AA efficacy rates, for BubbaBob
@ Don and Bob 1000 tomato's? Lordy!.. just seeing what you all have been yakking about.
1 bite&all resistance crumbles
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: IRELAND
Posts: 2,208
Hi Don
I totally respect your opinions though I am not in agreement with you.
I am living the AA way and it's so great
Why did you never try AA?
I know you read up a lot and you have stats etc but you never tried aa...ever?
So you don't know what you're missing...and I can say for sure (cause I KNOW fior sure) that you are missing out on such an amazing fellowship. It;s the best thing that ever came my way, and I have been very lucky in many ways - this stands out amongst everything!
just wondered if there was a reason as to why you never allowed yourself the privilege of engaging with a wonderful programme like AA??
If you tried it and never liked it fine - but you never even tried it??!
I'm intrigued, and I do not mean to be disrespectful to you in any way. I am genuinely interested in your motivation behind the avoidance.
I totally respect your opinions though I am not in agreement with you.
I am living the AA way and it's so great
Why did you never try AA?
I know you read up a lot and you have stats etc but you never tried aa...ever?
So you don't know what you're missing...and I can say for sure (cause I KNOW fior sure) that you are missing out on such an amazing fellowship. It;s the best thing that ever came my way, and I have been very lucky in many ways - this stands out amongst everything!
just wondered if there was a reason as to why you never allowed yourself the privilege of engaging with a wonderful programme like AA??
If you tried it and never liked it fine - but you never even tried it??!
I'm intrigued, and I do not mean to be disrespectful to you in any way. I am genuinely interested in your motivation behind the avoidance.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Jasper, GA
Posts: 239
Late hippie
I waited until I was 49 and sober to be the hippie I wasn't years ago. As such, I have sorta retired to the "sustainable farmer" lifestyle. Kinda Mother Earth News type without the liberal politics...I'm still politically conservative.
I grow 2500 tomato starter plants from seeds to sell at the local farmers market.
I have over 2 million pets...25 colonies of bees I harvest and sell honey from.
I make my own bio-diesel...not for ecological reasons, but because 60 cent a gallon for my pick-up beats 2 bucks a gallon.
I make 1.5 tons of handcrafted "boutique" soap that I sell at arts/crafts fairs each summer.
I grow lettuce, cabbage, broccoli, cauliflower, carrots and radishes that I sell at the local market along with the tomato plants.
I raise shitakii and oyster mushrooms for the high end restaraunt market.
I raise 1000 bunnies/month for the pet food (snake/reptile) market.
I make 500 "ear candles" (if you don't know, google it...I'm not explaining) a week I wholesale to the health food stores in the area.
Wife makes bead broaches for the craft fairs.
I turn wood art...bowls, vases, etc.
I am a (now) part time addiction counselor.
But before any of that, each day I make sure I do what I need to do to maintain my recovery.
BubbaBob
Man plans, God laughs.
I grow 2500 tomato starter plants from seeds to sell at the local farmers market.
I have over 2 million pets...25 colonies of bees I harvest and sell honey from.
I make my own bio-diesel...not for ecological reasons, but because 60 cent a gallon for my pick-up beats 2 bucks a gallon.
I make 1.5 tons of handcrafted "boutique" soap that I sell at arts/crafts fairs each summer.
I grow lettuce, cabbage, broccoli, cauliflower, carrots and radishes that I sell at the local market along with the tomato plants.
I raise shitakii and oyster mushrooms for the high end restaraunt market.
I raise 1000 bunnies/month for the pet food (snake/reptile) market.
I make 500 "ear candles" (if you don't know, google it...I'm not explaining) a week I wholesale to the health food stores in the area.
Wife makes bead broaches for the craft fairs.
I turn wood art...bowls, vases, etc.
I am a (now) part time addiction counselor.
But before any of that, each day I make sure I do what I need to do to maintain my recovery.
BubbaBob
Man plans, God laughs.
Extremity
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: somewhere, out over that away
Posts: 183
For you Cathy (I hope this brings you a smile)
Don is a member of AA and attends meetings pretty regularly, as well as doing the program, by refusing to do it.
Remember that the "only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking" and he has shown that he does have that desire.
Remember that our literature says that a member need not declare their membership or do so as they wish.
Remember that "any two or more alcoholics may call themself a meeting..."
Remember that "troublemakers can be teachers...and often become our best loved members..." (even as they stamp their feet and yell I'm not! I'm not!).
To avoid being a member, you would have to:
*Never talk to other AA members.
*Continue to drink and never express a desire to stop.
*Continually affiliate with that opposite. (drinking to the end)
Having watched Don's growth over that last year, I would have to say he is not only a member, but a member in good standing. He has made much progress, even though he may not see it yet.
"...sometimes slowly, they will always materialize..."
And he doesn't even have to accept it. In fact, I would be surprised if he did!
Don is a member of AA and attends meetings pretty regularly, as well as doing the program, by refusing to do it.
Remember that the "only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking" and he has shown that he does have that desire.
Remember that our literature says that a member need not declare their membership or do so as they wish.
Remember that "any two or more alcoholics may call themself a meeting..."
Remember that "troublemakers can be teachers...and often become our best loved members..." (even as they stamp their feet and yell I'm not! I'm not!).
To avoid being a member, you would have to:
*Never talk to other AA members.
*Continue to drink and never express a desire to stop.
*Continually affiliate with that opposite. (drinking to the end)
Having watched Don's growth over that last year, I would have to say he is not only a member, but a member in good standing. He has made much progress, even though he may not see it yet.
"...sometimes slowly, they will always materialize..."
And he doesn't even have to accept it. In fact, I would be surprised if he did!
Mostly Sunny Skies
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Mountain Top, WV
Posts: 62
Slugs and other alcohol abusers
Geeze!
I think Don S and Bubba Bob may have enough material for a new forum.
Next thing we know, you guys will be telling us to throw a keg party to control our slugs. How are we going to handle that one? Do slugs like non-alcoholic beer?
Toivo
P.S. Seriously -- I think Don should again be thanked for his insight and research. Whether everyone always agrees with him, he sure has a way of getting people to think and communicate. Thanks Don.
I think Don S and Bubba Bob may have enough material for a new forum.
Next thing we know, you guys will be telling us to throw a keg party to control our slugs. How are we going to handle that one? Do slugs like non-alcoholic beer?
Toivo
P.S. Seriously -- I think Don should again be thanked for his insight and research. Whether everyone always agrees with him, he sure has a way of getting people to think and communicate. Thanks Don.
Member
Join Date: May 2003
Location: El Paso, Tx
Posts: 5,862
Wow Bob, very intriguing, thanks for sharing!
How we individually choose to stay sober is of no consequence to me, I like to always think of the forums of one drunk helping another, be it various views, perspectives, methods, or processes. My method works for me, and I respect others rights to choose a method that works for them, so long as we're all sober, it's all good. I hope in that we can all agree... for once.
How we individually choose to stay sober is of no consequence to me, I like to always think of the forums of one drunk helping another, be it various views, perspectives, methods, or processes. My method works for me, and I respect others rights to choose a method that works for them, so long as we're all sober, it's all good. I hope in that we can all agree... for once.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Jasper, GA
Posts: 239
I'm all for ANYTHING that helps maintain physical, mental, and spiritual sobriety, not just dry drunks...I've said in the past that if you showed me a program that has a history of success by standing on your head for an hour a day, one finger in your left ear and another finger up your nose to the second knuckle, farting in tune to "Yankee Doodle Dandy" no one in my town would be able to buy beans at the local grocery because of me.
BubbaBob
Man plans...God laughs
BubbaBob
Man plans...God laughs
Member
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Zion, Illinois
Posts: 3,411
Originally Posted by liveweyerd
Don S, I love science and I read your information avidly, and yes, use my own mind to evaluate points made. Thank you and thank you again.
Music, you were insulting to Don S in your comment about being in landscaping leaving him too much time for useless (to you) endeavors.
Education is never a useless endeavor.
Narrow-mindedness is a terrible handicap, as is tunnel-vision.
I love working out at the gym, but I find my health and happiness is fostered more by education than by buffing up my butt. Though it does have its benefits. Goo-eyed guys give me financial discounts and it makes horseback riding a lot more pleasurable.
Music, you were insulting to Don S in your comment about being in landscaping leaving him too much time for useless (to you) endeavors.
Education is never a useless endeavor.
Narrow-mindedness is a terrible handicap, as is tunnel-vision.
I love working out at the gym, but I find my health and happiness is fostered more by education than by buffing up my butt. Though it does have its benefits. Goo-eyed guys give me financial discounts and it makes horseback riding a lot more pleasurable.
Hey Don....pollysy...????? Keep it simple man. I don't do well with words of more than one sillabull.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Jasper, GA
Posts: 239
Originally Posted by liveweyerd
Bubba, I lived a life kind of like yours before, it is enchanting, I hope to get to do it again. Do you have a website with your artwork?
BubbaBob
Man plans...God laughs
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 1,432
"...no one in my town would be able to buy beans at the local grocery because of me."
What, you don't grow and dry your own beans, too?! We should swap notes on which heirloom and gourmet tomatoes do well in your part of the country. I'm a big fan of Costoluto Genovese and Principe Borghese, if you haven't tried those; but we both know tomatoes are very regional in performance. Beefsteak does very poorly here, for example.
NA beer if fine for slugs, Soumi; it's the yeast smell that attracts them.
Cathy, your question is very valid and not disrespectful at all. I'll give it a thoughtful answer some time soon.
I'm still trying to get over knowing that I'm an honorary member of AA.
Don
What, you don't grow and dry your own beans, too?! We should swap notes on which heirloom and gourmet tomatoes do well in your part of the country. I'm a big fan of Costoluto Genovese and Principe Borghese, if you haven't tried those; but we both know tomatoes are very regional in performance. Beefsteak does very poorly here, for example.
NA beer if fine for slugs, Soumi; it's the yeast smell that attracts them.
Cathy, your question is very valid and not disrespectful at all. I'll give it a thoughtful answer some time soon.
I'm still trying to get over knowing that I'm an honorary member of AA.
Don
Extremity
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: somewhere, out over that away
Posts: 183
I'm still trying to get over knowing that I'm an honorary member of AA. ~ Don
DOH! Most of us had a hard time with that one.
Don,
I hope that you can see that my post really wasn't about you, but about the logic of AA which leads to "cease fighting anybody or anything" and to allow the process to unfold however it will in the individual. The way it was initially intended to do before the "authorities" of AA began to "dominate" everything they could into dogmatic "conformity".
Note that these three things are what we are called to be ever vigilant and guard against, as described in our Traditions and Concepts. And this begins with a sublte compassion as described in Chapter 7 of "The Big Book" of Alcoholics Anonymous.
Yet, few read it, even fewer read the "12x12" or "Concepts for Service", and very few understand it or incorporate it.
Yet, "almost to a man" most share their opinions about it (however absurd or erroneous.)
Reading the literature as you do, puts you in a very select group. Not only honorary, you are a fine example of studying (following the path).
I am wondering if you have found the "algebra" problem in the "Big Book" yet? And if you have, have you worked it out yet? The answer is quite surprising and would make you recant your 5% efficacy rate (that is a bit high, after all).
To all~
In a world where everyone spins the numbers, I tend to believe in the humble underestimating towards great odds, then I do the ubiquitous spin doctors trying to prove they are "the way, the truth and the light," or the new "model of social recovery."
As for religion and spirituality, just as with god(s) and God, I find that it is in my own best interest to have my own concept of those terms (as explained in the book). My God is my God, we are "all gods" (as stated by David and Jesus), my religion is how I carry myself through the day (as described by Kahlil Gibran) and my spirituality as well as those other concepts are mine and not really up for discussion. You are free to believe in your concepts however you wish and I seek only to find a commonality between us as a starting point towards a friendly relationship in which we may all benefit.
I thank my God I don't have to be perfect doing this.
Welcome to AA, Don and "Keep Coming Back!"
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