dwtbd

So you’re saying you’re not drinking , on purpose? Nice

Cosima11

Great analogy, I actually identify with the mountain goat (an astrological symbol for my sun sign, conjunct its own ruler). Like most things its easier to talk about the views from the top than what it takes to get there. What it really takes is stamina contrasted with a willingness to stand still or lose progress long enough to weather the storms when necessary. It takes playing the long game and letting others pass knowing you may eventually pass them as they slide back down from instant gratification.
There are similarities between your sober living situation and my living sober in a different, more challenging place..But what I had been doing led to nothing but dead ends or catastrophe. I think that might be the universal order of it, some (most) times to get out of the rut we have to take the less visibly appealing route.

2ndhandrose

I am thinking about you, O

Hawkeye13

Me too. How are things?

SnazzyDresser

We miss your wry updates, Obladi! How's that crazy sober house living going?

Obladi

Hello, my friends.

I've been livin the life! It's amazing how time flies when you're sober, eh? In actuality, life is pretty much the same (mostly) low key routine it has been since I got here. Chore, intentions, breakfast, meds, meditation, work, walk, dinner, meeting, gratitude, inventory, bed. The days do go by quickly, for real. It's hard to believe I've been here for something like 7 weeks already. A woman who was in the same rehab as I was came to live at this place a couple of weeks prior to me and got the boot last Friday. House manager wasn't havin her bad attitude any longer and snapped. I'm ok with that. She didn't seem all that serious and she was pretty bratty, so that's ok by me. I mean, I feel bad for her and I think she probably went off on a bender, but it looked like that was coming regardless. Three women have come in after me, so I'm now the third most senior woman in the house. Privileges granted: I can pick a daily meeting and others can opt to join me (as opposed to me needing to find out what everyone else is doing). However, I am required to do that meeting in the company of at least one other woman in the house, so... there's that. The new women are great - I have no complaints.

House manager felt that she needed to speak with me last night. She'd come downstairs to check to make sure we were doing a meeting. I knew she was really exhausted, so after the other women assured her that we were indeed doing a meeting, I said with a smile, "So you can relax." She called me upstairs to tell me that while she and I are cool, I need to not tell her to relax; she's the manager and when there's a new manager maybe things will be different, but she's gotta be her. I thought "well, I'd like to be me, too," but just apologized and said, "Of course, you do you." And it was fine. When I woke up this morning, I considered that my intention should be to not be spoken to about anything today. Well, that plan was out the window within a couple of hours. House manager came out onto the porch where I was sitting with the newest woman and said, "O, since Sarah left, we're all pitching in to cover her chores today, so can you help with the porch?" And I said, "Sure thing; when you say 'help,' do you mean 'do?'" It was a legit question - I didn't know if she meant someone else was doing part of the job or if she was using the word 'help' colloquially. Nevertheless, I quick said (with a smile), "Never mind, I'll just do the whole thing." Annnnnnd... got called up to her room. Again. "O, I am sick of doing this. You need to stop this behavior." There was no cause for you to speak to me like that and say (mimicking a snotty voice) 'Never mind, I'll just take care of it. (Can I say something? No!) "You are correcting me and it has to stop. Maybe things aren't going to work out here and if you don't like it you can leave. But I'm not going to keep going around and around with you. Maybe things will be different when there's another manager here, but while I'm here that behavior is not ok." I just sat and repeated at appropriate intervals, "I'm sorry." "I understand." "I know that's something I need to work on." But then... it seemed a tiny opening appeared, and I was able to step in. "L, I honestly was trying to clarify. But I realized as soon as that question came out of my mouth that it might sound wrong, so that's why I quick tried to correct myself." So we talked. And I told her about my intention for the day and she laughed and said, "See, God gets right in your way sometimes." And I replied, "No, God was teaching me a lesson." I told her that I know my brain works differently in being so literal with words and I understand that it's hard to get to know me, So I need to be hyper-aware of those things if I don't want to keep crossing people. As we talked it out, she realized that her issue was that she felt that when I spoke to her like that "in front of the new girl," I was being disrespectful and setting up a potentially bad dynamic. I get that, can see that. So in the end, she offered me a hug, we did that, I cried a few tears and we move on. She's got her stuff, I've certainly got mine. *sigh*

Most days this week I didn't get corrected for anything, and L said "you've been perfect this last week," so there's hope.

MIddlest still isn't speaking with me. She and youngest did text to wish me a Happy Mother's Day, though. And youngest texted some about her anxiety with wondering when bars are going to open again so she can go back to work. I offered some advice and then apologized because she hadn't asked for it, and she assured me it was ok and she appreciated it. Eldest was at my home as I expected her to be, so I showed her how to work the lawnmower and she took care of that task. Work is going really well and I'm gratified that I've been able to really help out the members of my team who were all struggling in various ways. I feel like my boss is still "riding" me a little, but that's her prerogative.

I'm at the 4th step and procrastinating. My sponsor has really appreciated my writing on the first three, so that part is good. Searching and fearless doesn't sound like the most fun thing I could do, but it's not meant to be "fun" and has to be done to do this step thing right. I know I'm supposed to write first and then discover my stuff, but I feel now that at the bottom of all of it is fear. Not so much current-day fear, but having now seen how desperately I wanted to belong, it puts a different lens on everything in the past. I've been shooting myself in the foot (the same foot!) over and over and over again, never really understanding that I held the gun. It's really just so sad to look at the majority of my life pretty much wasted. I feel so sorry for what I did to myself. Not "sorry for myself," exactly - but... I don't know, more of a third person kind of thing. It's just tragic.

I listed to "Joe and Charlie" yesterday to get some perspective on writing the 4th step. They were helpful. And just now I'm noticing the irony (or something) of the emphasis they put on defining words precisely in that step. So many well-intentioned people have shrugged off my love of words, but these very same people just love it when other (esteemed?) people approach their understanding in much the same way. Ah, well. A tiny rallying cry I'll keep to myself (aside from sharing it with y'all.)

After what I believe has been at least two years of procrastination, I finally washed all of the sap and whatnot off of my white car. It looks pretty good on the outside, aside from the sort of crumpled in rear passenger side where I backed into a Frito truck. (No damage to the truck, fortunately.) I won't be able to fix that until after I pay off my rehab credit card debt, but that seems fitting.

I continue to not choose to not drink - I just don't. When I walked past the local liquor store the other day, it merely repulsed me. I'm started to shake my head at my own addiction in the way I've seen other people rather bemusedly talk about their own. Like man, I can't believe I did all that shtuff. Believe it. I did. I expect the chickens who've come to roost will hang around for a good long while. And that's as it should be.

Obladi

There's a reason I'm dragging my feet on the 4th Step. I think maybe it's because I'm really weary of people pointing out what's wrong with me, even if they are correct. Maybe I just can't take any more of that right now. I'm finding plenty on my own.

Dropsie

Great to get an update.

Your interchange with the house manager reminds me of my persepective that most things that go awry between well meaning people come down to communication. You are trying to be nice (relax) or be sure you do the right thing with the porch and she hears lack of respect hence a knick in her control armour. Its all fear based but does not make it easier.

As an outsider, I think the issue is that she has issues with control and wanting to be respected (to ensure she has control) and your way of interacting with her butts heads with that. But I suspect that now that you all talked that out it will do wonders going forward because when you hear yourself going down that road, you will stop yourself and acknowledge it -- "whoops I fear that came out wrong, was just being sure I understood" etc.

I wonder if always apologizing is the right thing though -- I think its fine to say "I am sorry that came out wrong, did not mean it that way;" but to apologize as such when you were not being confrontational seems like it may feed her view that you were. But I suspect after your talk will be better.

I have some other thoughts to share but time to work, will check in later.

Fusion

Thanks for the update, O. From where I stand looking in on your report, that AA led sober house is run by a house manager, just a year or so 'sober': who isn't 'sober' in AA parlance terms. She's still trying to 'run the show' and making your life skewed as she applies her speech control/co-dependancy problem, to the house management. It doesn't sound mentally healthy. 1984 springs to my mind...why would she criticise you for asking for clarification? Have you spoken to the house owner that appointed her about her neediness/others speech control?

fini

O, the 4th step has nothing to do with other people pointing anything out. at all.
the step is for you, for helping you see your part.
that said, i dragged my feet, too. not just for this, but also because, obv., if i took this step it would get me closer to dreaded five and nine.
i esp. dragged my feet on the part related to ex husband. yikes. the only time sponsorperson finally suggested it really was time and "let's set a bit of a deadline here, how about that?"
i finally did the ex husband part writing in a busy coffeeshop (oh good old days when we could sit in bustling spaces!) as that somehow helped me to concentrate on the task at hand vs sitting at home, making sure i kept getting distracted from the task.

Hawkeye13

I think this house manager does have some significant control issues O.

Obladi

Yeah my dears, L definitely has her own issues. I haven't harped on that here because it's painfully clear from the telling and I'm just trying to focus on my own self and the lessons I need to learn here. Yes, initially when she was still angry, she said "Don't let your addiction tell you that I'm being overly defensive or threatened because you're older than I am and have a management background." That was pretty mean, but I didn't take it on as being in any way accurate. And yes, after she calmed down somewhat later on she volunteered that she was feeling insecure. I know. I can see it and identify with it and even commiserate with it. But that she feels the need to give me a tongue-lashing from time to time isn't really all that significant anymore; it's the fact that I am walking on eggshells and get upset when I break one that's more significant. And really what's most important of all, I think, is that I need to take a really hard look at how my behavior (and even demeanor) impacts other people. Whether I mean it or not, it's something to be aware of. And the Over-The-Top-ness of this all might be exactly what I needed to bring the point home.

I did speak with the owner once. Suffice it to say there's nowhere to go in that direction. And that is what it is. Doesn't help L any, but that's not anywhere near my circus.



Exactly correct, of course. What I was referring to was actually "the dreaded five," which I did not dread at all the first time and it was actually fine. I had lots more to say than she listened to. I really don't have trouble owning my shtuff once I see it. Trouble letting go of ownership, sure. Mostly because these defects of self-centeredness developed out of fear. Fear of not belonging (because I didn't), fear of never learning the rules (because no one would tell me), fear of being weird and different (because I am). So I fear that my sponsor will take this as a time to school me and while I'm open to the idea that there's probably more education in order, I'm just not prepared for anyone to point it out to me. You know, due to fragility and whatnot. It looks like a vicious vortex right this moment. I don't know if I'm making any sense at all.

I told her I'd read a good bit of the 12&12 in regard to this step and found it to be extraordinarily harsh. She doesn't see it that way - it's just about seeing our part in things that bother us. She told me one day maybe six months ago that perhaps the thing that happened with my brother was God's plan; maybe if I could think of it that way it would bring me peace. I'm kind of shocked at this now that it's coming out on my keyboard. More than shocked. Deeply troubled and feeling all of those old, "But if I was wrong about her, than I screwed up again and what the hell am I still doing with her?" and "But... I really really don't think I'm wrong; that's a very twisted point of view. Isn't it?"

And also, yesterday when I was telling my tale of being berated by L, pretty much her summary was, "You just need to take this as practice in not talking back and questioning authority." And when I told her that's what I had been working very hard at, she was like, "Oh, ok, good. I gotta go now." Before that, I'd told her I could write the step but where it's at right now for me is fear (...and would have liked to expand on that just a bit like I did above), and her response was, "Everybody feels that." That may well be the case, but I don't need to be poo-pooed. You know? My shlitt is special and doesn't smell like any one else's.

Grymt

Fear, like many things, is a feeling. Sometimes it overwhelms, sometimes it lurks. Ithelps to not identify with it. Instead of self talk like 'I am afraid'Say, think: 'At this moment of time, the feeling I call fear has arisen within me. It has the following characteristics: pause and spend some time looking at the breath as it is in the area around the mouth. Fast, slow, hot, coldWhat is my abdomen doing. Moving, contracting... A quick scan of the mind body phenomenon what other sensations, feelings are there... And so on. The same applies to any other feelings recognised as not me. In time there is calm, and then the circus starts up again... Be happy.

fini

ah yes, the special stuff that doesn’t smell like anyone else’s. well, of course it does.

you know, O, that there is no requirement ,to take the fifth step with your sponsor. i found going to a nun who is known around here for the fifth-taking to be an excellent decision. it caused me some concern about how my sponsorperson would see that, and “feel” about it, and i agonized a bit over my own feelings of not wanting to take that step with them. how that was saying i did not trust them in some ways. i knew what i didn’t trust was that they sometimes “took my side” when there was no need to. that their empathy about certain situations was not always to my benefit, though they did intend it that way. that i had fear about being told i was too hard on myself.
and i also knew we did not see the step in the same way.
so....i talked it over with RobbyRobot
i asked his advice, maverick that he was
and went with the nun.

different circumstances than yours, of course.
but yeah, i hear you on the “god’s plan” thing. not part of my belief system. ‘nuf said.
questioning authority? nobody actually has authority over you. that there are house rules is fine; there need to be. but authority? and does sponsor know what you need to “learn”?

who knows what we need to learn??
genuine question.

Obladi

Thanks, Grymt. I'm afraid (pun intended) I'm in a place where I'm realizing that fear has been a constant underlying motivation - or defect if you prefer - for pretty much forever.

I think the first step is awareness. I believe I may need to absorb this before I can move along and work on detachment.

Does that make sense?

Obladi

Thanks for that reminder, fini. I'd never really considered that as an option. Seems like it's "not done," though of course the book took pains to point out people with whom that step could be taken.

I think I'm struggling with the purpose of the 5th step. If it's a confessional to expose all of my darkest nooks and crannies, that's one thing. Maybe I ought to tell my whole entire story to one person on this earth and there's some mystical magic to having done that? Is that it? If it's intended to show my patterns, I think I don't really need any "help" at this time, snotty as that may sound. I don't feel snotty about it - I feel like I see it and it's excruciating and embarrassing and leads me right back into ego which is the opposite of what I'm to be doing, right? Having someone else point it out to me is just going to rub salt in the wound. And if it's intended to have someone else identify what I need to learn, then... yeah, same question you pose.

entropy1964

Hi O

Well I won't weigh in on what kind of person your house manager is or isn't. For me its not germane and you are where you are. And making it work seems to be the most important part.....if not, I would imagine, quite humbling.

I continue to be very impressed that you are making this work. That you are learning a lot about yourself. The amount of sharp and decisive change you are putting yourself through is probably quite challenging. Be compassionate with yourself. You aren't all flaws and character defects. You are human. All of us, when shoved under the microscope, are pretty dinged up. That's ok.

Seems to me you are getting some seriously concentrated practice at letting stuff go, not taking things personally and drawing within your own lines.

Hang in there!

fini

before i went on my 12-step journey, i had many conversations in email with a long-term AA sober guy.
one of the things i felt, as in a feeling, was that something in me needed to break. and i was unsure what that might be, and asked if any of that made sense to him. this vague but desperate feeling of something needing to break in order to move forward.
it stumped him a bit. eventually, what came back was an outline of the steps describing what each of them helps "break".
for the fifth, he wrote "it breaks our inability to trust."

i remember the moment i read it. i got pretty outraged. because i knew that i trusted. definitely knew that i had no inability to trust.
and a minute later i sat at my computer just bawling. cause i saw i trusted no-one. i couldn't and i didn't.

anyway, these are big things, and a little conversation like this does not really impart the impact this had on me.

you are not AT step five. you are doing step 4. so stay there. stay there so that you can be honest without being less so because of fear of future work.

and yeah, definitely 5 "is done" with anyone of your choosing. there are reasons that is in the book. if a sponsor cannot "handle" that...all the more reason to consider not doing it with them.
you will figure it out when you get there.

Fusion

O, from where I stand looking in on your thread, your sponsor's comments upon your brother's action being God's will, is well, incomprehensible. It's no reflection on you, if you realise that too, and ditch her, despite previously persevering with her. Plus her other comments about the sober living house. And the so called just over a year sober house manager. What qualifications do they have to tell you how to lead your life, when the house manager is clearly struggling?

If you wish to continue down the AA steps route once more, why don't you select someone on SR, that displays the type of serenity that the 12 Steps provide, that you seek, and ask them to guide you? There are many AA people on SR that demonstrate serenity. One posts on this thread, nuff said. There are a few others, who post other places on SR, as I'm sure you're aware. If they aren't able to assist, then there's virtual websites that provide sponsors by email, such as E-AA.

I can't guide you, because I found serenity (again) via a more direct route, intercepting any drinking thoughts. But if you wish to seek equanimity, via the 12 Steps, and you're not willing to do it yourself or follow for example, Joe and Charlie's guidelines, then maybe you should seek a new sponsor.

Obladi

Thanks for that, fini.

I also don't trust anyone, so in my own way I overdisclose when it's not safe to do so. Because it never is, or at least I've been incapable of discerning the difference. I try to fix my inability to trust by trusting, and it burns me just about every single time.

I don't understand what to "do" with 4 without understanding what the point of 5 is. There are many interpretations, as you know well, so I followed the instructions from the book as I understood them. But Joe and Charles dissection of words has me wondering if I did understand.

For instance, I understood that when we write about resentments, it is those we still hold onto. But I read/heard someone say they wrote out every resentment they'd ever had in their whole entire life. So... which is it? I've gotta think the purpose of 5 would inform that answer.

If I'm doing an inventory, I don't count everything I've ever had in the store, just what's there right this moment.

I think?