NeedHelp81

Ok. I'm sure most of you remember me from a month back or so....

Well, I have moved back in with my dad, Tyler with his brother.... I did what we are supposed to do and had no contact with him. Well this made things really awkward and drove him into a rage. After seeing me one night, and hearing a friend of mine say something about him (which wasn't even mean btw, he is sometimes delirious) he broke into my house (before I moved) and smashed everything AGAIN! But this time worse. I got home to discover my home in shambles and called the police. I filed a report, pictures were taken, I didn't press charges. I know, I know.... I thought that it would make things worse for me and really didn't want him to hurt (dont ask!). The officer was very nice and said that he would press charges right now and have him arrested on felony burglary and criminal mischief. He said he would only do this I would testify when time came. I said no.

Days went on, I picked up the pieces, I spoke with him a few times and said he would re-pay me for everything.

After awhile we started seeing eachother again (well, hanging out) and things went on and off and on and off....blah blah blah.

After that his brother (who is way more of an alchololic than T is) was being a typical A and being self-righteous T swung is hand and busted his bro's lip open causing him to receive 9 stitches. Long story short - Tyler was arrested a few days later for Assault.

Anyway, he has now developed a Crack/Coke habit - or let's say it has resurfaced. He had a mental breakdown in my car the other night with tears streaming down his face pleading for help. I thought this may be because he was drunk and he can get emotional but not like that. I have never seen him like that... ever. I picked him up the next day from work, and he was still saying the same things. He is finally reaching out for help - I am very happy for him that he is coming to this realization.

I told him I will not push him, but I will help him find the support he needs. I know that there is nothing I can do persay (sp?) but he has been somewhat suicidal (talking about it, wishing for death, etc ) and said that I am the only person that has believed in him that he can get help - that I am only the one that makes him want to live. I know this is bad, and it is alot of pressure on me you will ssay, and my codieness is back in full force! But I think that for this particular man, errr, boy - the detachment process is what will be his last days...

Stubborn1

The answer? Leave him alone and go live YOUR life and let him worry about his.
Yes you are codependant and an enabler.
Do both of you a favor.
If he dies.......there is nothing you can do.

NeedHelp81

There's nothing I can do?! Are you freaking kidding me! I get the whole Al-Anon thing but you people seem heartless. So driving him to his treatment center or driving him to get information is enabling?! That's codie behavior?! Seriously ..... that's messed up. You people have been so hurt by others that you choose to DETACH and care about no one but yourselves. That's how you make it sound with the "there's nothing you can do!" I know that I cannot tell him or make him or manipulate him into getting help. When he - when anyone - comes to me and there IS SOMETHING I CAN DO - I will help them. That's what people should do. God forbid I have an addiction and reach out for help! What if I didn't have the means, or the transportation, or the support?! I'd get MORE depressed and smoke some more frickin crack and hope for a goddamn heart attack.

LaTeeDa

Actually, I fell for the manipulation many, many times. The crying, pleading, "I can't do it without you" BS. The truth is, anyone who wants to get sober can. With or without your "help." It's quite convenient for an alcoholic/addict to put the pressure on you to "help" them get sober. That way, they have someone to blame when they go back to it.

It's not that I don't care about alcoholics/addicts. It's that I finally learned the lesson that life was teaching me. I am not that powerful..........

L

Stubborn1

Yup, it's a hard pill to swallow. I had the same reaction for many years until one day I said "holy crap! They are right". I still care very much for my childrens father and we are great friends. He respects me more today that I quit enabling then he ever did when I was helping so to speak. I made it easy for him to continue.
When an addict really really REALLY wants help he will find a way to get his own information no matter if he has to crawl there on his bloody knuckles. If it's easy then he has less of a chance to stay sober. He has to really want it. Otherwise......he'll relapse and just catch another ride with ya. Then repeat the cycle.
If it were as easy as you think this would not be a sickness. We would all just drive our addicts to AA and pick up information.
Hang in there and keep coming back. We'll be here.:praying

NeedHelp81

So then if they kill themselves - you just sit there and "know" you did the right thing? Have you ever heard of "not a classic case?" It is possible that someone can be that way with alcoholism/addiction. Not every one fits the same mold.

LaTeeDa

I will say it again. You are not that powerful. If he truly wants to kill himself, there is nothing you can do to stop him. If he wants to drink and drug, there is nothing you can do to stop him. If any of us had that much power, this board would not exist.

And, when he goes back to drinking and drugging, you will be his excuse. You didn't help enough, you weren't supportive enough. Been there, done that.

L

Stubborn1

If they kill themselves then they will do it away from you and you won't be there anyway. If they attempt it and you are there then isn't that only for your attention???

laurie6781

What a pile of ca ca!!!!!!

This is just more QUACKING and another form of MANIPULATION.

You cannot help him.

You cannot fix him, and

You cannot cure him.

What are you doing for YOU?

He has to get HIS OWN HELP. Hell, he can walk into any Salvation Army and tell them what he told you, and they will get him into one of their programs, and.......................IT'S FREE.

Yes, you are probably codependent, sure sounds like it. However, there is good news for you......................................instead of devoting all this time on him, find some Alanon meetings and start attending for you. Alanon is a great help. Alanon will not only help you to figure out what YOU want for YOUR future, it will help you work out ways to ACCOMPLISH your goals.

Please also find and read Melodie Beattie's "Co Dependent No More."

BTW, I should tell you that I have over 27 years sober and clean and over 24 years in Alanon. I speak from experience.

He needs to do ALL of this by himself for himself, including finding treatment and finding transportation to treatment. Not only will it show his commitment to the facility, but it will REAFFIRM his commitment to HIMSELF.

J M H O

Please keep posting and let us know how YOU are doing, we do care very much.

Love and hugs,

Pajarito

What I'd like to see is a thread posted by you that says: "I have hit bottom- now what?"

There is nothing you can do for him- nothing- to help him get sober. He is an adult. He can find a ride if he needs to, stop himself from smashing things up, stop himself from breaking into your place, walk into a treatment center BY HIMSELF. That does not mean you don't support him- from the sidelines. As long as you "help" him and soften the blow of his bad behavior, he will continue to do what he wants. He hasn't hit bottom- IMHO. Not even close.

If all my love and all my "help" could have saved my STBXAH I would indeed be a very powerful person. No one has that power except the addict. Good luck to you.

HopeandPrayer

Needhelp, I don't think anyone is suggesting you become heartless.

After seeing me one night, and hearing a friend of mine say something about him (which wasn't even mean btw, he is sometimes delirious) he broke into my house (before I moved) and smashed everything AGAIN! But this time worse. I got home to discover my home in shambles and called the police. I filed a report, pictures were taken, I didn't press charges. I know, I know.... I thought that it would make things worse for me and really didn't want him to hurt (dont ask!). The officer was very nice and said that he would press charges right now and have him arrested on felony burglary and criminal mischief. He said he would only do this I would testify when time came. I said no.

Reread what you wrote above and this part,


After that his brother (who is way more of an alchololic than T is) was being a typical A and being self-righteous T swung is hand and busted his bro's lip open causing him to receive 9 stitches. Long story short - Tyler was arrested a few days later for Assault.

This man sounds extremely violent when he doesn't get what he wants.
Right now you are giving him what he wants but what happens when you can't follow thru with helping him because of other committments you have, what will be his behavior then. That is what, IMHO, people are trying to get you to think about. They want YOU to be SAFE. There is nothing wrong with doing what you think is the next right thing, just don't forget previous violent behavior because at this time he sounds sincere.

Alcoholics are nortorious for saying or doing what they know you want to hear or see, just so they can continue their behavior. They want someone else to shoulder the burden, and no matter how much we love them, We Can't Love Them Sober. I have learned that with my youngest son. It wasn't until I let him fall on his own, take whatever consequences he faced with his addiction, did he finally, so far, GET IT and become sober (135 days now). He knows I will support him as long as he stays clean but if he relapses he also knows he is on his own. That doesn't make me cold or heartless, it just means I am turning it over to mine and his HP to help him thru this.

Take what you can use and leave the rest.
Barb

GiveLove

There isn't a cold/heartless soul on this whole board. If they were, they wouldn't be here.

What there ARE are a lot of people who have been handed the bullsh*t you're being handed by your violent, abusive, self-pitying BF and have lived through it, just to have it happen again and again.

And what there ARE are people who are trying to not have that happen to you. So the next time he "swings his hand" it won't be breaking your face.

Do what you feel you must, for your own peace of mind. There's nothing wrong with handing him a list of treatment facilities (my bet is that he'll do absolutely nothing with it) That's kind, and it's all you can do. You can't make him go, and you can't make him sober. AND you can't take responsibility for him refusing to get off his butt and get the help he needs.

But know that he's nowhere near bottom, he's just telling you what you want most to hear, so you'll stay. Sorry if that's not what you were hoping to hear, but we don't play that game here -- we actually care about you. If only you cared about yourself as much :ghug

NeedHelp81

What am I do for myself? Plenty. i work full-time am enrolled in school full-time making MY future.

The things I wrote about what he did (hitting his bro - which brothers do all the time A or not) breaking into my house, smashing everything, so on is so you can see what he has realized and why he has hit HIS bottom. He looked at me the other day and told me he "hit bottom." I suppose I should not listen to him when he vents, and brainstorms, and realizes. Him saying it outloud to someone as a witness is making it stay in his head. He knows what he said, and he knows it's the truth. I will NOT force him into anything. He knows this. I will not put up with his crappy behavior. He knows this as well.

It seems like everytime I come on here it's to bash what ever I am saying. I came here to ask what the next step is when someone actually wants help. Not what I am doing WRONG and so on.

And you people with the suicide stuff - wow.

NeedHelp81

Ok then. WHY IS IT SO HARD TO BELIEVE THAT HE REALLY HAS HIT BOTTOM?! Why is "he's lying to you" "don't believe him" - how do you know? Yes you have all dealt with A's and I respect HELPFUL replies, but why am I not supposed to believe someone who is crying and reaching out for help!?

LaTeeDa

The next step is to watch. He knows the right words to say. He's got you convinced. But, it's not about words, it's about actions. Anyone can talk the talk. Very few actually walk the walk. Believe actions, not words.

Alcoholics lie. It's part of the disease. If he actually DOES something toward getting sober, then I would believe him. Until then, it's just quacking.

L

Pajarito

Excellent.

Sorry- not normal. I have 4 brothers- they have never hit each other- ever.

Talk is cheap.

There are many forms of enabling/controlling- one is standing by while a person smashes everything in his path.

I think we are jumping on this thread, because we've been where you are- too many times. It stirs up emotion in us. . . at least it does for me. I am concerned that you are going to be next when T raises his fist. You will do what you want to, but I hope-at the very least- you will protect yourself. You simply cannot do for him what he alone can and must do for himself. He has to really WANT to get help. If he puts his words into action- great. . . so far I'm not seeing that in any of your posts.

tormented22267

I too thought mine was 'not the classic case'. But, I tell you what, everything you wrote in these next 2 paragraphs, I HONESTLY could have written myself:

Two years ago, I had almost the exact same experience, except the mental breakdown was at my house, not in a car. Seriously. My XABF cried, was more emotional than I had every seen him, told me I was the only one that ever believed in him and the only one who made him want to live.

I made so many phone calls, called treatment centers, got him literature, downloaded information from the internet, drove him to AA. I was SO happy that he was finally wanting help!!

Two weeks later, he was choking me because I was kicking him out of my house after being on a 3 day drunk.

Two years later - he's still drinking. He's still telling me I'm the only one that can help him, that makes him want to live, that believes in him. Two years later HE is still exactly the same (well, maybe a little worse).

I, however, am changing. I now refuse to 'help' him. It's a hard pill to swallow, but it IS true. IF HE wants help, HE will get it. Unfortunately, there is nothing I can do.

BTW, I am not heartless. I still love him. I would still be devastated if anything bad happened to him. However, I love ME more - and now know, from the bottom of my heart, that only he can help himself.

HopeandPrayer

When HE picks up the phone book and starts calling places for help, When HE actually goes to an appointment to help HIS addiction, When HE actively seeks out and attends AA meetings then maybe I would start believing him. But always keep in mind THEY have to want to do this for them, not for you or just to get out of trouble.

As codependents, it is always hard to let them be the one to make the decisions about their lives. We can still love them and yet set boundaries as to what we will accept in our lives when it comes to the drama they bring with them.

That is what people mean by detaching with love. Love them enough to make their own choices and face to consequences of the choices on their own.
Barb

NeedHelp81

He is attending AA meetings. No he his not clean. But he knows to take it one day at a time. One step at a time. One drink at a time. He has vowed that today he will be sober. I know you're laughing, but that is a big step for him. I don't know if this is a good thing because when I saw him yesterday he obviously hadn't drank (he had just got off work) but was shaking soooo bad. Shouldn't he be doing this with detox? Not HIS way?

Barbara52

If they are serious, they find someplace to get treatment. If they aren't, they don't.

What has he done about finding treatment since he hit bottom? WHat has changed other than the statement?


Over the years I have come to view suicide as the ultimate selfish act.

I have kown folks who committed suicide. It was tragic. It made me sad. But it was that person's choice, as bad a choice as could be IMO but their choice nonetheless. One they took regardless of what anyone said or did, regardless of them being in treatment for their problems.