A Million Little Pieces
NOT EVEN 1 CLUB!!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: When I find myself, I'll let you know!
Posts: 1,835
Whoa!! Everybody calm down. This is a discussion. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.
I read alot of books. Even if they aren't very good, I read them to the end. Always thinking, this has to get better. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't.
My sponsor just gave me this book a week ago. I was getting ready to start reading it and all this came up. Anybody that knows me, knows that I stay away from debates. Nobody ends up "right" and somebody usually gets hurt. That is not my intention with this thread. I am trying to work through some feelings that I am having and learn the lesson that is beneath.
I am seriously loosing sleep over this and have been bothered throughout the day. I was told last night that you can measure your emotional maturity on how big the thing is that is bothering you. GEE THANKS!! I'm as emotionally mature as a new born, because this book is kicking my butt!! LOL
So, I'm not trying to judge this man. His ways don't have to be my ways. I'm am thankful that many of you have been helped by his book. I too am learning something, and I haven't even read it yet. I think what is bothering me is the honesty thing. Because of AA, I live my life with rigerous honesty. (I didn't post this thread on AA forum, because I didn't know it was going to bring up an AA issue in me. So I'm sorry for the mention of AA in the alcoholics forum.) I am comfortable with AA and sharing my problems because of that fact. That people understand, that I could be where they have been. If people were to lie about what it was like, then how could I believe in their, what it is like now? It's sharing our ES&H.
It has been suggested that I not read the book. People that I also trust are or have read it. Someone told me to pray about it. To some of you, this may seem trivial, but to me, I have a lesson to learn, somewhere. I am getting ready to grow, somehow.
So, no, I'm not bashing this man. Just trying to figure out what is bothering me. And BTW, I'm going to start reading it today!!
Thanks for all your comments and for helping me work through this. Whatever it is!?!?!
Missy
I read alot of books. Even if they aren't very good, I read them to the end. Always thinking, this has to get better. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't.
My sponsor just gave me this book a week ago. I was getting ready to start reading it and all this came up. Anybody that knows me, knows that I stay away from debates. Nobody ends up "right" and somebody usually gets hurt. That is not my intention with this thread. I am trying to work through some feelings that I am having and learn the lesson that is beneath.
I am seriously loosing sleep over this and have been bothered throughout the day. I was told last night that you can measure your emotional maturity on how big the thing is that is bothering you. GEE THANKS!! I'm as emotionally mature as a new born, because this book is kicking my butt!! LOL
So, I'm not trying to judge this man. His ways don't have to be my ways. I'm am thankful that many of you have been helped by his book. I too am learning something, and I haven't even read it yet. I think what is bothering me is the honesty thing. Because of AA, I live my life with rigerous honesty. (I didn't post this thread on AA forum, because I didn't know it was going to bring up an AA issue in me. So I'm sorry for the mention of AA in the alcoholics forum.) I am comfortable with AA and sharing my problems because of that fact. That people understand, that I could be where they have been. If people were to lie about what it was like, then how could I believe in their, what it is like now? It's sharing our ES&H.
It has been suggested that I not read the book. People that I also trust are or have read it. Someone told me to pray about it. To some of you, this may seem trivial, but to me, I have a lesson to learn, somewhere. I am getting ready to grow, somehow.
So, no, I'm not bashing this man. Just trying to figure out what is bothering me. And BTW, I'm going to start reading it today!!
Thanks for all your comments and for helping me work through this. Whatever it is!?!?!
Missy
Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 8,709
Originally Posted by nocellphone
Since I have not (and prob'ly will not) read his book or seen his interviews, etc., can someone who has tell me their impression as to whether he wrote the book to help other struggling alcoholics find a way out of their personal hell or simply to make a million little dollars?
I find that motives reveal integrity, or the lack thereof.
I find that motives reveal integrity, or the lack thereof.
In a perfect world, this is what happened, in my mind...
He set out to write an account of his experiences in a historical fiction format.
And the original manuscript was probably just that.
But the money men heard more ding! ding! ding! and the possibility of buying more bling for their bourgeois wives if they published it as a true, autobiographical account of a scumbag turned respectable.
More green for the movie rights, that way...
Sure would be interesting to see some investigative reporting done about the genesis of the book, and who actually decided what.
To quote your good friend, Cello...
Music is everybody's possession. It's only publishers who think that people own it.
J. Lennon
Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Leaving Sparta
Posts: 2,912
Originally Posted by Autumn
One thing I cannot do, in all fairness, is compare his bottom or actual experiences to mine. Because I don't know what his truth is now, I'm not in a position to say he had a high bottom anyway.
Whether we feel this book was helpful or not there is still something fudamentally wrong with trying to pass off falsehood as facts to even one individual let alone thousands.
It is a practice long abused by the church which has caused suffering on countless people.
alconaut
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Motor City
Posts: 729
Originally Posted by Peter
Whether we feel this book was helpful or not there is still something fudamentally wrong with trying to pass off falsehood as facts to even one individual let alone thousands.
And although I have not read the book, I will express an opinion based on research, reviews, and facts I have read about it.
1000 Post Club
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Recoveryville, USA
Posts: 1,297
If he kept a journal in rehab, he certainly didnt mention it in the book.
He wrote that he was given a pad to write his inventory on and a box of crayons, but thats it as far as writing.
Hey, to each his own opinion of the book, right?
In a non-fiction book, the author should not have "creative license" in my opinion. Just my opinion.
Whatever is meant to be with the outcome of this new accusation, will be.
He wrote that he was given a pad to write his inventory on and a box of crayons, but thats it as far as writing.
Hey, to each his own opinion of the book, right?
In a non-fiction book, the author should not have "creative license" in my opinion. Just my opinion.
Whatever is meant to be with the outcome of this new accusation, will be.
alconaut
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Motor City
Posts: 729
NCP, I'm sorry I overlooked this part of your post.... I hope my response didn't insinuate to you that I had read it.
Originally Posted by nocellphone
Since I have not (and prob'ly will not) read his book or seen his interviews, etc., can someone who has tell me their impression as to whether he wrote the book to help other struggling alcoholics find a way out of their personal hell or simply to make a million little dollars?
I find that motives reveal integrity, or the lack thereof.
I find that motives reveal integrity, or the lack thereof.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: living in recovery
Posts: 75
Please for those who are condemning the book, how can you if you haven't read it?
For those who suggest he is 'abstinent or dry'. Who says so? Are you qualified to make this comment? Sobriety is a personal thing and not up for judgement by others.
For one who said he had not been to jail....wrong, he was in jail for 3 months after he was released from rehab. I guess you didn't read the book.
To one who suggested he wait to have dental work done when he was released from rehab....the man's face was smashed up. Painful eh?
I have been sober for a number of years. The first 10 years were in AA. The following 14+ years have not been AA. I'm still sober. Should I be classed as simply 'dry' or abstinent' by those who feel free to judge others.
I learned a lot from this book and have passed it on to an addict I feel will benefit from reading it. It certainly educated me in a number of areas.
Read the book before you condemn it or the author. Then you will find out if he attended meetings. He may not have liked them but he was there. He made mention of a number of the speakers at these meetings.
For those who suggest he is 'abstinent or dry'. Who says so? Are you qualified to make this comment? Sobriety is a personal thing and not up for judgement by others.
For one who said he had not been to jail....wrong, he was in jail for 3 months after he was released from rehab. I guess you didn't read the book.
To one who suggested he wait to have dental work done when he was released from rehab....the man's face was smashed up. Painful eh?
I have been sober for a number of years. The first 10 years were in AA. The following 14+ years have not been AA. I'm still sober. Should I be classed as simply 'dry' or abstinent' by those who feel free to judge others.
I learned a lot from this book and have passed it on to an addict I feel will benefit from reading it. It certainly educated me in a number of areas.
Read the book before you condemn it or the author. Then you will find out if he attended meetings. He may not have liked them but he was there. He made mention of a number of the speakers at these meetings.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Kingston, NY
Posts: 390
and the possibility of buying more bling for their bourgeois wives
I had a feeling that things would get a little heated over this topic. I have to say I'm with Peter and FoB - creative license belongs in fiction, not non-fiction, and it's just wrong to pass something off as fact that apparently is not.
I think it's great that people have gotten sober thanks to his words, and I don't doubt that many, many people really loved the book and the author's writing style.
In the grand scheme of things, this is really a tempest in a teapot. Ultimately, I suppose the fact that people have been helped trumps those of us who don't care for Mr. Frey's alleged lack of integrity. I'm not bashing the man, so please don't accuse me of doing so. I am simply stating my opinion.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 8,709
Originally Posted by quercusalba
....or, the possibility of buying more bling for their bourgeois *husbands*!
However, I would like to believe that somewhere inside me, there is the belief that female publishers simply would not have engaged in such behavior, if indeed such is the case.
Which it probably isn't, anyway
alconaut
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Motor City
Posts: 729
Originally Posted by Dan
I stand properly chastised for my terminal jockness
However, I would like to believe that somewhere inside me, there is the belief that female publishers simply would not have engaged in such behavior, if indeed such is the case.
Which it probably isn't, anyway
However, I would like to believe that somewhere inside me, there is the belief that female publishers simply would not have engaged in such behavior, if indeed such is the case.
Which it probably isn't, anyway
Bling!
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Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Zion, Illinois
Posts: 3,411
I've not read the book and won't! Don't need to. My concern is this. If a person is on prescribed drugs to deal with a problem, are they supposed to quit those drugs in order to be "sober?" Frey said he had his teeth worked on without the aid of any drugs, and his attitude was if this is just physical pain, "bring it on." This is not something I'd recommend to someone. How many people will read or hear Frey say this and make a decision that could eventually hurt them? Furthermore, my sobriety is such that if I broke a leg, or was hurt in an auto accident, I'd want medical attention and if drugs were used, so be it. I have faith that if I do what I need to do and my motives aren't to get "high", I'll be fine. In no way would I try to play and "tough guy" or the "martyr" by going drug free. I'm not saying his sobriety isn't real to him. I'm saying I don't want any part of what he has to offer. I think the more appropriate title for his book would be, "A Million Little Dollars."
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: canada
Posts: 170
Again, nothing that was written in the book, the dentist stuff, the rehab experience and his method of sobriety, was written as a program of recovery. I don't believe he said in the book that anyone who is an addict/alcoholic should have surgery without pain killers, this is an event in a book. Fiction or non fiction, the writer is not encouraging others to follow his example and go to the dentist and get root canals without pain killers.
I also do not recall him telling anyone to go off doctor prescribed drugs either. How is this even part of the debate here? I've had people in AA rooms tell me to go off prescribed medications, I've had people in my regular life tell me to stay on medications. When I made my choice about certain medications, this was a choice made with my doctor. Reading a Million Little Pieces played absolutely zero role in my choices to take or continue taking certain medications. If I was making my serious life choices based on a book that was recommended by Oprah, I think I would have some other issues in life that might need addressing.
You say that you won't read the book because you don't want whatever he has. That is cool, everyone is entilted to their own opinions. Others may not want what you have either. Some may think my methods of recovery are ridiculous and I may feel the same about theirs. It is really all relative as there is no set standard for general sobriety. It's not like addiction comes with a manual or a guideline! As far as I'm aware, James Frey never touted the book as a guideline or manual for recovery either. If it is helping people to get sober, great. Are we going to see a huge influx of people demanding dentistry work without pain killers? I don't think so.
If his profiting from the book offends you, the solution is to not buy it. My addictions counseller profits everytime I see her. She does get paid for what she does. Should I consider our time together as something less than what it is because she gets paid for it? Why shouldn't people get paid for work put out. He wrote a book, he was promoted on Oprah which gave his book a hefty boost and he is making money from it. That is how the world works, we get paid for work done. Quite frankly, all this new controversy will only boost his profits more.
Someone mentioned that in a non-fiction book, there should be no creative license. I think that if the book is being sold and promoted as a refrence manual then yes, creative license about facts would have no place. But the book is an autobiography, a memoir. It is a re-telling of a life from that person's perspective. Sometimes in recalling events the facts are different from what may be remembered. If I was writing an autobiography I would certainly use creative license. If I was writing an account of addiction as a refrence guide, clearly creative license would have no place.
I also do not recall him telling anyone to go off doctor prescribed drugs either. How is this even part of the debate here? I've had people in AA rooms tell me to go off prescribed medications, I've had people in my regular life tell me to stay on medications. When I made my choice about certain medications, this was a choice made with my doctor. Reading a Million Little Pieces played absolutely zero role in my choices to take or continue taking certain medications. If I was making my serious life choices based on a book that was recommended by Oprah, I think I would have some other issues in life that might need addressing.
You say that you won't read the book because you don't want whatever he has. That is cool, everyone is entilted to their own opinions. Others may not want what you have either. Some may think my methods of recovery are ridiculous and I may feel the same about theirs. It is really all relative as there is no set standard for general sobriety. It's not like addiction comes with a manual or a guideline! As far as I'm aware, James Frey never touted the book as a guideline or manual for recovery either. If it is helping people to get sober, great. Are we going to see a huge influx of people demanding dentistry work without pain killers? I don't think so.
If his profiting from the book offends you, the solution is to not buy it. My addictions counseller profits everytime I see her. She does get paid for what she does. Should I consider our time together as something less than what it is because she gets paid for it? Why shouldn't people get paid for work put out. He wrote a book, he was promoted on Oprah which gave his book a hefty boost and he is making money from it. That is how the world works, we get paid for work done. Quite frankly, all this new controversy will only boost his profits more.
Someone mentioned that in a non-fiction book, there should be no creative license. I think that if the book is being sold and promoted as a refrence manual then yes, creative license about facts would have no place. But the book is an autobiography, a memoir. It is a re-telling of a life from that person's perspective. Sometimes in recalling events the facts are different from what may be remembered. If I was writing an autobiography I would certainly use creative license. If I was writing an account of addiction as a refrence guide, clearly creative license would have no place.
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Location: Recoveryville, USA
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Fiction: An imaginative creation or a pretense that does not represent actuality but has been invented.*
Non-fiction would be the opposite? Something that represents fact or actuality, as something that actually occured.
A self bio is an accounting of what actually occured in a persons life. Creative license would be adding or changing something that did not actually happen. Im my opinion, that is.
Non-fiction would be the opposite? Something that represents fact or actuality, as something that actually occured.
A self bio is an accounting of what actually occured in a persons life. Creative license would be adding or changing something that did not actually happen. Im my opinion, that is.
learning
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Where I need to be
Posts: 310
Originally Posted by FriendofBill
He described it as a lecture, not a meeting, I believe.
Not that it matters really because I do think most of his story is B.S.
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Chicago IL
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[QUOTE=Chabroso] For one who said he had not been to jail....wrong, he was in jail for 3 months after he was released from rehab. QUOTE]
Actually, the jail after rehab appears to have been an "embellishment."
Actually, the jail after rehab appears to have been an "embellishment."
Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 8,709
It's starting to sound like a who's more sober contest...
Who gives a ****?
James Frey describes himself as a drug addict, an alcoholic, a liar and a thief.
What's the big surprise if he's a shyster, folks?
I know dudes and dudettes that have done and experienced far worse than anything Frey describes.
Whether it was real in his case or not, stand assured that somewhere in the world, this very minute, one of us is going through some kind of agony that makes A Million Little Pieces look like an afternoon with Mister Rogers.
If James Frey's story serves to open the eyes of one drunk, purpose has been served.
He'll meet his fate in a courtroom filled with Armani suits who will be more than happy to squabble over how much money he needs to pay back.
There's another Hollywood script in the making.
CNN tonight, peeps.
Vultures with popcorn tune in
Who gives a ****?
James Frey describes himself as a drug addict, an alcoholic, a liar and a thief.
What's the big surprise if he's a shyster, folks?
I know dudes and dudettes that have done and experienced far worse than anything Frey describes.
Whether it was real in his case or not, stand assured that somewhere in the world, this very minute, one of us is going through some kind of agony that makes A Million Little Pieces look like an afternoon with Mister Rogers.
If James Frey's story serves to open the eyes of one drunk, purpose has been served.
He'll meet his fate in a courtroom filled with Armani suits who will be more than happy to squabble over how much money he needs to pay back.
There's another Hollywood script in the making.
CNN tonight, peeps.
Vultures with popcorn tune in
Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 261
I read the book and loved it...I have no idea whether it is true or not, but love it anyhow...I couldn't put the book down and then purchased "My Friend Leonard" and read that as well...I'm going to love the book just as much, whether real or not, because addiction is real and at least I know that for sure...since it has affected my life in a very negative (and sometimes unbearable) way.
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