Am I overreacting?
Practicing the lion's roar
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 291
Am I overreacting?
Hi everybody. I'm a new member and really need to touch base with people who know what I'm talking about.
I'm engaged to an alcoholic. We've been together for a year, engaged since March. I recognized early on that he drank a lot, but naturally didn't think it was a problem until I'd lived with him for a month or two. Like most people, I tried unsuccessfully to make him stop drinking. He'd promise, then fail. I told him that I won't marry him until this problem is resolved, and that he doesn't have forever to figure it out. Now his goal is to become a "social drinker" only, by the end of the holidays. Of course, his behavior doesn't indicate that he has any intention of not drinking at home anymore.
The thing is, he really isn't that bad, especially when I read about what other people have had to endure. We've had some nasty late night verbal-only fights in the past, where he's said some hurtful things and then turns around and wonders why I'm not in bed, but those have stopped, at least for now. He doesn't spend all our money, he doesn't disappear, he doesn't stay out until all hours at bars or mess around with other women. Lately he's been overly nice to me while he drinks, but it doesn't ring true anymore and fails to "thaw" me out.
The thing is, he really is the nicest, sweetest guy in the world. He's even still sweet when he's drunk, especially lately. He never blames me for his problems or his drinking, never expects me to cover for him or lie for him, never drives drunk, never asks me to drive him to the liquor store, doesn't spend all the household money on booze or at bars, etc. I have no doubt that he loves me dearly, maybe even more than the alcohol, but the alcohol has a tighter grip on him than I do.
So what's the problem? I feel like I'm compromising myself by staying with him, and yet I feel I haven't given him enough time to change. He says he "knows" he needs to quit because he wants a family some day, and he's had a few sober days now and then, but his actions make me think there's no end in sight. What's more, I understand that alcoholism is a progressive thing and that he's more likely to get a LOT worse before he gets better, and I can't stand the thought of watching him decline like that.
So, I'd like to hear people's reaction to this. Am I overreacting? Am I wrongly expecting the worst? Have I already stayed too long, knowing that I can't accept this way of life as my own? Am I just nuts altogether?
I'm engaged to an alcoholic. We've been together for a year, engaged since March. I recognized early on that he drank a lot, but naturally didn't think it was a problem until I'd lived with him for a month or two. Like most people, I tried unsuccessfully to make him stop drinking. He'd promise, then fail. I told him that I won't marry him until this problem is resolved, and that he doesn't have forever to figure it out. Now his goal is to become a "social drinker" only, by the end of the holidays. Of course, his behavior doesn't indicate that he has any intention of not drinking at home anymore.
The thing is, he really isn't that bad, especially when I read about what other people have had to endure. We've had some nasty late night verbal-only fights in the past, where he's said some hurtful things and then turns around and wonders why I'm not in bed, but those have stopped, at least for now. He doesn't spend all our money, he doesn't disappear, he doesn't stay out until all hours at bars or mess around with other women. Lately he's been overly nice to me while he drinks, but it doesn't ring true anymore and fails to "thaw" me out.
The thing is, he really is the nicest, sweetest guy in the world. He's even still sweet when he's drunk, especially lately. He never blames me for his problems or his drinking, never expects me to cover for him or lie for him, never drives drunk, never asks me to drive him to the liquor store, doesn't spend all the household money on booze or at bars, etc. I have no doubt that he loves me dearly, maybe even more than the alcohol, but the alcohol has a tighter grip on him than I do.
So what's the problem? I feel like I'm compromising myself by staying with him, and yet I feel I haven't given him enough time to change. He says he "knows" he needs to quit because he wants a family some day, and he's had a few sober days now and then, but his actions make me think there's no end in sight. What's more, I understand that alcoholism is a progressive thing and that he's more likely to get a LOT worse before he gets better, and I can't stand the thought of watching him decline like that.
So, I'd like to hear people's reaction to this. Am I overreacting? Am I wrongly expecting the worst? Have I already stayed too long, knowing that I can't accept this way of life as my own? Am I just nuts altogether?
Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Sunshine State
Posts: 410
Everybody’s going to tell you the condition is progressive - meaning it will escalate. Honey, you so need to read this. I don’t think you’re overreacting at all. The best thing you can do is take a step back and really think about your options and the entire situation - and then get some help via an Alanon group, because that will show you:
#1. You’re not crazy
#2. You’re not alone
Best wishes.
#1. You’re not crazy
#2. You’re not alone
Best wishes.
Always hopeful...
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Illinois
Posts: 429
It is impossible to predict how it will go for him....and you. It is a progressive thing, tho, that is for sure. The potential is there for worsening, BUT he may make a better choice than some have. Glad you found this site. Have you read any books, or Alanon helps alot. It was one of the very best things I have ever done, and helped with even more than living with my A.
Practicing the lion's roar
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 291
I've thought about al-anon but I have issues with the idea that it's a disease. Whether it is or not remains controversial and I don't really want to start that debate here. Most of the info I've gotten has come from the internet and from this site, which is exactly what I needed.
I know how hard it is to predict what he's going to do, but historically he's not known for making good decisions about his well-being. He doesn't set limits for himself, and the fact that he's trying to now, for the first time, is encouraging yet discouraging at the same time.
I read the sticky about "if I knew then" and I just can't believe it'll ever get that bad for me. Naive? Possibly.
I guess what I'm afraid of is the idea of getting used to living with this... where living contrary to my principles becomes familiar.
I know how hard it is to predict what he's going to do, but historically he's not known for making good decisions about his well-being. He doesn't set limits for himself, and the fact that he's trying to now, for the first time, is encouraging yet discouraging at the same time.
I read the sticky about "if I knew then" and I just can't believe it'll ever get that bad for me. Naive? Possibly.
I guess what I'm afraid of is the idea of getting used to living with this... where living contrary to my principles becomes familiar.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 2,579
Keep your eyes open. I'm glad you are here. My husband of 27yr just divorced me (I am 52yr) because over time (and progression...yes,unfortunately it IS true about the drinking and even worse in our case,the behaviors) drinking evidently was more powerful than our marriage and family. I never imagined it would happen,but it did. Addiction IS that strong. It is difficult for you I am sure, but better than to be like many of us with children and finances,etc all tied together. It just gets more complicated and difficult as the years go by.
Your guy sounds like mine did about 15 years of so into our marriage.
I know it is difficult. I am really just now allowing myself to look at the full truth of the situation...not that I have not heard the words for a long time.
Glad you are here. Keep the focus on yourself and don't expect him to change....my did for times but it is not something that "just happens" ( for the alcoholic or the ones who love them). Recovery takes action and learning a new way,but it can be done.
((hugs)) read and post...it becomes a little less scarey and confusing.
Your guy sounds like mine did about 15 years of so into our marriage.
I know it is difficult. I am really just now allowing myself to look at the full truth of the situation...not that I have not heard the words for a long time.
Glad you are here. Keep the focus on yourself and don't expect him to change....my did for times but it is not something that "just happens" ( for the alcoholic or the ones who love them). Recovery takes action and learning a new way,but it can be done.
((hugs)) read and post...it becomes a little less scarey and confusing.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 2,579
p.s. Reading has really helped me,too. A couple great books to start with that I'd recommend are "Co-Dependent No More" , "Under the Influence" and the "Getting Them Sober" books by Toby Rice Drews (you can find a few "preview chapters" at http://www.GettingThemSober.com ). Hope you find them as helpful as I did.
Glad you are here.
Glad you are here.
Practicing the lion's roar
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 291
I will keep reading and posting... thanks!
The more I read, the more struck I am at how utterly commonplace my situation is, which makes it that much harder to keep hoping for things to improve. For so many people, their A got worse and worse before getting better, if they ever got better, so why should mine get better without getting worse?
A lot of the fear has already left me. When it seems like he's trying to pick a fight, I diffuse. When he asks me why I seem sad, I tell him, but I don't get all dramatic about it anymore, especially if he's drunk when he asks.
The more I read, the more struck I am at how utterly commonplace my situation is, which makes it that much harder to keep hoping for things to improve. For so many people, their A got worse and worse before getting better, if they ever got better, so why should mine get better without getting worse?
A lot of the fear has already left me. When it seems like he's trying to pick a fight, I diffuse. When he asks me why I seem sad, I tell him, but I don't get all dramatic about it anymore, especially if he's drunk when he asks.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Arizona
Posts: 928
Originally Posted by AllTooSober
I've thought about al-anon but I have issues with the idea that it's a disease.
It is about us and how we react to PEOPLE in our lives whether they are not drinking or not. It is about our issues.
The common denominator in Alanon is that everyone in the rooms is where you are today.
what you get in Alanon is what you put into it. Remain open.
You might try 5 or 6 different meetings before you decide Alanon is not for you.
Practicing the lion's roar
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 291
Yeah I suppose "don't knock it until you try it" should apply to al-anon like it does everything else. 
Thanks so much for all the support, everybody! It helps so much more than anything my well-meaning friends and family can do, bless their hearts.
Thanks so much for all the support, everybody! It helps so much more than anything my well-meaning friends and family can do, bless their hearts.
Acting not reacting
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: My happy place
Posts: 1,788
Do you watch Dr. Phil?
Did you see the episode about the girl engaged to Mr Mooch who was an alcoholic? Now I understand that your fiance has a job and its not quite the same, but there was some good advice on that show about living with and being engaged to an alcoholic..food for thought.
Did you see the episode about the girl engaged to Mr Mooch who was an alcoholic? Now I understand that your fiance has a job and its not quite the same, but there was some good advice on that show about living with and being engaged to an alcoholic..food for thought.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 9
This is a really hard topic for me to read -- I am in AllTooSober's shoes (exactly a year into a relationship with a man exactly as she described).
The flip side of the coin is that I saw my parents go through the same cycle; my mother would "drink socially" eight or ten months out of the year and then binge and have a ten-day bout that would tear us all apart (sometimes my father would leave for several days; drive and golf or whatever). I watched my father go through what I am going through now -- the thoughts of leaving someone you love, etc...
What I did see in my parents was a relationship that ultimately lasted 55 years. Maybe because it was my father who was the sober one made it different. I am wondering if a woman is more inclined to end a long-term relationship because of alcohol when a man feels he "has to take care of his family." In the case of my father, he was a 25-year retired Captain from the military and from the South, so he had a huge loyalty streak in him.
You (and I!) are going to hear a hundred stories of why we should end our relationships now and get out while we can, before we become entrenched and making it harder to leave. But sometimes the 90% good is worth the 10% bad - or maybe I'm deluding myself as well. I'm in my mid-forties and am still looking for "true love." I have a man now (an alcoholic, yes) who treats me better than I have ever been treated in my life. For me, right now, staying the course and working on sobriety is my path... But I'm looking into Moderation.org.
The flip side of the coin is that I saw my parents go through the same cycle; my mother would "drink socially" eight or ten months out of the year and then binge and have a ten-day bout that would tear us all apart (sometimes my father would leave for several days; drive and golf or whatever). I watched my father go through what I am going through now -- the thoughts of leaving someone you love, etc...
What I did see in my parents was a relationship that ultimately lasted 55 years. Maybe because it was my father who was the sober one made it different. I am wondering if a woman is more inclined to end a long-term relationship because of alcohol when a man feels he "has to take care of his family." In the case of my father, he was a 25-year retired Captain from the military and from the South, so he had a huge loyalty streak in him.
You (and I!) are going to hear a hundred stories of why we should end our relationships now and get out while we can, before we become entrenched and making it harder to leave. But sometimes the 90% good is worth the 10% bad - or maybe I'm deluding myself as well. I'm in my mid-forties and am still looking for "true love." I have a man now (an alcoholic, yes) who treats me better than I have ever been treated in my life. For me, right now, staying the course and working on sobriety is my path... But I'm looking into Moderation.org.
Practicing the lion's roar
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 291
What's interesting here is that my mother has her own drinking issues that I've been concerned about for the last 10 or 15 years, or so. Basically she'd have several glasses of wine and then start in on my dad about things he did that hurt her 40 years ago. They are still together after 40 years. Mom's in counseling and I think she's let go of her past hurts mostly, but she still struggles with abstaining from wine.
I'm certain that seeing this has affected my thought processes, too. My A treats me remarkably well. He's thoughtful, considerate, generous, does countless "little things," etc. But... when he's drinking, he changes. He won't let you finish a sentence. He repeats the same conversation you just had 10 minutes ago like it had never happened. He gets sulky and petty if I don't react to him the way he wants... he'll say things like "I choose to believe that doesn't mean you don't love me anymore," etc. Are all his nice qualities really worth the rest of it? Since he drinks about 1/2 a bottle of Bacardi 151 an evening, is he ever really alcohol-free? Are his "sober" actions really not affected by the booze? How can I really believe that all his nice-ness isn't partially a means of manipulation brought on by the alcohol?
It seems like each post I make turns into a big, long-winded ramble.. sorry about that, but I have lots on my mind. Obviously. :-)
I'm certain that seeing this has affected my thought processes, too. My A treats me remarkably well. He's thoughtful, considerate, generous, does countless "little things," etc. But... when he's drinking, he changes. He won't let you finish a sentence. He repeats the same conversation you just had 10 minutes ago like it had never happened. He gets sulky and petty if I don't react to him the way he wants... he'll say things like "I choose to believe that doesn't mean you don't love me anymore," etc. Are all his nice qualities really worth the rest of it? Since he drinks about 1/2 a bottle of Bacardi 151 an evening, is he ever really alcohol-free? Are his "sober" actions really not affected by the booze? How can I really believe that all his nice-ness isn't partially a means of manipulation brought on by the alcohol?
It seems like each post I make turns into a big, long-winded ramble.. sorry about that, but I have lots on my mind. Obviously. :-)
Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Bronx, NY
Posts: 412
Hey All Too Sober-
Thanks for your post because it gave me a reminder I needed today. Very familiar to me! I had the same questions as you- I was with my bf a year as well and he wanted to marry me too, though we weren't officially engaged.
He was always kind to me, always sweet, always protected me from his addictions (I never even SAW him drunk, not once- if I'd lived with him like you do, it woud be a different story). Never, ever mistreated me and the only times we fought were to do with his lying about drinking/using and him disappearing. But even when we fought, he was never even verbally mean to me.
So when I read other people's horror stories here, I can't relate either. Sometimes I think I'm overreacting too.
But ultimately, even though he wasn't a monster-- not by a mile-- I still wasn't happy or being treated fairly in the relationship. There was too much stress for me to be happy, stress about his health, about why he always disappeared even by phone, stress about whether he was lying to me when he said he hadn't drank, meaningless promises, forgetting our plans... I started to feel like a fool in front of him.
I would never want him to be my husband, or the father of my children, given his addiction issues. IMO, that's not fair to kids.
So I had to stop contact and figure things out for ME, because I felt like I needed more out of this relationship than I was getting, and since none of his actions followed his words- he wasn't changing. He talked a good game, but he knew how to con his way through AA. I didn't want my life to go down that road, and invest years and years of my life into a potentially losing battle. There are no guarantees about when and if they'll hit a bottom. Mine hit a few lows I would consider bottoms already, with no lasting effects in terms of his lasting recovery. He's had a year and a half at the most, in the past.
So at the end of the day, it's all on you. An alcoholic or addict doesn't have to be abusive or a monster. They don't even have to have the label. Only you can decide what you can and want to live with, what you see in your future, and you're reponsible for making that future happen based on the thigns you CAN control-- which do not include him or his drinking (as hard as that isto accept). As long as you have issues with his drinking or behavior, it is a problem, no matter his label or severity, in my opinion.
But it's your life. None of this easy and I know how you feel and I am CERTAINLY not suggesting whether you should stay or go. Just stressing that you are responsible for your life-- and I struggle with this too, a hard lesson for me to learn every day. Take your time in figuring things out. (hugs)
Thanks for your post because it gave me a reminder I needed today. Very familiar to me! I had the same questions as you- I was with my bf a year as well and he wanted to marry me too, though we weren't officially engaged.
He was always kind to me, always sweet, always protected me from his addictions (I never even SAW him drunk, not once- if I'd lived with him like you do, it woud be a different story). Never, ever mistreated me and the only times we fought were to do with his lying about drinking/using and him disappearing. But even when we fought, he was never even verbally mean to me.
So when I read other people's horror stories here, I can't relate either. Sometimes I think I'm overreacting too.
But ultimately, even though he wasn't a monster-- not by a mile-- I still wasn't happy or being treated fairly in the relationship. There was too much stress for me to be happy, stress about his health, about why he always disappeared even by phone, stress about whether he was lying to me when he said he hadn't drank, meaningless promises, forgetting our plans... I started to feel like a fool in front of him.
I would never want him to be my husband, or the father of my children, given his addiction issues. IMO, that's not fair to kids.
So I had to stop contact and figure things out for ME, because I felt like I needed more out of this relationship than I was getting, and since none of his actions followed his words- he wasn't changing. He talked a good game, but he knew how to con his way through AA. I didn't want my life to go down that road, and invest years and years of my life into a potentially losing battle. There are no guarantees about when and if they'll hit a bottom. Mine hit a few lows I would consider bottoms already, with no lasting effects in terms of his lasting recovery. He's had a year and a half at the most, in the past.
So at the end of the day, it's all on you. An alcoholic or addict doesn't have to be abusive or a monster. They don't even have to have the label. Only you can decide what you can and want to live with, what you see in your future, and you're reponsible for making that future happen based on the thigns you CAN control-- which do not include him or his drinking (as hard as that isto accept). As long as you have issues with his drinking or behavior, it is a problem, no matter his label or severity, in my opinion.
But it's your life. None of this easy and I know how you feel and I am CERTAINLY not suggesting whether you should stay or go. Just stressing that you are responsible for your life-- and I struggle with this too, a hard lesson for me to learn every day. Take your time in figuring things out. (hugs)
Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 5,075
Bottom line: Are you living the life you want? Everything else, including quantities of booze ingested, is secondary to that. No relationship is perfect. If you have a 90% good v. 10% bad, and are happy with that, that is what matters.
I was once 1 or 2 years into my 18-year relationship, too. I understand that phase of it.
I was once 1 or 2 years into my 18-year relationship, too. I understand that phase of it.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: behind the viewfinder...
Posts: 6,278
Originally Posted by denny57
No relationship is perfect. If you have a 90% good v. 10% bad, and are happy with that, that is what matters.
L
Practicing the lion's roar
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 291
LaTeeDa, you've hit the nail on the head. If I was happy with the relationship, I wouldn't have come looking for this site. If he were sober, I can safely say that I would be happy with him. We still have other issues to work through, of course, but I feel confident that we could do it.
I just spent the last few hours reading the excerpts found on the gettingthemsober website, and man, is that helpful. Especially the part where it tells you to listen to their actions instead of their words, just like deax said above. His actions say everything I need to know. And, I got a private message telling me to listen to my instincts, which also resonates as excellent advice.
Now if I can only translate all this certainty into action, that would be good.
I just spent the last few hours reading the excerpts found on the gettingthemsober website, and man, is that helpful. Especially the part where it tells you to listen to their actions instead of their words, just like deax said above. His actions say everything I need to know. And, I got a private message telling me to listen to my instincts, which also resonates as excellent advice.
Now if I can only translate all this certainty into action, that would be good.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 9
Wow - AllTooSober, you could be me writing. My SO is sitting next to me, having just made me breakfast in bed and doing "all the little things."
But, LaTeeDa, there is the debate of the trade off. We can be happy in our relationships but still need this site.
Everyone, everywhere needs help for various things. In my previous relationship (one that lasted 12 years!), I had a man who had never finished high school, never got a driver's license, never cut his hair, saw a doctor, or went to the dentist. In the beginning, we were in our late-20s so it was no big deal. But 12 years later, I had a 40-something man still acting like a 20-something child who couldn't take responsibility for himself. No alcohol issues there, but ultimately more problematic and co-dependent than the situation if find myself in now, dealing with an alcoholic.
I don't believe in Prince Charming any more. No one is perfect so we use these sites to learn how to deal with problems. This site is for chemical addiction problems. Others have gambling addiction problems, or sex-addiction problems, or food addiction problems, or problems not relating to addiction at all, but perhaps abuse or neglect or compulsive behaviours. It doesn't make the relationship not worth working on and working through the problem...
But, LaTeeDa, there is the debate of the trade off. We can be happy in our relationships but still need this site.
Everyone, everywhere needs help for various things. In my previous relationship (one that lasted 12 years!), I had a man who had never finished high school, never got a driver's license, never cut his hair, saw a doctor, or went to the dentist. In the beginning, we were in our late-20s so it was no big deal. But 12 years later, I had a 40-something man still acting like a 20-something child who couldn't take responsibility for himself. No alcohol issues there, but ultimately more problematic and co-dependent than the situation if find myself in now, dealing with an alcoholic.
I don't believe in Prince Charming any more. No one is perfect so we use these sites to learn how to deal with problems. This site is for chemical addiction problems. Others have gambling addiction problems, or sex-addiction problems, or food addiction problems, or problems not relating to addiction at all, but perhaps abuse or neglect or compulsive behaviours. It doesn't make the relationship not worth working on and working through the problem...
Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Bronx, NY
Posts: 412
Originally Posted by Carolyn 93
In my previous relationship (one that lasted 12 years!), I had a man who had never finished high school, never got a driver's license, never cut his hair, saw a doctor, or went to the dentist. In the beginning, we were in our late-20s so it was no big deal. But 12 years later, I had a 40-something man still acting like a 20-something child who couldn't take responsibility for himself.
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