minnie

This thread is really interesting to me. I am what some of you might consider a "normie". I love evenings like that you are describing. I love them because of the atmosphere and the fact that I am connecting on various levels with people around me. Sometimes I might drink. Sometimes I might not. But that's got nothing to do with my enjoyment.

I am very surprised and vaguely insulted by some comments suggesting that people like me have a problem but don't know it yet.

c'est la vie

I think this quote is more accurate in describing the folks hanging out at the bar/restaurant than the couple that suggest that everyone drinking surely must be a closet drunk who needs self examination. It leaves open the possibility that the rest of the folks are having a casual drink and truly enjoying conversation and atmosphere.

It's difficult for some of us alcoholics to imagine having a drink without the powerful draw for more or the total immersion in the drinking that all other enjoyment is overshadowed, but apparently it really is possible.


And I believe that ALL people could benefit from more self awareness, but it doesn't have anything to do with whether or not one drinks a little, a lot, or not at all.

Musky

The idea that most people should follow a twelve step program at some point to gauge where they stand is over the top in my opinion. Seems to me that opinion reflects a feeling of self-righteousness and judgementalism. It indicates to me that a little anger is being directed at the world as a whole.

I've never been to a meeting. I know I have a problem. I do not assume that most people do, or that they should have to examine their lives in the way I've finally understood that I need to.

I agree with c'est la vie that a little self examination never hurts, but that type of reflection can be applied to how we treat people in general, how we do business, how we treat the environment, or any number of things. No twelve steps needed for that type of thinking.

Just my opinion. Sorry if it offends anyone.

Kevin

CarolD

This is the Alcoholism Forum
we are here to help each other stay sober.

Period.

Clarity4me

I agree with Carol D, Its a free country. If you dont like to drink or eat chicken or go swimmiing, whatever, its your perogative. I know "normal people who dont drink, they never drank, they dont like to drink. I myself just liked to drink too much, and it got me in trouble. I dont think there is any "normal" level of drinking. What is it? 2 beers a week. 6 whiskeys a month? Wine at a wedding? I mean what is "normal" drinking. It would help to clarify this.

Don S

There are 'moderate' drinking guidelines which can be useful. From Moderation Management's web site:
-- Do not drink every day. MM suggests that you abstain from drinking alcohol at least 3 or 4 days per week.

-- Women who drink more than 3 drinks on any day, and more than 9 drinks per week, may be drinking at harmful levels.

-- Men who drink more than 4 drinks on any day, and more than 14 drinks per week, may be drinking at harmful levels.

Peter

"Normal" drinking for me, would be those people who do not give alcohol a second thought. These people do not have to contemplate whether they should have a drink or not or how much they should drink. They can take it or leave it. Alcohol simply is not an issue. It is the man or the woman who can sit at a dinner table with one glass of wine for the whole evening and then get up and walk away with half undrunk.

People who have to observe "moderation guidelines" are simply not "normal drinkers" in my opinion. I will even go on to add that trying to tell someone with a known history of drinking problems how they can drink "moderately" or "normally" may be downright deadly.

jimhere

If by normal, you mean the non-alcoholic type who can drink moderately and can take it or leave it alone, I definitely am not one of those.

I'm not sure what people mean when they say "normal." I too dislike the term "normie." It sounds slightly derisive when an alcoholic or addict refers to to a non-alcoholic or non-addict. Like we are special in some way.

If by normal you mean the people who settle for the average workaday life of get up, go to work, come home, go to bed, pay the bills, I am not one of those. Although that is largely what my life looks like to the person who doesn't know me. I have never been able to settle for "normal." I couldn't settle for that when I was five years old and still can't. Some of us need to know that life has depth & meaning beyond the ordinary-it has kept me striving and reaching all of my life. I've always had a restless streak. I'm grateful that I have been able to find some meaning to life beyond the ordinary, everyday life. But I still have to get up and go to work every day.

So, I don't know if I am normal or not. From what I've seen, I don't know if I want to be. But I am alcoholic, albeit one who hasn't had a drink in a long time and I can live "out there" with "them" and they don't know any different.

leviathon

For me the bottom line is not whether or not other people are drinking and unaware of their problems because they think they are normal. For me I am not normal in how I used to over indulge. I drank each and every night to black out. That is not normal, nor is it healthy.

My view is not to judge others. Let them do as they will. The majority of the population does not have a problem drinking one or two and leaving it. A minority have an issue with it. End of story.

Peace, Levi

2dayzmuse

I think the principles of the 12 steps could help anyone in every aspect of their life such as work, family, personal growth, facing and ridding them selves of fears and weaknesses. It doesn't have to strictly apply to the alcoholic only.

Five

What a great post Jim....

minnie

Normal is a simply a setting on a washing machine, I have heard it said.

There is no "us" and "them" in my mind. I just have different ways of avoiding the painful stuff than some others. But I'm learning.....

brigid

Same!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ... everyone has their challenge in life to overcome, mine is alcohol ... that is all!! There are support groups and forums for all sorts of things on the web ... sort of makes you wonder what is normal, really, everyone is out there just living life. Me being an alcoholic is part of life I have to live with, same as someone with a beautiful face and figure has to live with jealousy and falsity (ok, you are thinking that the face and figure would be a more fun challenge).

love and peace

leviathon

LOL awesome analogy...

BSPGirl

Normal is a setting on the dryer.

Marte

2dayzmuse

Normal is something you compare yourself to as result of past life experiences. I drank day in and day out and if I stopped I would go into withdrawal. I remember I just wanted to feel normal again. To me, normal was a day where I didn't have to depend on alcohol as my source of motivation, or functionality.

Peter

"Normal" is what happens when I eat too much broccoli and cheese.

MNGirlyGirl

Normal is a town in Alaska!!

2dayzmuse

Normal is never what you perceive it to be. Hah...

sloane2468

When I was growing up normal to me was watching adults have before dinner cocktails, with dinner wine, after dinner liqueur. When I was in my teens normal was drinking to get drunk period. Adulthood normal was drinking until I passed out otherwise what was the point? I worked in the clubs and at the time all club owners gave out drink tokes for an after shift drink to employees. The people that would have their drink and go home always struck me as the abynormal ones. The term normal is tricky, maybe because I have no idea what the hell it is. Mainstream thinking? a mold that is set by society? I will abuse any substance, doesn't matter what it is. I want to stay clean, I want a better life for myself, and will never know the meaning of normal and that's okay too.