A Thank You
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: London
Posts: 501
A Thank You
To all of those members who post on here with views that do not fit, exactly, with the message of AA.
I am really not trying to start a war, I just want to say its comforting to read people who are not so dogmatic, and staunch as the people around me in some of my meetings. It is frightning to be in AA and "not want what people have", but feel to scared to THINK differently let alone anything else.
So thanks for the members who are cynical of AA and dont swallow huge parts of it. Because I dont swallow a lot of it. And I am two years sover and have done the steps. And most of you say you go to meetings which proves to me that not everyone in meetings are some glassy eyed religious lunatics (because, believe me, many of them are).
I feel connected to people who are individuals.
My primary purpose is to stay sober and help another alcaholic.
I am really not trying to start a war, I just want to say its comforting to read people who are not so dogmatic, and staunch as the people around me in some of my meetings. It is frightning to be in AA and "not want what people have", but feel to scared to THINK differently let alone anything else.
So thanks for the members who are cynical of AA and dont swallow huge parts of it. Because I dont swallow a lot of it. And I am two years sover and have done the steps. And most of you say you go to meetings which proves to me that not everyone in meetings are some glassy eyed religious lunatics (because, believe me, many of them are).
I feel connected to people who are individuals.
My primary purpose is to stay sober and help another alcaholic.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: NYC, NY
Posts: 193
I hear ya!
If it weren't for my weekly agnostic AA meeting (although I have a HP) which is filled with old timers - most with 20 plus years of sobriety - who have mosly done it their way, who are filled with irreverence, intelligence, humor and zest for life, who allow me to spill out any negativity or fanaticism that I experience in other traditional meetings, I would not be able to be in the program.
We end each meeting with a simple "Live and Let Live" rather than a prayer.
If it weren't for my weekly agnostic AA meeting (although I have a HP) which is filled with old timers - most with 20 plus years of sobriety - who have mosly done it their way, who are filled with irreverence, intelligence, humor and zest for life, who allow me to spill out any negativity or fanaticism that I experience in other traditional meetings, I would not be able to be in the program.
We end each meeting with a simple "Live and Let Live" rather than a prayer.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: London
Posts: 501
Originally Posted by Time4Me
I hear ya!
If it weren't for my weekly agnostic AA meeting (although I have a HP) which is filled with old timers - most with 20 plus years of sobriety - who have mosly done it their way, who are filled with irreverence, intelligence, humor and zest for life, who allow me to spill out any negativity or fanaticism that I experience in other traditional meetings, I would not be able to be in the program.
We end each meeting with a simple "Live and Let Live" rather than a prayer.
If it weren't for my weekly agnostic AA meeting (although I have a HP) which is filled with old timers - most with 20 plus years of sobriety - who have mosly done it their way, who are filled with irreverence, intelligence, humor and zest for life, who allow me to spill out any negativity or fanaticism that I experience in other traditional meetings, I would not be able to be in the program.
We end each meeting with a simple "Live and Let Live" rather than a prayer.
Said in a droll voice: Today I have serentiy, because I hand it over. Today I dont fear anything because I hand it over.
Of course, not everyone in AA is like that, far from it - but I have just had some bad experiences recently. Sometimes I put personalites before principals. I did not get sober to serve God.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 8,709
Hi Mill.
The reasons I keep coming back to SoberRecovery are much the same that compel me to get up off my ass and get to a meeting, even on nights when I'd rather just goof off or hide under the covers, depending on my mood. When I'm sitting in a room with others, I have the exceptional gift of looking at me. And yeah, we do come in many shapes and flavors, don't we?
One thing I learned, and not easily, is that as long as I include myself in the equation that may ultimately solve the problem that's making me twitchy, then the odds are good that the peers I don't see eye to eye with, and myself, will find a comfort zone where we can meet.
Different views than mine abound in society in general.
Given that AA is formed of members of that society, it follows that our groups will be representative of all of us. I believe it is ultimately my responsibility to do a triage of sorts, take what I need, and leave the rest behind, as the slogan goes.
I'm better at that, but I still fall short some days.
I still think it's all about me sometimes
The reasons I keep coming back to SoberRecovery are much the same that compel me to get up off my ass and get to a meeting, even on nights when I'd rather just goof off or hide under the covers, depending on my mood. When I'm sitting in a room with others, I have the exceptional gift of looking at me. And yeah, we do come in many shapes and flavors, don't we?
One thing I learned, and not easily, is that as long as I include myself in the equation that may ultimately solve the problem that's making me twitchy, then the odds are good that the peers I don't see eye to eye with, and myself, will find a comfort zone where we can meet.
Different views than mine abound in society in general.
Given that AA is formed of members of that society, it follows that our groups will be representative of all of us. I believe it is ultimately my responsibility to do a triage of sorts, take what I need, and leave the rest behind, as the slogan goes.
I'm better at that, but I still fall short some days.
I still think it's all about me sometimes
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: London
Posts: 501
Yes, that saying you dont have to like everyone but love them. I agree.
I do get resentful about the God thing (mainly - I am sure - because it requires a diplition of my ego) - and find people who think and talk in AA slogans very uncomftable. But, for the sake of the world and myself, we have to grow up and learn to live with as many people as possible. It makes sense.
I take my sobreity bit by bit by bit and try and let go of how I think the future is going to be (thats where I get in a knot).
Coming on SR has relieved me of a lot of guilt because the people, I think, are a lot more open and often human than what you hear in meetings.
I do get resentful about the God thing (mainly - I am sure - because it requires a diplition of my ego) - and find people who think and talk in AA slogans very uncomftable. But, for the sake of the world and myself, we have to grow up and learn to live with as many people as possible. It makes sense.
I take my sobreity bit by bit by bit and try and let go of how I think the future is going to be (thats where I get in a knot).
Coming on SR has relieved me of a lot of guilt because the people, I think, are a lot more open and often human than what you hear in meetings.
Knucklehead
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Davenport, WA
Posts: 4,005
Originally Posted by Time4Me
I hear ya!
If it weren't for my weekly agnostic AA meeting (although I have a HP) which is filled with old timers - most with 20 plus years of sobriety - who have mosly done it their way, who are filled with irreverence, intelligence, humor and zest for life, who allow me to spill out any negativity or fanaticism that I experience in other traditional meetings, I would not be able to be in the program.
We end each meeting with a simple "Live and Let Live" rather than a prayer.
If it weren't for my weekly agnostic AA meeting (although I have a HP) which is filled with old timers - most with 20 plus years of sobriety - who have mosly done it their way, who are filled with irreverence, intelligence, humor and zest for life, who allow me to spill out any negativity or fanaticism that I experience in other traditional meetings, I would not be able to be in the program.
We end each meeting with a simple "Live and Let Live" rather than a prayer.
Doorknob
Michael
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: London England
Posts: 291
Hello Millwall,
Can I assume from your name that you might be from south east London? Well I am from the opposite side of the compass in north west London. Good to hear from you on the site.
I was interested to read what you said, in particular about individuality. We all have our own stories about addiction and alcoholism and what works for us as well as what hinders us. The group is certainly wide based and there are views from the whole spectrum. I am an AAgnostic for a number of reasons that I won't bore you with today, but the organisation does do great things for a large number of people.
This is where your comments on individualism come in. How can an organisation with a single product to sell, the twelve step programme, and a strong quasi-religious framework benefit every peron who wants to lead a sober life. To me it stands to reason that what an individual needs is an individual course of action.
Michael
Can I assume from your name that you might be from south east London? Well I am from the opposite side of the compass in north west London. Good to hear from you on the site.
I was interested to read what you said, in particular about individuality. We all have our own stories about addiction and alcoholism and what works for us as well as what hinders us. The group is certainly wide based and there are views from the whole spectrum. I am an AAgnostic for a number of reasons that I won't bore you with today, but the organisation does do great things for a large number of people.
This is where your comments on individualism come in. How can an organisation with a single product to sell, the twelve step programme, and a strong quasi-religious framework benefit every peron who wants to lead a sober life. To me it stands to reason that what an individual needs is an individual course of action.
Michael
Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: London
Posts: 448
I guess I'm the rep. in South West London then And agnostic too.
I take the 12 steps as a 'suggested' program of recovery. I take it as an option, a suggestion, a legally and morally unenforcable idea. It is not 'the' program singular, but 'a suggested' program.
I take the 12 steps as a 'suggested' program of recovery. I take it as an option, a suggestion, a legally and morally unenforcable idea. It is not 'the' program singular, but 'a suggested' program.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: a spiritual vortex, Colorado
Posts: 844
yep
from day one, this thing was comprised of drunks. which sorta means your basic chaos thing. when i read AA comes of age, it gave me great appreciation for what those early drunks wrestled with.
They had someof our same 'extremists'- from Born Agains who wanted loudly to establish a new religion to the Psychologists who wanted nothing to do with a spitritual concept to rabid atheists.
I found it comforting that most of all, the various group consensus wanted to be inclusive and evolving. they understood that zen buddhists wern't gonna buy into a monotheistic western god concept. And they were fine with it.
If the early atheists had not been loud and uncompromising, there would have been no 'god as we understand him" language....some might call THAT a gift from god!!
am still in awe and completly amused by the fact that a group of low bottom drunks could have pulled off anything that lasted over 48 hours , let alone years...
mel Ash, in zen and recovery, talks of the teachers among us - he puts ol bill W in some heady company- the mother teresas, the ghandis, ml King, jesus-
i think he's right. and just like many Teachers, its their followers who get caught up in splitting hairs over'doctrine' and exclusiveness and self righteousness.
i owe my life to the program. but the program is all of us drunks/junkies doing it the best we know.
cool
from day one, this thing was comprised of drunks. which sorta means your basic chaos thing. when i read AA comes of age, it gave me great appreciation for what those early drunks wrestled with.
They had someof our same 'extremists'- from Born Agains who wanted loudly to establish a new religion to the Psychologists who wanted nothing to do with a spitritual concept to rabid atheists.
I found it comforting that most of all, the various group consensus wanted to be inclusive and evolving. they understood that zen buddhists wern't gonna buy into a monotheistic western god concept. And they were fine with it.
If the early atheists had not been loud and uncompromising, there would have been no 'god as we understand him" language....some might call THAT a gift from god!!
am still in awe and completly amused by the fact that a group of low bottom drunks could have pulled off anything that lasted over 48 hours , let alone years...
mel Ash, in zen and recovery, talks of the teachers among us - he puts ol bill W in some heady company- the mother teresas, the ghandis, ml King, jesus-
i think he's right. and just like many Teachers, its their followers who get caught up in splitting hairs over'doctrine' and exclusiveness and self righteousness.
i owe my life to the program. but the program is all of us drunks/junkies doing it the best we know.
cool
Member
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Charleston S.C.
Posts: 1,461
I also enjoy the different points of view. Although, I don't agree with most programs in total, by keeping an open mind and willing to go to any lengths, I've been able to draw strength from most all. I think the biggest issue I have probems is with programs that practice exclusion. Or at least people use programs to preach exclusion. Don W
Member
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: London, UK
Posts: 7
i always speak my mind honestly at meetings, i cannot stand meetings where everyone pretends they are perfect and just repeat slogans - it gets me angry - so i decided not to go to those meetings anymore. there's nothing wrong with them per se, some people gravitate to those meetings because that's what floats their boat, but for me i like honesty and controversy that way my buttons get pushed, my world gets rocked and i realise i have something else to discover about myself.
x
x
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
