Alice Kate

How does a loving, caring, devoted guy when sober, turn in an obnoxious, self-centered, cocky jerk, that doesn't give a damn, when he is drinking? After all, he is not drinking all day every day. At night, every night I'm positive, but surely when he wakes up he is himself right? So how can he go from doing anything not to lose me a couple a weeks ago, to now having hit the alcohol hard again (as he was sober for 21/2 years) not care that it's over and not give it a second thought?

He has sober moments right ? So he must realized whats happened in those sober moments, yet he has done nothing about it - no contact at all. It's as if he has just accepted it's over, just like that. How does that happen out of the blue? He knows he can't drink and be with me, and he said himself he WANTS to drink right now. He needs to. Is that why, or has he suddenly just stopped loving me, despite the fact that he says he truely loves me, and is devastated at whats happened, and he feels completely dead inside. He also says he knows he can't live up to my standards (those being not drinking and smoking pot, because they make him a truly horrible to me). How come now it's so easy for him to just let me go! Yet I know for a fact if he wasn't drinking he would be fighting so hard for our relationship.

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated. It's so confusing.

prodigal

A.K., you are asking me why someone else is doing something. I'd like you to think about that for a second. Why does he suddenly not care? Why is he just walking away without what seems to be a second thought? He wants to have it both ways: keep you and keep using. He is doing what addicts do; namely, being self-serving, self-centered, and AS CHANGEABLE AS THE WEATHER.

Neither you, nor I, nor anyone else can make sense out of nonsense. I've been exposed to addicts my entire life and I quit driving myself crazy awhile back when I stopped my mind from wandering to the "why" section of an addict's brain.

I understand that you are hurt and confused. Believe me, we've all been there when we've been involved with an addict. If you think you're confused, imagine what a mess it is inside his head. I genuinely wish I could give you the answers you seek.

You're grieving a loss and it is natural to want to figure out just what happened. I don't know what happened. You don't know what happened. Heck, if he's doping and drinking, he probably doesn't even know what happened. Addiction is "cunning, baffling, powerful" and it blind-sides us at times.

Have you looked into attending Al-Anon? Do you have a support system of family and friends? I can only suggest what you can do in order to reach out for support and healing. I hope we can give you the support you seek here. Also, how about getting a copy of "Codependent No More" by Melodie Beattie. It's a great book, and it may help you to get insight into what's going on.

CBrown

Yup! You summed up an addict to a T! Well, I've only known one, but he sounds an awful lot like most of the addicts on here. They go Jekkyl/Hyde in a second and you never know who you're going to get. Does the booze mask who they are and the real person come out? Or does the booze anesthetize the real person? Or are all those parts the real person? I don't know but in my XABF's case he rotated through all the personalities and as time went on the nice one disappeared more and more. Chaos is definitely their middle name.

Barbara52

Choas. That's the word I would use to describe it all.

Alice Kate, I know how it hurts and understanding trying to find the reasons behind it. But my experience tells me its not worth the effort to understand the irrational. I drove myself crazy trying to understand why AH was (and is) choosing irrational over rational, how he could say the opposite when drunk and when sober, how he could throw away his relationships with me and his children. I came to understand that trying to apply logic and reason just didn't work. I came to understand that I couldn't change him in anyway whatsoever.

I learned to change my focus to myself where I can make a difference. I took the time to figure out what I wanted for my life, made plans to make that happen and am working on my own issues. As a result I am so much happier in my life because I no longer am banging my head on the wall trying to make my AH change or see reality.

Startingover2

It seems like that is the question I ask all the time but never have gotten an answer to.....There is a sticky above with this in it but I will copy it for you...

http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ddicts-do.html

I put a copy on my bathroom mirror. It reminds me daily that until they get help there is no way he can love you completely.

denny57

Alice Kate you are lucky, because you live in L.A., like me. There are at least 100 Al-Anon meetings to choose from in the area.

A great book to read is "Under the Influence."

Miss Pink

its not the alcohol that makes them into hateful, angry, thoughtless, self centered jerks.

Its the alcoholism.

Disease...not chemical.
Drinking is but ONE symtpom.....all the others are there whether they are drinking or dry.

Alcoholism....the disease.

geees poncho

Instant, JERK, JACKASS, CREEP, CON, IDIOT, FOOL, Just Add Alcohol

CBrown

"its not the alcohol that makes them into hateful, angry, thoughtless, self centered jerks."

I have to say, I'm buying into this theory more and more. I don't know whether they use the booze to kill the guilt of being such a person, or if they use in order to free the inhibitions and be the schmuck they always wanted to be or what.

I could ponder this one all day and never come up with the answer. All I know is that I will not subject myself and my family to such a person. I want to be a helpful, moral, positive, uplifting person. And I also choose to surround myself with such people, too. That's why I could never sign up for living in a rotten marina with R and his friends - doing unspeakable acts to themselves and others. Sorry, no deal.

nandm

You pose some very good and legitimate questions. Unfortunately, I don't believe they are questions that anyone even the alcoholic can answer in a definative way.

I hope you do not mind my replying to your post. I read the posts in this section as it reminds me of the damage I could continue to do if I stop working on my recovery and it also helps me deal with the alcoholics in my life. I am a recovering alcoholic, in a long term relationship with another recoverying alcoholic, with children who have fought with drug addiction and alcoholism.

I know that when I was drinking I never knew who I was going to be from one minute to the next whether it was going to be Dr. Jekyl or You Better Run and Hyde. Which was the real person? In retrospect probably some of both. Alcoholism is a miserable disease for everyone involved. It not only takes takes the alcoholic down but everyone close to him. The self hate, fear, regret, resentment, control issues are all things that run rampant in the alcoholics mind while drinking. You wonder why even though he may have "sober" moments he doesn't reach out and try to make things right. The only answer that I can give is when alcohol enters my body a part of my spirit changes, I become someone I hate. When I wasn't drinking my mind was on the shame, resentment, and worry about when and where I would get my next drink to try and make it all go away. I could not see past that to how someone else was feeling around me. The shame would not allow me to reach out to try and fix things with others. It is only through a "few days" of sobriety that I have been able to develop an understanding of the damage and pain I caused those closest to me.

You have recieved some wonderful advice from posters on this thread. They are absolutetly correct, don't take his disease on yourself. It is not about you. You can not fix him. His disease is not reflection on what he truly feels about you or your relationship. He is not making a "choice" of alcohol or you, he is sick and there is not a choice as long he is unwilling to reach out. ALANON is a wonderful place to find support, and tools for working through this difficult time. You also obviously have a wonderful support group right here. Take care.

geees poncho

For me and alot of others I'v heard in meetings. It was the original euphoria we felt in our 1st experience, when it turned on us, we didn't recongnize it for what it was. PROBLEMS WITH BOOZE & DRUGS---
ALCOHOLISM & ADDICTION

FormerDoormat

This is essentially the same question you asked on Christmas Day is it not? What's bothering you more, the fact that he's not nice when he's drinking or that he's not begging you to take him back? If it's the latter perhaps you only intended to manipulate him into sobriety when you kicked him out, not end the relationship.

All my efforts to motivate/manipulate my boyfriend to stop drinking failed. Ultimately my relationship failed, too. Partly because I couldn't tolerate my boyfriend's drinking, but mostly because my attempts to manipulate and control my boyfriend's actions caused him to resent and mistrust me.

Alanon helped me understand the role I played in the failure of my relationship. Why not give it a shot?

Cynay

Well, ya know I really struggle with this one. When I was in the throws of living with an Alcoholic I was one angry person and when your in a romantic relationship it will bring out a whole other set of feelings as well. When I came to SR I lost sight of all that because it had been so long since I had lived with an alcoholic... but trust me I was right where you are then ... I was hurt, very very hurt on many many levels ..... I have lived with Alcoholism all my life starting with my Mother and ending ohh.... guess it has not ended as yet since one of my sponsees is a recovering Alcoholic....

I had to look deep at a young age as to what Alcoholism was... I wanted to be able to love and forgive my Mother, I wanted a relationship with her.

There is a book I could suggest that helps alot in seperating the disease from the person, its called Under the Influence by Dr. James R. Milam & Katherine Ketcham. It really breaks it down to what is happening. It is a myth in my opinion that they are split personalities... Alcohol's effect on the brain causes severe psychological and emotional distortions of the normal personality. Sobriety reveals the alcoholic's true personality and the grow still needed. I believe that as the disease progresses their personality becomes more distorted. Alcoholism is a progressive disease and the longer it continues the more the physical and emotional is changed.

I was not upset that my Mothers liver was being ruined by alcohol... that did not push my emotional buttons.... but I was very upset that her emotional/mental functions were because that is what is pushing my buttons.... the longer they drink the worse it becomes...the more there brain has to find different ways to send and receive messages through a toxic waste dump....

Im sure that he probably drank when you met and Im also pretty sure he did not act like this... its like the frog in the pan of water.... turn on the heat low and slowly heat the water to a boil.... The frog will die. The trick for me is to know if they are sitting in that pan in the first place and take action then. Today when I date I pay pretty close attention to the amount they drink and I dont mind one bit if they dont drink at all.

Just my 2 cents... I really do suggest the book though, I could not find my forgiveness or my compassion until I found my truths about this being a disease. I can choose how I will live or not live in that situation but I can not choose his disease, I can not fix his disease and I did not cause his disease.... only the Alcoholic can change that.