ccirider

Peace.

Having read through some of the threads here, I feel as though a reminder is in order for all of us that our focus should not be upon the A's insanity, but rather upon our own. Comments such as, What a selfish piece of crap!!!! or I had to get one little jab in.......................... are inappropriate comments, IMHO. If I were to go to an Al-Anon meeting where such comments were condoned or encouraged, I would not go back. For me, it is analogous to someone showing up at an AA meeting with a bottle of vodka.

I have no problem with people talking about the A's in their lives and how they relate to them. That is what we are here for. We are here to learn healthy ways of relating to the A's in our lives, whether we choose to live with them or not. A woman at a recent Al-Anon meeting mentioned to the group how she behaved towards her AS and said that she felt bad about herself because something was coming out of her that she didn't like. She is in Al-Anon, not because of the character defects that she sees in her son, but rather because of the character defects she sees in herself.

BohemiMamaof3

That is a really good point, Ccirider. I know it's hard for many people because the pain and situations they are going through are so new and raw. When you take a step back, and then are working on your own issues and a little time passes, it seems like you can have a more realistic view of yourself and a more compassionate view of your A-loved one. I guess I said all that to say to some of you who are really hurting and angry, that it will get better in time, as you detach and work on yourself. But thank you for that reminder, I think we can poisen ourselves with our own bitterness if we're not careful, well at least that's how I can be.

Mair

I agree with you cc to some extent Ive learnt in time not to go down the road of cursing the a in my life, he may have done some terrible things to me, but at the end of the day he is a very ill man. But when your codependant this is the trait that we have, we help and then we get angry when they dont listen, when you learn about codependancy you learn not to help them till your asked and then you decide whether you should or shouldnt. Its a learning process that took me a long time to understand and for the people here who are early on in their recovery it's a process that they too will get to understand.

Mair xx

justjo

Yes I think as we grow and learn more about addiction, we start reasoning with ourselves and accept that we cant change it. It is a natural response to be resentful when you are co-dependent and blame them for the hurt you feel. As we start to take care of ourselves all the name calling soon becomes a thing of the past.

Lilyflower

I agree that it does little to help us progress along our path of recovery. That said, I would much rather people came onto this forum to vent rather than have a blazing row with their A. There can be different types of name calling to the A: just getting the frustration out of our system, so we can clear the fog in our mind and re focus, thus getting ourselves back on track with our recovery, OR plainly just wanting to blame an A for all the woes in our world.

The former can be productive and lead to personal growth, the latter is just directed anger and feeds our negativities.

Lily xxxxxxxx

CBrown

I have an uncle who served in Korea. I'm sure there were a lot of awful things that took place, but there is one incident that still haunts him. Recently he went through an awful patch, remembering it in his 70s. Anyway I remember how my dad told me about it.

"He did something terrible. I won't say what he did, but it's something he shouldn't have done." And that was it. From his tone I can tell it was awful, and my dad felt bad about it. He condemned the act, but he never said a bad word about my uncle.

I've badmouthed my XABF, probably for any possible reason you could come up with. To make me feel better about myself, in revenge, to stop me from thinking he was a wonderful guy, to break my commitment to him, to kill the love, whatever. Did it work? No. The only thing has really worked was time, staying away from him, sorting out the truth vs. fiction in my time with him in my life, and putting the focus back on me. Is my journey over? Heavens, no! But I like the direction I'm in, even if it's excruciatingly slow at times.

I guess we don't need extremes. I don't want to love him, and I don't want to hate him. I just want to accept what happened, learn, and move on. CCRider, you are right. R has/had a lot of bad qualities but he had good qualities too.

I'm going to keep thinking about this topic, as it is one I still wrestle with, and I thank you for creating the topic for self-growth.

ccirider

Hi BM:

I have found that to be the case with myself. When I was in the heat of the battle, it was hard for me to see how that was changing who I was as a person. I think it's somewhat analogous to what an alcoholic goes through as his disease progresses. He simply cannot see what is happening to himself. Similarly, I could not see how my codependency was changing who I was as a person, but my kids sure saw it clearly. I thought I was so right, yet I was so wrong.

ccirider

Hi LF:

I don't think that it's appropriate behavior to hurl insults at addicts/alkies, whether it's in their faces or behind their backs. If I lower myself to the level of the alcoholic, then I become like him, even if I am not drinking. I can't speak for all the other codies, but for me, allowing myself to descend to the level of the addict/alkie has been the most troubling thing about codependency. I am getting into the same hole he is in; the only difference is we are not sharing the same bottle of wine.

Recovery, for me, has been to learn new ways of responding to people who take the low road, whether they are alkies in my life, or people who flip me the bird on the freeway. It has to become a way of life for me, and that is why I have to constantly remind myself in order to break my bad habits.

As far as venting goes, I don't think that it's very healthy, but I think there may be exceptions to the rule. I had a buried resentment way, way down inside me that came up recently. It was a great feeling to bring that resentment up to the surface and get it out so that I could deal with it. I have since forgiven that person, and I continue to do so every day because I don't want to hang on to it. OTOH, I have had resentments that were just boiling inside me that I used to vent, but my venting only made me sicker. So is venting healthy or not? I guess I would say that depends on whether or not the resentment is buried deep down inside you or not.

ccirider

Hi CBrown:

Wow, that's tough. I would hate to have something in my past haunt me like that.

It sounds like you are heading in the right direction. Realizing that badmouthing doesn't work is a huge step forward.

You got it. Accept it, learn from it, and move on. When we get angry about what happened, it means that we are not accepting what happened. When we get angry at the alkies in our life, we are not accepting them the way they are. It was a big blow to my ego to realize that I truly am powerless over what happened and powerless over this person. Having said all of that, anger is part of the process that we go through. I don't remember all of the 5 stages of grief, but I do know that the first one is denial, and the second is anger, until we finally reach the final stage - acceptance.

Miss Pink

Your back, CC?

I thought you left SR..?

good_luck

Denial, Anger, Bargaining, Depression, Acceptance

Worth noting, one tends to bounce around the stages until they are done with them. It's not like they go exactly in order. I find myself going back to bargaining a lot, personally. (Magical thinking) It's good to keep this process in mind, and realize that you can't really skip a step.

It would be nice to just jump to acceptance, but I agree that isn't the way that it works. Gotta work through all the unpleasant ones first.

ccirider

Hi MissPink:

Whether I am back or not isn't what is important. What is important for us is to learn healthy ways of reacting to people, places, and things. I was lurking on the forum and didn't want to confront anybody directly. For that reason, I started this thread because I think that it's a good topic for growth. Having said all of that, I would have to be blind to not notice that the administration here does not welcome my presence.

Lilyflower

Thanks for responding directly to my post CC,

I'm having a struggle at the moment. I'm 'bouncing around' as someone said. I'm feeling resentment toward my abf again. I know the feelings are coming from within me. I can't explain why they are there. Abf hasn't been drinking and has been giving me lots of space. We are struggling financially at the moment and I keep feeling inside that it's his fault (he is off work ill at the moment and therefore income is low). I'm finding it hard because we are having to get by on the bare minimum, haven't done a food shop since before xmas, I've been eating 17p per pack noodles at work for dinner for weeks and there is never any spare cash, I feel so depressed by the whole situation. I know he will go back to work soon (has 2 weeks left on his medical note) and things will pick up again but I just feel so tired and fed up with having to constantly struggle. He cannot help being off work ill and this is no ones fault but it seems like my guts want someone to hold accountable. I'm finding it hard to do the 'acceptance' thing.

I'm having a bad week so far, been feeling very down since the weekend.

Lily xxxxxxxxxxx

best

What would be wrong with that?

People who drink show up looking for answers on how to stop all the time that is what AA is for.

At Al Anon... people show up looking for growth.
We are all at different stages in our growth.

I did better when I learned better and until such a time I was treated with love and respect...even though I didn't deserve it.
By example, not by correction, I learned a better way.

My actions in Life gave me this...

The people who loved me till I learned to love myself gave me this...

CBrown

There is one reaction that I get that I cannot put a label on. I get it when I hear about Britney Spears's latest daily breakdown. I get it when I hear my XABF's bought his 12th ring for the same wedding ceremony, or that the rats in his houseboat are taking over. It's not hate, anger, or love. My jaw drops, I think "oh my, it's happening yet again ...", and there's a little bit of sorrow in there too.

What do you call that? Amazement? Wonderment? Empathy? Maybe it's just my heart and soul wishing the person were in a better place. Maybe it's all that in one instance.

geees poncho

Its called shock. For sure its not analogous

HA HA HA

denny57

I think it's difficult for addicts (recovering or not) to understand where it is coming from.

Miss Pink

I guess thats a *yes*?

BohemiMamaof3

Click here
Oh Behave now!

nandm

Interesting perspective that somehow the alcoholic is lower than you. Does that include the recovering alcoholic? I can not justify the behavior of the active addict/alcoholic but I can say that they are sick but that does not mean anyone is better than them. To say one is better than someone else is to make a judgment regarding someone else. It is to assume that we know them, deep down inside, what they think, what they feel, who they can be, who they are, and their pain and struggles. Everyone struggles with something. The alcoholic/addict is no different. It does not make them less of a person. Ego is involved when judging someone else. Even the Bible says "judge not lest ye be judged." That is why I choose to stay away from believing I am superior to anyone else.