Is paying his bills co-dependant behavior?
Searching for Serenity
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 128
Is paying his bills co-dependant behavior?
I've been wondering (not stressing, mind you, just wondering) if this behavior is in any way enabling or co-dependant.
My addict fiancee currently has 90+ days clean. Before he went into treatment in October, he had worked for the past 2 years to support our family while I was a stay-at-home mom. We've always shared financial responsibilty equally (for the most part), even though he was the one making the money. But as his addiction began to escalate, he would give me less and less money each month to pay bills, or buy groceries leaving me in the situation where I had to make the decision of what bill needed to be paid, and which had to be left behind. Sometimes only getting less than $50 to buy groceries (including diapers) for a family of 3 that was supposed to last for 2 weeks. Usually this happened with little-to-no explanation as to where the money was going. He also gradually began to get credit cards. Some of them he told me about, some he didn't. Thankfully, because his past credit is so bad, most of them had limits of $200 - $300. They all got maxed out, plus he took out several short term loans (you know the payday companies where the loans have interest rates of 600% per year and you're paying $300 a month just to pay the finance charge).
He left me in kind of a bad situation with all of that.
The last check he got:
He got paid on Friday, then went into treatment on tuesday without having paid any bills and gave me no money for groceries and when i checked his account that day it had $5 in it. I still don't know where all of that money went.
Well, almost immediately his enabling parents took care of the short term loans.
Since treatment, he is doing well and currently I am working and he is staying at home with our son and looking for a job. He's not looking very hard but I'm not in complete disagreement with that because I would like to put off putting our son in daycare and I don't want him to rush into a job and end up doing something where he is going to be around people who are using. Nor do I want him to get a job that will interfere with his recovery program. I am paying the bills which includes slowly getting those credit cards paid off. They are in his name. But I don't trust him to handle finances on his own. He makes bad decisions and isn't very good at determining which bills are "priority" and which aren't. The way I see it, we're going to have to deal with this sooner or later anyway, with his money or mine and I don't really like to hear the phone ringing nonstop for us to pay a company.
Here is my question: Am I being co-dependant by paying these bills for him?
My addict fiancee currently has 90+ days clean. Before he went into treatment in October, he had worked for the past 2 years to support our family while I was a stay-at-home mom. We've always shared financial responsibilty equally (for the most part), even though he was the one making the money. But as his addiction began to escalate, he would give me less and less money each month to pay bills, or buy groceries leaving me in the situation where I had to make the decision of what bill needed to be paid, and which had to be left behind. Sometimes only getting less than $50 to buy groceries (including diapers) for a family of 3 that was supposed to last for 2 weeks. Usually this happened with little-to-no explanation as to where the money was going. He also gradually began to get credit cards. Some of them he told me about, some he didn't. Thankfully, because his past credit is so bad, most of them had limits of $200 - $300. They all got maxed out, plus he took out several short term loans (you know the payday companies where the loans have interest rates of 600% per year and you're paying $300 a month just to pay the finance charge).
He left me in kind of a bad situation with all of that.
The last check he got:
He got paid on Friday, then went into treatment on tuesday without having paid any bills and gave me no money for groceries and when i checked his account that day it had $5 in it. I still don't know where all of that money went.
Well, almost immediately his enabling parents took care of the short term loans.
Since treatment, he is doing well and currently I am working and he is staying at home with our son and looking for a job. He's not looking very hard but I'm not in complete disagreement with that because I would like to put off putting our son in daycare and I don't want him to rush into a job and end up doing something where he is going to be around people who are using. Nor do I want him to get a job that will interfere with his recovery program. I am paying the bills which includes slowly getting those credit cards paid off. They are in his name. But I don't trust him to handle finances on his own. He makes bad decisions and isn't very good at determining which bills are "priority" and which aren't. The way I see it, we're going to have to deal with this sooner or later anyway, with his money or mine and I don't really like to hear the phone ringing nonstop for us to pay a company.
Here is my question: Am I being co-dependant by paying these bills for him?
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Hackettstown, NJ
Posts: 692
Given the whole contents of your post, NO I don't think this is codependency (not yet). If I understand correctly, he paid the bills for 2 years while you took care of the kids. Now you are working to pay the bills while he stays home and cares for the kids and takes care of his own recovery. That sounds like a fair partnership. You can set a boundary (first in your own head - discuss this with others too, then present the boundary to him) about how long you think is reasonable for him to stay home and not work. Depending on what kind of work he did, that answer could change. Depending on how much intense recovery he needs, that answer could vary. If he is an addict, he is a very sick individual who will need treatment for life. (I'm a recovering addict with 5 yrs clean (in March) and I still must go to meetings, talk with sponsor, take service committment in my NA Area, etc.). Right out of rehab, I did not work for at least 6 months at first. I needed to heal. Try to be grateful that he is clean now. Rehab does not always work (that's an underrstatement, actually). He needs your support. BUT, if you were to give him a year to heal and find a job by the end of that time, and he was now out of rehab for 18 months and not working, you might then consider enforcing those boundaries - the ones you are going to carefully and thoughtfully set now!!
Just my 2 cents. you will find other opinions here.
Just my 2 cents. you will find other opinions here.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: NY
Posts: 1,054
I would like to say WELCOME and congrats to the fiance for 90 days!!
You have some genuine concerns about your fiance, and you should still remain cautious when it comes to finances. I wouldn't recommend marrying him until he's had some good long term recovery. When you marry one with debts, or prone to create more debt, it becomes your problems and it creates much stress for the marriage, especially being married to an addict. Unless he shows long term recovery from addiction, emotionally, spiritually, and financially, remain cautious.
As I know this is a difficut situation needing daycare, but a man not working is not good.
It would help him in his recovery to be working. It sounds as if he's far enough along (90 days) to be looking for work. It will be a balancing act to make work and meetings but it can be done. People do it every day.
I wouldn't pay his credit cards, that is enabling. If you do it now you may be doing it forever. Addicts have a lot of things to clean up in sobriety, this is one. He will feel better about himself if he handles this problem himself. Let him take the calls from credit card companies.
Do not take on his responsibilities. It will hinder his recovery and yours.
Blessings,
NH7
You have some genuine concerns about your fiance, and you should still remain cautious when it comes to finances. I wouldn't recommend marrying him until he's had some good long term recovery. When you marry one with debts, or prone to create more debt, it becomes your problems and it creates much stress for the marriage, especially being married to an addict. Unless he shows long term recovery from addiction, emotionally, spiritually, and financially, remain cautious.
he is doing well and currently I am working and he is staying at home with our son and looking for a job. He's not looking very hard but I'm not in complete disagreement with that because I would like to put off putting our son in daycare
It would help him in his recovery to be working. It sounds as if he's far enough along (90 days) to be looking for work. It will be a balancing act to make work and meetings but it can be done. People do it every day.
They are in his name. But I don't trust him to handle finances on his own. He makes bad decisions and isn't very good at determining which bills are "priority" and which aren't.
Do not take on his responsibilities. It will hinder his recovery and yours.
Blessings,
NH7
Searching for Serenity
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 128
Originally Posted by NeedingHelp7 
As I know this is a difficut situation needing daycare, but a man not working is not good.
It is fairly normal for one parent to stay at home while the other works, right?
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Chicago area
Posts: 4,269
My husband was, by mutual decison, a stay at home dad, for ten years, back when. My income supported our family of three. Having said this, he did not run up debt to pay for drugs, gaming or what not. He also was a volunteer paramedic in the community we lived in and was on call, almost every night.
If he had run up debt to pay for drugs (and if I had been inclined to let him return home) I would not have paid a cent towards his accumulated debt. That to me is enabling....doing for him, what he can do for himself.
I would expect him to get a job,any job, a pt job and earn money to pay them off. In otherwords, I would give him the dignity of realizing the consequences of his choices.
If he had run up debt to pay for drugs (and if I had been inclined to let him return home) I would not have paid a cent towards his accumulated debt. That to me is enabling....doing for him, what he can do for himself.
I would expect him to get a job,any job, a pt job and earn money to pay them off. In otherwords, I would give him the dignity of realizing the consequences of his choices.
Psalm 118:24
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: ILLINOIS
Posts: 15,203
I would continue to keep paying the bills to avoid him having the trigger of spending the money again!!
Wait and see how he does in recovery to figure out if, letting him take care of the bills is a good idea.
You and your kids have to eat, and have shelter. That's the most important part
Wait and see how he does in recovery to figure out if, letting him take care of the bills is a good idea.
You and your kids have to eat, and have shelter. That's the most important part
Member
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Home of the Ravens-MD
Posts: 1,316
I'd have to say that paying HIS bills (those that are not in your name, those that he ran up...using) would be enabling.
I also have to agree, b/4 marrying him, I would want to see some long term recovery under his belt.
just my 2cents.
I also have to agree, b/4 marrying him, I would want to see some long term recovery under his belt.
just my 2cents.
Psalm 118:24
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: ILLINOIS
Posts: 15,203
Originally Posted by SERENITY BOUND
I'd have to say that paying HIS bills (those that are not in your name, those that he ran up...using) would be enabling.
I also have to agree, b/4 marrying him, I would want to see some long term recovery under his belt.
just my 2cents.
I also have to agree, b/4 marrying him, I would want to see some long term recovery under his belt.
just my 2cents.
I'd agree if, they weren't for the home etc.
Searching for Serenity
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 128
OHHH hah, it's probably going to be a looooonnnng time before i trust him to pay our bills again. i'm just thankful that his name wasn't included on our son's savings account, or that would probably all be gone too. i was mostly referring to the credit card bills, most of which were spent on cash advances which he used to pay for, well i don't know for sure, but i can guess. i did put some purchases on those credit cards, but that was usually because he didn't have anything left from his check and i would say, "well how am i going to buy diapers?" and he would say "here just put it on this card" and then half of the time it would get declined at the register. but, then again, we have a few bills that are in my name too, and he payed for those when he was working. he feels really guilty about everything that went on. and not supporting us financially as well as he should have.
there's a big part of me that just wants to pay it off so we can move forward and forget about it, we've come to an agreement at this point that i'm handling the finances indefinately, and he's been really good about putting any money that he may accumulate into my account, and bringing me reciepts when he uses my debit card, and giving me the bills as soon as he gets them from the mailbox. he's obviously making an effort to send the message to me that he knows he's irresponsible and he doesn't want to put me in that position again.
but then part of me wants to say "i told you you shouldn't get those cards to begin with"
there's a big part of me that just wants to pay it off so we can move forward and forget about it, we've come to an agreement at this point that i'm handling the finances indefinately, and he's been really good about putting any money that he may accumulate into my account, and bringing me reciepts when he uses my debit card, and giving me the bills as soon as he gets them from the mailbox. he's obviously making an effort to send the message to me that he knows he's irresponsible and he doesn't want to put me in that position again.
but then part of me wants to say "i told you you shouldn't get those cards to begin with"
Psalm 118:24
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: ILLINOIS
Posts: 15,203
See how earnest he is about his recovery
Give him lattitude with his going to meetings. Attend meetings you can and any social event connected with the meetings.
For a person to have good recovery, you have to be centered in this in all your affairs not just going to a meeting once in a while
praying it all works out well for you
Give him lattitude with his going to meetings. Attend meetings you can and any social event connected with the meetings.
For a person to have good recovery, you have to be centered in this in all your affairs not just going to a meeting once in a while
praying it all works out well for you
Belgian Sheepdog Adictee
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: In Today
Posts: 6,101
I have to say, that paying the utilities, rent and buying groceries is, of course, A-OK. However, please DO NOT contribute even one penny to those credit card bills. His CONSEQUENCES for HIS ACTIONS.
Now, as much as you like that he is staying at home and taking care of your child, right now at 90 days, he needs STRUCTURE in his life:
Going to work
Going to meetings
Meeting regularly with his sponsor
Paying his overdue bills
Helping around the house
Learning new ways to live life.
So................................please re-evaluate your own position for YOUR OWN Sake and see where you can facilitate your own recovery, set your boundaries and go from there.
I would CAUTION you at this time, to WATCH his ACTIONS and not listen to HIS WORDS. It takes a pretty good amount of time in recovery for 'addict thinking to start to change and reality to set in.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
Now, as much as you like that he is staying at home and taking care of your child, right now at 90 days, he needs STRUCTURE in his life:
Going to work
Going to meetings
Meeting regularly with his sponsor
Paying his overdue bills
Helping around the house
Learning new ways to live life.
So................................please re-evaluate your own position for YOUR OWN Sake and see where you can facilitate your own recovery, set your boundaries and go from there.
I would CAUTION you at this time, to WATCH his ACTIONS and not listen to HIS WORDS. It takes a pretty good amount of time in recovery for 'addict thinking to start to change and reality to set in.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Marietta, GA
Posts: 1,453
Since your not married his bills should be his and your bills yours. Living expenses i would only pay if they are for everyone and only for a designated and short time. I wouldnt be out buying him new clothes or anything like that. If you're paying his past credit cards that were used to buy drugs then you're paying for his drugs and taking away his consequence.
Before you get married you may want to set a boundary that he has to have his finances in order. if they arent then you're going to be dealing with this forever. i had to learn that lesson the hard way - I've supported many ex's and so far they're all still broke and unemployed. good riddence in my case.
Before you get married you may want to set a boundary that he has to have his finances in order. if they arent then you're going to be dealing with this forever. i had to learn that lesson the hard way - I've supported many ex's and so far they're all still broke and unemployed. good riddence in my case.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Kansas
Posts: 10,182
You've gotten some good feedback already. I'd like to address a portion of your original post.
I understand your concerns in that area. I'd like to share a little with you about my experience in recovery and jobs. I went through a 30 day rehab. At that time I was also married to a very violent alcoholic/addict, and the rehab was over 2 hours away from where we lived.
Things fell into place that I was able to start over in the small town where the rehab was because going back home to the then husband was not an option.
That meant I was the single parent of an 8 year old daughter, and the sole provider.
It was up to me to find a job and make ends meet. I networked through my friends in AA to find places to apply, and within a week I was working full time at a nursing home as a CNA. I am a firm believer that the sooner an addict in recovery becomes a productive member of society, the better.
No one is going to be able to keep him insulated forever from temptation, and it's going to be out there. There are plenty of addicts who have found ways to work and attend meetings, if that is what you are referring to in regards to 'interfering' with his recovery program.
I don't want him to rush into a job and end up doing something where he is going to be around people who are using. Nor do I want him to get a job that will interfere with his recovery program.
Things fell into place that I was able to start over in the small town where the rehab was because going back home to the then husband was not an option.
That meant I was the single parent of an 8 year old daughter, and the sole provider.
It was up to me to find a job and make ends meet. I networked through my friends in AA to find places to apply, and within a week I was working full time at a nursing home as a CNA. I am a firm believer that the sooner an addict in recovery becomes a productive member of society, the better.
No one is going to be able to keep him insulated forever from temptation, and it's going to be out there. There are plenty of addicts who have found ways to work and attend meetings, if that is what you are referring to in regards to 'interfering' with his recovery program.
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Calif
Posts: 1,007
I agree with Laurie. He needs to take care of his own credit cards. However, I really don't know how they can work when they are in recovery. It's probably more important that they go to meetings each day.
What good is it to get a job if they can't make it through the day?
Congratulations to your bf for 90 days clean! That's really great!
Hugs, Devastated
What good is it to get a job if they can't make it through the day?
Congratulations to your bf for 90 days clean! That's really great!
Hugs, Devastated
Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Marietta, GA
Posts: 1,453
I could be wrong not having gone through recovery but for me, work is extremely theraputic. gets your mind off of your problems, allows you to have the respect of supporting yourself, keeps you busy and allows you to contribute to society in a positive way. i have a hard time believing that a little hard work could possibly have a negative effect. If he's so bad that he cant make it through the day then i'd worry more about him watching my kids.
Attitude of Gratitude
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Dayton, Ohio
Posts: 2,305
If you work during the day, how about him getting a part time job at night? Anything he earns goes towards paying his credit card bills, and it eases him back into the workplace.
Today 01:05 PM
Today 01:05 PM
If he's so bad that he cant make it through the day then i'd worry more about him watching my kids.
Today 01:37 PM
Today 01:37 PM
Searching for Serenity
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 128
Originally Posted by winnie12
I could be wrong not having gone through recovery but for me, work is extremely theraputic. gets your mind off of your problems, allows you to have the respect of supporting yourself.
Originally Posted by winnie12
i have a hard time believing that a little hard work could possibly have a negative effect. If he's so bad that he cant make it through the day then i'd worry more about him watching my kids.
he's doing a good job with our son. he's a good father and, in all honesty, he wasnt spending all that much time with him in the last few months before he went to treatment.
i sort of hate to take that away from him where he would be working 8-6, then come home and eat supper and immediately leave for a meeting. he would hardly ever get to see our son.
and also, it's been nice for me to have him there to do housework (dishes, home repairs, etc.) we just moved into a new house. it's old and it needs a lot of work, so he's been working on fixing a lot of stuff around the house and that's nice for me that i don't have to worry about that when i get home.
i think ya'll are right about the credit card bills! they should be his responsibility. thank ya'll for replying!
Belgian Sheepdog Adictee
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: In Today
Posts: 6,101
Devastated:
When I got sober and clean that was one of the PRIMARY REQUIREMENTS......GET A JOB.
I worked, 40 hours a week, attended 10 to 12 meetings a week, and took care of 'my home' responsibilities. Most of the sponsees I have worked with over the years have done EXACTLY the same thing.
It give STRUCTURE to one's life. Allows the one new to recovery to MAKE A COMMITMENT and then allows that same person to see HOW THEY ARE FOLLOWING THROUGH with said commitment.
It is PART OF GETTING BETTER.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
P.S. 'IF YOU BABY THEM, YOU WILL BURY THEM.'
However, I really don't know how they can work when they are in recovery. It's probably more important that they go to meetings each day.
I worked, 40 hours a week, attended 10 to 12 meetings a week, and took care of 'my home' responsibilities. Most of the sponsees I have worked with over the years have done EXACTLY the same thing.
It give STRUCTURE to one's life. Allows the one new to recovery to MAKE A COMMITMENT and then allows that same person to see HOW THEY ARE FOLLOWING THROUGH with said commitment.
It is PART OF GETTING BETTER.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
P.S. 'IF YOU BABY THEM, YOU WILL BURY THEM.'
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Kansas
Posts: 10,182
Originally Posted by devastated
I agree with Laurie. He needs to take care of his own credit cards. However, I really don't know how they can work when they are in recovery. It's probably more important that they go to meetings each day.
Also in your bigger cities, there are meetings all hours of the day to accommodate for people's work hours.
Also, when I worked a temp job at a counseling center, I found a noon meeting just down the street. On my lunch break, I took my sack lunch with me and attended the meeting.
If an addict wants it bad enough, they will figure out a job and meetings, believe me.
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