I'm so hesitant to post this...
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: smalltown, MS
Posts: 40
I'm so hesitant to post this...
Please don't "flame" me..
I've been in a relationship with my boyfriend for over 2 years. He went to treatment for 90 days over a year ago and has been clean and sober for that long
He works a strong recovery program. Still goes to at least 5 meetings a week.
He was married when we first started seeing each other. How it started was wrong..we both realize and have accepted that. We caused a lot of heartache to a lot of people and we are both very sorry. I could go on and on with the "reasons" it started but it would seem like making excuses and there are no excuses.
It happened and we have and will continue to deal with the consequences of that. We love each other very much.
He's been divorced for over 4 months. We've always maintained pretty steady contact by telephone but have gone long periods of not seeing each other at different periods of time. After the divorce (and subsequent physical confrontation and attack on me, by his exwife), he was so devastated by his kids' rejection that he was afraid that he would lose them forever if they found out we were physically together...anyway...
I finally told him that I wouldn't allow myself to be in a relationship with someone who wouldn't be with me. Told him I want a healthy relationship and that not spending time together like normal human beings was definitely not healthy. We didn't speak for a week and he finally called and asked if he could come over and talk.
He talked and talked and told me he would do anything to make "us" work. He has his own place, I have mine but since that talk, every day after work, he comes over, we talk, cook, eat together, watch tv, then most nights around bedtime, he goes home. We go to the grocery store every weekend
Life is really good...for the most part. I still have things I'm working on myself.. The trust issues because of the lying while he was drinking and drugging...the fact that I didn't know all the stuff he lied about until after the fact. The guilt over how our relationship started.. The nature of our relationship made me feel like such a horrible person and I am still working through that.
Anyway...He insists he wants to be with me forever; that he loves me more every day, that he wants us to eventually live together...
Here are some of my questions/concerns..When I ask him how he plans on telling his mother and kids that we are going to live together, he says "I don't know." He will not get any more specific about our future than "I love you and want to be with you forever."
We are still not spending time "out in public" other than grocery shopping at our little mom and pop grocery store and a quick run to the dollar store. I feel like he's worried that someone in our small town will see us or his ex wife will show up and cause another scene. He insists that is not the case, that he is not worried about anyone else, he's just uncomfortable in public places (I know that is, at least partially, true). I am still invisible as far as his kids and mother are concerned. I asked him if he talked to his mother about "us" and he said no..that she has already stated that she would never acknowledge or accept our relationship so he feels it would be "rubbing her face in it" if he brings it up.
He says he thinks about us and our future all the time...I don't understand why he can't/won't talk about it. It makes me feel very insecure. He says to watch his actions to make sure they match his words... Well... what actions should I be watching for?
I spent so long making excuses for his behavior because he was married and then because he's an addict that sometimes it's still hard for me to know when I'm making excuses or if I have unrealistic expectations. Is this an alcoholic issue or is it a relationship issue or both or neither? Some days I feel so good and some days I still feel crazy.
Thanks for listening..
I've been in a relationship with my boyfriend for over 2 years. He went to treatment for 90 days over a year ago and has been clean and sober for that long
He works a strong recovery program. Still goes to at least 5 meetings a week. He was married when we first started seeing each other. How it started was wrong..we both realize and have accepted that. We caused a lot of heartache to a lot of people and we are both very sorry. I could go on and on with the "reasons" it started but it would seem like making excuses and there are no excuses.
It happened and we have and will continue to deal with the consequences of that. We love each other very much.
He's been divorced for over 4 months. We've always maintained pretty steady contact by telephone but have gone long periods of not seeing each other at different periods of time. After the divorce (and subsequent physical confrontation and attack on me, by his exwife), he was so devastated by his kids' rejection that he was afraid that he would lose them forever if they found out we were physically together...anyway...
I finally told him that I wouldn't allow myself to be in a relationship with someone who wouldn't be with me. Told him I want a healthy relationship and that not spending time together like normal human beings was definitely not healthy. We didn't speak for a week and he finally called and asked if he could come over and talk.
He talked and talked and told me he would do anything to make "us" work. He has his own place, I have mine but since that talk, every day after work, he comes over, we talk, cook, eat together, watch tv, then most nights around bedtime, he goes home. We go to the grocery store every weekend
Life is really good...for the most part. I still have things I'm working on myself.. The trust issues because of the lying while he was drinking and drugging...the fact that I didn't know all the stuff he lied about until after the fact. The guilt over how our relationship started.. The nature of our relationship made me feel like such a horrible person and I am still working through that.
Anyway...He insists he wants to be with me forever; that he loves me more every day, that he wants us to eventually live together...
Here are some of my questions/concerns..When I ask him how he plans on telling his mother and kids that we are going to live together, he says "I don't know." He will not get any more specific about our future than "I love you and want to be with you forever."
We are still not spending time "out in public" other than grocery shopping at our little mom and pop grocery store and a quick run to the dollar store. I feel like he's worried that someone in our small town will see us or his ex wife will show up and cause another scene. He insists that is not the case, that he is not worried about anyone else, he's just uncomfortable in public places (I know that is, at least partially, true). I am still invisible as far as his kids and mother are concerned. I asked him if he talked to his mother about "us" and he said no..that she has already stated that she would never acknowledge or accept our relationship so he feels it would be "rubbing her face in it" if he brings it up.
He says he thinks about us and our future all the time...I don't understand why he can't/won't talk about it. It makes me feel very insecure. He says to watch his actions to make sure they match his words... Well... what actions should I be watching for?
I spent so long making excuses for his behavior because he was married and then because he's an addict that sometimes it's still hard for me to know when I'm making excuses or if I have unrealistic expectations. Is this an alcoholic issue or is it a relationship issue or both or neither? Some days I feel so good and some days I still feel crazy.
Thanks for listening..
Member
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 4,290
Well, I'd have to say its definitely a relationship issue. Whether its an alcoholism issue, I don't know.
I do know that for me if there was a possibility that a relationship with a man had a chance of harming my relatiohsip with my sons, I'd say good by to the man. My sons will always be my sons. I have learned men come and go.
I also know for me, if I were in a relationship with a man and he wouldn't bring me into his family circle, I'd have some real big doubts about the future of that relationship. Its a red flag for me in a number of ways. He'd be showing me disrespect. He'd be possibly showing that honesty in relationships with his family wasn't there. All sorts of things.
I do know that for me if there was a possibility that a relationship with a man had a chance of harming my relatiohsip with my sons, I'd say good by to the man. My sons will always be my sons. I have learned men come and go.
I also know for me, if I were in a relationship with a man and he wouldn't bring me into his family circle, I'd have some real big doubts about the future of that relationship. Its a red flag for me in a number of ways. He'd be showing me disrespect. He'd be possibly showing that honesty in relationships with his family wasn't there. All sorts of things.
the girl can't help it
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: splendraville
Posts: 5,599
Originally Posted by DMPA
I am still invisible as far as his kids and mother are concerned. I asked him if he talked to his mother about "us" and he said no..that she has already stated that she would never acknowledge or accept our relationship so he feels it would be "rubbing her face in it" if he brings it up.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 215
DMPA - Your story is so similar to mine its almost eery. He finally did get comfortable going public with the relationship and telling his family...and 5 years later we are married but he has frequent major issues with guilt. So much so that it interferes with him enjoying his new life. SO be very careful.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 902
Sorry you are so confused. I'm not sure if this helps, but I'll give it a try...
I dated someone who was separated but not divorced, so the story is already a bit different BUT....he was very concerned that someone outside of our circle of mutual friends would see us out, so our movements were limited. This really bothered me and he knew it. I was also non-existent to his family. They knew he was seeing someone because his son, who was 2 at the time, would run around and say his version of my name. It got worse when he figured out how to say my name because the mother though of me as nothing but a hooker, only she put it in worse term. I realized at some point that he would not do anything about this until he was ready, so I accepted it, until he dumped me to go back to his wife.
It could also be that he's an A. They tend to ber very selfish whether they are sober or not, so no matter how much he loves you, if he wants to keep this under wraps unitl he can face himself better.
I know this is a bummer, but you'll get through it. Do you really want to be the "secret lover" for the rest of your life?
I dated someone who was separated but not divorced, so the story is already a bit different BUT....he was very concerned that someone outside of our circle of mutual friends would see us out, so our movements were limited. This really bothered me and he knew it. I was also non-existent to his family. They knew he was seeing someone because his son, who was 2 at the time, would run around and say his version of my name. It got worse when he figured out how to say my name because the mother though of me as nothing but a hooker, only she put it in worse term. I realized at some point that he would not do anything about this until he was ready, so I accepted it, until he dumped me to go back to his wife.
It could also be that he's an A. They tend to ber very selfish whether they are sober or not, so no matter how much he loves you, if he wants to keep this under wraps unitl he can face himself better.
I know this is a bummer, but you'll get through it. Do you really want to be the "secret lover" for the rest of your life?
get it, give it, grow in it
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Calif coast
Posts: 3,167
In my opinion:
His top concern right now should be his kids. It should also be trying to mend/ make amends to the mother of his kids so they can co-parent their kids in the healthiest way possible as divorced people. These kids have lived with an addict father and now divorce. They should not be exposed at this time, to the woman who will be perceived as breaking up their family. As a dad, husband, addict he had been making poor choices.
As part of his recovery, it sounds like he is learning to put others before himself and make better choices. It is not all about him or alll about you. It is about those kids so the cycle of addiction can be addressed.
He can't make you feel insecure, only you can do that for yourself.
Have a busy productive life in your own right. Maybe playing house with an unavailable man is not your best move. Even tho he is divorced - his recovey and family have to take a priority.
Back off, give him time to be a fully functioning man + father, or he will just bring all his baggage into your relationship.
If you are going to be with him in the future it mightwork if you both take the time to get healthy and happy lives independent of one another.
His top concern right now should be his kids. It should also be trying to mend/ make amends to the mother of his kids so they can co-parent their kids in the healthiest way possible as divorced people. These kids have lived with an addict father and now divorce. They should not be exposed at this time, to the woman who will be perceived as breaking up their family. As a dad, husband, addict he had been making poor choices.
As part of his recovery, it sounds like he is learning to put others before himself and make better choices. It is not all about him or alll about you. It is about those kids so the cycle of addiction can be addressed.
He can't make you feel insecure, only you can do that for yourself.
Have a busy productive life in your own right. Maybe playing house with an unavailable man is not your best move. Even tho he is divorced - his recovey and family have to take a priority.
Back off, give him time to be a fully functioning man + father, or he will just bring all his baggage into your relationship.
If you are going to be with him in the future it mightwork if you both take the time to get healthy and happy lives independent of one another.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: behind the viewfinder...
Posts: 6,278
If I were in your position, I would be asking myself a lot of questions.
First of all, you've been in a relationship with him for 2 years, but he has only been divorced 4 months. That means for 20 months he was in essence living a "double life." This would tell me that he not only has problems with committment, but has trouble making decisions. And, if he was able to do this while married to someone else, he could do it with you, too.
Secondly, his current actions are reinforcing the above conclusions, which I admit I came to based only on what you have shared.
Thirdly, for me it would be a mistake to get into a serious relationship so soon after ending a previous one. (or, in this case, getting into another relationship while still in the previous one) This says to me that he is probably needy and not really comfortable enough with himself to face being without a partner for any period of time.
All the above are big red flags to me, and I would not want to be in a relationship with someone who has these issues.
Please don't misinterpret these observations as being about you. They are not. I am pointing out aspects of his behavior that would make me take a serious look at whether I would want him as a partner. IMHO, you deserve much better.
L
First of all, you've been in a relationship with him for 2 years, but he has only been divorced 4 months. That means for 20 months he was in essence living a "double life." This would tell me that he not only has problems with committment, but has trouble making decisions. And, if he was able to do this while married to someone else, he could do it with you, too.
Secondly, his current actions are reinforcing the above conclusions, which I admit I came to based only on what you have shared.
Thirdly, for me it would be a mistake to get into a serious relationship so soon after ending a previous one. (or, in this case, getting into another relationship while still in the previous one) This says to me that he is probably needy and not really comfortable enough with himself to face being without a partner for any period of time.
All the above are big red flags to me, and I would not want to be in a relationship with someone who has these issues.
Please don't misinterpret these observations as being about you. They are not. I am pointing out aspects of his behavior that would make me take a serious look at whether I would want him as a partner. IMHO, you deserve much better.
L
Wipe your paws elsewhere!
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 3,672
His words say "I want to be with you." His actions say "I prefer you to be invisible."
Do you enjoy being invisible? Keep in mind that this is a man who left his wife for another woman. People tend to repeat past behaviors. So when he was with his wife he was a drunk who cheated on his partner. Take away the alcohol and you still have a man who cheated on his partner.
When the bloom is off the rose, and you remove those rose-colored glasses can you trust a man who cheats on his partners to be your life partner?
I think you know the answer to these questions; and that's what led you here.
Do you enjoy being invisible? Keep in mind that this is a man who left his wife for another woman. People tend to repeat past behaviors. So when he was with his wife he was a drunk who cheated on his partner. Take away the alcohol and you still have a man who cheated on his partner.
When the bloom is off the rose, and you remove those rose-colored glasses can you trust a man who cheats on his partners to be your life partner?
I think you know the answer to these questions; and that's what led you here.
((((FD))))Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 35
If there is one thing that I have learnt and that is to believe behaviour not words. You are with a man that cheated on his wife when he was not sober. If he should ever relapse again chances are he will do all the same behaviours again. Is the relationship you are in making you happy or do you want him to change? Off the topic... I was reflecting on Maslow's hierarchy of needs and realised that not many of those get met in a relationship with an alcoholic or addict.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 5,075
I'm still not divorced and AH has had a girlfriend for over 2 years. god only knows what he tells her. I was privy to his emails at the beginning/end and he did tell his best friend she was convenient.
You say you love each other very much. This is how he, then, defines love. Can you live with it?
You say you love each other very much. This is how he, then, defines love. Can you live with it?
Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: The Jungle
Posts: 5,435
First let me say that I'm not going to flame you.
Second....well....you're in a bit of a pickle. It is always easier for others to recognize the red flags than it is for the person smack dab in the middle of the relationship. There are emotions involved for you....there are no emotions involved with those responding to your post. They see things that are clearly black and white but due to the emotional involvement, you see multi-shades of gray.
If there are two things that will make a person NUTS, it is divorce and addiction. A person just out of a divorce is broken and needs time to heal from that relationship. A person in early recovery from addiction is broken and needs time to heal as well. This doesn't mean that we feel sorry for that person.....it just means that they need time to heal and adjust to some major life changes.
Others here (and you as well) have pointed out the many hurdles you have to overcome and the red flags that are waiving. Only you can decide if you are willing to wait it out and continue to deal with a less than satisfying relationship for X period of time......with the possibility that the wait may be for nothing or it may result in a lovely relationship. Who knows.
Only you can make that decision.
gentle hugs
Second....well....you're in a bit of a pickle. It is always easier for others to recognize the red flags than it is for the person smack dab in the middle of the relationship. There are emotions involved for you....there are no emotions involved with those responding to your post. They see things that are clearly black and white but due to the emotional involvement, you see multi-shades of gray.
If there are two things that will make a person NUTS, it is divorce and addiction. A person just out of a divorce is broken and needs time to heal from that relationship. A person in early recovery from addiction is broken and needs time to heal as well. This doesn't mean that we feel sorry for that person.....it just means that they need time to heal and adjust to some major life changes.
Others here (and you as well) have pointed out the many hurdles you have to overcome and the red flags that are waiving. Only you can decide if you are willing to wait it out and continue to deal with a less than satisfying relationship for X period of time......with the possibility that the wait may be for nothing or it may result in a lovely relationship. Who knows.
Only you can make that decision.
gentle hugs
Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: OHIO
Posts: 959
The best predictor of the future is what was done in the past. For you being the OW has got to be mind shattering. He hurt his entire family by what the two of you have already done. He has alot to come to terms with and so do you. His family (mother) may never respect you for the role that you played in the destruction of her sons family. She will forgive her son but may not you. You need to be prepared for this. A 20 month affair is not something to be proud of even if you feel that you love this man. With his newly found sobriety he is in touch with his feelings again and thats something that he self medicated to prevent. Like the others have already said he has alot of wreckage to clean up before he is able to be in a healthy relationship again. You need to cut this man loose so he can find himself and stand on his own with all the feelings that he needs to deal with without any intervention from you. And besides I think you are selling yourself short. You deserve better than this.....this isn't how you want to be remembered by his children and grandchildren as being the "other woman" or the "homewrecker".....YOU are worth more than this title - much much more. Good Luck to you.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 141
I am not going to flame you, DMPA. People in glass houses, and all that.
I do have some questions for you, though. These are all ones that I asked myself in the past that helped me get some clarity.
What are your expectations of an intimate relationship?
Interesting that he told you to watch his actions rather than listen to his words. What do you think his actions are saying?
Does he propose to be with you forever simply by maintaining the status quo?
Do you think you can resove your trust issues given that he has already proved himself to be someone how is capable of cheating?
People do what works, hon. I would imagine that a bit of earache from you is small beer (pardon the pun) compared to growing some and dealing with the sitation in which he has found himself.
Equally, you seem to be trying to make a sow's purse out of a pig's ear. He knows what you would like, but is unwilling to do anything about it. The ball is in your court.
I do have some questions for you, though. These are all ones that I asked myself in the past that helped me get some clarity.
What are your expectations of an intimate relationship?
Interesting that he told you to watch his actions rather than listen to his words. What do you think his actions are saying?
Does he propose to be with you forever simply by maintaining the status quo?
Do you think you can resove your trust issues given that he has already proved himself to be someone how is capable of cheating?
People do what works, hon. I would imagine that a bit of earache from you is small beer (pardon the pun) compared to growing some and dealing with the sitation in which he has found himself.
Equally, you seem to be trying to make a sow's purse out of a pig's ear. He knows what you would like, but is unwilling to do anything about it. The ball is in your court.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 225
I believe that I will "flame" this. Life, marriage, relationships, etc. are hard enough. You walked into a complicated situation willfully. You are surprised that the situation remains complicated?
Better luck next time. Make better choices. Try to hurt fewer people, too.
If someone told me that they had to choose between a relationship with me or their children, it would be obvious what I should do. Get some perspective. Love ends sometimes, and I honestly doubt that there is a better reason for it to end than that.
Better luck next time. Make better choices. Try to hurt fewer people, too.
If someone told me that they had to choose between a relationship with me or their children, it would be obvious what I should do. Get some perspective. Love ends sometimes, and I honestly doubt that there is a better reason for it to end than that.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Stumbling toward happiness
Posts: 4,706
DMPA,
I'm so sorry for what you're going through.
I could say so much, but I won't. I'll just offer this: if you would like to talk to a woman who has been through a nearly identical situation -- including being hidden, being part of infidelity, double lives, alcoholism/drug abuse, and all of the confusion that goes with it -- please feel free to PM me. My relationship lasted for several years.
And oh, by the way: I promise not to flame you or anything like that. I'm a pretty gentle soul I just see you saying many of the things I said, hearing many of the things I heard, and I understand how it all feels. If you are going to proceed with this relationship, you should learn about the different twists and turns things can take, so you'll be ready to protect your happiness no matter what choices he makes for HIMself.
I'm so sorry for what you're going through.
I could say so much, but I won't. I'll just offer this: if you would like to talk to a woman who has been through a nearly identical situation -- including being hidden, being part of infidelity, double lives, alcoholism/drug abuse, and all of the confusion that goes with it -- please feel free to PM me. My relationship lasted for several years.
And oh, by the way: I promise not to flame you or anything like that. I'm a pretty gentle soul
I just see you saying many of the things I said, hearing many of the things I heard, and I understand how it all feels. If you are going to proceed with this relationship, you should learn about the different twists and turns things can take, so you'll be ready to protect your happiness no matter what choices he makes for HIMself.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 2,126
DMPA ---
There was only one statement of yours I wanted to respond to, but before I get to it I'd like to comment on a couple of others' comments, very briefly....
"...It could also be that he's an A. They tend to ber very selfish whether they are sober or not..."
I've read this, or similar feelings on the 'friends and family' forums, and have heard it from others, but ..... this is really a huge generalization, and extremely prejudicial.....and from my experience, on both sides of the problem, it's not really true....at least I've not found a higher percentgage of selfish A's than I have found selfish people, period......we seem to be reliving the 'me' generation.....but me, and many of my recovered friends, we are NOT selfish.....not now that we've put the addictions behind us, and have found a better way of life.....there are some of us out there..... (o:
anvilhead said, "...now that he's divorced and thus a free man, but others "disapprove" he wants to keep it on the low down..."
This isn't so much a comment as a grammatical/socio-cultural/verbiage thang.....I have been known as a bit of an 'editor' -- lol (been doing it since I was 12 and started off reading galley-proofs for Western Journal of Medicine).....but I digress.....I believe what you meant, anvilhead, was he wants to keep it on the down-low (hidden) and not low down (inside facts) ..... (o:
...and now to the line in your original post that stood out to me....:
"...He says to watch his actions to make sure they match his words... Well... what actions should I be watching for?..."
someone responded, "...Interesting that he told you to watch his actions rather than listen to his words. What do you think his actions are saying?..."
Which actions should you be looking for? What are his actions saying? Heck!! I don't see any actions matching any of his words.....hmmmmm just a passing observation.....something to think about.....
No matter what you decide to do.....be sure to be happy with yourself..... (o:
NoelleR
There was only one statement of yours I wanted to respond to, but before I get to it I'd like to comment on a couple of others' comments, very briefly....
"...It could also be that he's an A. They tend to ber very selfish whether they are sober or not..."
I've read this, or similar feelings on the 'friends and family' forums, and have heard it from others, but ..... this is really a huge generalization, and extremely prejudicial.....and from my experience, on both sides of the problem, it's not really true....at least I've not found a higher percentgage of selfish A's than I have found selfish people, period......we seem to be reliving the 'me' generation.....but me, and many of my recovered friends, we are NOT selfish.....not now that we've put the addictions behind us, and have found a better way of life.....there are some of us out there..... (o:
anvilhead said, "...now that he's divorced and thus a free man, but others "disapprove" he wants to keep it on the low down..."
This isn't so much a comment as a grammatical/socio-cultural/verbiage thang.....I have been known as a bit of an 'editor' -- lol (been doing it since I was 12 and started off reading galley-proofs for Western Journal of Medicine).....but I digress.....I believe what you meant, anvilhead, was he wants to keep it on the down-low (hidden) and not low down (inside facts) ..... (o:
...and now to the line in your original post that stood out to me....:
"...He says to watch his actions to make sure they match his words... Well... what actions should I be watching for?..."
someone responded, "...Interesting that he told you to watch his actions rather than listen to his words. What do you think his actions are saying?..."
Which actions should you be looking for? What are his actions saying? Heck!! I don't see any actions matching any of his words.....hmmmmm just a passing observation.....something to think about.....
No matter what you decide to do.....be sure to be happy with yourself..... (o:
NoelleR
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
