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Question
This question may seem quite strange but I'm going to ask it anyway. I am hoping that any Adult Children of Alcoholics can help me out. I have been married for 13 years to an alcoholic and I suppose I have been kidding myself that he will change. I want to leave him so bad but I'm concerned about my children. However reading the characteristics of children who have an alcoholic parent my son displays so many of them and now I feel HORRIBLE. Tell me anyone of you who went through this as a child, looking back now would you have wanted the other parent to have left the alcoholic??
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Interesting question. My alcoholic father passed away when I was 13, so although my mother did not leave him, he was no longer in my life. Did it make things better? Nope. Knowing what I know now, and having been married to an alcoholic, and having two children, I would answer your question that it really doesn't matter. What I would have wanted as a child is at least one of my parents to get help with the problem. Of course, as a child, I didn't realize this. Now I know that is the only thing that would have made a difference. Not leaving or staying.
L
L
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True, however, my husband refuses to get help and has even told me that when the kids are gone I will be a lonely woman because he will be spending his time at the bar, so I really dont see him quitting or seeking help.
On a tear
Join Date: Jul 2003
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Have you thought about what it was in the alcoholic that drew YOU in?
Sometimes, both the codependent behaviors as well as the alcoholic behaviors are learned.... and I am of the opinion that some of the codependent behaviors may be part of inherited personality traits as well.
What I know today is that my parents loved me - the best they knew how. I know my siblings and I are close, and I consider my sober alcoholic mom and sister to be some of the best people in my life.
I know that I am alcoholic and codpendent... but that is who I am.
I am grateful they brought me into this world. I am grateful I got to know my parents sober (after I left home) and I am grateful for the relationships they give me today.
Was my childhood happy? Pretty much... though puberty and teen years were hellish. But it is what it is...
Sometimes, both the codependent behaviors as well as the alcoholic behaviors are learned.... and I am of the opinion that some of the codependent behaviors may be part of inherited personality traits as well.
What I know today is that my parents loved me - the best they knew how. I know my siblings and I are close, and I consider my sober alcoholic mom and sister to be some of the best people in my life.
I know that I am alcoholic and codpendent... but that is who I am.
I am grateful they brought me into this world. I am grateful I got to know my parents sober (after I left home) and I am grateful for the relationships they give me today.
Was my childhood happy? Pretty much... though puberty and teen years were hellish. But it is what it is...
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I'm not sure I didnt realize he had this problem to the extent that it was. The words spoken to me and to my children by him when he is drunk are unforgivable especially after so many years of hearing the same words and the same feeling re-enforced by those words. The things that he has said to my son are horrible and now when he comes home drunk my son hides from him so he cannot pick on him. So I guess it seems that I should stay because eventually when my children are older they will realize that their dad loved them dispite the words he spoke?????
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Okay, I'm going to try and say it again. I realize that this form of communication can be difficult, so I will try my best to be clear.
Staying or going isn't the question. Getting help in order to change YOUR behavior is what will make a difference. I can tell you are concerned for your son. You can help him by helping yourself.
L
Staying or going isn't the question. Getting help in order to change YOUR behavior is what will make a difference. I can tell you are concerned for your son. You can help him by helping yourself.
L
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Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Stumbling toward happiness
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This is not what you want to hear, but since you asked.
Both of my parents were alcoholics. I suffered verbal abuse that damaged me so badly that I wasn't a truly normal person until nearly 40, and only because of intense counseling and inner work.
I would have given anything for one of my parents to be sober enough to realize that this was happening, explain why we had to leave, and take me out of that nightmare. Anything. I may not have understood at the time (hence the explaining, and perhaps even family counseling) but I also wouldn't have gone through 30 years of hell.
And I have never forgiven them for not doing so.
You worry what they'll think of their father. Raising children in that sort of disrespectful, abusive situation is the farthest thing from love that exists. Not only that, it teaches them that it's an acceptable way to live THEIR lives, and raise THEIR kids. It's okay to permit the abuse, because "some day they'll see that he loves them."
I'm sorry for this opinion in advance, but my personal view is that all the inner work and meetings in the world are not going to protect your children from a fate like mine, nor protect you from that questions that may some day come up: Why did you let him do that to me, mom? Or the question that will come up for you: Why does my son verbally abuse his children? How on earth did he turn out to be an abuser?
If you are unwilling to leave, perhaps some family counseling might help soften some of the effects of this toxic, loveless environment both you and your children are living in.
Stop in to the ACoA forum on this site. See how people have turned out.
Hugs and strength to you to find a happier life. You deserve it.
GL
Both of my parents were alcoholics. I suffered verbal abuse that damaged me so badly that I wasn't a truly normal person until nearly 40, and only because of intense counseling and inner work.
I would have given anything for one of my parents to be sober enough to realize that this was happening, explain why we had to leave, and take me out of that nightmare. Anything. I may not have understood at the time (hence the explaining, and perhaps even family counseling) but I also wouldn't have gone through 30 years of hell.
And I have never forgiven them for not doing so.
You worry what they'll think of their father. Raising children in that sort of disrespectful, abusive situation is the farthest thing from love that exists. Not only that, it teaches them that it's an acceptable way to live THEIR lives, and raise THEIR kids. It's okay to permit the abuse, because "some day they'll see that he loves them."
I'm sorry for this opinion in advance, but my personal view is that all the inner work and meetings in the world are not going to protect your children from a fate like mine, nor protect you from that questions that may some day come up: Why did you let him do that to me, mom? Or the question that will come up for you: Why does my son verbally abuse his children? How on earth did he turn out to be an abuser?
If you are unwilling to leave, perhaps some family counseling might help soften some of the effects of this toxic, loveless environment both you and your children are living in.
Stop in to the ACoA forum on this site. See how people have turned out.
Hugs and strength to you to find a happier life. You deserve it.
GL
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,175
I was raised by alcoholic parents. There were six of us kids, and my father drank his time away,became unable to work, while my mom held everything together.
When I, the youngest, was 13, my father died, and my mom proceeded to pick up the bottle. She drank for 15 years until we had an intervention.
My father did many bad things, but, generally was fun and funny. But my monm and my dad fought, struggled. She would go get him out of the bar, they would fight all night. She worked two jobs, and he drank his life away.
All of my brothers and sisters and I are codependent.
I have been involved with an abusive man for years who drinks, and have until now been unable to stand up and walk away. We have a 2 year old son.
At least once a week I think about What sort of person I would be if my mother had stood up, walked out, and began her life...maybe with a healthy man, maybe alone. I have NO DOUBT that I learned how to behave in relationships from my mother and her choices. I look at my son, and I want him to know what love is. 2- way love. I want him to learn self worth first and foremost. I want him to be independent. I do not judge my om harshly, but, I know that her choices altered my course.
Good Luck. Your heart knows what to do.
When I, the youngest, was 13, my father died, and my mom proceeded to pick up the bottle. She drank for 15 years until we had an intervention.
My father did many bad things, but, generally was fun and funny. But my monm and my dad fought, struggled. She would go get him out of the bar, they would fight all night. She worked two jobs, and he drank his life away.
All of my brothers and sisters and I are codependent.
I have been involved with an abusive man for years who drinks, and have until now been unable to stand up and walk away. We have a 2 year old son.
At least once a week I think about What sort of person I would be if my mother had stood up, walked out, and began her life...maybe with a healthy man, maybe alone. I have NO DOUBT that I learned how to behave in relationships from my mother and her choices. I look at my son, and I want him to know what love is. 2- way love. I want him to learn self worth first and foremost. I want him to be independent. I do not judge my om harshly, but, I know that her choices altered my course.
Good Luck. Your heart knows what to do.
Occasional poor taste poster
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,542
In MY situation, my Father was the alcoholic and his drinking became a problem when I was in my teens. He was a "nasty drunk" type of drinker and he could clear a room with one comment. My sister and I begged my Mother to leave him but she always had a reason not to. I felt resentment for my Mother not getting us out of that situation when the gettin was good.
Looking back 35(ish) years ago, I can't honestly say if it would have made a difference if she left or not. What little resentment I had for my sober parent was nothing compared to the.... hard to find the right word... damage done by my Father.
Your son should not be subjected to that abuse and neither should you. It IS abuse, make no mistake about it and don't minimize your husbands behavior.
Looking back 35(ish) years ago, I can't honestly say if it would have made a difference if she left or not. What little resentment I had for my sober parent was nothing compared to the.... hard to find the right word... damage done by my Father.
Originally Posted by whatfor99 
The things that he has said to my son are horrible and now when he comes home drunk my son hides from him so he cannot pick on him.
Living in a Pinkful Place
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 7,545
Regardless whether you decide to stay or go - there are programs to help you and your son.
And let me say - while I was typing this my Dad called me - I had a childhood with a father that drank & he was not a nice person when he drank. Today he doesn't drink anymore and because of Al-Anon, we have been able to heal from the past. He lives in another State, but we talk every Friday and see each other 4 - 5 times a yr.
This doesn't always work out well with everyone - but with getting help for ME - it has made dealing with him and the other A's in my life a lot easier.
As an adult child of an alcoholic, a mother of an addict, wife of an alcoholic, & sister of an alcoholic - my suggestion would be the best thing you can do for you and your son is to seek help for yourselves - thru Al-Anon, Alateen, therapist, other support groups - however you feel lead by your HP.
Just my e, s, & h,
Rita
And let me say - while I was typing this my Dad called me - I had a childhood with a father that drank & he was not a nice person when he drank. Today he doesn't drink anymore and because of Al-Anon, we have been able to heal from the past. He lives in another State, but we talk every Friday and see each other 4 - 5 times a yr.
This doesn't always work out well with everyone - but with getting help for ME - it has made dealing with him and the other A's in my life a lot easier.
As an adult child of an alcoholic, a mother of an addict, wife of an alcoholic, & sister of an alcoholic - my suggestion would be the best thing you can do for you and your son is to seek help for yourselves - thru Al-Anon, Alateen, therapist, other support groups - however you feel lead by your HP.
Just my e, s, & h,
Rita
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Location: Los Angeles, CA
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One of my best friends recently shared with me that his father was alcoholic. His mother would ask him when he was a child what she should do - stay or go. He didn't want to choose. To this day, his mom tells him she stayed because of him and his sister and she resents it.
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Location: Arlington, VA
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Both my parents were alcoholics. Both gave me many life lessons that it took me many years to unlearn. Heck, I'm still working on unlearning!
I've often told folks I would have been better off without either of my parents in my life. Probably not really true since I have no idea whether there were any non-dysfunctional family members who could have helped out and foster care would not have been a better alternative.
With one alcoholic parent and one not, I would have resented the non-alocoholic parent for not getting me out of the toxic environment. I did resent the other adults in my life (uncles, grandparents, etc) for not doing anything.
I've often told folks I would have been better off without either of my parents in my life. Probably not really true since I have no idea whether there were any non-dysfunctional family members who could have helped out and foster care would not have been a better alternative.
With one alcoholic parent and one not, I would have resented the non-alocoholic parent for not getting me out of the toxic environment. I did resent the other adults in my life (uncles, grandparents, etc) for not doing anything.
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I thank all of you for your honesty, I have felt for so long that I need to leave but didnt want my children resenting me for the choice. My son does not understand me wanting to leave but I'm hoping that someday he will see why I have to take him and his sister out of this environment.
On a tear
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Volcano Country!
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Abusive behavior is not excusable... not because of mental deficiency.. not because of disease... not because of addiction or alcoholism.
My responsibility as a parent was to provide a safe place to raise my kids, then to try a provide them what they needed to become the best adults they can be.
I survived my childhood. I love my parents. But I do not condone allowing abusive behavior toward children.
My parents made their amends to me through a "living amends" - they changed and did their best to do better once they figured out how.
((hugs))
My responsibility as a parent was to provide a safe place to raise my kids, then to try a provide them what they needed to become the best adults they can be.
I survived my childhood. I love my parents. But I do not condone allowing abusive behavior toward children.
My parents made their amends to me through a "living amends" - they changed and did their best to do better once they figured out how.
((hugs))
Another Day in Paradise
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Upland, CA
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This is a slightly different perspective than you asked for, however it may provide some insight for you.
I WAS the alcoholic Father and in fact after 16 years of marriage and while I was still drinking I left the marriage for another woman. It would be another 7 years before I got sober. I have now been sober for the past 8 years. I have 4 children all now over 21, but they were ages 6 through 15 when I left. I did support them financially as well as shared custody 50-50 with their mother. I give you that history to preface what I saw from the time I left until today.
My children, all four have told me that they felt the divorce was the best thing that could have occurred from their view. They felt that the two houses were both better places since the "conflict" was much less and it allowed them to learn to deal with both parents based on that particular parent's behavior and teachings. Even dealing with my drinking for the next 7 years after the divorce. Obviously they are much happier with me since I have been sober these past years. In addition I think that having to be a single parent and a drunk ultimately caused me to begin to act like a parent and not just be the "father" who was part of their conception. The result was I got sober and over the past 8 years have forged a very wonderful relationship with all of them. I now have 4 grandkids that have never seen Grandpa drunk.
The bottom line is that from a child's point of view they were happy that their drunken father was not part of their mother's life. I don't think that drunken parents really have any valuable life lessons to teach children.
PS. My #2 son had a drug and alcohol problem when he was 18 through 20 and as a result of having seen me get sober he did come to me and ask that I help him. October 29th will be his 7th AA birthday (if he doesn't drink between then and now)! I did have something to teach him in sobriety.
Jon
I WAS the alcoholic Father and in fact after 16 years of marriage and while I was still drinking I left the marriage for another woman. It would be another 7 years before I got sober. I have now been sober for the past 8 years. I have 4 children all now over 21, but they were ages 6 through 15 when I left. I did support them financially as well as shared custody 50-50 with their mother. I give you that history to preface what I saw from the time I left until today.
My children, all four have told me that they felt the divorce was the best thing that could have occurred from their view. They felt that the two houses were both better places since the "conflict" was much less and it allowed them to learn to deal with both parents based on that particular parent's behavior and teachings. Even dealing with my drinking for the next 7 years after the divorce. Obviously they are much happier with me since I have been sober these past years. In addition I think that having to be a single parent and a drunk ultimately caused me to begin to act like a parent and not just be the "father" who was part of their conception. The result was I got sober and over the past 8 years have forged a very wonderful relationship with all of them. I now have 4 grandkids that have never seen Grandpa drunk.
The bottom line is that from a child's point of view they were happy that their drunken father was not part of their mother's life. I don't think that drunken parents really have any valuable life lessons to teach children.
PS. My #2 son had a drug and alcohol problem when he was 18 through 20 and as a result of having seen me get sober he did come to me and ask that I help him. October 29th will be his 7th AA birthday (if he doesn't drink between then and now)! I did have something to teach him in sobriety.
Jon
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Posts: 126
hello, this is just my experience....I am an Adult Child....growing up I had one very sick & dysfunctional alcoholic father, and one mother who spent her life trying to emotionally protect me from him. My mom didn't leave him for 26 years--thinking that divorce would have really hurt her children--me & my brother. Well in hindsight, staying together hurt us WAY more than she could ever imagine--- I ABSOLUTELY wished she took me away from him & away from his emotional abuse a long, long time before she did...before the damage was done. She couldn't see what was happening--and how deeply i was affected by what he said/did.For me today, the "aftermath" affects every aspect of my life--all my relationships-- & even though he is healthier now--I often resent him for what he did--and sometimes her for not leaving him.... I know it's my responsibility to heal myself, and I know my parents did the best they knew how at that time--- but there are many moments where I think...why did he do this to me??? and why did she let it happen???
Bottom line: YES, I would have wanted my mom to leave him
This is just my experience...
I wish you much support in whatever you decide!
~Stephanie
Bottom line: YES, I would have wanted my mom to leave him
This is just my experience...
I wish you much support in whatever you decide!
~Stephanie
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 126
Originally Posted by whatfor99
I have felt for so long that I need to leave but didnt want my children resenting me for the choice. My son does not understand me wanting to leave but I'm hoping that someday he will see why I have to take him and his sister out of this environment.
I believe you are right in thinking about wanting to take your children out of that environment. Maybe they will look back and understand/see why you did it...But maybe they won't understand.....but maybe that's the point: they won't have to see, feel, or understand the pain & suffering they "missed out on".
Much love & support to you!!
~Stephanie
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Location: southern indiana
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abuse is never ok....but somehow, i became desensitized to it during my marriage to my xah. thank god, we had no children involved.
having said that, i agree with LaTeeDa when she states that getting help for yourself is first and foremost. now, just what is that help? get yourself as quickly as you can, your children also, into al-anon.
you have a child hiding from his father. please don't minimize this action. damage is being done to his young tender mind, heart, and spirit.
and remember, alcoholism is a progressive disease......it only gets worse if left untreated. if you think things are tough now, just wait and see what kind of hell he can havoc upon your children as they grow older.
so, as the responsible parent, it is your responsibility to find help for you and your children and if divorce is in your future, to learn not how to choose another man that is so unhealthy in mind, spirit, and body. jmho
take what you like and leave the rest.
hugs to you
jeri
having said that, i agree with LaTeeDa when she states that getting help for yourself is first and foremost. now, just what is that help? get yourself as quickly as you can, your children also, into al-anon.
you have a child hiding from his father. please don't minimize this action. damage is being done to his young tender mind, heart, and spirit.
and remember, alcoholism is a progressive disease......it only gets worse if left untreated. if you think things are tough now, just wait and see what kind of hell he can havoc upon your children as they grow older.
so, as the responsible parent, it is your responsibility to find help for you and your children and if divorce is in your future, to learn not how to choose another man that is so unhealthy in mind, spirit, and body. jmho
take what you like and leave the rest.
hugs to you
jeri
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