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Old 03-14-2021, 05:40 AM
  # 61 (permalink)  
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Hey, Five.

It's good to hear that you're back to a week. Feel better, or not?

It sounds like maybe the 1% is ambivalence? I spent a very long time there. Long, long time. I wanted to want to stop drinking, but I just could not find a way over that last hurdle. How could I develop the "want?" Isn't that something that comes from within? For me, it seemed to be so. Unfortunately, I don't have a formula for that.

Or maybe for you, it's all about how to socialize without a buzz? Maybe the prospect of doing that is a complete yawner for you.

I don't know; this is all speculation on my part. Only you can know what it is that's holding you back (or not allowing you to take the leap) to complete sobriety. If this is something you want, then maybe look a little further into why a drink appears in your hand each time you're in a social setting. Or (and?) give more thought to what your motivation is to stop drinking. Maybe you've posted about that already and I missed it. I'm not asking you to recap for my sake, but I am saying "for health reasons" is a pretty weak motivation, for me.

O

p.s. Your outline of the rules you are employing to not drink in certain situations is highly reminiscent of one of my favorite passages from the Alcoholics Anonymous book. If you're interested, I'll be happy to share. But I don't want to "thump" on your thread uninvited (at least not at this time ).
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Old 03-14-2021, 08:01 AM
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If I drink 'too much' I get a slight pain in my right side. I don't like it. It makes me nervous. I have had mri/scans and everything looks good but I know I have gallstones. My liver enzymes are slightly elevated. I know it's the alcohol because it goes away when I don't drink and starts again if I am drinking.

I feel really good after a week. No pains, clear headed, and happy enough. Definitely bored. Getting good workouts in and getting a lot done. There is just no mental shut off valve. I miss that.

I'm curious, how did you find your want to go 100% Obladi? I have been ambivalent for years. I think I have said the exact words, 'I want to want to quit'. But when I drink I still enjoy the experience as long as I don't have hangovers and pain. I don't like feeling I am an outcast socially either.

I know the best thing is to just quit for good.

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Old 03-14-2021, 08:05 AM
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PS I am pretty sure I know the passage you are talking about. You can tell me whatever you think I won't be bothered. I used to go to AA years ago and I still have a Big Book. Its collecting dust though.
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Old 03-14-2021, 09:04 AM
  # 64 (permalink)  
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Well, Five... that's a very complex question with a simple answer: I decided that there was nothing I wanted more right now than to Not Drink. I dropped any consideration of how I might feel in an hour, later today, tomorrow or 100 years from now. Just for this moment, for now, I don't want to drink.

Here's some of the complexity - thanks for giving me a space to write about it. :
At the end, I was far beyond drinking socially. That wasn't even thinkable - why would I want to go to a bar and pay exorbitant amounts to keep myself in check enough to drink only a couple of weak cocktails with people I didn't particularly like in any special way? I didn't really have health anxiety about drinking. I mean, I knew the outcome could be nothing but bad news, but it didn't dissuade me because I didn't care. Way back a long time ago, I experienced that ambivalence you are in. It was terrible beyond belief (though I'd bet you can believe it), so there came a time that when I decided to drink, I just skipped the ambivalence part. I got to the point at the end there - and it was a long end - where a flip would be switched, I'd be drinking seemingly without reason, and it took enormous effort to turn it off. Depression and anxiety were pretty much my two states of "being." I preferred the depression over the anxiety, and so I drank. I realized that for me, the 'bottom' that some well-meaning people told me I had to hit didn't exist. For me, the bottom was six feet under. And still I didn't care; I actually yearned for the grave.

...but I did care, just a tiny bit, just a whisper of desperation saying, "I can't keep doing this." I kept posting here and it was a lifeline - there were people (strangers!) who cared enough to encourage me to do something to get out of the pit I was in.

I realized there were only two choices for me - either I needed to stop or I was going to have to live out the misery of drinking 24/7 until the next bottom hit, and the next one after that. I was facing something like an infinity mirror, only my mirror was of endless trapdoors leading to more and more bottoms. It didn't seem I was going to be able to drink myself to death fast enough, so I had to give up. That wasn't the end of my misery, but it was the end of my drinking. For now. And since it's always now, I'm safely ensconced in this space where I don't drink.

Honestly, Five? I don't know that I'm at 100%. Maybe it's 99.9? Sometimes I do entertain the notion of drinking at some point in the near or distant future. I think it's just what my brain does - what I trained it to do. But fortunately for me so far, the thought of actually drinking is like standing too close to the edge of the Grand Canyon. Thrilling in the most stomach-turning way. So I take few steps back and sit quietly, reminding myself that I never drink now.

In the final analysis, I don't think it was a "want" that drove me to stop drinking altogether, it was more like an instinctive reaction reflecting the need for my authentic self to survive.

I dearly hope that this mind-dump is helpful to someone.
It most certainly was helpful (not to mention emotional) for me to write about it - thanks for asking, Five.

O
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Old 03-14-2021, 09:06 AM
  # 65 (permalink)  
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p.s. If you are thinking of the one that goes on for a good long paragraph about what we do/did to 'control' our drinking, you're spot on. You might want to dig it out and give it another read. Parts of it are hilariously (or tragically) (or both) accurate for this alcoholic.
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Old 03-15-2021, 11:05 AM
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It was definitely very helpful to me, Obladi.
I related to most of what you said.
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Old 03-16-2021, 06:05 PM
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I'm still trying.

I thought I had made it through the weekend until I met up with my neighbors on Sunday. They offered a beer and I just auto replied 'Ok'. Had 3 beers that were 6.5 percent in about 3 hours. I tried to get out of there after 1 but we were having fun and they insisted. I slept restless but no other side effects.

I gotta be honest and say I plan on having some beers this weekend. Going to spend time with family for a night. Then we will see. I have one other 'drinking' event lurking which is a birthday party for an old friend. After that the calendar is clear. Just gotta get my mind right. Which obviously I know it currently isn't or I wouldn't be planning to drink! Duh.

Otherwise I am good. I swear though there is just one landmine after another in this quitting drinking. I am sure I am throwing most of them in front of myself.

I got to reading your thread Obladi and Briansy's. So much great information! I didn't have the guts to reply at all but I learned a lot.

My day today has been pretty routine. Work today was pretty easy and stress free. I was alone at home. I am at the gym now got a 20 minute run in and 150 reps on my core. Now sitting in the hot tub.

About to go in the steam room, go home, eat, and get in bed. I haven't eaten anything today and it's 7pm already. Terrible.

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Old 03-21-2021, 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by FiveX
I know the best thing is to just quit for good.
Originally Posted by FiveX View Post
I gotta be honest and say I plan on having some beers this weekend. Going to spend time with family for a night. Then we will see. I have one other 'drinking' event lurking which is a birthday party for an old friend. After that the calendar is clear. Just gotta get my mind right. Which obviously I know it currently isn't or I wouldn't be planning to drink! Duh.
Hi FX,
I definitely recall your last five days as being the kind of avoiding quitting I tried for quite a while. But you knowing that doesn’t help you.

What it reminds me of that happened since I quit was how I felt when I knew I was going to be spending the weekend with my (now wife) girlfriend way back then just months after I quit for good. The anticipation of that deep pleasure of love and sex that was about to happen over the weekend was the cat’s pajamas. It had that deep pleasure similarity to all those drunken weekends I had desperately failed to manage for so many years. But, it also had 1000 times more goodness, moral standing, and opportunity for a future of happiness. What was then a new deep pleasure of love for my wife has been totally integrated and is now part of who I am.

In any case, I bet you must have enjoyed yourself this past weekend and hopefully avoided any troubles or side pains due to your drinking.

GT





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Old 03-21-2021, 02:54 PM
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Thinking of you, FiveX.
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Old 03-22-2021, 08:18 AM
  # 70 (permalink)  
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Me too, Five.
When is the required drinking birthday event?
Can I mark my calendar to look for you after?
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Old 03-22-2021, 02:10 PM
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Hi all still here.

I did drink on friday night. No major issues.
Slight hangover and tired feeling the next day. I did drink more than I set out to drink and had some distilled spirits. So I drank 3 shots and 4 beers within approximately 5-6 hours. I did enjoy myself which was nice because I hate thinking about the reality that I shouldn't be doing this.

So I have the birthday party this weekend. I am actually on the fence about that one because of the location. I don't think this bar even has the kind of beers I like which are craft beers. If I do drink there it would be 2 max because Ill be driving. So I feel like it would be a waste of a week sober, but if my friend wants to have a shot and beer with me I'd feel awkard saying no. After this weekend I have nothing going on until mid-summer, so I will be attempting to stay sober for over 3 months, hopefully that should provide me with some clarity.

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Old 03-22-2021, 02:57 PM
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Alright then, see you here next week.
I'm glad to know you still want to try this sober thing.
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Old 03-23-2021, 07:59 PM
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It should be just that simple I feel like. Trying this sober thing. I do want to be sober. I am so not good with cutting all ties. Every girlfriend I ever had there were multiple break ups and make ups. Then certain drugs. Now this alcohol thing. I just want to shut the door on it but it keeps on knocking.

My buddies called me they want to go out for whiskey wednesday tomorrow. An obvious bad idea. Thats how this works though, right? Theres always another reason on the horizon. Excuses are so easy to find.

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Old 03-24-2021, 04:09 AM
  # 74 (permalink)  
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Yup.

Ambivalence ranks right up there on self-induced mental torture. Not least of which because we don't choose to torture ourselves - addiction takes over and does that for us. At least for me, it seemed like I was only along for the ride through this terrifying haunted house, even though I was the one who got back in that rusty car every single time.

I feel for ya. It's a rotten state to be in.
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Old 03-24-2021, 04:59 AM
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Originally Posted by FiveX View Post
It should be just that simple I feel like. Trying this sober thing. I do want to be sober. I am so not good with cutting all ties. Every girlfriend I ever had there were multiple break ups and make ups. Then certain drugs. Now this alcohol thing. I just want to shut the door on it but it keeps on knocking.

My buddies called me they want to go out for whiskey wednesday tomorrow. An obvious bad idea. Thats how this works though, right? Theres always another reason on the horizon. Excuses are so easy to find.
I kept going until it got really ugly. There was absolutely no way for me to stop until I had a really big, tangible incentive. And that was how horribly scary it was that alcohol had stopped working and was now causing real real problems. It was before of course but even the part where I was drinking had now stopped being fun. Now that is scary. I have incredible amounts of respect for those that don't let it get that bad, but most get to at least that point and some far beyond.

It may be helpful to read a bit and learn a little bit about the subject matter if you haven't already done so. This Naked Mind, alcohol explained and the unexpected joy of being sober are all great reads and have sections going into detail on the physiology of what's happening when we drink. I found it really helpful in the transition.
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Old 03-25-2021, 01:02 PM
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I decided I am going to stop drinking now.
Today is my day one.
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Old 03-25-2021, 06:22 PM
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Congratulations!
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Old 03-25-2021, 07:15 PM
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Thanks!

I have been reading around on here and relating to experiences a lot. One question I am asking myself is why do I keep delaying quitting?

I need to go all in or all out. Even though I don't want to and I'm not ready. It's obvious to me that my chances for a good life from here are much better with no alcohol in the picture.

There is no reason to wait.

It's scary right now. I can't wait to get some time under my belt.

So I went out drinking last night. Had fun with friends but got quite drunk. Felt atrocious all day today. In the morning I just knew it is time to quit for good. I decided that I would still go to the birthday party this weekend and just not drink. After work my sober friend called me out of the blue to see if I wanted to grab lunch this weekend, I mentioned the party, and he is going to come with me! Perfect.

I can't wait to get some sleep tonight. I slept horribly last night and snored my wife out of the bedroom. Sigh. I really only snore after alcohol. Waiting on my kids to run out of energy so this day can be over with!

Ok no more rambling for now.

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Old 03-25-2021, 07:20 PM
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Other than to you Briansy. I read your whole 'struggling' thread cover to cover today. Some great wisdom in there, very helpful! Keep on going. I will check out those books, thank you for the suggestions.
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Old 03-25-2021, 07:30 PM
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Welcome Back Five

what sort of things are you going to do to make sure this is your last quit?

D
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