Dee74

A reminder that politics is off topic here, guys.

Let me try the personal cards on the table approach.

The likelihood is no matter what political position you espouse there’ll be someone here that disagrees with you.

One members lack of national leadership is another’s Antifa insurgents spreading fake news. One members horror at armed personnel on the streets is anothers welcome return to law and order.

I wish I was exaggerating but I'm really not. Perceptions are that divided.

Arguments ensue and I and the other staff are the guys who have to cleanup those arguments. Every hour we spend doing that is an hour less for posts to be responded to.

My heart is heavy. I get you guys are scared angry and fed up, but the rules here state recovery first.
No ones ‘censoring’ you. It’s all there in the rules we all agreed to, rules of many years standing.

2.Outside Agendas: No posts of an overtly political or religious nature OR posts promoting advocacy of particular personal, medical, legal, religious, political, or non-profit causes. The forums are intended for offering mutual personal support related to recovery from addiction or recovery for family and friends. This is our primary purpose. Debating controversial subjects should be taken elsewhere. Limited references are allowed, but the forums should not be used to convert others. Do not post content or links or materials to and from sites that flame someone's person, religious beliefs, race, national background, sexual orientation, or recovery program/method. It is inappropriate to promote the use of alcohol or drugs on our addiction recovery forums.



We need to be a united community here focusing on the similarities, not the differences.

You can go and vent your hearts out many many many places on the web but it’s damaging to the cohesion of the community to do it here.

Dee
Administrator
SR

FBL

Well stated, Dee! As a member of this community for nearly 11 years I'm so happy that SR remains a safe, positive place for us to come together to share our struggles and triumphs in recovery. Let's remember that we're ALL in this thing together!

Dropsie

I also want to show support for this policy, which I know can be a bit controversial.

I feel very strongly about these issues and it is the only area in my life that I really do not understand if you do not agree with me.

So better to keep it offline and focus here on building a place of support and community.

feldknocker

Thank you for this post. Politics was brought into an AA meeting I attended last night. It was my home group of all things. The topic leader made a "topic" that was entirely political and inappropriate for an AA meeting. The good news about my group is that people did an excellent job of commenting about recovery and living in today - while not getting into the same political discussion as the topic leader. It made me so appreciative of our traditions. That's one of the things that keeps me coming back. I'm glad the same spirit exists here. To me, recovery is a place to go to get away from all of that - even if for a short while.

Dee74

I've been pretty generous with this rule so far not removing posts, PMing people instead, and only editing one. I thought that was fair with what is a new emphasis on an old rule.

The honeymoon period is over tho and as from today I think its fair that staff remove posts that we feel break this rule and ask for a resub where appropriate.

Dee
Administrator
SR

fini

“To me, recovery is a place to go to get away from all of that - even if for a short while.”

to me, i think of the folk who cannot get away from all that, because they live it every single day. all. the. time.

i don’t know what people are supposed to do when they are wanting sobriety support and their lived experience is one that many call “politics”.

Dee74

I realised I missed copying a post over here - relevant part as follows

Noone is trying to deny anyone support.
Quite the opposite.

The intent is that everyone (or as many members as humanly possible) feel safe here,
I know its not a perfect solution that will fit all members and their current situations.

I'm painfully aware of that.

I've consulted with the other staff, as always - but personally I've had some very late nights and early mornings the last couple of weeks trying to work this out best I can

This community is important to me too.

The line seems to be ok with most folks
Right now? I'm calling that a result.

Anyone with concerns or problems can PM me or any other mod or Admin.
D

SnazzyDresser

Lol, I bet I know which side of the politics argument this person is taking! And the idea that SR should be filled with this type of advocacy is absolutely terrible. Thank God for Dee and SR trying to keep the focus on sobriety here.

fini

ooof, Snazzy, i never said anything about filling SR with any advocacy.
and i don't understand the lol on this.
i find this all really heartbreaking, and keep wondering what i'd find here if my lived experience included being routinely discriminated against and violently threatened and/or physically hurt. and then if i were part of SR, or wanted or needed to be, and then were told "no politics", when my life, my personal life, is so much full of what to others might seem like "side of politics argument".
i was hoping posters here would understand the point i was making, and hadn't intended to need to elaborate.

thank you, Dee, for adding to your post.

just thinking now of one of my young AA friends, a woman who has been spat on and told to go home more than once, simply for walking down the street while Asian.
how would she speak about her lived life without it getting into the politics of racism?
that is what i'm concerned about.

dwtbd

I’m sure if that woman’s story were told by her here on SR , the mods would allow her to tell it. An individual ‘s experience and pain are intimately personal and to express them in public should never be shut down.

But I hope also the mods do edit and remove posts not directly connected to the OP.

Generalized virtue signaling statements drenched in condescension and the soft bigotry of low expectation invite discussion and more of the same followed by inevitable push back.

There is a huge internet out there , this place should only have one advocacy , abstinence.

The mods here do a great job for here.

Dee74

I'd like to think that if someone has a story like that they could still tell it here and still remain within the the rules, fini.

dwtbd

I kept the thread open for discussion - I may disagree with some of the opinions and sentiments...but I don't think editing a thread like this would be useful.

If I'm not sure a post breaks the no politics rule I generally leave it.

If you or anyone feels any of the posts here are against the no politics rule you can report the post and let the whole mod team look at it.
I actually prefer it that way,

but yeah I knew that a thread like this could 'go bad'.
It just shows how difficult it is right now, that even talking about talking about politics uncovers some pretty wide divisions.

As a group the staff will keep an eye on things.

We'll simply close it if/when we feel it's outlived its usefulness.
D

dwtbd

I hadn’t realized there is a separate thread with the same title in another forum.

But gotcha on the PMing

uncle holmes

Thanks! I learned this lesson back in the 90’s and made sure I never did it again! It was during the OJ trial and before the meeting a group of us were sitting at a table! It was kind of quiet so I figured I’d strike up a conversation and brought up the OJ trial! A member there who I looked up to and admired for his long term sobriety and wisdom interrupted me and said please don’t talk about that here because he comes here to get away from all that!

I apologized and learned a valuable lesson! Still new in recovery at the time, I didn’t realize that’s why many people go to meetings - to get away from all that insanity out there and to focus on their recovery and serenity! And I learned from that experience maybe that’s what I should be doing - going to meetings to calm the brain down and focus on recovery! And out of respect for others and for myself I make sure I do that!

fini

okay.
i hear you.
i don’t agree, but i hear you.
except for this: i am unclear, dwtbd, if you see my statements as generalized virtue signaling drenched in condescension and i ask for clarity so i can take it under advisement.

Obladi

I think it's a very fine line we need to walk here if we're going to support each other in sobriety, which we all want to do. This conversation is a good example of why that is the case.

I am indebted to every one of you for the support you've given me. It's been personal. I know each of you sincerely cares about my success in regard to quitting and staying quat. I believe, too, that each of you cares about me - the me you've come to know here. The one with feelings and struggles and a sincere desire to live a life of integrity, evidenced first in this context by refraining from altering my state by chemical means.

That people as a whole differ in a most fundamental way about what constitutes "political" is distressing to me. I'm sad about that, but I certainly can't fix it. I respect the decision of SR administration - what else could they do, really, given this fundamental divide?

To "lol" in derision or label another's expression of their feelings as indications of their motive or character contributes to divisiveness. It frankly looks like bullying from over here. That pigeon-holing, labeling, belittling is incredibly hurtful to people like me.

Thank you, Dee. I've said it before and will likely say it again; it's a hard job you do. We've all benefited from the gifts of your sobriety. Thank you for getting clean!

Obladi

I hope that didn't come off as preachy. It's not meant to be. I just wanted to say how I feel.

xo

Grymt

After trying a few times to formulate some thought that may be useful but not succeeding perhaps this'll do 'can't fix it'
I cannot fix the things outside of myself. As an alcoholic it's important to recognise that the problem and solution is within and can be fixed there.
SR is for fixing the alcoholic. There are many other places a fixed alcoholic can join the endeavours to fix the world.

Dee74

I've decided that these threads (there are 3 in total) have outlived their usefulness.
It was an attempt to give everyone a voice on this and I thank everyone who contributed.

Arguing and infighting tho is not any good for any of us and pretty much illustrates why we need the no politics rule.

Anyone who really wants to say anything else can PM me or one of the other mods.

D