Grymt

Sometimes the uninstructed ones cope with anxiety by taking intoxicants.



It’s not unusual that, in the long run, this increases anxiety. Resulting in an increased reliance on intoxicants. A seemingly endless spiral. Sometimes leading to debilitating panic attacks.



For some at some time a decision is made to find another way.



Sometimes another way is prescribed drugs. This can work but may lead to a different addiction with side effects.



Combining a drug with therapy is sometimes recommended.



The question remains whether there is a way that does not use any kind of drug and can be completely self reliant. Independent of therapy.



In my experience a resounding yes. I went through all of the above and now completely drug and therapy free I have many years completely anxiety free. In fact I can’t summon up a memory of what anxiety actually feels like even though there was a time I was taking 8 x 5mg benzodiazepines every day. I used to take Zoloft too but couldn’t cope with the dead feeling which was ironic because when I went cold turkey on that one I suffered horrible withdrawals and attempted suicide.



Anyway, what made the difference for me? Thaeravada Buddhist Meditation. As taught by Sayagyi U Ba Khin of Myanmar (vipassana) and as taught by Ajahn Chah of Thailand (Thai Forest tradition) in the various monasteries and retreat centres in Australia. Namely IMC in Perth, Goenkaji in the Blue Mountains and Ajahn Brahm at Jhana Grove.

Grymt

I’ve had my say on this. Just to round up it is a lifestyle involving things like training to refrain from doing things to later feel remorseful about. Unless anyone has specific questions for me I’ll be quiet and hope others can add what works for them too.

Grymt

I do have a few more things to say.



Deep relaxation, letting go, is easier if one eats moderately. It helps to not set out to eat for pleasure but to maintain a healthy body.



These strictures help to release deeply clung to traumas. It can be quite uncomfortable to face them but they do pass. The deeper one relaxes the clearer and sometimes more intensely the pain is felt so it’s important to take it easy. Go for a walk. Read something wholesome that keeps the mind open while distracting in a healthy way. Gradually feel the reality and let go. This is where learning to meditate is invaluable.

Hex

I have severe anxiety and panic disorder and am on Klonopion, Soma, Paxil and Propranolol.
Self medication leads me always to relapse so I need these meds.

Grymt

Yes, well said

Thank you

Hex

Klonopin

least

The best way I know to relax and unwind and calm down is to pet my dog and/or cats. . When I'm petting my dog, Billie, I find it hard to be upset or anxious cause it's so relaxing to stroke her shiny silky fur. . Cats are the same way. I can't help but feel calmer when I'm petting them.

And to settle down and relax at bedtime, I snuggle with Billie right next to me and drift off to sleep feeling at peace.

advbike

And I find intense aerobic exercise a few times a week to be of significant benefit in reducing the anxious feelings, but of course its sort of combatting one extreme with another, so the meditation sounds interesting. I have also found yoga quite beneficial, a sort of middle way. Thanks for this, Grymt.

Grymt

to all replies
“As for anxiety, I suffered from anxiety for years before I took my first drink, so I had to deal with it after I stopped. For me it was exercise, and time.” - Dee https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...ml#post7876134 (Long time it seems like)



Others seem to indicate that it is difficult because it takes time. This highlights another necessary factor in dealing with anxiety, namely patience.

Not just hearing ‘this too will pass’ but cultivating a faith that it is so by patiently waiting for it to do so. Patience is also the most important thing to cultivate when meditating.

It’s like: ‘how long is a piece of string?’ . You can’t know. It depends on conditions. The time taken is a result of past actions so you just have to patiently wait while making sure that while waiting you don’t create more conditions for future arising of anxiety.

Grymt

“…the anxiety has all but left once I started to focus on a different story to tell. So, I think I learned something there...... Focus on a different story.” - Mizz https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...ml#post7876974 (Creating New Habits)



These gems of help are linked to and credited. I know I’ll miss some. Work in progress.

BrianinLondon

A good 10K walk at a decent but not power walking pace for me if I am doing it almost daily and sometimes doing longer walks of up to 25K keeps me in a decent place and makes me feel like I am achieving something - obviously it can't majorly offset "incidents" which screw my peace of mind and can't be legislated for but the longer I am sober the less those happen. It helps that my complexion and general appearance is so much healthier when doing this exercise which I know is a superficial yard stick but how I look does have a real impact for me - a Buddhist might say this approach guarantees suffering as impermanence and non-attachment should be embraced but it's so deeply engrained in my being to worry about my appearance I don't know how I could eliminate it. How I physically feel also helps and it just makes me feel like I'm living life getting out in the fresh air and moving - especially if it's in nature during the day.

Lastly, time outdoors exerting myself is time away from sitting in rumination. This can only be a good thing. It doesn't mean we won't ruminate whilst walking, but it at least won't be our sole focus.

Grymt

While sometimes it may be necessary to white knuckle it ( Buddha described it like this: ‘’…with his teeth clenched and his tongue pressed against the roof of his mouth — he is beating down, constraining, and crushing his mind with his awareness, those evil, unskillful thoughts are abandoned and subside. With their abandoning, he steadies his mind right within, settles it, unifies it, and concentrates it.‘’ ) note that this is the extreme of a number of ways beginning with (when simple mindfulness is difficult to maintain) changing focus, distract with a wholesome thought and or activity. Ultimately returning to what is called ‘the middle way’.



If one becomes angry (or anxious or whatever) there are three things possible.

Express it, like shouting and throwing things, hitting etc.

Suppress it, bottle it up, turn it inward, become passive aggressive.

Let go of it by thinking ‘this phenomenon or process called anger has arisen within this mindbody thing called me. Now let me see how long it lasts. It has these qualities: heat, vibration, tightness etc’

the third one is the middle way between two extremes.




By noticing it is there one steps outside of it, even for just a moment, and during that time it’s shackles are loosened. This takes practice. It takes time. Patience. In time the unwholesome processes are let go of and a serenity dawns like when the clouds part and the sun or moon light shines through.

BrianinLondon

Learning about the ego has been really helpful for me Grymt. Simply observing what's happening in the body is an acknowledgment that my ego is perceiving some threat or other and responding - usually giving it undue gravity - I try to ask myself: "is this level of discomfort genuinely warranted because, for example, some guy made a ****** remark that undermined me?". Understanding that our ego is a malfunctioning protection mechanism and 100% instinctive allows me to forgive myself for the ****** feelings - I can't control them but over time I can get better at not jumping to conclusions about the quality of my recovery just cos I'm feeling angry or anxious. Going through problems rather than around them. I'm hoping that in time I will have amasses a sufficient body of evidence through staying sober that I can call upon to limit the duration of discomfort when the level of threat is not proportionate to my reaction. I guess that's what they mean when they say the highs and lows don't go away but they even out a bit through continued sobriety. As long as I'm not using some other aversion tactics to avoid the feeling like gambling, taking drugs, abusing sugar etc?

Obladi

I'm still learning to 'deal with' anxiety.

First, I had to learn to name what I was feeling - the actual physical sensations. Strange because I recognized those symptoms once I stated them out loud, but I hadn't actually known that those were "feelings." It's strange to be so separated from oneself, but it's (been?) a thing for me. I was going to say that I haven't made a tremendous amount of progress, but I forget just how difficult it was to learn to name my feelings and then to go even further to explore what was causing this discomfort. It wasn't current circumstances, difficult as they may be at any given time, but it was conflicting attachments to contrary understandings of who "I" am.

I'm anxious and depressed in spurts nowadays, but have made enough progress to understand that noticing and living through these sensations won't kill me. Rejecting alcohol as a salvo allows me to genuinely present to not only those feelings, but also to be of service to those around me.

That's a pretty good start, I think.

O

advbike

Recognizing what I'm "feeling" at any given moment is tough. Just never was aware of them.. we didn't discuss our feelings in my family of origin. A therapist asked me how I was feeling a few years ago and I had no clue, haha. I still often lack awareness, although anxiety seems to be omnipresent, even if at a low level. I know it's their when I find myself reverting to coping mechanisms - surfing online, looking at crap to buy, etc. Just recently realized that means there's some anxiety that I'm not aware of, much less confronting.

Grymt

‘Now suppose that in the autumn — when it's raining in fat, heavy drops — a water bubble were to appear & disappear on the water, and a man with good eyesight were to see it, observe it, & appropriately examine it. To him — seeing it, observing it, & appropriately examining it — it would appear empty, void, without substance: for what substance would there be in a water bubble? In the same way, a monk sees, observes, & appropriately examines any feeling that is past, future, or present; internal or external; blatant or subtle; common or sublime; far or near. To him — seeing it, observing it, & appropriately examining it — it would appear empty, void, without substance: for what substance would there be in feeling?’
https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitak ... .than.html

When asked ‘what does passion feel like?’ some may say ‘it’s nice’

What does nice feel like. Etc etc…

what are the qualities of passion? Feelings is a word that in this context means sensations or sense impressions. Emotions also have associated bodily feelings.

Buddha used the four elements to describe things. For example, air is movement, vibration, fire is temperature, combustion, water is solubility, fluidity and earth is weight, hardness or solidity.

For example a dry lump of clay is solid. If you add water it softens. If you add heat to softened clay it hardens.

Passion is hot, heavy and moves. Anger vibrates, is hot and solid.

To cool hot coals, throw a handful of water on it. There is a reaction of sizzling noise and an explosion of steam. Throw another, and another and a time comes when there is no more reaction.

Likewise, if one throws petrol onto a fire the fire increases dramatically.

So what to do with anger? Throw anger on it? What cools anger. What stills passion. What calms anxiety.

Loving Kindness, awareness, mindfulness, compassion, lack of remorse from doing unwholesome acts and by not hesitating to do wholesome acts are some antidotes. These are like the cooling waters on a hot fire.