Rare chance of closure with an ex-alcoholic
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 6,784
Rare chance of closure with an ex-alcoholic
Hi friends
As you know I have lived very sad months when I left an alcoholic ex with which I had a lot of dreams with. But was verbally abusive when drunk and I had to leave.
He acted like a jerk, talked about me with his friends and of course is already going out with another girl. A silly drunkard. (Suits him well)
He kept saying "hi" to me and talking about all his parties and trips at work. This of course generated a lot of stress and anxiety.
Finally today I stepped up and told him that he had two choices, one, never talking to me again, two, that we could go somewhere to talk and tell truths and get out all this tension for once.
We are meeting next Tuesday.
I know I know, supposedly you should NEVER EVER talk again. But what the hell.
I would like to insult and hit him for hours!! for all this pain and just knowing that while I cry my heart out for months he is going at it with another girl, WOW! after so many promises and stuff I blindly believed.
Any ideas about what to say? I will try to say things calmly.
I am all ears.
As you know I have lived very sad months when I left an alcoholic ex with which I had a lot of dreams with. But was verbally abusive when drunk and I had to leave.
He acted like a jerk, talked about me with his friends and of course is already going out with another girl. A silly drunkard. (Suits him well)
He kept saying "hi" to me and talking about all his parties and trips at work. This of course generated a lot of stress and anxiety.
Finally today I stepped up and told him that he had two choices, one, never talking to me again, two, that we could go somewhere to talk and tell truths and get out all this tension for once.
We are meeting next Tuesday.
I know I know, supposedly you should NEVER EVER talk again. But what the hell.
I would like to insult and hit him for hours!! for all this pain and just knowing that while I cry my heart out for months he is going at it with another girl, WOW! after so many promises and stuff I blindly believed.
Any ideas about what to say? I will try to say things calmly.
I am all ears.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: The Swish Alps, SF CA
Posts: 2,144
What are your motives?
I mean unless you are ready to forgive him and move on, which, frankly I am not hearing, what purpose does this meeting accomplish? hurting him? having him hurt you some more? reconciliation? short term "make up sex" with all the self loathing that comes with it?
Yeah, I just don't get it, I mean I am friends with all of my "exes" but one, and we have contact from frequent to infrequent, but I have no healthy reason to contact anyone I have a festering resentment towards unless it's to make amends for my own behavior, because in my experience meeting someone to "get closure" and trying to get them to "make amends" to me had some dark twisted self seeking motives of my own underlying it all, and if they were able to "make amends" they would have either already made those amends or not had the behavior in the first place.
Good Luck, and let us know how it turns out, I for one am interested in hearing how it turns out.
I mean unless you are ready to forgive him and move on, which, frankly I am not hearing, what purpose does this meeting accomplish? hurting him? having him hurt you some more? reconciliation? short term "make up sex" with all the self loathing that comes with it?
Yeah, I just don't get it, I mean I am friends with all of my "exes" but one, and we have contact from frequent to infrequent, but I have no healthy reason to contact anyone I have a festering resentment towards unless it's to make amends for my own behavior, because in my experience meeting someone to "get closure" and trying to get them to "make amends" to me had some dark twisted self seeking motives of my own underlying it all, and if they were able to "make amends" they would have either already made those amends or not had the behavior in the first place.
Good Luck, and let us know how it turns out, I for one am interested in hearing how it turns out.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Kansas
Posts: 10,182
What is meeting with him going to accomplish, seriously?
He couldn't care less how you feel.
Being with an alcoholic leaves deep wounds.
Personally I got tired of having contact with mine and scratching the scabs off to have them bleed all over again.
They say the best revenge is living well.
He couldn't care less how you feel.
Being with an alcoholic leaves deep wounds.
Personally I got tired of having contact with mine and scratching the scabs off to have them bleed all over again.
They say the best revenge is living well.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Stumbling toward happiness
Posts: 4,706
You feel better, likely, because you are looking forward to getting your 'fix' of being with him.
But what purpose does it serve? What will you say? "Don't ever talk to me unless you have something bad to say about your girlfriend , or unless it's to say what a lousy time you're having?"
He has moved on. It stinks, but it frees you to find somebody with a little integrity who isn't an alcoholic.
Just not sure what you'll be getting out of this, or what you'll say that you couldn't say in an email. Good luck.
But what purpose does it serve? What will you say? "Don't ever talk to me unless you have something bad to say about your girlfriend , or unless it's to say what a lousy time you're having?"
He has moved on. It stinks, but it frees you to find somebody with a little integrity who isn't an alcoholic.
Just not sure what you'll be getting out of this, or what you'll say that you couldn't say in an email. Good luck.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hertfordshire, UK
Posts: 111
I know the feeling of wanting closure, and I'll readily admit I tried to have those kinds of conversations with my AXGF on more than one occasion. What I was hoping for was to feel like, for once, I'd been heard. That my feelings were validated, that the dirty laundry could be washed, the air could be cleared, and I could reach acceptance and to move on. Sounds nice, huh?
I never got it. Instead, I ended up once again being subtly or explicitly blamed for everything that went wrong, my buttons pushed, and once again I was left feeling hurt, confused, and damn foolish.
I left my AXGF because, at its core, she cared more for booze than she did for me. She was always much more ready to hurt my feelings than to do anything that might threaten her continuing freedom to drink what she wanted, when she wanted. Just because it was a few months or even a year down the line since we'd split up, that aspect of her hadn't changed in the slightest. I was fooling myself to expect anything else.
On the other hand, if you really want to do this then I'd say go for it. Say what you need to say. Listen to what he really says, and compare his words to his actions. But don't expect any reaction that will help you to feel better about this. That will have to come from within.
Mr B.
I never got it. Instead, I ended up once again being subtly or explicitly blamed for everything that went wrong, my buttons pushed, and once again I was left feeling hurt, confused, and damn foolish.
I left my AXGF because, at its core, she cared more for booze than she did for me. She was always much more ready to hurt my feelings than to do anything that might threaten her continuing freedom to drink what she wanted, when she wanted. Just because it was a few months or even a year down the line since we'd split up, that aspect of her hadn't changed in the slightest. I was fooling myself to expect anything else.
On the other hand, if you really want to do this then I'd say go for it. Say what you need to say. Listen to what he really says, and compare his words to his actions. But don't expect any reaction that will help you to feel better about this. That will have to come from within.
Mr B.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 282
I've got to agree with everyone. A's don't listen and they don't care what you think. Nobody is trying to be mean or rude it's just a cold, hard truth we all had to learn. As freedom so eloquently posted I got tired of scratching off the scabs too and that is exactly what it felt like. I would not be surprised if your A decided not to show up or he shows up and you meet, he plays with your head and you go home feeling the same old hurts all over again. I'm sorry it's like this but please believe us...it really is like this.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Middle of the U.S.
Posts: 85
I'm not sure real closure is possible at all, especially when you're feeling such strong emotions. Also, the person displaying the most emotion is the one with the least control in an interaction. He might take pleasure in your pain, leaving you to feel even worse.
If you decide to meet with him anyway, be very careful with yourself.
If you decide to meet with him anyway, be very careful with yourself.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: florida
Posts: 269
you gotta do what you gotta do, but just be prepared to just leave the conversation even more hurt and fustrated, cause the odd of getting closure isnt very high
i run it through my head what i would/will say when my xah ever gets in touch with me, cause i know one day that will probably happen since we have a son, he cant call but if he remembers my address he may one day write while hes in rehab, and ive sit and thought about all i would say to him, really get out everything hes did to me, really make him see what hes done to me, but i just dont see the point anymore, i wont ever be with him again so really it doesnt matter what he thinks anymore, if blaming me gets him through the day then so be it, it would be nice to have closure with him but i dont need it to live my life, somewhere in his head he knows what he did and one day he will answer for that even if its before God
i run it through my head what i would/will say when my xah ever gets in touch with me, cause i know one day that will probably happen since we have a son, he cant call but if he remembers my address he may one day write while hes in rehab, and ive sit and thought about all i would say to him, really get out everything hes did to me, really make him see what hes done to me, but i just dont see the point anymore, i wont ever be with him again so really it doesnt matter what he thinks anymore, if blaming me gets him through the day then so be it, it would be nice to have closure with him but i dont need it to live my life, somewhere in his head he knows what he did and one day he will answer for that even if its before God
Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: brooklyn new york
Posts: 34
why??? i am oing threw somethinl similar. what are you going to gain by this. sounds
sounds like you just want to vent over wasting with him.or maybe you want him back
if he still drinking and found another woman let him go.he will play with your head just to use you
I am new hear & I love this site be careful very careful good luck
if he still drinking and found another woman let him go.he will play with your head just to use you
I am new hear & I love this site be careful very careful good luck
Wipe your paws elsewhere!
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 3,672
I've found that people will do whatever the heck they want to do regardless of what other folks have to say about it. It's clear to me that you intend to meet your ex on Tuesday. So why do you need advice on what to say to him? I think you already have an agenda.
I've learned that there's a motive behind every action I take. I'm learning to examine my motives carefully to determine if the action I'm planning to undertake will be beneficial and healthy for me. If it's not, then I rethink my plan.
I'm no longer interested in partaking in activities that may be harmful to me.
I've learned that there's a motive behind every action I take. I'm learning to examine my motives carefully to determine if the action I'm planning to undertake will be beneficial and healthy for me. If it's not, then I rethink my plan.
I'm no longer interested in partaking in activities that may be harmful to me.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: UK
Posts: 4,682
Sounds like a really bad idea in the first place but good luck!
Reminds me of a guy i know, he had a chat with his wife (seperated) after 7 years apart, he had a kid by another woman, with many other partners too in the 7 years, as his wife did not want any. He was skint, nowhere to stay and she only saw him for closure. He is still drinking and smoking pot.
Now 3 months later they are living together, he has his wedding ring back on, came up and saw me in North Spain (she/they live down south) couldn't figure out why he was back with her and looked at it as a convenience thing, he is hoping that his ex takes him back in the UK soon! His wife thinks they are now together forever, you would think that you could not make this sort of stuff up!!!
So closure for her has given her a wonderful surprise...until he leaves her again, probably breaking her heart and with a pocket full of her cash!
Just be careful:-)
Reminds me of a guy i know, he had a chat with his wife (seperated) after 7 years apart, he had a kid by another woman, with many other partners too in the 7 years, as his wife did not want any. He was skint, nowhere to stay and she only saw him for closure. He is still drinking and smoking pot.
Now 3 months later they are living together, he has his wedding ring back on, came up and saw me in North Spain (she/they live down south) couldn't figure out why he was back with her and looked at it as a convenience thing, he is hoping that his ex takes him back in the UK soon! His wife thinks they are now together forever, you would think that you could not make this sort of stuff up!!!
So closure for her has given her a wonderful surprise...until he leaves her again, probably breaking her heart and with a pocket full of her cash!
Just be careful:-)
Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 18
Hi Dreamer999,
I am sorry you are still struggling with the outfall of this painful relationship. Despite the turmoil you have been through, you have clearly shown what a smart, strong and self-respecting young lady you are--amply demonstrated in your previous posts.
What I hear from you now is that you are basically feeling harassed by the ex; that while you have detached from him and his disease, he insists on literally getting into your face and trying to torment you with his shares about his life, etc. And that you would really just like him to leave you alone, which is entirely understandable.
If you do not want to experience the stress of meeting with him face-to-face which I agree as others have suggested would probably only add fuel to the fire and likely make you feel even worse, and is not likely at any rate to defuse the situation--and if he would not honor your request to stop talking at you as it were--maybe you could get your HR dept. or its equivalent involved? Seems like it would be reasonable to require him to limit your exchanges to work-related discussion only.
Good luck and I am sending you good thoughts.
I am sorry you are still struggling with the outfall of this painful relationship. Despite the turmoil you have been through, you have clearly shown what a smart, strong and self-respecting young lady you are--amply demonstrated in your previous posts.
What I hear from you now is that you are basically feeling harassed by the ex; that while you have detached from him and his disease, he insists on literally getting into your face and trying to torment you with his shares about his life, etc. And that you would really just like him to leave you alone, which is entirely understandable.
If you do not want to experience the stress of meeting with him face-to-face which I agree as others have suggested would probably only add fuel to the fire and likely make you feel even worse, and is not likely at any rate to defuse the situation--and if he would not honor your request to stop talking at you as it were--maybe you could get your HR dept. or its equivalent involved? Seems like it would be reasonable to require him to limit your exchanges to work-related discussion only.
Good luck and I am sending you good thoughts.
A jug fills drop by drop
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 6,784
Hello friends
Touchy and dangerous area I know. I followed this advice from a therapist as she made clear that I needed to set my boundaries at work. Of course there is room to talk about more personal stuff... and yes it will be a very delicate moment so I need to set my objectives straight as you say.
First of all THANK YOUUU ALL for taking the time to answer. I have read all of your posts thoroughly.
Yes indeed, I suck at breakups. When we broke up the guy was drunk as hell so there was no decent sober conversation (good luck with that..sobriety!!) whereby we can honor the past and say "thanks and goodbye" as you mention.. there was a lot of confusion at the time. We agreed to start over as friends in a different context later on (as we were just settling in and there were other stressors in our relation).
Of course, by now I know the extent of the damage and the fact he is an alcoholic (tough calling him that, as I also drink socially and at first I thought it was fun..before the verbal abuse!!) So, really there is nothing there for me anymore. Of course with his actions lately I am in no mood to be "friends", another sucky idea. Sometimes I think that him talking about his parties is his way to stay "friends" - he does not have anything else to talk about! OR well, probably he just likes to "have me there, available and still smiling at him as if no one was hurt" - I dunno. It's all just a freaking mess as you see....
I sent him an email before (yes, even worseee!) saying that I hated him (I shouldnt have..of course..)... and that I was let down by him..and a bunch of stuff that is not so true anymore.
As you can see everything has been very badly handled by both parties. Seeing him with this woman just days after the breakup, laughing and all, was like a punch...
So what I am looking for is not to hear anything from him.. hopefully he wont even talk... but for ME to have the chance to be heard and talk about my truth as it is now..to bring me peace. Something along the lines of
"I know we agreed to stay friends and I won't say it will never happen, it may happen. When you are in your 10th year of AA, THEN you may count on my friendship...
Right now I would like to have as little contact as possible with you and only about job related matters. Work is already stressful to have you talking about your private life, and your friends discussing it as well. You need to be aware I am out there too, and that I am not interested in your private life. I respect you at work and I expect you to do the same.
Personally I would like to see you and talk to you as friends, but there was a cunning betrayal of trust from your part that makes this impossible. I mentioned before I hated you but no, that is no longer true. I do not hate you- I just do not recognize you anymore. I no longer want to be connected to you, in any way. "
Maybe I call it off and write a letter... so there is not a "fix" of looking at his eyes and give him the chance to see my hurt. Although of course he has, I have looked like a zombie at work for months.
So little time and so much to sort out. What I would really want to do is to have a visceral talk and get ALL the feelings out.. although that would work if the person was also ready to be honest and respect my feelings so.. I guess that is not an option.. damn I wish I could do it.. at least all that would be HONEST!! and not this "acting" as if everything is OK...
Yes, I like to give the enemy even more ammunition to fight against me..
I've had these kind of honest talks, AA-like and afterwards I feel much better. But those talks with other exes were more light hearted, never involved an alcoholic that ran with a girl right away and went to me at work with his dumb smile as if he was an innocent lamb, going at it with her while I cry for the Nth time listening to our songs and mourning everyday.
ARGH!!!!!!!!!
ChangingMyself, thanks a lot for your words I will keep you posted...
Touchy and dangerous area I know. I followed this advice from a therapist as she made clear that I needed to set my boundaries at work. Of course there is room to talk about more personal stuff... and yes it will be a very delicate moment so I need to set my objectives straight as you say.
First of all THANK YOUUU ALL for taking the time to answer. I have read all of your posts thoroughly.
Yes indeed, I suck at breakups. When we broke up the guy was drunk as hell so there was no decent sober conversation (good luck with that..sobriety!!) whereby we can honor the past and say "thanks and goodbye" as you mention.. there was a lot of confusion at the time. We agreed to start over as friends in a different context later on (as we were just settling in and there were other stressors in our relation).
Of course, by now I know the extent of the damage and the fact he is an alcoholic (tough calling him that, as I also drink socially and at first I thought it was fun..before the verbal abuse!!) So, really there is nothing there for me anymore. Of course with his actions lately I am in no mood to be "friends", another sucky idea. Sometimes I think that him talking about his parties is his way to stay "friends" - he does not have anything else to talk about! OR well, probably he just likes to "have me there, available and still smiling at him as if no one was hurt" - I dunno. It's all just a freaking mess as you see....
I sent him an email before (yes, even worseee!) saying that I hated him (I shouldnt have..of course..)... and that I was let down by him..and a bunch of stuff that is not so true anymore.
As you can see everything has been very badly handled by both parties. Seeing him with this woman just days after the breakup, laughing and all, was like a punch...
So what I am looking for is not to hear anything from him.. hopefully he wont even talk... but for ME to have the chance to be heard and talk about my truth as it is now..to bring me peace. Something along the lines of
"I know we agreed to stay friends and I won't say it will never happen, it may happen. When you are in your 10th year of AA, THEN you may count on my friendship...
Right now I would like to have as little contact as possible with you and only about job related matters. Work is already stressful to have you talking about your private life, and your friends discussing it as well. You need to be aware I am out there too, and that I am not interested in your private life. I respect you at work and I expect you to do the same.
Personally I would like to see you and talk to you as friends, but there was a cunning betrayal of trust from your part that makes this impossible. I mentioned before I hated you but no, that is no longer true. I do not hate you- I just do not recognize you anymore. I no longer want to be connected to you, in any way. "
Maybe I call it off and write a letter... so there is not a "fix" of looking at his eyes and give him the chance to see my hurt. Although of course he has, I have looked like a zombie at work for months.
So little time and so much to sort out. What I would really want to do is to have a visceral talk and get ALL the feelings out.. although that would work if the person was also ready to be honest and respect my feelings so.. I guess that is not an option.. damn I wish I could do it.. at least all that would be HONEST!! and not this "acting" as if everything is OK...
Yes, I like to give the enemy even more ammunition to fight against me..
I've had these kind of honest talks, AA-like and afterwards I feel much better. But those talks with other exes were more light hearted, never involved an alcoholic that ran with a girl right away and went to me at work with his dumb smile as if he was an innocent lamb, going at it with her while I cry for the Nth time listening to our songs and mourning everyday.
ARGH!!!!!!!!!
ChangingMyself, thanks a lot for your words
I will keep you posted...
Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: OHIO
Posts: 959
He is willing to meet you only to hurt his new love hun.....he will hold her captive with the threat of YOUR memory.....and you are still left in the dust....as alot of us were/are. Someone needs to post that letter from Jon......I can't find it or I would post it right now..
You are treading where angels fear to go sweetie....a slippery slope for sure. Please don't fall for it....even if you did in a moment of weakness initiate it.
Janitw
You are treading where angels fear to go sweetie....a slippery slope for sure. Please don't fall for it....even if you did in a moment of weakness initiate it.
Janitw
Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 149
well good luck to you.
from my experience, if they felt something for sorry theyd apologize. if it seems they have a pattern of not recognizing or not caring if theyre going to hurt you, they continue. so telling them that theyve hurt you, breached trust, or even changed... sometimes seems counterproductive.
it also can bring more pain when we meet with someone, they still do the same patterns.
at best, maybe he will show genuine concern for your feelings and respect your boundaries. but even then, how will that make you feel? when my ex did that it just made me sadder because then i couldnt be ANGRY and move on, i was stuck in my own personal limbo / hell. "maybe hes not such a bad guy! he does love me"
i understand your situation is different because you work with him, and i understand thisi a lesson you must learn ourself. and you could be the exception- maybe it wont cause you hurt to talk about things as it has done for me and others. maybe someone else will share on this in the future and you can sahre you hope strength and experience for them.
i wish you luck and hope you keep posting.
from my experience, if they felt something for sorry theyd apologize. if it seems they have a pattern of not recognizing or not caring if theyre going to hurt you, they continue. so telling them that theyve hurt you, breached trust, or even changed... sometimes seems counterproductive.
it also can bring more pain when we meet with someone, they still do the same patterns.
at best, maybe he will show genuine concern for your feelings and respect your boundaries. but even then, how will that make you feel? when my ex did that it just made me sadder because then i couldnt be ANGRY and move on, i was stuck in my own personal limbo / hell. "maybe hes not such a bad guy! he does love me"
i understand your situation is different because you work with him, and i understand thisi a lesson you must learn ourself. and you could be the exception- maybe it wont cause you hurt to talk about things as it has done for me and others. maybe someone else will share on this in the future and you can sahre you hope strength and experience for them.
i wish you luck and hope you keep posting.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 5,075
Originally Posted by Dreamer999 
So what I am looking for is not to hear anything from him.. hopefully he wont even talk... but for ME to have the chance to be heard
JTinStLouis
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: St Louis, MO
Posts: 115
Hi Dreamer,
I completely understand why you want to meet with this man and have this discussion, you want to finally get your side heard and hope he can feel and understand the pain he has put you through and how empty his promises came to be, I get it I really do. The flaw in this plan is not yours however, the flaw is nothing more than the fact he is not in any position mentally or emotionally to have any understanding of the complex feelings you are dealing with. These things I know because in a not to distant path I was that man, when I was drinking and using I would bounce about aimlessly with no real consideration of others, but in my own deluded mind I felt I was, therefore my conversations and promises seemed sincere, which made it very difficult for those around me to have any idea when I was lying or when I was actually being for real. I will only say based the situation I fear you will only expose yourself to further hurt and non-closure, you can get the closure you need if YOU choose to move on, you dont need to shut the door on this as this memory although painful may help you going forward, to put your feelings in front of others who do not respect your feelings.
Hang in there
Love JT
I completely understand why you want to meet with this man and have this discussion, you want to finally get your side heard and hope he can feel and understand the pain he has put you through and how empty his promises came to be, I get it I really do. The flaw in this plan is not yours however, the flaw is nothing more than the fact he is not in any position mentally or emotionally to have any understanding of the complex feelings you are dealing with. These things I know because in a not to distant path I was that man, when I was drinking and using I would bounce about aimlessly with no real consideration of others, but in my own deluded mind I felt I was, therefore my conversations and promises seemed sincere, which made it very difficult for those around me to have any idea when I was lying or when I was actually being for real. I will only say based the situation I fear you will only expose yourself to further hurt and non-closure, you can get the closure you need if YOU choose to move on, you dont need to shut the door on this as this memory although painful may help you going forward, to put your feelings in front of others who do not respect your feelings.
Hang in there
Love JT
Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,582
I wrote a long letter to my exabf asking that he tell our friends the truth about our split (he said ugly things blaming me...all untrue) as i am moving back to our town this spring. I also asked for him to mail my clothes and personal items back to me. No reponse, so a week later I sent an email saying that I assumed he received my letter and that we needed address these things. I just received an email reply from HIS account but written by his new fiance telling me to not contact him again and saying that I could call her if need be.
I guess if he felt obliged to "do the right thing" he would have done it on his own.
I guess if he felt obliged to "do the right thing" he would have done it on his own.
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