How To Support An Abused Woman
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I have a friend in the program who is living with unbelievable abuse but can't seem to get out of the relationship.
I was trying to get her to leave, now we talk about if she's choosing to stay with him to try and protect herself in the relationship.
I have told her she may end up in a body bag one day but she very clearly has stated she isn't ready to leave.
Earthworm.
I was trying to get her to leave, now we talk about if she's choosing to stay with him to try and protect herself in the relationship.
I have told her she may end up in a body bag one day but she very clearly has stated she isn't ready to leave.
Earthworm.
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,358
How To Support An Abused Woman
(Sorry to hijack, but I thought I had begun a new thread when I began typing this....too late now)
Earthworm, thought this might be interesting for you to read:
The following are some tips from the book by Lundy Bancroft called Why Does He Do That? Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men. There's a section devoted to "Dealing with your own frustrations" and "What if She Doesn't Believe She is Being Abused?" that are also very helpful. Personally, I recommend buying or borrowing the book from the library. It's an eye-opening read. On to the book......
If you would like to make a significant difference in the life of an abused woman you care about, keep the following principle fresh in your mind..."Your goal is to be the complete opposite of what the abuser is".
The Abuser: Pressures her severely
So You Should: Be patient. Remember that it takes time for an abused woman to sort out her confusion and figure out how to handle her situation. It is not helpful for her to try to follow 'your' timetable for when she should stand up to her partner, leave him, call the police, or whatever step you want her to take. You need to respect her judgement regarding when she is ready to take action - something the abuser never does.
The Abuser: Talks down to her
So you Should: Address her as an equal. Avoid all traces of condescension or superior knowledge in your voice. This caution applies just as much or more to professionals. If you speak to an abused woman as if you are smarter or wiser than she is, or as if she is going through something that could never happen to you, then you inadvertently confirm exactly what the abuser has been telling her, which is that she is beneath him. Remember, your actions speak louder than your words.
The Abuser: Thinks he knows what is good for her better than she does
So You Should: Treat her as the expert on her own life. Don't assume that you know what she needs to do. I have sometimes given abused women suggestions that I thought were exactly right but turned out to be terrible for that particular situation. Ask her what she thinks might work and, without pressuring her, offer suggestions, respecting her explanations for why certain courses of action would not be helpful. Don't tell her what to do.
The Abuser: Dominates conversations
So You Should: Listen more and talk less. The temptation may be great to convince her what a 'jerk' he is, to analyze his motives, to give speeches covering entire chapters of this book. But talking too much inadvertently communicates to her that your thoughts are more important than hers, which is exactly how the abuser treats her. If you want her to value her own feelings and opinions, then you have to show her that you value them.
The Abuser: Believes he has the right to control her life
So You Should: Respect her right to self-determination. She is entitled to make decisions that are not exactly what you would choose, including the decision to stay with her abusive partner or to return to him after a separation. You can't convince a woman that her life belongs to her if you are simultaneously acting like it belongs to you. Stay by her even when she makes choices that you don't like.
The Abuser: Assumes he understands her children and their needs better than she does
So You Should: Assume that she is a competent, caring mother. Remember that there is no simple way to determine what is best for the children of an abused woman. Even if she leaves the abuser, the children's problems are not necessarily over, and sometimes abusers actually create worse difficulties for the children postseparation than before. You cannot help her to find the best path for her children unless you have a realistic grasp of the complicated set of choices that face her.
The Abuser: Thinks for her
So You Should: Think with her. Don't assume the role of teacher or rescuer. Instead, join forces with her as a respectful and equal team member.
Notice that being the opposite of the abuser does not simply mean saying the opposite of what he says. If he beseeches her with, "Don't leave me, don't leave me," and you stand on the other side badgering her with, "Leave him, leave him," she will feel that you're much like him; you are both pressuring her to accept your judgement of what she should do. Neither of you is asking the empowering question, "What do you want to do?"
Note from me: I'm not sure that I understand or agree with everything that is written here (like the part about the children...maybe because I don't have any), but perhaps others will get a different spin on it than I did. I always try to encourage that they contact a DV agency for the best possible support since they are trained to do that and I'm not.
And finally, please forgive the typos as I'm spell-check challenged!
Earthworm, thought this might be interesting for you to read:
The following are some tips from the book by Lundy Bancroft called Why Does He Do That? Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men. There's a section devoted to "Dealing with your own frustrations" and "What if She Doesn't Believe She is Being Abused?" that are also very helpful. Personally, I recommend buying or borrowing the book from the library. It's an eye-opening read. On to the book......
If you would like to make a significant difference in the life of an abused woman you care about, keep the following principle fresh in your mind..."Your goal is to be the complete opposite of what the abuser is".
The Abuser: Pressures her severely
So You Should: Be patient. Remember that it takes time for an abused woman to sort out her confusion and figure out how to handle her situation. It is not helpful for her to try to follow 'your' timetable for when she should stand up to her partner, leave him, call the police, or whatever step you want her to take. You need to respect her judgement regarding when she is ready to take action - something the abuser never does.
The Abuser: Talks down to her
So you Should: Address her as an equal. Avoid all traces of condescension or superior knowledge in your voice. This caution applies just as much or more to professionals. If you speak to an abused woman as if you are smarter or wiser than she is, or as if she is going through something that could never happen to you, then you inadvertently confirm exactly what the abuser has been telling her, which is that she is beneath him. Remember, your actions speak louder than your words.
The Abuser: Thinks he knows what is good for her better than she does
So You Should: Treat her as the expert on her own life. Don't assume that you know what she needs to do. I have sometimes given abused women suggestions that I thought were exactly right but turned out to be terrible for that particular situation. Ask her what she thinks might work and, without pressuring her, offer suggestions, respecting her explanations for why certain courses of action would not be helpful. Don't tell her what to do.
The Abuser: Dominates conversations
So You Should: Listen more and talk less. The temptation may be great to convince her what a 'jerk' he is, to analyze his motives, to give speeches covering entire chapters of this book. But talking too much inadvertently communicates to her that your thoughts are more important than hers, which is exactly how the abuser treats her. If you want her to value her own feelings and opinions, then you have to show her that you value them.
The Abuser: Believes he has the right to control her life
So You Should: Respect her right to self-determination. She is entitled to make decisions that are not exactly what you would choose, including the decision to stay with her abusive partner or to return to him after a separation. You can't convince a woman that her life belongs to her if you are simultaneously acting like it belongs to you. Stay by her even when she makes choices that you don't like.
The Abuser: Assumes he understands her children and their needs better than she does
So You Should: Assume that she is a competent, caring mother. Remember that there is no simple way to determine what is best for the children of an abused woman. Even if she leaves the abuser, the children's problems are not necessarily over, and sometimes abusers actually create worse difficulties for the children postseparation than before. You cannot help her to find the best path for her children unless you have a realistic grasp of the complicated set of choices that face her.
The Abuser: Thinks for her
So You Should: Think with her. Don't assume the role of teacher or rescuer. Instead, join forces with her as a respectful and equal team member.
Notice that being the opposite of the abuser does not simply mean saying the opposite of what he says. If he beseeches her with, "Don't leave me, don't leave me," and you stand on the other side badgering her with, "Leave him, leave him," she will feel that you're much like him; you are both pressuring her to accept your judgement of what she should do. Neither of you is asking the empowering question, "What do you want to do?"
Note from me: I'm not sure that I understand or agree with everything that is written here (like the part about the children...maybe because I don't have any), but perhaps others will get a different spin on it than I did. I always try to encourage that they contact a DV agency for the best possible support since they are trained to do that and I'm not.
And finally, please forgive the typos as I'm spell-check challenged!
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Excellent post, ICU. Maybe you could cut and paste it into a new thread so more will see it.
From the perspective of one who has lived with abuse for half of my life, these things would have made lots of difference to me. Being pressured from both sides of the issue just leaves a woman who is not ready to leave her spouse afraid to ask for assistance the next time because she doesn't want to hear all the 'I told you so' speeches.
I think the author may have been referring to men who will use the children as weapons to try to control the woman, which is very likely when he realizes he is losing his control over her. Most women will walk through flames to protect their kids from being hurt, and the abuser knows this and uses it. Mental and emotional manipulation of my children was something that my ex did many times, as well as threatening to withdraw financial support or take something away from them. Of course the child doesn't understand this insanity and is left wondering what in the world they did that caused daddy to want to punish them. It sucks!
From the perspective of one who has lived with abuse for half of my life, these things would have made lots of difference to me. Being pressured from both sides of the issue just leaves a woman who is not ready to leave her spouse afraid to ask for assistance the next time because she doesn't want to hear all the 'I told you so' speeches.
Originally Posted by ICU 
Note from me: I'm not sure that I understand or agree with everything that is written here (like the part about the children...maybe because I don't have any), but perhaps others will get a different spin on it than I did.
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Originally Posted by Earthworm
I have a friend in the program who is living with unbelievable abuse but can't seem to get out of the relationship.
I was trying to get her to leave, now we talk about if she's choosing to stay with him to try and protect herself in the relationship.
I have told her she may end up in a body bag one day but she very clearly has stated she isn't ready to leave.
I was trying to get her to leave, now we talk about if she's choosing to stay with him to try and protect herself in the relationship.
I have told her she may end up in a body bag one day but she very clearly has stated she isn't ready to leave.
I am relieved, because there was a gun in that house, too.
We just never know what will happen; or when.
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Join Date: Feb 2007
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ICU That was an awesome post.
I had people that just assume because I'm married to an ah that I should leave him ,and tell me if I don't, than I will eventually be abused by him, who the hell are they to tell me how to live my life? he has never even come close, other than raising his voice to me ,but don't normal people have confrontations ? I mean why is it just because you've learned about something ,you think you're a professional and have the right to ruin someone else's life .I mean I know they think they do out of kindness, but not everything is black or white, there is gray in this world. sorry for venting I hope that's ok here
I had people that just assume because I'm married to an ah that I should leave him ,and tell me if I don't, than I will eventually be abused by him, who the hell are they to tell me how to live my life? he has never even come close, other than raising his voice to me ,but don't normal people have confrontations ? I mean why is it just because you've learned about something ,you think you're a professional and have the right to ruin someone else's life .I mean I know they think they do out of kindness, but not everything is black or white, there is gray in this world. sorry for venting I hope that's ok here
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Notoshure,
It's absolultely fine to vent here! And you're right....not every alcoholic is abusive, and it's wrong to assume that they are.
I always 'try to' share the best of what I have to offer in the way of experience, resources, knowledge, etc. I know for sure that I am guilty of telling people just what they should do in their situation. Now that I am aware of it, I try like heck to catch myself....sometimes I'm successful, and sometimes I'm not. It is a constant battle for me; especially when someone is being physically hurt.
Now I just try to encourage people to take one step to get safe and that's by suggesting they contact a DV agency and talking with experts that 'do' know the right thing to say, and what 'not' to say.
I hope I plant a seed, answer questions that they bring up, encourage progress, and try (I really do try) to then let it go. Sometimes it's just so darned hard though. You care so much and don't want anyone to go through what you've gone through or worse.... But, you're 100% right, in the end, no one has the right to tell any other adult how to live their lives.
One thing though, when someone is tellilng me something that "I should do" and it ticks me off, I try to ask "what is their motive....is it to help or hurt me"? If it's to hurt me, well, enough said.....
But if it's to help me....how can I be angry with a good motive? Sure, I may not like how they handled it, but I can forgive that because I hope people forgive me for the things I don't handle properly!
P.S. Sometimes though, a friend (especially one who has been through it) can see through the 'suspected' abused person's denial....the signs become obvious to us). But there are 'more gentle' ways of approaching the subject.
It's absolultely fine to vent here! And you're right....not every alcoholic is abusive, and it's wrong to assume that they are.
I always 'try to' share the best of what I have to offer in the way of experience, resources, knowledge, etc. I know for sure that I am guilty of telling people just what they should do in their situation. Now that I am aware of it, I try like heck to catch myself....sometimes I'm successful, and sometimes I'm not. It is a constant battle for me; especially when someone is being physically hurt.
Now I just try to encourage people to take one step to get safe and that's by suggesting they contact a DV agency and talking with experts that 'do' know the right thing to say, and what 'not' to say.
I hope I plant a seed, answer questions that they bring up, encourage progress, and try (I really do try) to then let it go. Sometimes it's just so darned hard though. You care so much and don't want anyone to go through what you've gone through or worse.... But, you're 100% right, in the end, no one has the right to tell any other adult how to live their lives.
One thing though, when someone is tellilng me something that "I should do" and it ticks me off, I try to ask "what is their motive....is it to help or hurt me"? If it's to hurt me, well, enough said.....
But if it's to help me....how can I be angry with a good motive? Sure, I may not like how they handled it, but I can forgive that because I hope people forgive me for the things I don't handle properly!
P.S. Sometimes though, a friend (especially one who has been through it) can see through the 'suspected' abused person's denial....the signs become obvious to us). But there are 'more gentle' ways of approaching the subject.
Last edited by ICU; 03-10-2007 at 09:46 AM. Reason: Added P.S.
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I was a physically and emotionally abused married woman--I was beaten even when I was pregnant. All of you are right.I remember when I was in nursing school I had a professor (female) teaching us psych--she went on and on about how women who stay in abusive relationship do so because they want to--and all in the class were nodding their heads in agreement. I was always quiet in class but I let it rip!! I stood up and yelled--''until you have taken the walk don't talk the talk" Then I loudly told the class --Imagine this____
you are young
you are isolated
you have no money of your own
you have a baby
a home
and the husband comes home several times a week
and puts a shot gun to your head
telling you that if you leave him
he will kill you
and the baby
Well they were quiett for a while and I ran out of the class intears--I was no longer living that life--but I had in the past--how dare they assume I enjoyed it thats why I stayed!! My professor apologised to me and to the class.
How do you help some one??
By finding them a safe place to stay where they will get help---it's easy to say--get out of there---but to where? If you want to help you have to be financially ready to have the funds to get her out and get her an apartment and a lawyer--otherwise I don't know what she will do or where she will go--and don't say the shelter--been there done that---then where???
you are young
you are isolated
you have no money of your own
you have a baby
a home
and the husband comes home several times a week
and puts a shot gun to your head
telling you that if you leave him
he will kill you
and the baby
Well they were quiett for a while and I ran out of the class intears--I was no longer living that life--but I had in the past--how dare they assume I enjoyed it thats why I stayed!! My professor apologised to me and to the class.
How do you help some one??
By finding them a safe place to stay where they will get help---it's easy to say--get out of there---but to where? If you want to help you have to be financially ready to have the funds to get her out and get her an apartment and a lawyer--otherwise I don't know what she will do or where she will go--and don't say the shelter--been there done that---then where???
full of hope
Join Date: Feb 2007
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Originally Posted by frizzylynn
I stood up and yelled--''until you have taken the walk don't talk the talk"
It just dawned on me that all the people reading this are the understanding people! Sorry! Just hit a nerve I guess! Thanks Frizzy!
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and don't say the shelter--been there done that---then where???
Ours here, as do others have lots of help available now, even long term housing. In some instances we have even transferred sufferers to another city or state, when necessary. We have therapists that work with the abusees. We have programs to help them find work, or go back to school. We have day care for their kids while they are at work or in school. We have a "clothing shop" with beautiful donated clothes of all types and sizes for causual and work, and for the kids. We are not a large community. The whole county is just about 200,000 people and the city is not quite 100,000.
Many shelters around the country have everything we have here and more, much more.
We have landlords here, that make a point of donating one of or more of their units on a yearly basis to give the abusee a new start.
Oh and our shelter here, also has a 'wing' (I think it's 4 bedrooms) for abused men. Yes, there are women that abuse their mates also.
As to what you can do right now to help your friend Earthworm is be there for her. Let her know when she is ready to leave that you will help her if you can do that. Help her be prepared ahead of time for her "jump." Maybe she would feel better if she had an "emergency" bag packed with some clothes and copies of all documents she would want to have, stored with you that she can grab and run.
What has been said above about 'pressuring' her is true. She has to reach the end of her own rope. Sometimes all we can do is just "be there." Be a shoulder to lean on, be an ear to listen to them vent, and be prepared to go on a moments notice and pick them up and get them out of there, if you are able.
Several times, I have personally picked up the tab for a motel room when the shelter was full and there would not be a bed for a day or two and the abusee had to get out NOW. That's just me.
There are things I have done and do, that I would NEVER suggest that anyone else even attempt to do, roflmao but I get very passionate about abuse and even more so when children are involved. A long long time ago, I was where the abusees are now. I got out with a lot of help from others, so today I continue to pay back what was done for me so long ago. Sometimes just being an ear to listen or a shoulder to cry on can mean more than you will ever know to the lady who is so alone, so ashamed, so fearful. That alone can keep one going when there seems to be no light at the end of the tunnel. You are a good friend Earthworm to care the way you do!
Just be you Earthworm. She obviously knows you care! It is hard we know. Please continue to post and let us know how you are doing, we do care.
Love and hugs,
Last edited by laurie6781; 03-11-2007 at 04:32 PM.
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so many of the abused women i deal with have the misconception that their husbands drinking is what is causing the abuse. they think if their husbands would just stop drinking, that the abuse would stop.
and they also seem to think their husbands have ultra powers.....and i understand that, because i have lived it also.
i've heard many alcoholics speak at open meetings about their stories.....and how abusive they were when drinking and now that they are sober and working a program, all is well.
i always have kind of a hard time with that simple explanation, and think it feeds into the myth that alcoholism causes abuse....i believe there are alcoholics, and then there are alcoholics with other issues that are very deep and dark.
jmho.
but i fear for women and men that are in physically and verbally abusive relationships with an alcoholic.....fear that they are waiting for the miracle of sobriety, while the threat of violence increases.
we hear more and more everyday in the news of tragedies of this sort.
and they also seem to think their husbands have ultra powers.....and i understand that, because i have lived it also.
i've heard many alcoholics speak at open meetings about their stories.....and how abusive they were when drinking and now that they are sober and working a program, all is well.
i always have kind of a hard time with that simple explanation, and think it feeds into the myth that alcoholism causes abuse....i believe there are alcoholics, and then there are alcoholics with other issues that are very deep and dark.
jmho.
but i fear for women and men that are in physically and verbally abusive relationships with an alcoholic.....fear that they are waiting for the miracle of sobriety, while the threat of violence increases.
we hear more and more everyday in the news of tragedies of this sort.
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I hear 'ya Embraced. I too used to "think", no, actually, I used to "KNOW" that once the alcohol was gone, everything would be just fine. My mind would not accept anything different. Well, I've certainly been educated since then.
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chero.....i'm sorry, hon.....but i was in an abusive alcoholic marriage and went to domestic violence counseling....what they taught us was just was i posted.....alcoholism and violence are two seperate issues.
and, for me, it was true. my xh got sober for 10 months one time, and he was still abusive. i also learned that i wasn't the first woman he had been abusive with.
i'm sorry chero....but that is what i was taught in all the counseling i have been in.
((((((chero))))))
love to you
jeri
my heart is breaking for you, now!!!
and, for me, it was true. my xh got sober for 10 months one time, and he was still abusive. i also learned that i wasn't the first woman he had been abusive with.
i'm sorry chero....but that is what i was taught in all the counseling i have been in.
((((((chero))))))
love to you
jeri
my heart is breaking for you, now!!!
full of hope
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Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 1,170
I feel like I'm waiting for the bottom to drop out. If what you say is true then why did he only do it when he was drinking? Well, the physical was then. The verbal is actually when he is trying to quit. I'll endure the verbal if he'd just stop the drinking. But he doesn't make it through long enough to get over the withdrawals...which I'm guessing the verbal would stop eventually. And truthfully I'm not sure I could handle the verbal forever. Sometimes it is as bad as any of it. I don't know...I'm shaking inside.
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Hey there chero, have a big 
just cuz
We're all here for you and we all support you completely no matter what you do. Know that I am praying for you today and every day. I'm going to my meet in a few minutes and when we all hold hands and pray I will say your name so all of our prayers will go up for you.
Mike
just cuzWe're all here for you and we all support you completely no matter what you do. Know that I am praying for you today and every day. I'm going to my meet in a few minutes and when we all hold hands and pray I will say your name so all of our prayers will go up for you.
Mike
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chero....i can only speak for what happened between my xh and myself. and what i was taught in all the counseling i went through.
not everyone is alike and maybe your husband will be different.....who knows?
i don't know your story, so i can't possibly tell you that this will be the same for you.
i'll be saying a prayer for you too.
love to you
jeri
not everyone is alike and maybe your husband will be different.....who knows?
i don't know your story, so i can't possibly tell you that this will be the same for you.
i'll be saying a prayer for you too.
love to you
jeri
Last edited by embraced2000; 03-11-2007 at 05:34 PM.
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