Bjen

My title is thick with sarcasm. My A whose name is Scott. Called this morning. He is in prison on a DUI and parole violation. At least until October. They haven't sentenced him on the DUI yet so it may be longer. Anyway, some of you may have read about the motorcycle of mine that I bought for both of us that I have paid for over half of and he took over payments because I don't want it anymore. I can't ride it, its scary and big. I wrote him a long letter and told him in one sentence that I was selling it. Then I continued the letter.

I was afraid to tell him because I knew he'd be mad at me. Well, he called wrote me back a long letter. Pouring his heart out. Not necessarily about us but just about his thoughts and that he hates what he has done to his life and that he plans on sobriety to fix it. That is the short of it. He states that him and I must have made some sick pact years ago to torture one another til the end. He isn't proud of how horrible things have become for us but I feel he is just as baffled as I am the we can't seem to walk away from each other. It is like we hate one another but when we look at each other we remember that we love one another, just hate all the crap that has happened.

He also said that all I ever give him is small talk and he never knows how I feel about anything. Well, that is one of my wonderful adaptations is to hide my feelings from him and myself. Why feel anything when it doesn't matter anyway. Part of me being here is to come back to myself and learn how to feel again. So I spent 3 hours yesterday writing him. Trying to communicate my feelings on so many things.

So this morning he calls me and starts in right away about my selling the bike. He called me a wh*** and said I was selling it to my new (non-existent) boyfriend and that he wants it and I can't sell it. He says his mom will make the payments for him. WTF!!! I told her she would be crazy to do that. She knows it but she never tells him NO!!! She is a hopeless enabler and I love her and don't criticize her for it. She just doesn't know what to do. She is 74 and says that all she has is her kids.

So I didn't say anything. I just listened to him scream. He finally yelled "What!" when I didn't respond. I said "I don't have anything productive to say to you right now and you will stop calling me names or I will hang up- How dare you" Well, we ended up deciding in a loud angry way that I don't want payments made on the bike, I want it GONE!! Paid off and if he could do that he has one week to do it or I will sell it. He says I am trying to screw him. I told him if I was gonna do that I wouldn't have told him about it.

I even offered to take his chrome off for him as the guy buying it doesn't want it anyway.

So, his mom will probably buy it for him and he will kill himself on in when he gets out.

I love her but what is she thinking??? She bought him a truck, he rolled it, no insurance, she bought him another one, he goes back to jail, she bought him a motorcycle, he doesn't want that one, he wants mine!! Spoiled fricking 38 year old jerk!!!!

Do I point this out to him or forget it. Did I do Ok defending myself? Why do I hate him and still love him? What do I do now? Why do I care. I want to handle things in a way that I feel good about and he makes in hard. He doesn't ever see that I am a good person and I'm trying to take care of myself. I would like to save that money instead of pay for a bike. I want a bike I can ride or a bigger house and pay off a loan I have. But when I ask him "what about me?" He says "it's always about you" HUH?????

UGH!!! Angry!! I want to yell at him and beat him in the nose. At least I would feel better for a minute. What do you guys think?

Bjen

I guess I had a reason for putting his name on there but I forgot. I'll remember why and post it next time.

Bjen

Look at me go. I just want to say, I don't see anyone posting as long of threads as me. I seem to let it all out at once. So for all your replies I thank you in advance for always taking your time to read my mumbo jumbo and for caring enough and for understanding. I love you wonderful people I have never met. Thank you!! And Prodigal.... are you proud of my paragraphs? I make them just for you.

prodigal

I suggested you try an Al-Anon meeting and at this point you might want to find a counselor with whom you can address these issues. This board will give you support, but I think you need answers. You are trying to - or seem to expect - some sort of rational, coherent, stable response from this man. When you don't get it, you become quite upset. Do you know why you are upset? Do you think he is responsible for making you upset? Why are you concerned about his mother's enabling behaviors?

I think you are getting yourself worked up because his behavior is not what you want. What do you expect to get if you point out his irresponsible behavior to him? This is not about defending yourself. In doing so, you perpetuate this drama over the motorcycle.

We had a lady posting here (I haven't seen her recently) who was quite upset that her husband wanted to remodel their home. His attempts were not particularly successful. I believe the last I heard he wanted to start tearing down walls. This battle of the wills raged for several weeks.

It didn't have a doggone thing to do with the awful color he wanted to paint the walls or the crummy cabinets he picked out (I can't remember the exact things he was going to do, but she didn't like it). IT WAS ALL ABOUT CONTROL.

You know what makes people get crazy and overly-involved in stuff like this really fast? They want to control one another. They want certain responses. They want things to be the right way - their way. Hey, you may not like my response, but I call it as I see it. And I've been through this many, many times with my AH. In fact, I've spent the past 25 years battling depression and anxiety all because I want it to be MY way. Hell, I shut my yap months ago when it comes to talking to AH, but that doesn't mean that inside I still don't have that compulsion to want to control.

Forget trying to discuss the bike with him. Discuss the weather. Discuss what you ate for dinner last night. Just let it rest. When you start going into areas where you feel the need to defend yourself, you are going down a slippery slope. It's time to detach. Leave the enabling to his mom.

By the way, I understand your urge to punch him. He's getting to you. But he's getting to you because you are letting him get to you. As soon as he started screaming, you don't have to silently martyr yourself by listening. You hang up.

newenglandgirl

Hey Bjen - sorry for the chaos! I know how incredibly frustrating and crazy-making dealing with an A can be. Prodigal gives you excellent advice.
It takes us a while to realize how unproductive and pointless trying to have rational, normal exchanges of information with As can be. Do what you have to do to keep YOU sane. Sell the bike. Do whatever. You're the rational one in this crazy dance. But please DO get yourself a therapist. Can't tell you how much it has helped me. I recommend it highly. Like Prodigal says, you could benefit from some answers...individual professional attention can be so healing.

I don't know if it has to do with being an A, or something else, but my AH focuses on very irrelevant stuff too...Prodigal's probably right that it has to do with control...and I'm thinking too that probably the real issues at hand are just way too painful to for him to confront and process. So he obsessess over things that in the grand scheme don't matter.

keep posting! let us know how you're doing!

HolyQow

It looks like a control issue to me too. You don't want the bike. He has made payments. He went to prison and stopped making the payments? If you remove all of the emotional stuff attached to this bike.....it's the same as defaulting on a loan. Once he stopped making payments, it became your problem.

If you sell the bike, are your going to split the money with him? Maybe this is what he has an issue with (or lack of control), if it's sold, only you get to decide where that money goes? He did make payments?

I think you should do what's best for your financial situation, but also, consider what is fair.

I think it's very tough to sort out property from feelings.

denny57

Sell the bike. Give him the share that he put towards it in payments.

Let his mom run his life and try a new one on for you. If he doesn't see that you're a good person, stop trying to convince him. Find someone who recognizes your goodness and wants it in their life.

Save your sanity!

Sunflower

So sorry for all the chaos around you now...nothing is ever boring living with an A!! I am the Mother of an AS--she is on a different page than you--she is still trying to make him''better'' and ''happy''-don't be to hard on her.
I am glad you post long letters and hope you continue to do so...I like reading them very much---it causes me to see it from your side,,,

Sunflower

OH I almost forgot--mr wonderful is a good name--lol ---I always call my son''wonderboy''

Bjen

I thought today about the control issue. What I want more than control is his nice side. The side I see sometimes that isn't selfish. I wanted him to say he understood my reasons for selling it. I think he wants control and I want his OK. I feel bad about the bike and that makes me mad. I have heard alot of his "good" self lately and didn't think he would get mad. I think I was more upset that I got the "bad" side again. When I already had in my mind that he would agree. I know all doesn't get better just because they are sober but I thought his rational would, I guess, as always, he is only rational when it suites him. I just want to get along with him and be positive and he doesn't always choose that route then I am hurt and I turn that into anger from the frustration. I just wanted to vent it. I mentioned his mom's enabling because I thought someone would bring it up. I guess I didn't want to have to explain that I know she has a problem too. I defend her because I love her.

So, what is a martyr. If I take it quitely I am a martyr. But I let him yell and then gave him a boundary. I've read other posts where that was supported but yet I am a martyr when I felt I was choosing how I wanted to handle myself in the situation. Confused.

Bjen

Also, I am getting insurance through work soon and I planned on looking for a counselor. Thank you though. I'm not upset with anything that was said, I just felt a little misuderstood. It is hard to type and get everything across the way you mean it too.

prodigal

But, see ... that's it. YOU want his nice side. You want his behavior to be pleasant. This is certainly a normal, natural desire. But he doesn't have it to give at this time. So you are not getting what you want; thus, attempts to control may get him to straighten up. You WANTED him to say he understood your reasons for selling the bike. C-O-N-T-R-O-L.

A martyr is someone who is suffering in silence. Their suffering is often justified and legitimate. But deep down inside they are spitting mad! They stuff it down and remain silent. Yet the suffering remains. When dealing with an A, feeling martyred is one of the roles the partner takes on in the dance.

Start reading. There is Al-Anon literature you can order online from their website. I always suggest Melodie Beattie's Codependent No More, and Toby Rice Drews' Getting Them Sober (three books - each not that long - in paperback).

I've lived with this "junk" for 25 years. A couple different men, but the same old song. I think it's great to vent on this board - vent away - everybody here has done it and gets support. But you are looking for answers. Those answers are in reading to educate youself on the "nature of the beast." Go to some meetings - you'll meet people face-to-face who can support you. This board is useful, but it is only one of many, many useful tools. Look for answers - you'll be surprised to find that a lot of important ones are within yourself.

try try again

I totally understand where you are with your AH because I am at the same place with mine. It's very rare that we can have a discussion about anything without it turning into one or the other wanting to control. We end up arguing and yelling and it ends up being like STILL living in the chaos even though he's been gone for a month. I've decided to just stop talking to him for now because it doesn't do either of us any good because NEITHER of us are rational right now. If I have to tell him something about kids, mail, etc. I write him a short e-mail to the point. It's incredibly hard and I still love him and want to talk to him everyday, but I just know that right now it will do more harm than good. So I read your postings instead of calling and pray and I am going to my first Alanon meeting in close to twenty years tomorrow! Good Luck with everthing, you're in my thoughts.

dreamwvr

Prodigal is exactly right. I have come to the conclusion that these words are not in my A vocabulary. I seriously think he doesn't know what they mean. I've been there and used them, most often than not when I needed to ignore the situation. I do have a good example like the one you talked about with the remodeling and I am proud to say that I did detach.

Went over to my A house a couple of weeks ago (night time around 9:30pm). I heard really loud noise as I pulled up and walked up to the house. Walked in and he's singing 99 bottles of beer on the wall, while he's tearing his whole bathroom apart (walls and all) - to find a leak that I had previously told him was under the sink. Now, we were already past the point of living together any longer because I have my own place, but I thought what an idiot. I thought you know I love you, but you really can go way beyond normal at times. I just asked what he was doing, said cool honey. It's going to look good. and went about my business. He continued for a short while and started following me around the rest of the night. The next morning he stated, "Wow, I wonder what I was thinking of last night because I really do not have the money right now to do anything with this bathroom. What am I going to do?" I just told him, well I guess it will take a little time, but you'll make it look really nice. In my head, I was thinking "yeah - to remodel a bathroom is going to be expensive and you are not working right now..dummy."

MsGolightly

i have MAJOR control issues, myself. and at least i can recognize that now! i always want my A to say a certain thing, exactly as i want it, or do something that i'm somehow thinking in my head she should be doing, and it never happens!

i'd have to agree with prodigal's advice about everything here... very wise beyond her years

IO Storm

Hi.

To glance at and then re read your first post, I saw it this way...

He's in jail.
You are not.
You are right, you're trying to take care of yourself and have a good life..
He cannot stand the thought..

Because he's in jail..
Because of his own actions.
You are not.

I will not touch the bike thing. You are not crazy, it's just codependent behavior.

I bet when Mama takes up the slack you feel a little piece of the rug you are on start to slip.

Please see a counselor, keep posting.

(Oh, BTW, I was with a Mama's boy once, I truly do feel for you.)

Love.

IO Storm

denny57

Bjen, try not to be so hard on yourself. Reading your post, what you call "want" on your part actually appears to be a desire for control. I recognize it because I was the same way. I couldn't change my need for control until I acknowledged I had it.

Accepting that the nice things I wanted (most of all respect) were not going to be given to me by the man I chose was a hard pill to swallow. Yet, once it went down, life got better.

Take care of yourself.

Sunflower

Hey IO STORM----don't knock the As Mother---I am the mother of an A and it is a whole different story when it is your child---I have had an AH(ex) and a AS there is a HUGE difference...Doesn't make him a MAMAS BOY---she is just doing what she thinks is right---even though it may be wrong--she doesn't understand yet...Boy if I had to name all the people who blamed me as a mother of an AS--the list would be really long--''you should do this''-''why didn't you that''-easy for them to say there son is not dying litterally from alcohol abuse-laying in a gutter somewhere,,,,I brought my AS into this world-he will always be my responsibilty no matter what his age....I have supported him through thick and thin--yes when I let go-things changed for he better--but it can take a long time to get to that point.....

prodigal

Denny has hit the nail on the head and is imparting a great deal of wisdom when she says, "Accepting the nice things I wanted (most of all respect) were not going to be given to me by the man I chose ..." I have put up with more than mere disrespect. I DON'T EVEN COUNT. My opinions, my desires, my suggestions - diddly-squat. He doesn't even listen to me. So be it.

That is when I realized I could sit and swallow this garbage and continue to be a victim and a "less-than" or I could walk. It's not an easy walk, but I learned one extremely valuable lesson for myself, and that is: charming men who drink more than they should and play on our sympathies and do things to help us out of the "goodness" of their hearts (paying our bills, taking us out to lavish dinners, giving us flowers all the time) .... RUN!!!!!!!!!!!!

Please note: I said "drink more than they should." Really charming guys who move in fast and get us hooked in quickly and proceed to nail us down with some sort of commitment in a matter of months are a few other attributes that go with the above-mentioned description of when to RUN!

IO Storm

My mom and I were talking the other day about her past with her mother-in-law. My grandma (long long passed)
used to say, the chicks can peck at each other, put no chicken better EVER be caught peckin' at MY chicks!