I've lost all hope

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Old 12-05-2008, 07:25 AM
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I've lost all hope

I've been going to Al-Anon for about one month and it has helped me significantly. I understand Al-Anon is about my own recovery process.

I've been dating a man I've known for some 40 years. He's bright, kind, warm, loving when he is clean and sober.

I question my sanity for having started dating the man originally. There certainly was a comfort zone from having known one another for so many years. He had been going through a separation process and was really down on his luck for a five year period. In my naivety I thought if I could help him he would get himself back up on his feet and want to be whole again in a new chapter of his life.

I know, from some of the stories I've listened to at Al-Anon, that many of you have gone through so much with your loved ones addictions. I've thought to myself why haven't I walked out of this relationship over the past couple of years with all of the "drama" caused directly from this man's drugging and drinking. The thing is I've not been exposed to cocaine use and had no idea of his addiction. I truly believed if I hung in there and did this or that I would have an effect on him and he would want to get the help he so desparately needs.

I'm learning no matter what I do it doesn't matter. I've helped support him financially as well for the past two years. He went homeless this past summer and put himself into detox. The thing is he went in there to stop his cocaine use not his alcohol problem.

He got a job where I work and it was ok for 5 months but, there were problems with co-workers. He's since gone back to an old job that subjects him to people from the past. So, this week he let me know that he was using cocaine again but, will stop.

He did agree to see a therapist but when he called the agency while drinking the therapist refused to speak with him. He explained to me if they wanted to truly help him they should talk to him while he's drinking because while he's sober he's just telling them what he thinks they want to hear. I'm no expert but, I do think he's got a dual-dependency issue and would benefit greatly if he stays with the therapist to get to the root cause of his self-destructive behavior.

I'm at the very end of my rope. He was arrested a few months back and is waiting to go back into court again and have the case dismissed.

I've been a widow for 7 years and all but one of my husband's children is an alcoholic. One has died, one is in recovery and the other two are active. The child that died lived with us on and off. I vowed to NEVER GET INVOLVED romantically with anyone who was using drugs or alchohol and I'm wondering how I ever got here.

I truly believed through love and kindness I could help this man. He's a very loveable person and I hate the thought of his going further downhill but now I know there's nothing I can do.

He wants to marry me. He tells me he wouldn't have come this far without my help. He tells me he would choose me over the bottle any day if I would just be with him everyday. He makes promises he's absolutely incapable of keeping.

I'm a very strong character but this week I cried on the phone with him and told him I can't go through this anymore. I don't want to say anything to him that I'm not ready to follow through with. I'm afraid if I leave now he'll get foolish while drinking or drugging and get arrested again. They'll put him away for sure this time. He's deathly afraid of this happening. It's also the holiday season and that bothers him and on a good day this will throw him off.

Quite frankly I've talked with him so many times during his attempts to be sober about my feelings. I'm getting lost into his addictions and I hate that. I'm getting up there in years and just want to enjoy the rest of my life. I changed my career a few years back and love what I do. I thought I could keep all of this drama out of the rest of my life but it's beginning to permeate everything so much that I've decided to go to see a counselor myself to find out why I think I'm so wonderful I can get people to want to change?????

My Mom and Dad split up when I was 7 the first time. My Mom tried to take her life and she voluntarily went into an institution for a time. My parents made an attempt to get back together when I was 10 but he left to start a new family and a new life. My Mom's family was incredibly supportive and my Mom did the very best she could do. She died 8 years ago. My Mom was not an alcholic but her moods could change in a split second and she was verbally abusive. I've been to counseling in the past and when one is an adult we begin to recognize the human frailties of our parents, forgive them and move on to take responsibility of our own lives.

I'm a people pleaser and recognize I acted in very specific ways with my Mom to not rock the boat. The child in me does appear from time to time. This relationship with my alcholic has opened up all the old wounds from my past. I believe in karma and have asked God to enlighten me as to what MY LESSON is in all of this.

I want to walk away from the alcoholic but fear for him. That's my emotion talking. My intellect tells me I've done all I can do and to "Let Go and Let God".

I used to drink at least 3 glasses of wine every night for years. I used to smoke a pack and one half of cigarettes a day. I had to come to a point when I said I'm destroying myself and gave it all up. It wasn't easy but I know I'm worth it and I'm able to have A DRINK when I go out with my friends. I do not drink any longer when I'm with my alcoholic.

I believe I've been enabling him for two years and want to do what's right for both of us. I can't let myself get sucked up inside his abyss!

Your thoughts, stories and prayers would be very much appreciated.

Thanks for reading.

Alphawoman
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Old 12-05-2008, 07:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Alphawoman View Post
I truly believed through love and kindness I could help this man. He's a very loveable person and I hate the thought of his going further downhill but now I know there's nothing I can do.

He wants to marry me. He tells me he wouldn't have come this far without my help. He tells me he would choose me over the bottle any day if I would just be with him everyday. He makes promises he's absolutely incapable of keeping.

My intellect tells me I've done all I can do and to "Let Go and Let God".
(((Alphawoman))) I feel for you, but if love and kindness could help an A, we'd all have sober husbands/wives/so's. A's make all kinds of promises just to keep us hooked. They are incapable of keeping any of them, because truthfully, they don't mean them. It's sad, but it's true. There is nothing you can do for him, except to let go and let God, and work on your own recovery. Keep reading and posting here.
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Old 12-05-2008, 07:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Alphawoman View Post
I want to walk away from the alcoholic but fear for him. That's my emotion talking. My intellect tells me I've done all I can do and to "Let Go and Let God".
Once, after an hour of crying and fretting to my counselor he looked at me and said, "What would you do if you weren't afraid?"

And I knew the answer.
It sounds like you know the answer, too.
The tricky part is getting to the root of the fear - exploring it and finding a way to overcome.

What are you afraid will happen to him? Loss of job, loss of home, loss of respect?

Do you feel it is your responsibility to provide these things to him?

I can understand not wanting to see someone you love in pain, but I was able to overcome my fear of their pain when I recognized that I was not responsible for causing their pain. It wasn't my failure.

I'm glad that you're here - this is a great place to share and grow.
Keep posting!

-TC
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Old 12-05-2008, 01:02 PM
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Thanks for your help. I'm happy I've got a place to share my thoughts and concerns.
Now, I must find my own courage to take care of me.
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Old 12-05-2008, 01:04 PM
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Thanks to Toughchoices. I know what I must do. I pray for the strength and courage to do the right thing for myself.

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Old 12-05-2008, 01:34 PM
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We can help with that, alphawoman. Please keep posting - read around the forum, especially the Sticky posts at the top, and you will see many stories of people who've survived and thrived. Though I was once standing where you are, today I am happy beyond all reasonable definitions of the word......you can be too. I am no superwoman.

I hope that you can put the same energy, time, and tenderness into saving your OWN life that you tried to put into someone else's.

You're worth that, you know.

:ghug3
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Old 12-05-2008, 01:53 PM
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Dear Give Love,

Thanks for your compassion and advice. I will keep coming to this site.
I've actually got tears in my eyes.

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Old 12-05-2008, 05:56 PM
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welcome, alphawoman. you have alot to share with all of us. i'm glad you are here.
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Old 12-05-2008, 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Alphawoman View Post
He wants to marry me. He tells me he wouldn't have come this far without my help. He tells me he would choose me over the bottle any day if I would just be with him everyday. He makes promises he's absolutely incapable of keeping.
Alphawoman
Well this screams RED FLAG to me like nothing else.
Of course he would like to have you with him all the time. Alcoholics need someone to take care of them 24 hours a day. They need someone to manipulate.
Personally, if someone is drinking and I was not already married to them, I would surely wait till they proved to me that they could and would stop drinking.
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Old 12-06-2008, 06:24 AM
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Morning Wascally Wabbit,
Thanks for sharing with me as I need guidance at this time.
I've tried to speak to my ABF about these things. He tells me that AA is social engineering and loving someone means accepting them the way they are. He went off the deep end when I suggested to him he go away from all the negative influences and me for a time to get clean and sober. He said he needed a guarantee of my marriage agreement to be waiting for him at the end of it all. He compares the fact the I work two jobs and being a workaholic (out of necessity) to being an alcoholic. Regardless of the points I attempt to bring to the table to help him to even admit he's not dealing with his life realistically he has a counter argument (sound argument).
His life has spiraled downward since his wife and he separated. He has 3 children and one of them doesn't have anything to do with him. I'm aware there are always two sides of a story and I've known his wife for almost 30 years and he for 40 years. I believe I can say with confidence they both fed off of one another's negative energy. He is downright verbally abusive when he's drinking. He's obsessive and compulsive. When he's not doing one of his addictive things (drinking, drugs, smoking, gambling) he is compelled to make up for it with something else. The reason I decided to get on this site and go to Al-Anon is my wondering what is wrong with me that I truly thought I could lead this man into getting the help he really needs. I do love him as a person because he's been in my life for so many years. I no longer feel any romantic pull towards him but I'm very concerned with the repercussions from actually following through with no longer being a romantic interest in his life.
I told him this week if he truly loved me he would let me go because I am now starting to get physically ill from continuing in this relationship. Again, how foolish am I to think he'd accept that and what's wrong with me for not being strong enough to say I'm leaving???????? This is where I'm trying to say "Let Go and Let God". I'm going to go to a counselor as well as this site and Al-Anon because I obviously have a problem as well. I need to see with clarity how I got here in the first place and to avoid EVER DOING AGAIN IN THE FUTURE!
I'm sure many people have walked in my shoes. How did you get better? How did you leave? What are you doing to make sure you don't find yourself someone's trash receptacle for all of their problems?
Help please.
Thanks so much.
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Old 12-06-2008, 06:28 AM
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Originally Posted by miss communicat View Post
welcome, alphawoman. you have alot to share with all of us. i'm glad you are here.
Thanks miss communicat for sharing. I'm very glad to have found this site and the wonderful people who have responded to me.

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Old 12-06-2008, 06:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Alphawoman View Post
How did you get better? How did you leave? What are you doing to make sure you don't find yourself someone's trash receptacle for all of their problems?
First, I want to say that I could totally relate to your stories about the "arguments" against AA, comparisons of your workaholism to his alcoholism, need for "guarantees" of your love, etc.....

I've heard almost exactly the same stuff.

I got better by not listening to it. It is not true. An active alcoholic is in such intense and strange denial of their disease! They can justify the drinking in myriad ways, but none of that makes the behavior healthy. When I stopped paying attention to this talk, I started to find my balance again.

Al-Anon is an excellent place to learn the truth about your role in alcoholism.
It helped me figure out what was within my power and what was outside of it. I also read a lot here on SR - in the stickies at the top of this forum and on the alcoholism forum, too. Getting educated gave me the ability to make my own decisions about alcoholism and saved me from being caught in pointless arguments with my AH.

As far as not becoming a "trash receptacle" for someone else, I'm setting life goals for myself (finish school, save money, move somewhere mountainous, exercise often, etc...). I believe that when I make myself important, take care of my needs, cultivate love for myself, and treat myself gently, I am better able to recognize and avoid people who are incapable of treating me well. I've learned what "loving me" looks like by loving myself. If someone cannot treat me with the same respect I now treat myself - I know that it is best not to be involved with them.

I'm glad you've found us!
Keep reading and posting.

-TC
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Old 12-06-2008, 07:59 AM
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I heard much of the same, alpha.

It seems to be an alcoholic "script" - if you read through the posts here, you'll notice many similarities in the control tactics they use in order to maintain their comfortable status quo.

Looking back through my journals, I can see that it was a progression for me. I couldn't even begin to think of escaping the life that was killing me until I did four things:
--educated myself on addiction and codependency (Al-Anon, books, counseling)
--decided that I'd come to a point where it was "him or me" -- I could save only one of us, and I fully decided that it had to be me
--used journaling and counseling to visualize the life I wanted (it is more difficult to shake a damaging lifestyle if you don't have a clear vision of what you really want to take its place)
--completely embraced that I wanted something better, that I DESERVED something better, and wanted it so badly that I was willing to walk through some uncertainty and trouble to get there

You are educating yourself and building a support community - congratulations! The rest will come when you decide you're ready.

We'll be here every step of the way for you
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Old 12-06-2008, 10:33 AM
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Thank you Toughchoices. There is so much comfort in knowing someone does understand what life has been like with an A. I thought I'd turned a corner before I started dating my A but, I guess my Higher Power thinks I need to learn much more!
I'm not going to give up on myself. Thanks for the advice.
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Old 12-06-2008, 10:35 AM
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I will follow your advice. Thanks so much GiveLove. I feel so much wisdom coming from this site and Al-Anon. I want the rest of my life to be all I deserve.
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Old 12-06-2008, 07:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Alphawoman View Post
He wants to marry me. He tells me he wouldn't have come this far without my help. He tells me he would choose me over the bottle any day if I would just be with him everyday. He makes promises he's absolutely incapable of keeping.
I feel for you, Alphawoman, but it doesn't get any better, it only gets worse. I could really relate to what you had to say. I waited for him to choose the bottle over me and it never happened in 16 years and I was with him every day and the promises he was incapble of keeping kept being made. He also told me a very long time ago that if he had to choose between me and the bottle, no matter how much he loved me, the bottle would always win out as it had been his friend through all the hard times.

Don't waste any more of your life. I can tell you are wanting to have some quality to your life now and even though it doesn't seem like it, it is so much easier at this stage of the game, than waiting another 10 years. My only regret in our separating is that it didn't happen alot sooner, when I saw the red flags. The reason I say that is because now, aside from missing him and the dream of what I wanted it to be, I feel a huge amount of regret for the years I invested in a no win situation. And if I'm really honest with myself, I saw signs at the very beginning that should have been a warning to me.

It's been six months since my XAH left and it hasn't been easy, I won't lie to you, but it is getting easier now and I'm so grateful that I have everyone in this forum for support. Take care of yourself and keep posting.
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Old 12-08-2008, 07:54 PM
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Thank you for your words of wisdom Prairiegirl.
Although it's painful I know I can't continue in this relationship and survive. In the past when I try to speak from my heart and talk about my own feelings I get told I always look at the negative and don't recognize all of the positive things he has done for the past 5 months. My hopes have been built up so frequently only to be let down over and over again. It's like getting an electrical shock each time you reach for the light switch. He always has a counter comment to make so there is no discussion. In fact there is no me anymore! I've asked God to give me the courage to do what's right for myself. I keep on having visions of what I saw this summer when he was homeless and cringe to think about it being winter. I thought I would be such a good influence in his life but it doesn't matter what I think, do or say because ultimately he's got his own path to follow.
I recently attended an Al-Anon meeting where we discussed the slogans. One person read from a page that started with "Let It Begin With Me." For the first time in my life those words held a whole new meaning! If I begin to let it begin with me then I'll have to give to myself first before giving to anyone else. This is a foreign concept to me but it resonated loudly that if I could nurture myself the way I nurture everyone else I would get through this. I've had to hold on the the slogan "Let Go and Let God." I know He will handle everything and I'm exactly where I'm supposed to be in my life. I've got to continue with my own recovery process. I realize that I'm only in control of myself and no one else. But, I am just heartbroken about this person I love and having to let go. Simultaneously, I grow more resentful toward him everyday and that hurts both of us.
I'm so glad I found this site. Thank you for sharing because it helps me so much in the state of confusion I'm in.
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Old 12-09-2008, 02:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Alphawoman View Post
Thanks for your help. I'm happy I've got a place to share my thoughts and concerns.
Now, I must find my own courage to take care of me.
Alphawoman
Alphawoman, you may find this helpful - Sober Recovery. It's a modern parable about letting go.

While I know that losing all hope for your relationship is intensely painful and sad, in hindsight I think you'll come to see that it is also liberating. You have lost all hope that you will be able to live a happy life within the cage you have found yourself in. But the cage door is open; if you walk through it, who knows what you will find? Whatever it is, I guarantee you it'll be different from what you're living with now.

Take care,
Mr B.
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Old 12-09-2008, 05:21 AM
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Thank you Mr. B. Your kind words of encouragement are greatly needed and appreciated.
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Old 12-09-2008, 05:50 AM
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Hi Alphawoman,

Welcome to this site. These people are great and have really helped me with their advice and sharing. I do not have any great advice as I am right there with you. The only difference is I am married and have a five year old. I so badly wish I was strong enough to do what is right for me and my child. I like you think that if I show enough care and love, I can help him. I am finding with working on myself, this is not going to happen. The posters here are a wealth of information.

I would also like to say run, run, run from marriage. I don't in any way mean this to be negative. I just wish I would have ran. I always thought I could change him. His disease is getting progressively worse with the years. We have been married almost nine years. And I know it will be getting worse. I keep telling myself "get me through the holidays" and then I will make a move in some direction to get out of this mess. He has no idea. I have been detaching from him with love, but this is just driving me insane. He thinks since I don't fight him on this anymore, this means I am okay with all the drinking and drugging. WRONG! I grew up in a family of alcoholics and I swore I would never do this to my kids. Here I am doing exactly what I said I wouldn't. I really do plan on doing something come January.

Sorry for the long story, I just wanted to let you know you are not alone. Please keep coming back. We will all be here for you.:ghug

Chris
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