Do I qualify?
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Slouching toward Bethlehem
Posts: 94
Do I qualify?
Hi gang. I'm been hoping you can help me sort through an issue I've got. I've been attending AA meetings more off than on for about six months now, and have spent the great majority of that time sober, with the occasional lapse now and then. Currently I've got about a month of sobriety to my credit.
My problem is this: though I identify myself as an alcoholic during meetings, I'm really not sure that's the case. True, my drinking was getting out of hand. But at my worst I was never really drinking more than about a bottle of wine a night, five or six nights a week. Now I find myself wondering whether I'm going because I need to go, or because it pleases my wife and some of the acquaintances I have made in the Rooms. I've read the big book, and I can identify with parts of it though not all, and I've heard the old adage that normies don't go around wondering if they're alcoholic. Still, in my heart of hearts there's doubt.
I guess my questions are these: (1) is this normal, and just alcoholism trying to talk me back into my cave? and (2) how did you get past it (or have you)?
My problem is this: though I identify myself as an alcoholic during meetings, I'm really not sure that's the case. True, my drinking was getting out of hand. But at my worst I was never really drinking more than about a bottle of wine a night, five or six nights a week. Now I find myself wondering whether I'm going because I need to go, or because it pleases my wife and some of the acquaintances I have made in the Rooms. I've read the big book, and I can identify with parts of it though not all, and I've heard the old adage that normies don't go around wondering if they're alcoholic. Still, in my heart of hearts there's doubt.
I guess my questions are these: (1) is this normal, and just alcoholism trying to talk me back into my cave? and (2) how did you get past it (or have you)?
Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: The Field of Dreams
Posts: 7,249
I don't think anyone can really answer this except you.For me,I knew long ago.Long before I decided to stop.Perhaps you should read ch.3 once again."We do not like to pronounce any individual as alcoholic,but you can quickly diagnose yourself.Step over to the nearest barroom and try some controlled drinking.Try to stop abruptly.Try it more than once.It will not take long for you to decide,if you are honest with yourself about it.It may be worth a bad case of the jitters if you get a full knowledge of your condition" I'm not sure if this is good advice or not.I am definatlly not suggesting you go drink again.So don't go and try to tell your wife the people at SoberRecovery told you to go drink. 
Its simply a quote from the big book.
Its simply a quote from the big book.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Beaver, WA
Posts: 1,346
1) Quite possibly. At least from what I've read you having already written about yourself.
2) John Barleycorn(Alcohol) was a very good advocate. I tried beating the game alone and continued to have lurking notions that I could drink with impunity ...
if only.......... Until I finally quit playing the game and saw that entire abstinence was my only real option.
Would love to talk more live time in chatroom if you wish. Please feel free to PM me if you want. By the way, what is with the CAVE?
3legs
2) John Barleycorn(Alcohol) was a very good advocate. I tried beating the game alone and continued to have lurking notions that I could drink with impunity ...
if only.......... Until I finally quit playing the game and saw that entire abstinence was my only real option.
Would love to talk more live time in chatroom if you wish. Please feel free to PM me if you want. By the way, what is with the CAVE?
3legs
Member
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Zion, Illinois
Posts: 3,411
Groucho,
You said you drank a bottle of wine a night. Why not just a glass of wine a night? Try that.
You sound just like me when I first came around. I knew deep down I was an alcoholic but kept trying to convince myself otherwise. My sponsor asked me one day why I kept looking for a way out. I just didn't want to be an alcoholic.
There's another place in the Big Book in chapter 3 where it suggests trying to not drink for one year. When I read that I knew I was sunk. There's no way I could have done a year at that time. I didn't know how.
So, try drinking just one glass of wine a night, put the bottle away and check how you feel. Try this for a week or two. What the hell, it's worth a shot isn't it.
You said you drank a bottle of wine a night. Why not just a glass of wine a night? Try that.
You sound just like me when I first came around. I knew deep down I was an alcoholic but kept trying to convince myself otherwise. My sponsor asked me one day why I kept looking for a way out. I just didn't want to be an alcoholic.
There's another place in the Big Book in chapter 3 where it suggests trying to not drink for one year. When I read that I knew I was sunk. There's no way I could have done a year at that time. I didn't know how.
So, try drinking just one glass of wine a night, put the bottle away and check how you feel. Try this for a week or two. What the hell, it's worth a shot isn't it.
Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: England, UK
Posts: 197
Groucho
It's a tough one to answer for anyone but yourself.
I have had similar thoughts and now I'm approaching 60 days sober. I'm less concerned with the thoughts of am I or amen't I an alcoholic. The fact is that I'm sober today and today I am enjoying being sober.
I attend meetings twice/three times a week and yesterday I spent all day at a AA/Alanon convention.
I know for me that going to AA helps me stay sober...one day at a time. Sharing at AA helps others to stay sober also. My experience from AA has helped me to become a better person and that has a positive impact upon the lives of those whose lives my behaviour affects every day. That's what matters to me I guess. So I'm less hung up about being diagnosed as an alcoholic.
Rich
It's a tough one to answer for anyone but yourself.
I have had similar thoughts and now I'm approaching 60 days sober. I'm less concerned with the thoughts of am I or amen't I an alcoholic. The fact is that I'm sober today and today I am enjoying being sober.
I attend meetings twice/three times a week and yesterday I spent all day at a AA/Alanon convention.
I know for me that going to AA helps me stay sober...one day at a time. Sharing at AA helps others to stay sober also. My experience from AA has helped me to become a better person and that has a positive impact upon the lives of those whose lives my behaviour affects every day. That's what matters to me I guess. So I'm less hung up about being diagnosed as an alcoholic.
Rich
Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Greenfield, MA
Posts: 62
take the test-From AA Website
http://www.aa.org/default/en_about_aa.cfm?pageid=4
IS A.A. FOR YOU?
Only you can decide whether you want to give A.A.a try —
whether you think it can help you.
We who are in A.A. came because we finally gave up trying to control our drinking. We still hated to admit that we could never drink safely. Then we heard from other A.A. members that we were sick. (We thought so for years!) We found out that many people suffered from the same feelings of guilt and loneliness and hopelessness that we did. We found out that we had these feelings because we had the disease of alcoholism.
We decided to try and face up to what alcohol had done to us. Here are some of the questions we tried to answer honestly. If we answered YES to four or more questions, we were in deep trouble with our drinking. See how you do. Remember, there is no disgrace in facing up to the fact that you have a problem.
Answer YES or NO to the following questions.
1 - Have you ever decided to stop drinking for a week or so, but only lasted for a couple of days?
Most of us in A.A. made all kinds of promises to ourselves and to our families. We could not keep them. Then we came to A.A. A.A. said: "Just try not to drink today." (If you do not drink today, you cannot get drunk today.)
Yes No
2 - Do you wish people would mind their own business about your drinking-- stop telling you what to do?
In A.A. we do not tell anyone to do anything. We just talk about our own drinking, the trouble we got into, and how we stopped. We will be glad to help you, if you want us to.
Yes No
3 - Have you ever switched from one kind of drink to another in the hope that this would keep you from getting drunk?
We tried all kinds of ways. We made our drinks weak. Or just drank beer. Or we did not drink cocktails. Or only drank on weekends. You name it, we tried it. But if we drank anything with alcohol in it, we usually got drunk eventually.
Yes No
4 - Have you had to have an eye-opener upon awakening during the past year?
Do you need a drink to get started, or to stop shaking? This is a pretty sure sign that you are not drinking "socially."
Yes No
5 - Do you envy people who can drink without getting into trouble?
At one time or another, most of us have wondered why we were not like most people, who really can take it or leave it.
Yes No
6 - Have you had problems connected with drinking during the past year?
Be honest! Doctors say that if you have a problem with alcohol and keep on drinking, it will get worse -- never better. Eventually, you will die, or end up in an institution for the rest of your life. The only hope is to stop drinking.
Yes No
7 - Has your drinking caused trouble at home?
Before we came into A.A., most of us said that it was the people or problems at home that made us drink. We could not see that our drinking just made everything worse. It never solved problems anywhere or anytime.
Yes No
8 - Do you ever try to get "extra" drinks at a party because you do not get enough?
Most of us used to have a "few" before we started out if we thought it was going to be that kind of party. And if drinks were not served fast enough, we would go some place else to get more.
Yes No
9 - Do you tell yourself you can stop drinking any time you want to, even though you keep getting drunk when you don't mean to?
Many of us kidded ourselves into thinking that we drank because we wanted to. After we came into A.A., we found out that once we started to drink, we couldn't stop.
Yes No
10 - Have you missed days of work or school because of drinking?
Many of us admit now that we "called in sick" lots of times when the truth was that we were hung-over or on a drunk.
Yes No
11 - Do you have "blackouts"?
A "blackout" is when we have been drinking hours or days which we cannot remember. When we came to A.A., we found out that this is a pretty sure sign of alcoholic drinking.
Yes No
12 - Have you ever felt that your life would be better if you did not drink?
Many of us started to drink because drinking made life seem better, at least for a while. By the time we got into A.A., we felt trapped. We were drinking to live and living to drink. We were sick and tired of being sick and tired.
Yes No
Did you answer YES four or more times? If so, you are probably in trouble with alcohol. Why do we say this? Because thousands of people in A.A. have said so for many years. They found out the truth about themselves — the hard way.
But again, only you can decide whether you think A.A. is for you. Try to keep an open mind on the subject. If the answer is YES, we will be glad to show you how we stopped drinking ourselves. Just call.
A.A. does not promise to solve your life's problems. But we can show you how we are learning to live without drinking "one day at a time." We stay away from that "first drink." If there is no first one, there cannot be a tenth one. And when we got rid of alcohol, we found that life became much more manageable.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ALCOHOLICS ANONYMOUS® is a fellowship of men and women who share their experience, strength and hope with each other that they may solve their common problem and help others to recover from alcoholism.
The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking. There are no dues or fees for A.A. membership; we are self-supporting through our own contributions.
A.A. is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization or institution; does not wish to engage in any controversy; neither endorses nor opposes any causes. Our primary purpose is to stay sober and help other alcoholics to achieve sobriety.
Copyright © by The A.A. Grapevine, Inc.; reprinted with permission
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
© Copyright 2004 Alcoholics Anonymous World Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Privacy Statement and Web site Policy
Street Address:
Alcoholics Anonymous
475 Riverside Drive
11th Floor
New York, N.Y. 10115 Mailing Address:
Alcoholics Anonymous
Grand Central Station
P.O. Box 459
New York, N.Y. 10163
IS A.A. FOR YOU?
Only you can decide whether you want to give A.A.a try —
whether you think it can help you.
We who are in A.A. came because we finally gave up trying to control our drinking. We still hated to admit that we could never drink safely. Then we heard from other A.A. members that we were sick. (We thought so for years!) We found out that many people suffered from the same feelings of guilt and loneliness and hopelessness that we did. We found out that we had these feelings because we had the disease of alcoholism.
We decided to try and face up to what alcohol had done to us. Here are some of the questions we tried to answer honestly. If we answered YES to four or more questions, we were in deep trouble with our drinking. See how you do. Remember, there is no disgrace in facing up to the fact that you have a problem.
Answer YES or NO to the following questions.
1 - Have you ever decided to stop drinking for a week or so, but only lasted for a couple of days?
Most of us in A.A. made all kinds of promises to ourselves and to our families. We could not keep them. Then we came to A.A. A.A. said: "Just try not to drink today." (If you do not drink today, you cannot get drunk today.)
Yes No
2 - Do you wish people would mind their own business about your drinking-- stop telling you what to do?
In A.A. we do not tell anyone to do anything. We just talk about our own drinking, the trouble we got into, and how we stopped. We will be glad to help you, if you want us to.
Yes No
3 - Have you ever switched from one kind of drink to another in the hope that this would keep you from getting drunk?
We tried all kinds of ways. We made our drinks weak. Or just drank beer. Or we did not drink cocktails. Or only drank on weekends. You name it, we tried it. But if we drank anything with alcohol in it, we usually got drunk eventually.
Yes No
4 - Have you had to have an eye-opener upon awakening during the past year?
Do you need a drink to get started, or to stop shaking? This is a pretty sure sign that you are not drinking "socially."
Yes No
5 - Do you envy people who can drink without getting into trouble?
At one time or another, most of us have wondered why we were not like most people, who really can take it or leave it.
Yes No
6 - Have you had problems connected with drinking during the past year?
Be honest! Doctors say that if you have a problem with alcohol and keep on drinking, it will get worse -- never better. Eventually, you will die, or end up in an institution for the rest of your life. The only hope is to stop drinking.
Yes No
7 - Has your drinking caused trouble at home?
Before we came into A.A., most of us said that it was the people or problems at home that made us drink. We could not see that our drinking just made everything worse. It never solved problems anywhere or anytime.
Yes No
8 - Do you ever try to get "extra" drinks at a party because you do not get enough?
Most of us used to have a "few" before we started out if we thought it was going to be that kind of party. And if drinks were not served fast enough, we would go some place else to get more.
Yes No
9 - Do you tell yourself you can stop drinking any time you want to, even though you keep getting drunk when you don't mean to?
Many of us kidded ourselves into thinking that we drank because we wanted to. After we came into A.A., we found out that once we started to drink, we couldn't stop.
Yes No
10 - Have you missed days of work or school because of drinking?
Many of us admit now that we "called in sick" lots of times when the truth was that we were hung-over or on a drunk.
Yes No
11 - Do you have "blackouts"?
A "blackout" is when we have been drinking hours or days which we cannot remember. When we came to A.A., we found out that this is a pretty sure sign of alcoholic drinking.
Yes No
12 - Have you ever felt that your life would be better if you did not drink?
Many of us started to drink because drinking made life seem better, at least for a while. By the time we got into A.A., we felt trapped. We were drinking to live and living to drink. We were sick and tired of being sick and tired.
Yes No
Did you answer YES four or more times? If so, you are probably in trouble with alcohol. Why do we say this? Because thousands of people in A.A. have said so for many years. They found out the truth about themselves — the hard way.
But again, only you can decide whether you think A.A. is for you. Try to keep an open mind on the subject. If the answer is YES, we will be glad to show you how we stopped drinking ourselves. Just call.
A.A. does not promise to solve your life's problems. But we can show you how we are learning to live without drinking "one day at a time." We stay away from that "first drink." If there is no first one, there cannot be a tenth one. And when we got rid of alcohol, we found that life became much more manageable.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ALCOHOLICS ANONYMOUS® is a fellowship of men and women who share their experience, strength and hope with each other that they may solve their common problem and help others to recover from alcoholism.
The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking. There are no dues or fees for A.A. membership; we are self-supporting through our own contributions.
A.A. is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization or institution; does not wish to engage in any controversy; neither endorses nor opposes any causes. Our primary purpose is to stay sober and help other alcoholics to achieve sobriety.
Copyright © by The A.A. Grapevine, Inc.; reprinted with permission
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
© Copyright 2004 Alcoholics Anonymous World Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Privacy Statement and Web site Policy
Street Address:
Alcoholics Anonymous
475 Riverside Drive
11th Floor
New York, N.Y. 10115 Mailing Address:
Alcoholics Anonymous
Grand Central Station
P.O. Box 459
New York, N.Y. 10163
Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Arizona
Posts: 872
Two quotes for you...
1. "It's not how much we drank, it's where we ended up." -- some (wise) old timer at my meeting. :soapbox
2. "I would rather go through life sober, believing I'm an alcoholic; rather than drunk, or even a little drunk -- denying that I am ..." -- Black Wally, Phoenix AZ.
2. "I would rather go through life sober, believing I'm an alcoholic; rather than drunk, or even a little drunk -- denying that I am ..." -- Black Wally, Phoenix AZ.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Slouching toward Bethlehem
Posts: 94
Thanks for your insite. I've taken all the quizzes before, AA's included. I always pass with flying colors. I scored 9 out of 12 this time, by the way.
I don't think I'm interested in one glass of wine. Thanks for helping clarify things.
So, try drinking just one glass of wine a night, put the bottle away and check how you feel. Try this for a week or two. What the hell, it's worth a shot isn't it.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Arizona
Posts: 872
Originally Posted by Groucho
I don't think I'm interested in one glass of wine.
Sucks, but it is what it is. I'm an alcoholic and I cannot drink alcohol safely.
Welcome to the club!
Ken
Grateful recovering alcoholic
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Blissfield, MI
Posts: 814
Groucho,
Another thing to remember: it's not the amount we drank, it's not the length of time we drank - it's what happens to us WHEN we drink. After taking that first drink, can you fully guarantee what you are going to do?
For me, a drink was a fifth. I never used glasses, a drink was the size of the container it came in. Made sense to me!!! Sick, sick, sick.
So, I felt I wasn't really lying to the ocifers, I mean police officers, when I said I only had 2 drinks!!
Good luck on your journey,
Jen
Another thing to remember: it's not the amount we drank, it's not the length of time we drank - it's what happens to us WHEN we drink. After taking that first drink, can you fully guarantee what you are going to do?
For me, a drink was a fifth. I never used glasses, a drink was the size of the container it came in. Made sense to me!!! Sick, sick, sick.
So, I felt I wasn't really lying to the ocifers, I mean police officers, when I said I only had 2 drinks!!
Good luck on your journey,
Jen
Member
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: uk
Posts: 41
i have exactly the same problem at my worst the most i was drinking was a bottle of wine a night, or four cans of strong beer or cider it never got any worse or any better, i stopped several times and then started again having only a drink once or twice a week only to end up the same, i've been sober now for a little over three months which is the time i gave myself to stay sober and then see how i feel, well i feel so much better, however i now get the feeling i can control it , but there again i've said this about a hundred times before and its never worked so i dare not try it.
stay strong
dave
stay strong
dave
Happy Christmas!
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: on a wire near you
Posts: 33
hi groucho
This is what I think...it's not how much you drink, but how much you NEED it. I generally only drank a bottle of wine a night...but if I couldn't have it I would would get anxious, irritable and didn't know what to do with myself. Trying to have just one glass would be torture for me...it had to be enough to last all evening. I don't think you have to get smashed every day to be an alcoholic...you can find yourself using it as a kind of medicine that you have become dependant on...to feel normal. All the best, Bird
Not the center of the Universe
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Orchard Lake, Michigan
Posts: 974
I don't think there is a better way to put it than
(but of course I have to try 
) I think if you get to the point that you are trying to control your drinking then your drinking is already controlling you. But I can't say for sure because I never really tried to control my drinking in all the 25 years I was using. I know I did end up literally needing a drink or three every morning to function. I know that I just couldn't imagine a life without alcohol until I had one. I know that my life has changed in countless ways, big and small, all for the better in the 2+ years since I stopped. And I know that even today I catch myself wondering
Jah Bless
Originally Posted by Music
I know one thing if I don't know anything else. No "normal" drinker I've ever known has ever had to wonder if they're an alcoholic or not. 
) I think if you get to the point that you are trying to control your drinking then your drinking is already controlling you. But I can't say for sure because I never really tried to control my drinking in all the 25 years I was using. I know I did end up literally needing a drink or three every morning to function. I know that I just couldn't imagine a life without alcohol until I had one. I know that my life has changed in countless ways, big and small, all for the better in the 2+ years since I stopped. And I know that even today I catch myself wondering "Why can't I have all this happiness, peace and serenity and a glass of wine too?"
and that one question is how I know I'm an alcoholic. Jah Bless
Member
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Boston
Posts: 710
Originally Posted by Music
I know one thing if I don't know anything else. No "normal" drinker I've ever known has ever had to wonder if they're an alcoholic or not.
Patsy
Member
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 1,432
I believe that drinking behavior exists on a continuum, and I know people who drank a bottle of wine (or something similar) every night, rarely more, sometimes less.
I don't think there is such a thing as a 'normal' drinker. It's not us vs. them, with a clear line of demarcation. For some people drinking behavior steadily increases until it becomes very harmful. For others it's just a habit like overeating; if they changed, they'd probably live longer, but they're not adversely affected enough by it to see the benefit of quitting. Some people go in and out of heavy drinking during their lives, with periods of abstinence interspersed.
IMO, Groucho, you are describing a somewhat heavy drinker who has successfully reduced his drinking significantly and is mostly abstinent. Abstinence is probably the easiest choice for you as it is/was for most of us, based on our past history.
And what's wrong with pleasing your wife and acquaintances? If you find the support helpful, great. If it becomes an impediment to your life in some way, and you feel confident in your sobriety, don't go. I'm guessing you'd be welcome back anytime. In my case, I believe that if I showed ambivalence about sobriety it would cause distress in my children. That's a good motivating factor for me.
'Alcoholism' doesn't talk to you; you talk to you. People who achieve long term sobriety do it by changing their beliefs about the role of alcohol in their lives. If you're wondering about it, you're wondering about that role. Perhaps the adverse effects of your previous drinking aren't as sharp in your memory, because time has passed. Getting some feedback from you spouse or others on that might be useful.
Don S
I don't think there is such a thing as a 'normal' drinker. It's not us vs. them, with a clear line of demarcation. For some people drinking behavior steadily increases until it becomes very harmful. For others it's just a habit like overeating; if they changed, they'd probably live longer, but they're not adversely affected enough by it to see the benefit of quitting. Some people go in and out of heavy drinking during their lives, with periods of abstinence interspersed.
IMO, Groucho, you are describing a somewhat heavy drinker who has successfully reduced his drinking significantly and is mostly abstinent. Abstinence is probably the easiest choice for you as it is/was for most of us, based on our past history.
And what's wrong with pleasing your wife and acquaintances? If you find the support helpful, great. If it becomes an impediment to your life in some way, and you feel confident in your sobriety, don't go. I'm guessing you'd be welcome back anytime. In my case, I believe that if I showed ambivalence about sobriety it would cause distress in my children. That's a good motivating factor for me.
'Alcoholism' doesn't talk to you; you talk to you. People who achieve long term sobriety do it by changing their beliefs about the role of alcohol in their lives. If you're wondering about it, you're wondering about that role. Perhaps the adverse effects of your previous drinking aren't as sharp in your memory, because time has passed. Getting some feedback from you spouse or others on that might be useful.
Don S
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