelming to me, and I said no right off the bat. I’ve been on the precipice of ending things all together, but I just haven’t been able to pull the trigger on it. I feel like we’re in somewhat of a stalemate, though, so I gave it further thought & came up with a compromise idea. I’m willing to try something novel to see if (a) he can live up to his claims of how much he’s changed & not drink at all and (b) to see how I really feel with him fully back in my life. So, after talking with my own therapist, last night I proposed to him a 2-week living together trial period. My boundaries are no drinking at all - not at home or away from home; no pressuring me for physical intimacy (I haven’t had those kind of feelings for him in more than a year & am not ready for that yet); and respect for my schedule and activities while he’s at the house. He’s agreed to my boundaries, and he’s going to stay with me starting April 11th through April 25th.

I’m not quite sure how things will go when he moves back in for this trial period. In 12+ years together, I’ve never seen him go more than about 3-4 days without a drink. My therapist told me that in the 2nd week of sobriety, withdrawl symptoms can appear & manifest in various physical & emotional forms. I’m looking for advice for anyone who’s had past experience with living with their A in their first real attempts to get sober. I’m concerned about how this will go because aside from going to his therapist, he’s not in any other program to treat his alcoholism. Am I just setting us both up for failure? Any ESH you can sure is very much appreciated.

Freedom1990

If you two have been separated for a little over a year, and he was unable to go without a drink for more than 3-4 days when you were together, I wouldn't get my hopes up too high.

It sounds like you're going into this trial with eyes wide open. Try not to have expectations. You have your boundaries set, so the only suggestion I have is to stay consistent with those boundaries and follow through if he crosses them.

:ghug :ghug

tallulah

Ok.. don't squish me.. but I'm going to come at it from a different angle.

He is taking on both keeping off the booze and moving back in with you for a trial period at the same time? To me, just playing devil's advocate, that sounds like an awful lot of 'stuff' to be taking on.. well for both of you really. To me it would make more sense if he tackled one or the other but not at the same time. And as your boundary is no drinking when he is living with you, I would have thought him getting some sober and working on recovery time under his belt before he moved back in for a trial would make more sense (?).

I liken it.. and I know it is not the same but I can't think of any other analogy.. to trying to quit smoking and lose weight at the same time. If you know what I mean.

Anyway... my thoughts are with you and I'm crossing everything that you get the outcome you hope for..:ghug

Kimmieh

I agree with this. I don't have experience, but I don't quite see the benefit of exposing you to this:

What exactly is in this for you?

naive

the moving in sounds like a bad idea to me, as he's only 3 weeks sober and not in AA. he'll be going thru all sorts of stuff, ups and downs, etc.

do you really want to subject yourself to that?

i don't understand why your marriage counselor would even suggest such a thing. why not wait until he gets 6 months sober under his belt, let him stabilize a bit.

LaTeeDa

I agree with the opinions above. I believe an A must have a really good grasp on recovery before any relationship with him will stand a chance. I think you probably know this on some level, too. So, it seems that this may just be a way to finally say to yourself, "see, I knew it wouldn't work, now I can be free." Which may be exactly what you need to do at this point.

Are you setting the both of you up for failure? It would seem that way. But, maybe that's exactly what you want.

L

Freedom1990

Re-read her post. She said it's been 3 weeks that he's not drank around her, but she believes he's still drinking.

Barbara52

Wow. Just what are you supposed to be getting out of a trial live together period regardless of the length? I mean, seriously. Let's assume he is going to start seeking sobriety. From what I know, he is going to be unpleasant to be around (to put it mildly). He will need to concentrate on his sobriety and won't be able to respond to your needs.

Yet you want to step into this? Again, what are you supposed to be getting out of this? I fail to see any positives in it for you.

Also you have kids if I remember right. What the heck is this back and forth going to be doing to them? Talk about confusing the hell out of them! Daddy's not living with us. Daddy's back. Ooops, no he's not. Is this fair to the kids?

And lets assume the worst case scenario and he doesn't stop drinking. How do you force him out after period X?

laurie6781

Its pretty much already been said above.

However, I certainly would question that therapist on how much experience they have with active alcoholism.

I certainly WOULD NOT do any 'trial of again living together' until he is in A PROGRAM OF RECOVERY and has at least a year in said program and is showing by his actions that he is changing.

I certainly would not put my children through a detox and an 'insane' person in early recovery who has no program to follow.

Please, give this some more thought. I do not think you are getting very good advice from this 'therapist.'

J M H O

Love and hugs,

jaimemk

Ugh. Not really familiar with these forums, yet, but was going to ask on here tonight how to know when it's safe to move back in together. I'm no where even close in my situation. I couldn't do what you are entertaining. I need something to go on, that he has progressed in his own life, for himself. I'm afraid if he is pressuring me, and he is, to move back in... it's because he wants to quit but can't without his other substance of choice... "me." And I won't be enought when life gets real again. Three weeks respecting your boundary (not all that impressive) but not even three weeks (and that's not a lot) of sobriety. Unless, like LaTeeDa said up there, it will provide the crisis you are needing to finally have peace about letting go. No romantic feelings in the last year? Those would have showed up again if you were feeling good about his progress. I mean, I would think they would. And do you want to be in the same home with someone you have no romantic feelings for? And tons of apprehension for?

I guess my only advice would be to search your heart and ask yourself what it is you want. My counselor kept asking me... "Jaime, what do you want?" (My first marriage of fifteen years) I kept thinking, I want out. I want to be done. But I wouldn't throw in the towel. What do you really want? Do you want him as he is right now? He will be just like he is, only more so.


You don't need anyone to give you permission to take care of you... and only you can define what that would look like. I used to ask HP to help me tune out all voices but my own and His. So I could hear me, and honor myself.

I have a fever, and shouldn't post on days like this. Not very articulate. But man oh man, think this one over!

Sending love :ghug3

GiveLove

Yes. CatsNDogs, I understand how you want to "try everything" before giving up, but please please try to play the tape all the way through.

So - he manages to stay sober and tolerable for two weeks. (by the way, there are very few things that I CAN'T fake for two whole weeks). Then what happens? He moves back in entirely? And if he starts drinking then, since he's "got you back", what then?

Or, as Barbara above states, if he DOES start drinking, how do you get him back out? And if he lies and says he's not?
What will the effect of this all be on YOU, and also on your kids?

If you are really trying to assure yourself that this will be the easy way forward, please go through all of the scenarios and make sure you have an answer for each of them.

I also don't see the point in doing what you're doing IN THE WAY YOU'RE DOING IT. AND I agree that the counselor in question is working either from ignorance of active alcoholism or from extreme bias toward reconciliation at any cost (sounds religious...is he/she?) AND I agree that you should not do this until he has had a substantial period of sobriety.

But only you can decide what's right for you..... please do think all of this through above, and play the tape all the way through.

CatsnDogs4Me

Tallulah – Thanks for giving me another angle to think about the situation. My AH is a smoker, as well, who, ironically enough, failed in his attempt last summer to quit smoking. He got down to about 1-3 cigarettes a day, and then it slowly crept back up to close to a pack a day (typing this makes it sound eerily similar to posts about drinking I’ve read here…)

LTD & others who posted about potentially setting us both up for failure. I’ve thought about that myself & even questioned myself about what I’m looking for out of this trial period. My AH has been begging me for months to move back in so he can show me how much he’s grown in his efforts at recovery. I’m trying not to judge him b/c he’s not in AA, and he says he’s working on his drinking with his therapist … and I realize AA is not for everyone & that there are some other programs that can help. So, I’m trying to keep an open mind. My AH claims I’m not seeing how much he’s changed b/c when we get together it’s only for a few hours vs. day-in and day-out. So, what I’m trying to see from this is whether there’s a shred of hope that the relationship could be mended. For the last month or so, I felt that shred slipping further and further away. I’m a very left-brain thinker & have a hard time trusting my feelings (yes, working on that in therapy…) So, my left-brain mind says I need to see in person whether or not his claims of being changed are true, and whether or not I’m willing to commit to more months of counseling.

Barbara – Thanks for your post. Fortunately, there are no children involved in our situation. I truly feel for those out there who have children and are in this same mess. Our only kids are the dogs & cats, who have always been more bonded to me than him. I thought about what you said about meeting my needs, and the funny thing is, over the past few years, I’ve learned to meet my own needs b/c he couldn’t be there for me. I guess I’m looking to see whether or not I think he could meet any of my needs in the future.

Laurie – Interesting you mention doubts about the marriage counselor. I’ve definitely had my doubts about how she’s approaching our issues myself…

Regarding those who asked about what I plan to do if he crosses one of my boundaries. My answer is that he moves back out. He has his own apartment, and he’s only bringing over his computer & some clothes/toiletries for this 2 week stint. I’ve told him that even if things go well, it doesn’t mean we move back in all together. It just means we have some more information about the relationship & our next steps. Ironically enough, a few months ago the marriage counselor suggested I set a check-point date for things, and the date I chose was May 1. So, that’s part of the timing on this. I’d like to know on May 1 where I feel this marriage is headed.

Thank you all *so* much for your ESH and your concerns. I will read & re-read your posts & take everything in.

LaTeeDa

Having been there, done that, almost exactly with my AH, I will say that our little trial of being together for two weeks (yes, I did two weeks also) only confused me more. As GL said, anyone can fake it for two weeks. The real question for me was not whether he had changed enough, but whether he was the person I wanted to spend my life with, drinking or not. And, looking back, I realize I could have figured that out without "living" with him for two weeks. But, in the end, no major harm was done other than prolonging the inevitable, so I understand you have to do what you have to do.

L

Ago

So far, any decision I have EVER made in my life that requires someone else to change in order for it to be successful has ended in dismal failure.

What I have learned is my "recovery" isn't dependent on whether or not someone else "gets healthy" and when I make decisions based on "what if" or "If only", I end up hurt, upset, frustrated, angry, and I give the power of MY happiness to another person.

A sick person.

I have found that by working on myself and keeping the focus on my myself and MY decisions, "hitching my wagon" to a sick person's "wagon train" gets less and less attractive.

GiveLove

So true.

CatsnDogs4Me

I’ve been giving a lot of thought to everyone’s responses to my post from last night, and I have to thank you so much for your honesty & support. I’ve been having so much anxiety over the past 2 days since suggesting this trial period to AH, which I also had to face & process to think that maybe this wasn’t the best decision for me to make right now. After reading through everyone’s responses & thinking things through overnight, I think I am rushing into it too quickly at this point. I got another hit in the head with that thought this morning when I read my daily “Language of Letting Go” missive from Melody Beattie, which talked about not rushing things & taking things in their due course. I think maybe AH & I could be setting ourselves up for failure, or at least wasted time, by trying the trial move-in period right now. I think many of you are right that AH could probably fake it & make it through 2 weeks if he thought it meant he’d win me back & everything would be just fine & dandy between us again. He’s coming over tonight, and I’m going to talk with him about my anxieties and concerns. I think if he’s serious about tackling sobriety & recovery than maybe it’s best for him to focus on that first before we tackle the adjustments we’d both have to make in living together. I am concerned he’s going to lean on me too much as his crutch, or next DOC (as someone pointed out), and I know that’s not a good option for me. I’m going to tell him I’m willing to push out our “checkpoint” date to June 1 & give him April & May to work on his sobriety/recovery (i.e. stay sober for 2 months.) When I came to this conclusion, my codie-ness kicked in full force, and I thought “oh, I’m letting him down if I change my mind so I can’t tell him that… I’ll just suck it up for these 2 weeks & then we’ll go from there” then I realized, (a) the number of times he’s let me down because of choices he’s made - - without consulting me first, (b) if I’m saying I’ll “suck it up”, that’s hardly healthy for a relationship and (c) that I have every right to step up and say “hey, I think I jumped the gun here; I’m stressed & anxious about trying this right now; let’s talk about some other options.” If he truly respects me & this relationship as much as he says he does, then he should respect my concerns and be willing to work with me on another option. He keeps talking about how marriage is compromise & he’s willing to do whatever it takes, and now is his chance to show me he’s serious. I’m not pinning my happiness on what he decides. Actually, right now, I’m quite happy with how I’m going about my life day-to-day. It’s just the marriage that’s the big question mark. I feel exactly what LTD said in her post : “The real question for me was not whether he had changed enough, but whether he was the person I wanted to spend my life with, drinking or not.” Thanks again for your support, and I’ll likely post tomorrow to let you know how our discussion goes tonight.

Bernadette

So far, any decision I have EVER made in my life that requires someone else to change in order for it to be successful has ended in dismal failure.

Very good point.

Nothing to add to the above Catsndogs-- hope you get the answers you're seeking -- nothing wrong with a little left brain detached analysis in this situation! Keep your head!
peace,
b