Need to vent - input wanted

Old 09-20-2007, 01:59 PM
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Need to vent - input wanted

Just wanted to vent that it's been about a month since SO has started to work AA. He's half-heartedly trying, which is better than not trying at all, but I'm being impatient (silently) and wanting him to embrace this program. I know it's not my business but his crap still effects me to some extent and I can't help that if I am having a relationship with this man.

It's becoming easier to detact at times since I've started my program. I am at peace more and I don't engage in arguments as much. I don't get antagonized as often and for that I'm grateful. I speak up in meetings and talk to people afterward but I still am not completely comfortable. This is a new experience for me, opening up with strangers and being friendly. I am normally a cautious person by nature and like to observe people before I decide to befriend someone. I am learning to trust and open up right away but it's hard for me. I especially hate the no-crosstalk rule because I wish sometimes I could ask someone a question to better understand what they are saying and I would love some feedback of what I say in meetings but it's now allowed. It feels good to openly say how I feel and not be judged though.

I wish I could go to ameeting every day. I wish there were CoDa meetings in my area because I would love to join that too. I think I would benefit tremendously from them.

The 1 1/2 months A has been in "recovery" has gone like this so far: First two weeks, meetings here and there and still drinking; huge binge and bad argument, started back to AA meetings and talking with people for 16 days straight, no drinking, talking freely about how wonderful the people are in meetings, how much he is getting back, calling and talking with other members, doing some reading of BB. He was in a best friend's wedding and it all fell apart about two weeks ago. Drank that night, no AA the next day but back on the wagon and meetings again the following day. Exclaimed how he liked being sober, didn't like the hazy head and hung over feeling. Felt good being sober. The following Sat., started drinking again. Had another fight that night, and have had a bumpy week so far. Hasn't been back to a meeting since the fight on Sat. night. Also drank again last night but only two huge drinks and no argument. Also admitted that he hasn't surrendered on Sat. night. Doesn't look good does it?

I know I can't control this. I just want to not feel so crappy. I know I'm in charge of this, no one else, except my HP. I'm working it. I can't help but feel sad and let down when I think there is hope and I see improvement to only take a bunch of steps back again. It depresses me.

Jenny
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Old 09-20-2007, 02:08 PM
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It sounds like he's not really committed to recovery yet and therefore the rollercoaster is going to continue. So the question becomes how do you want to live?
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Old 09-20-2007, 02:36 PM
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Good that you understand you can't control it, and I agree that it doesn't sound like he's committed, especially if he continues to drink. However, he might meet the requirement for AA membership, which is the desire to stop drinking.

From my experience it's not an easy decision to "embrace" AA and the 12 Steps. For this alcoholic who thought he'd been doing fine for 27 years, the thought of turning my will and life over to a God of my understanding was horrifying. Even though my life was falling apart I still blamed my downfall on my ex and anyone else I thought had "wronged" me. Although I abstained from drinking, it took me 5 months in the program to be brought to my knees, and wanting to end my life before I decided to embrace the Steps. I've heard of people who wait years before they embrace the program, but they still continue to drink on occasion and attend meetings. If it works for them that's great, seems to me like it would be a living hell to do it half-way.

The crosstalk rule is for the benefit of the person who's sharing, so they may do so without interruption and unsolicited advice. To share is to free ourselves of a burden we may be carrying, or to share our experience, strength and hope with others. If you'd like to ask questions to gain a deeper understanding, how about doing it after the meeting or in the Alcoholism forum here on SR? Most alcoholics are more than willing to help and share, please don't let a bad experience deter you from asking for feedback. And if you feel like you're being judged because you're an Al-Anon'er, please find someone else to share with. There are plenty of us who'd like to hear from you too.

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Old 09-20-2007, 06:05 PM
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I know that crappy feeling. AH quit drinking a week or so ago, but no AA. Doesn't want to go that road if he doesn't have to. Now I feel like I'm on hold waiting for the other shoe to fall. I'm grateful for small blessings of him being sober to date, but I can't shake this feeling that I'm waiting waiting waiting for him to slip knowing full well he needs recovery and a support system. What a mess.
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Old 09-21-2007, 08:04 AM
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I feel your pain Lady. It's so hard. I could almost cry just thinking about the situation. I am trying so hard to focus on myself. I am trying so hard to make the right decisions for me and my kids. I will not go back once I leave. I know myself. I am hoping he decides to do something before it's too late for me to turn back. I have no control over that. I only know that I am not ready to take that step yet. Forever is a long time.

I am going to two meetings today. I have my regular Friday group mid-day and tonight I am attending a new meeting. I am excited to meet new people. I am also attending my Sat. AA meeting where the people there welcome an Al-Anon member and some are both AA and Al-Anon. I like that meeting a lot and they thank me for coming which is a nice feeling. I am also attending a new Al-Anon meeting on Sun. morning which is quite a drive but I am excited about that one too. I haven't told Abf my plans yet.

As for him, the drinking commenced again last night. It's not good that he's back to drinking full time. Something he said last week scared me and I now realize why. He mentioned a woman in his meeting saying that she realized that no matter how many times you slip or what you do wrong, AA is the only group which will welcome you back. He so enjoyed saying that to me that I felt he had a realization that he could mess up over and over and it was okay. He wouldn't be judged and could always quit and rejoin AA anytime he wanted. It sounded to me like he was giving himself a free pass to drink whenever he felt like it and he was happy about it. I think I was right. He hasn't been back since that meeting.

I avoided him last night knowing that he was drinking but he didn't tell me he was. It was the old familar sound of the ice maker putting ice into his pint size glass for that Red Bull and Vodka drink. The sound made my heart sink. I fell asleep on the couch by 9:30 and wouldn't get up. He tried all lovey-dovey kissing my cheek, tucking me in on the couch, covering me up with the blanket, etc. but it's not a sober gesture so it doesn't count. I discount all drunken gestures, good or bad. They don't matter because it's not the real him. I am not happy about the tension I will be living under again. Even though I choose to duck out of arguments instead of joining them, it doesn't make me any less anxious when I know he's been drinking. I still am living in that unknown fear of what will happen tonight? Will it be peaceful or a rage? I hate that feeling. And after enjoying a few weeks of an evenness, knowing that it would just be him, not the raging drunk, I am sad to know Mr. Hyde is back.

Jenny
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Old 09-21-2007, 08:36 AM
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Originally Posted by sunshine321 View Post
Forever is a long time.
This kind of thinking kept me stuck for a long time. No decision has to be forever. We all have choices, and will continue to have choices in the future. If I start thinking my decisions are forever, then the fear of making a mistake paralyzes me into not making a choice (which really still is a choice, BTW). If I make a choice and it turns out not to be the best one, I can make a different choice. Make sense?

L
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Old 09-21-2007, 10:37 AM
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"Something he said last week scared me and I now realize why. He mentioned a woman in his meeting saying that she realized that no matter how many times you slip or what you do wrong, AA is the only group which will welcome you back. He so enjoyed saying that to me that I felt he had a realization that he could mess up over and over and it was okay. He wouldn't be judged and could always quit and rejoin AA anytime he wanted. It sounded to me like he was giving himself a free pass to drink whenever he felt like it and he was happy about it."

My AH was sober for 98 days before drinking again for 8 days straight. Thru all that week of drinking, he attended his AA meetings and explained to me the same thing as you said above. Even now, he has been sober since 9/12 and going to meetings, but in almost all the meetings he goes to, everyone there relapses from time to time, over and over. I said "Gee, I thought AA tries to promote long term or lifelong abstinance". He said they do, but if you screw up, they welcome you back with open arms. I agree, to me it sounds like a free pass to screw up too, that's why I'm attending 5 Alanon meetings a week so WHEN it DOES happen again, and I know it will, I will have a good mindset and be equipped to act, not react.
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Old 09-21-2007, 11:02 AM
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I remember when my kids started program, and just didn't do it the "right" way! They went to meetings whenever and didn't have a sponsor and weren't working the steps... grrrr.

Then the woman who would eventually be my sponsor asked ME how many of those things *I* was doing in *my* recovery! I was going to meetings.... but only once a week (I thought the kids needed to go at least 3 times a week). I didn't have a sponsor and was not actively working the steps.

So... I set out to do those things (in part, to "show" by example a good way to work a program).

You can guess what happened... I focused so much on me, that I forgot to focus on how THEY worked THEIR program!

Sheesh...
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Old 09-21-2007, 11:55 AM
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L,
To respond to your comment, it makes sense what you are saying. But I cannot go through pain like that over and over. I will not disrupt my children's life over and over if I can help it. I will stay for as long as I am able to mentally and then if the time comes for me to go because I'm not happy in the situation, then I will go. It will be final. No going back. That's how I handle relationships. When they are over, they are over. I am comfortable with that. It's getting to that point that's hard. The actual decision of how much is too much and when it's not worth staying anymore.

Jenny
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Old 09-21-2007, 12:00 PM
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I hear what you are saying BigSis,about focusing on my recovery and I agree. But I am recovering and the other person is going backward. It's hard to stand by and not "feel" anything about that. It's scary.

I am focusing on my recovery. I am not telling him he isn't doing it right. I keep my mouth shut. I haven't asked him if he is going to meetings. I haven't preached to him. I haven't said one word about him picking up a drink the past two nights. It doesn't mean I don't feel anything about it. It doesn't mean I wouldn't like to say something, but I won't because I know enough now to know it doesn't matter what I say, especially to a person who is sick. I know from going to AA meetings that it doesn't work if you don't work it. That's fact. I know that by drinking and not going to meetings, he's not working a program. That's not okay with me. Maybe that is part of my conditions to stay in this relationship. I haven't come to that conclusion yet.

I also know that setting an example can work and I agree with you. I believe that's how he started going to AA to begin with and that is why I haven't given up working the program myself. I will keep on attending for the rest of my life whether I am with this man or not. I got here somehow and I don't need to ever get here again. I can apply this program to many people in my life and hopefully will instill some of what I'm learning in my children.

Jenny
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Old 09-21-2007, 05:04 PM
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As I type this, my AH just walked in the room with a beer. Last night he went bowling with friends and I was in bed asleep when he came home so not sure about if he had a few last night or not.

When he said he was quitting I had the talk with him about AA. Mostly informative stuff like statistics and how sobriety is rarely achieved without support, sponsor and working a recovery program. I highly recommended it but was clear the decision was up to him and for him. Just two short weeks ago his words were he would do whatever it takes. Admitting to me he had a problem is just scratching the surface of his denial imo.

He totally cringes at the mention of AA even when it's not about him. My friend and I were talking on the phone a few days after AH quit about the latest exploits of one of her coworkers. Young guy, married, makes a ton of money, has a house worth around 800K and finally admitted he had a serious problem after his latest horror show, landing in jail etc. He joined AA and he's very serious about it.

AH was listening to the conversation and I could see him immediately getting anxious to the point where he left the room. I'm sure he meant it at that moment he said he was quitting but I don't think he's ready to admit he can't do this on his own, that he's powerless over it. He can't get past the anxiety and deal with deeper denial to go the next step to AA. I think he just wants to stop being an abusive jerk, but wants to still be able to have a few like anyone else. But he hasn't figured it out he can't do that and has to completely quit.

Bottom line he's not ready and the balls in my court about what do I want for me.
One thing that I never thought about before is whether I can live with a dry drunk or him in recovery if he decides to get serious. I think I just wanted the drunken rages to stop. When I expressed my boundary I don't think I was very clear and may need to rethink and reword it. I said I couldn't live with the drunkenness, abuse and chaos anymore. I never expected he would actually try to stop for as long as he tried. And he mentioned tonight when he saw me notice him with a beer that I'll never see him drunk again. I've never thought about living with someone wondering all the time if they'll slip either dry drunk or in recovery. I really really have to think about that and what my boundaries are. I think I've always thought that I would stay with him if the drinking stopped and if he was in recovery working a program. Now I don't know for sure if I can say that. I know for sure I can't feel committed to the relationship anymore if he just quits without working it.

I'm like you in this respect, when I leave it will be over, no going back. Inner changes happen, decisions are made and life marches on. I wouldn't consider living together again and possibly putting myself through this a second time. And I think Alanon will be with me too for a long time to come.
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Old 09-21-2007, 06:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Lady BlueMiles View Post
I know that crappy feeling. AH quit drinking a week or so ago, but no AA. Doesn't want to go that road if he doesn't have to. Now I feel like I'm on hold waiting for the other shoe to fall. I'm grateful for small blessings of him being sober to date, but I can't shake this feeling that I'm waiting waiting waiting for him to slip knowing full well he needs recovery and a support system. What a mess.
My ah husband quite about 6 weeks ago. It didn't happen from his idea, unfortunately it was a BAD episode and I wanted out of the marriage. So he quit. At first he went to 2 AA meetings a week and acted like he wants to get well. Then it was 1 mtg a week. He went a total of 6 meetings and stopped. When I asked him about it - he got crabby and said I am nagging.

I feel if he is not committed to being well emotionally, he is not committed to our relationship. I cannot see it any other way. I feel sad and resentful.
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Old 09-21-2007, 07:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Aquarian View Post
I feel if he is not committed to being well emotionally, he is not committed to our relationship. I cannot see it any other way. I feel sad and resentful.
I don't think an active A can be committed to a relationship. The alcohol and the power it has over the A prevents that. I know that although my AH is apparently still white knuckling it (with at least some lapses into drinking) there is no way he is capable of being in our marriage. Not that I want that anymore anyway. He is too busy holding on to the edge to be anything to anyone, including his children.
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Old 09-21-2007, 10:15 PM
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I still consider my AH an active A even though he scratched the surface of denial by admitting he has a "drinking problem" and is an abusive jerk when he's drunk. I know he doesn't want to be like that and hates himself for it. I know he doesn't want to lose US. Thing is he can't admit he's an alcoholic and still thinks he can control it and still have a few like non A's watching a game, or out with friends. In just two weeks he went from "I'm quitting drinking and will do what it takes," to "you'll never see me drunk again." Yea right. He had a few last night bowling with the boys, and a beer tonight. I figure he'll be in full swing again by next weekend if not sooner. So where does that leave me? I'm still with an active A that can't walk the talk.

I've resigned myself to preparing for the future on my own because I can't take living with an Active A anymore, but I never considered what I felt and thought from the perspective of living with a recovering A. Most people here say not to go back to an A until at least one or two years of sobriety, but what if you haven't actually separated yet and the A tells you he decided to quit and do recovery?

From what I'm seeing posted, most of these A's including my AH, seem to do a deluded half attempt at quitting. imo It being just another twist and turn on the active A rollercoaster ride. Or is this a step, or stage they go through trying to get up courage to face their denial? I just don't want to be fooled, used and manipulated by a bunch of active A false talk about quitting one minute and drunk the next.

Just watching my life these past two weeks I can't see how our relationship can survive a fresh recovery attempt without a separation period and I'm afraid I'm one that once we're separated I don't think I'd go back. Maybe I'm just too burned out, no more trust left to give, too far detached emotionally and mentally. Maybe too tired of it all.
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