CAPTAINZING2000

I take my family to every AA and Al Anon function there is.

I can't begin to tell you how important it is to have families at AA functions. Without support from family and friends, an alcoholic doesn't have as great a chance at a meaningful recovery.

Our recovery depends a lot on your support

freya

I agree 100%. I attend AA and Al Anon meetings (I'm an Al Anon).....and a lot of extra functions like fundraisers, conventions, days-of-sharing, etc... Actually, I just got invited to serve on a planning committee for an annual Women in AA and Al Anon event that happens a couple of counties over in the Fall...I'm very excited about it, especially meeting new people that I don't see every week.

I also volunteer 2 hours a week at our local AIS office and whenever my partner (she's AA) and I go on vacation we always research meetings and plan on attending some wherever we' re going to be. That's really a lot of fun -- because every place is so different, but so the same when it comes to 12 Step meetings....and we've been very, very lucky that we've never had any kind of negative -- or even, actually, less than great -- experience doing that. I mean we've been to everything from a womens meetings at Harvard Divinity School to a meetings in rural eastern Virginia and Texas...and they've all been awesome!

My kids are young men -- and they were 18 and 16 when I came into program, so I can't say that I've ever dragged them to anything -- but I do talk about program principles/ideas a lot and it's pretty amazing to me how open my sons are to it and we've actually had some really good discussions that have been kinda surprising to me.

One thing that has happened in the last year that has been really cool is that one of my cousin's sons got into AA and at one point he wrote us a 9th step letter. So, we wrote him back, of course, and my partner ended up writing out her AA entire story, and then they started talking, and then my partner and I took my aunt up to visit him one weekend, and we all went to some meetings together -- which was very good for my aunt because she kinda got a much better sense about what recovery is all about -- and it's been really nice to see how my partner and this kid (who is the exact same age as my oldest son) are supporting each other, too.

So, it's just a great journey -- freya

Lucy06

What if the so called "recovering addict" does not want his spouse involved in any recovery activity (in my AH's case, therapy as he refuses to attend AA) but only want support? What does that tell you? Just curious to have some insight from someone in your situation.

laurie6781

Chris, you know me. You know I have been sober a LONG time, and you know I have also been active in AlAnon a LONG time. I am going to disagree with you here. That is an all encompassing statement that is not true. When you have worked with as many as I have in both recovery from addiction, and from co dependency you will understand. Many Friends and Family have spent so long and tried so hard to keep the family together, have taken abuse after abuse, and really have no recourse but to step back and watch the ACTIONS of the afflicted person, just to preserve their own sanity or what is left of it.

Then you come along and say 'support' your alcoholic. Sorry Chris, time for you to go to Alanon. There is too fine a line between 'support' and 'enabling' and these folks have been through as great a h*ll as the alkie and in some cases even more so. When the alkie is ready, the alkie will invite them to a meeting, an open one, I hope lol, and then it will be up the Friends and/or Family to say yea or nay.

Many times, the addict does NOT want the family, spouse, s/o there. They are having a hard enough time as it is, and are just starting to feel like being able to share a teeny bit in a meeting. Also, please remember, many of us addicts come from very TOXIC dysfunctional families.

I really appreciate that you are branching out to the Friends and Family board and I think it is great ............................... yep, here comes the BUT, lol ......................maybe it's time for you to start attending AlAnon. Read more around these boards, see how much support the Friends and Family have given their alkie/addict, see how they have been sucked dry.

Please for your own sake, start attending AlAnon on a regular basis and work the 12 steps from the AlAnon perspective. Trust me, you will get a WHOLE NEW PERSPECTIVE on your program of recovery.

J M H O

CAPTAINZING2000

I wish, I could.

My son's drinking problem was causing me fits. I'm almost afraid to say, I feel safer with him in Afghanistan at night.

Our Al Anon has dried up here in the small town I live. I've been reading posts on here and trying to give my input on how crazy an alcoholic mind works.

I have to say, I've enjoyed taking my family too every AA dinner etc. they would go to with me.

It saddens me to read the posts from people saying their spouses aren't giving this 100% to their AA program etc.

If, the spouse is giving 100% to help and not enable and they don't see the same maybe, it'll be easier to make a clean break.

Bernadette

Our recovery depends a lot on your support


Hi Zing--
I have to say ditto Laurie!!

When I was new to understanding alcoholism this is just the kind of statement from a recovering alcoholic that I would hang my hat on and (granted NOT in the spirit you intend this remark!!) just grind myself down to a nub trying to "support" my alcoholic brothers.

Made me a basket case!!

I know what you're trying to say - if an alcoholic that I love invited me to an AA meeting with them (and two that I know have) I would go by all means.

But I think for us codies we have to be very careful of where we decide to throw our support! Kinda like an alcoholic wondering if it is OK to have just a taste of that cake made with rum....you probably have to pause and consider. Same for me as a codie regarding supporting the alcoholic. Because of my problems with codependency I can't just "help" people willy nilly - I have to be very careful lest I slide down a slippery slope and end up lost again.

I mean, I'd simply love to support my alcoholic brothers!!! Problem is they don't want my support.

The truth as I've come to see it in my Recovered A friends is-- they get sober with or without family support because it is time for them to get sober and they want recovery/sobriety SO badly nothing gets in their way.

peace-
B

CAPTAINZING2000

I want to make clear, I wasn't saying anything about enabling.

I read the stories and quite frankly, I wouldn't put up with any of crap we put people thru. It's made me see more clearly how I used to be.

With that being said, there are many of us in AA that, do take staying sober serious. We do try to be the best husbands, wives, sons, fathers etc. to show, we're doing the best we can.

I can say I'm sorry for all I've done but, being a good son now, has made my mom proud of how, I've finally turned out.

I owe that all to AA. and God

I wasn't the best dad but, I've been as good a grand dad as I can be to my grand kids

mle-sober

I think everyone here on the F&F forum is supporting the sobriety of their alcoholic loved one -- just by virtue of being here, sharing with each other, learning, finding their way through the maze of their emotions, etc.

CAPTAINZING2000

you're all angels for trying the best you can to put up with all you do

Barbara52

I do not go to AlAnon, AA, CODA, ACOA or any other meetings.

I am not here to support an A through anything.

I came here for support for me, someone living and married to an A who refused to admit to it. I learned a great deal from a whole lot of people in here. I continue to come here to learn for myself and, I hope, sometimes to help other as I have been helped.

One thing I know that would not and does not help me to read is that someone else's recovery can depend on my support. Sorry but nope, it doesn't, and I cannot, will not be thrust into that role. I haven't been there done that and do not know what an A is going thru when they seek recovery. An As recovery depends on themself and the support system they find in their recovery program of choice, not on me, the spouse, sister, mother, friend of that A. I am not that powerful and do not want to be.

My recovery from my issues did not and does not depend on anyone else either. It is my responsibility and my work to do. Although I have found wisdom and comfort in the words I read here, none of you fine people are responsibile for my recovery either. You aren't that powerful.

I have every sympathy for an A trying to find recovery. I pray all will find their way. But my sympathies for them is not why I come here.

Barbara52

No. I wasn't an angel for putting up with the crap that was my marriage to an A. I was sick.

LaTeeDa

Like Barbara, I was very sick. Also, like Barbara, I am not a meeting-goer.

I 'supported' my husband in every way possible, including financially. I convinced myself that if I could just be a better wife, mother, wage earner, or whatever, he wouldn't have to drink. I took waaaaaay too much responsibility for his condition, and let myself wither in the process. I came here and some very wise people helped me see that he was not my responsibility. I went to counseling and found out the only person I could change was me.

To say that the alcoholic depends on my support puts me back in that awful place I once lived. Where getting him well was my job. Nope, not gonna go there ever again. And BTW, the part of your sig that says "yourself last" really bothers me because that's where I put myself for too long----last.

L

Daisy30

I think you are speaking about reciprocity.

I think why it is hard for some of us to hear and understand this is because we have know knowledge of a recovered A. We don't know what that looks like.

I do get what your saying and in a way it is part of how you say thank you to those people by asking them to join you at events (show them your success). I think that is a good thing

CAPTAINZING2000

Some were brought up to believe in the marital vows.

My ex was sicker then i was. At least, I got help to be a better person.

I care about people. That, I owe to staying around AA.

My heart does go out to all of you reading what kind of crap you put up with.

As Ann Landers wrote, " are you better off with them or, with out them" ?

Barbara52

I do know what longterm recovery looks like for an A. My brother has been inrecovery for 20+ years and is a wonderful man. A dear friend has been in recovery for 15+ years and has been able to give some great information of what recovery should look like. Both have told me I cannot be the support system for an A seeking or new to recovery. I've also read that from a number of RAs in this forum.

Regardless of all that, all I can do is seek my own recovery and possibly help those who have are where I used to be and to seek information on my own continuing issues.

I do not come to this F&F board to learn how to support an A. That is not the purpose as I see it of this section of the forum.

If I want information on how to support an A, I'll go look in one of the many board addressing the needs of the As.

This is only one board addressing our needs, the F&F of As.

Ago

I have to agree with Barb, Laurie, Bernadette etc.

I frequently speak from my experience as an alcoholic, but this needs to be a place where "the alcoholic" doesn't "come first"

That's part of codependency, not recovery from codependency

I came here to learn how to navigate relationships with practicing alcoholics in my family and a relationship, and learned what I needed to work on and focus on was myself, not them.

With "healthy" relationships I can put "others first" because they reciprocate, with someone in addiction if I put them first, they will take take take until I end up very ill, because I give give give until I lose my sense of identity, my self esteem, their reality becomes mine, their problems become mine, their behaviors become mine, and I don't know who I am anymore, just that I am ANGRY.

If it's time for them to "support" their "A" they will know, because their "A" will have some years of sobriety under his belt, and he will be "supporting" them, and they will be walking hand in hand, side by side, supporting each other....They will be "supporting" each other because they want to, because the relationship evolved that way, and it's fun, not because they read it on an internet forum, ya know?

Please seek support about your son Zing, we love ya, get the help that's freely offered, and then pass it forward, I have found what I have learned here VERY appropriate to take back to the rooms of AA.

LaTeeDa

I was thinking this, too. Instead of posting threads in defense of the recovering A. (Sorry, that's how this thread feels to me. Like, hey us A's aren't all bad, you know?)

The majority of posters here have spouses or SO's who are alcoholic, but we have several parents, children, brothers and sisters of A's, too. Why not seek support from them? Especially if you have no support in your town.

L

CatsPajamas

When I started counseling and then Al Anon (all sort of at the same time) I learned that the best way I could "support" him was to get a sponsor, get a program, work the steps and get a life. Since coming here to SR, I have learned that it's not always Al Anon or Nar Anon specifically~ some of my favorite people here don't attend meetings or do 12 step work but have still arrived at the happy, joyous and free part that's promised if we put the focus on ourselves and not the A.

I had to get out of the way in order for my A to get better. And trust me, I've had more than one A whose life was totally entangled with mine - partner, child, relative, friend.

I dated a guy who was very active in NA (had been for 20 yrs prior to our starting to date) and his circle of friends and activities was all NA related. I attended a lot of functions with him and made some good friends. I didn't see that as supporting him in his recovery - I saw that as going with him to social functions and meeting his friends. For me it was a bonus that it was recovery related.

Zing, some of us friends and family are able to find our own recovery and work thru issues while our partner/spouse/child/relative does the same. For some, the hurt and trust issues are just too big, the damage and carnage is too great, and the relationship does not survive. I learned that I can be very supportive of my A but at the same time I cannot ever live with him again.

Side note: I know a lot of "double winners" who worked the AA or NA program to get and remain sober, and then started going to Al Anon or Nar Anon in order to learn a fresh perspective on how to handle relationships differently.

Cats

Freedom1990

The same happened in the small town I live in. However, I am incredibly blessed to have a sponsor who is a black belt in AA and Alanon!

My refusal to address my codependency issues after I got clean/sober was a huge factor in me drinking again after 4 years in AA.

You have been affected by your son's drinking problem, regardless of the fact he is in Afghanistan right now.

There's no time like the present to start addressing your codependency issues, no?

:ghug :ghug

freya

Well, I guess maybe I'm just not in the habit of taking things so personally, but, obvioulsy, I didn't take the OP the way that most of the other people here have. Personally, I distinguish between "suppport" and "enabling," and, for me, one definitely precludes the other.

The things I do as far as my program goes are definitely for me, not for my A, and I have no illusions about the fact that her sobriety does not and cannot depend on me or about the fact that I am not responsible for it (or for any other choices she makes)...or about the fact that my own recovery program does not and connot depend on her. But it is nonethelss very true that insofar as we both do work our programs and take them seriously and insofar as we both do program related things with each other, we are supporting each other in ways that somoeone unfamiliar with and uninvolved in 12 Step recovery could not -- not that there certianly aren't other ways of being supportive, but, for me, I do find it makes it much more helpful to be working from and sharing the same philosophical/theoretical base....and it does make it "easier" for both of us.

Also, I do have to say that I personally find the idea that "this is the only thread we have" and alcoholics coming here as alcoholics is some kind of afront to "us" to be kinda disturbing.

First of all, there are lots of awesome, really helpful general recovery threads on this very site: the women' and men's threads, the "What is Recovery? thread, the Spirituality thread....just to name a few. There is planty of room there and plenty of great info/insight for anyone who wants to read and/or post. In fact, even most of the threads that are more specifically aimed at alcoholism or other addictions have great stuff to offer anyone who is the least bit able to think metaphorically and, thereby, apply the ES&H being shared there to his/her own situation and struggles. I mean, really people, unless there's a "So-and-Sos ONLY" warning by the forum on the main title page, who's keeping you out????? Why not visit around and see what there is to get from other forums??????

Secondly, the whole "us"/"them" set-up is very problematic to me, because I can't think of a single case in which I've encountered that kind of thinking in which there hasn't been some kind of underlying fear and rsentment at the root of it. And for me, fear and resentment of any kind, no matter how deeply underlying, is just not something that is compatible with my own recovery.

Finally, I do not like, support, or collude in the (unfortunately very popular in Al Anon) idea that when A's come into "codie" space, they should somehow feel obligated to hide the fact that they're A's. I'm sorry, but no matter what aspect or manifestation of the family disease of alcoholism someone is dealing with at any particular time in any particular venue, it is very, very unlikey that their own addictive behaviors (if they happen to be an alcoholic/addict) are not somehow importantly and integrally related to that aspect...and while I certainly don't think "codie" space is the place for them to work on those behaviors specifically or to make them the focus of their participation here, it is still totally unrealistic and diminishing of them and their lived experience to expect that not to be a part of whatever they are here to deal with.

I don't like the idea of "cutting" myself up into little pieces, only certain ones of which can go here or be there or express in situation X, etc...etc...etc... ....That's what known, I believe, as compartmentalization, and last I heard, it was not a healthy, effective coping strategy. And if I am unwilling to do it myself, then I'm really not going to be expecting others to do it just to make me feel more comfortable.

Anyways, I know pretty much everything I've just said here goes against some of the current Al Anon grain, but I find these kinds of us/them attitudes to be, ultimately, not compatible with the principles of recovery.....and when they come up this strongly, I feel it's important to let people know that not all people who have been affected by the addictions of others -- and not even all Al Anon members -- share them.

freya