Is it really your AV, or just someone/thing to blame for your weakness???
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2017
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Is it really your AV, or just someone/thing to blame for your weakness???
Our bodies and brains, when addicted to alcohol, are really treacherous, are they not? Two weeks into sobriety, one really starts to feel better. Brain fog gone, most of the aches and pains also. See - they seem to say, it's all right, we're fine, and a drink - or two - would really be nice wouldn't it? This actually starts around day four or five, I think.
Then comes the end of week two (in my case), and feeling better than I have in many weeks. But seeing/realizing that the old "we're fine" ploy doesn't seem to work this time around, these two - body and brain - become vindictive in the extreme. You wake up on day 15 feeling like s... , your head feels dull, your liver hurts and feels like a lump of lead inside of you.
And the two of them, together with your AV, team up and tells you: "A couple of whiskeys and you'll feel no pain, Corrie. Just one or two." But my SR voice reminds me that if I do, tomorrow I'll be right back where I was a couple of weeks ago, and many other times before that. And I just don't want to start all over again; even if it's only been two weeks.
So I'm going to take the dogs outside to do their thing, then get into bed, and pray for sleep to take me away from my alcoholic suicidal thoughts.
Night everyone on SR.
Then comes the end of week two (in my case), and feeling better than I have in many weeks. But seeing/realizing that the old "we're fine" ploy doesn't seem to work this time around, these two - body and brain - become vindictive in the extreme. You wake up on day 15 feeling like s... , your head feels dull, your liver hurts and feels like a lump of lead inside of you.
And the two of them, together with your AV, team up and tells you: "A couple of whiskeys and you'll feel no pain, Corrie. Just one or two." But my SR voice reminds me that if I do, tomorrow I'll be right back where I was a couple of weeks ago, and many other times before that. And I just don't want to start all over again; even if it's only been two weeks.
So I'm going to take the dogs outside to do their thing, then get into bed, and pray for sleep to take me away from my alcoholic suicidal thoughts.
Night everyone on SR.
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Wisconsin, USA
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It's probably a little of both, and a sprinkle of humanity mixed in. Sorry you are getting a lot of noise from wherever it's coming from, but it's just that - noise. You have the power to make the right choices when you hear that noise....taking out the dogs, going for a walk, praying, eating a sandwich, whatever it might be that doesn't involve drinking.
On a somewhat serious note...if you truly are having suicidal thoughts please do contact someone about it. They would much rather have it be a false alarms and just talk than the alternative. Having a bad day is normal....wanting it to be your last is not.
https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...ease-read.html
On a somewhat serious note...if you truly are having suicidal thoughts please do contact someone about it. They would much rather have it be a false alarms and just talk than the alternative. Having a bad day is normal....wanting it to be your last is not.
https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...ease-read.html
Member
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 1,183
I think most of us have heard that voice. I call it the reptile, some folks call it an addict voice or AV, it's part of addiction - our brain's way of saying, I want you to restore my chemical (im)balance that you've gotten me accustomed to. Earlier on, that same (im)balance is responsible for withdrawal symptoms ranging from jitters to full-blow DT's and hallucinations and seizures, but eventually it quiets down to just an annoying little voice. 
Mine is long quiet now, so it does go away, but it takes time.
Mine is long quiet now, so it does go away, but it takes time.
Life Goes On
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Baltimore, Maryland
Posts: 6,069
In my opinion, the "beast" speaks with the voice of the AV and it is entirely up to Me whether I listen or not. Oh but that AV is a wily conniving little bugger and will use everything IT knows about me to cajole, scare or otherwise convince Me to drink.
Here's a couple of links on AVRT, from which we borrow the term Addictive Voice:
There's a relatively brief intro here: https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...ined-long.html (AVRT Explained (long))
For the voracious learner in you, there's a really really long thread you can read here: https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...iscussion.html (Addictive Voice Recognition Technique (AVRT) Discussion)
O
Here's a couple of links on AVRT, from which we borrow the term Addictive Voice:
There's a relatively brief intro here: https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...ined-long.html (AVRT Explained (long))
For the voracious learner in you, there's a really really long thread you can read here: https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...iscussion.html (Addictive Voice Recognition Technique (AVRT) Discussion)
O
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Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,981
It's to understand our conscious mind (That alcohol is evil, and there is no reason for it) and our alcoholic subconscious (Just a sip won't hurt, you can only have a couple,. etc)
You are ALWAYS in control. That is something to always embed as the AV is just an evil demon trying to tempt you to do wrong, but it can never get it's way unless you do so.
You are ALWAYS in control. That is something to always embed as the AV is just an evil demon trying to tempt you to do wrong, but it can never get it's way unless you do so.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 147
Hi, Scott. I'm sorry you misunderstood my "Suicide" quip. What I meant was that - carrying on with drinking is like committing suicide in the end, isn't it? Slow and painful, but suicide nevertheless...
Thanks for caring.
Thanks for caring.
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Atlanta
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I don't use the term AV often (it just doesn't resonate with me as a good descriptor) but I wanted to say that I don't see alcoholism as a weakness or it being about weakness that we "can't" quit. It's a disease. So for me, it's not about "strength" or "will" (not necessarily your words, just how I think of hearing some people describe their approach to "beating" our disease) - it's about one decision - to quit- then acceptance that we cannot do it ourselves.
Whatever we term or how we think of alcoholism, the important part is sharing that you get through each day sober!
Whatever we term or how we think of alcoholism, the important part is sharing that you get through each day sober!
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,229
AV is just the label i huck on the part of me that seeks self destruction at every point it can. it doesnt even have to be booze. that part of me could also have me sign up for a loan i cant afford or some committment i'll never be able to fulfill or get me to take on way more then i can handle. I swear it does all that to try and then come aroudn when i'm stressed and freaking out cause i've over done it again and it whispers in my ear "how about a drink?". the AV is cunning its 10 steps ahead of the sane part of my brain. its always plotting and schemeing how it can somehow get me to screw myself over and eventaully reach for a drink.
I can see why some thought this illness was a form of schitzophranea or something at one point. It really does feel as if theres some other person in me that just wants to take over the wheel and drive me off a cliff by getting me to make poor choice after poor choice. I can hardly help myself.
But I guess I drew my line in the sane with this beast when i got sober and said you might trick me into a lot of stupid stuff but i'm not drinking. over time i've backed the line up futher to my side and said i'm not smoking either and i'mg onna excercise and i'm gonna eat right etc.. all the while that AV part of me is thrashing and lashing out begging for its fix.
But all you can do is starve this beast dont give if the fuel it wants and it'll back off.
I can see why some thought this illness was a form of schitzophranea or something at one point. It really does feel as if theres some other person in me that just wants to take over the wheel and drive me off a cliff by getting me to make poor choice after poor choice. I can hardly help myself.
But I guess I drew my line in the sane with this beast when i got sober and said you might trick me into a lot of stupid stuff but i'm not drinking. over time i've backed the line up futher to my side and said i'm not smoking either and i'mg onna excercise and i'm gonna eat right etc.. all the while that AV part of me is thrashing and lashing out begging for its fix.
But all you can do is starve this beast dont give if the fuel it wants and it'll back off.
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: New York, NY
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Denial and rationalization are big components of alcoholism and these continue when we stop drinking. It's the reason why I still go to AA meetings after 26 years of sobriety: I know I have another drink in me but I don't think I have another recovery.
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Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Chicago
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For me it was all about the REAL decision to quit. I had thought about quitting a million times and half a** tried hundreds of times. Again for me it wasn't the av getting me to drink again. It was that I really hadn't committed to quitting. When I finally decided that I had had enough did I finally succeed.
It was that I didn't care what my av, or whatever you want to call it, said. I didn't listen or care what it thought. I knew I was done and no one was going to tell me otherwise.
I know that may sound over simplified but for me to come to that decision was the greatest thing I ever did for myself. I finally became selfish for a good reason.
All that being said, my point is that you know you can't drink. You've made it two weeks without it so you CAN do it. Now do you want it or not?
It was that I didn't care what my av, or whatever you want to call it, said. I didn't listen or care what it thought. I knew I was done and no one was going to tell me otherwise.
I know that may sound over simplified but for me to come to that decision was the greatest thing I ever did for myself. I finally became selfish for a good reason.
All that being said, my point is that you know you can't drink. You've made it two weeks without it so you CAN do it. Now do you want it or not?
Self recovered Self discovered
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Toronto Canada
Posts: 5,148
For me it wasn’t about not being able to drink. Hell I did it for decades and I was really good at it. It was making me sick though, physically and mentally and psychologically too. I was about to lose everything I held dear.
It was more about making the choice to never again drink, so that I could have a life worth living. I knew that if I decided I could quit, me alone, it was the best way to guarantee I would never drink again. My sobriety would depend on nothing or no one else. I decided that nothing would ever, could ever make me change my mind. And so I did. I made a plan about never drinking again.
How about you, corriec? Do you have a plan about ever using alcohol?
It was more about making the choice to never again drink, so that I could have a life worth living. I knew that if I decided I could quit, me alone, it was the best way to guarantee I would never drink again. My sobriety would depend on nothing or no one else. I decided that nothing would ever, could ever make me change my mind. And so I did. I made a plan about never drinking again.
How about you, corriec? Do you have a plan about ever using alcohol?
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Join Date: Sep 2017
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Hi, Freshstart. Just a couple of things/thoughts, and thank you for your message.
1. Like you, I think this is something I have to do on my own; noboby can help me but ME! I have to want it, not AA, or family, or friends...ME!
2. Yes, of course I have plans, even just A plan. But first I have to kick this ugly monster called alcohol out of my life. Financially I'm up s... creek. And my personal life is shot, gone.
I never want to be back to where I was five years or more before now; I want to be someone completely different; happy with others, and happy just with myself.
But right now, it is only day 17, and I'm hanging in there. At least it's already much easier than the first few days, although - God knows - I've been here/there before.
1. Like you, I think this is something I have to do on my own; noboby can help me but ME! I have to want it, not AA, or family, or friends...ME!
2. Yes, of course I have plans, even just A plan. But first I have to kick this ugly monster called alcohol out of my life. Financially I'm up s... creek. And my personal life is shot, gone.
I never want to be back to where I was five years or more before now; I want to be someone completely different; happy with others, and happy just with myself.
But right now, it is only day 17, and I'm hanging in there. At least it's already much easier than the first few days, although - God knows - I've been here/there before.
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Originally Posted by ljc267 
For me it was all about the REAL decision to quit. I had thought about quitting a million times and half a** tried hundreds of times. Again for me it wasn't the av getting me to drink again. It was that I really hadn't committed to quitting. When I finally decided that I had had enough did I finally succeed.
It was that I didn't care what my av, or whatever you want to call it, said. I didn't listen or care what it thought. I knew I was done and no one was going to tell me otherwise.
I know that may sound over simplified but for me to come to that decision was the greatest thing I ever did for myself. I finally became selfish for a good reason.
All that being said, my point is that you know you can't drink. You've made it two weeks without it so you CAN do it. Now do you want it or not?
It was that I didn't care what my av, or whatever you want to call it, said. I didn't listen or care what it thought. I knew I was done and no one was going to tell me otherwise.
I know that may sound over simplified but for me to come to that decision was the greatest thing I ever did for myself. I finally became selfish for a good reason.
All that being said, my point is that you know you can't drink. You've made it two weeks without it so you CAN do it. Now do you want it or not?
Member
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 1,183
Looking back, I think for me there was a critical point where I decided I was done, I wanted the madness to end and I knew it was time to quit. It felt different that time, and I had finally come to understand that I was not going to "figure out how to moderate again" (= keep drinking, but minus all the negative consequences), I had failed too many times and I was clear even to my pickled brain that it was never going to happen. But it was more than deciding to quit, after all I could decide in 2 weeks to drink again, it was also about deciding to make use of all available resources and putting continued sobriety at top priority over all other things. For me at the time that meant committing to an all-day/every-day intensive outpatient program, not interacting with certain people, not going to certain places, planning my days out and thinking ahead to possible points where I might be triggered, attending community support group meetings, learning as much as I could about addiction, reading, a bunch of other little decisions that supported the major decision to quit. I've seen a lot of people trip up after making a decision to quit, but not making all those other little decisions to help keep themselves quit long-term.
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Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 3,027
Originally Posted by ljc267
For me it was all about the REAL decision to quit. I had thought about quitting a million times and half a** tried hundreds of times. Again for me it wasn't the av getting me to drink again. It was that I really hadn't committed to quitting. When I finally decided that I had had enough did I finally succeed.
It was that I didn't care what my av, or whatever you want to call it, said. I didn't listen or care what it thought. I knew I was done and no one was going to tell me otherwise.
I know that may sound over simplified but for me to come to that decision was the greatest thing I ever did for myself. I finally became selfish for a good reason.
All that being said, my point is that you know you can't drink. You've made it two weeks without it so you CAN do it. Now do you want it or not?
It was that I didn't care what my av, or whatever you want to call it, said. I didn't listen or care what it thought. I knew I was done and no one was going to tell me otherwise.
I know that may sound over simplified but for me to come to that decision was the greatest thing I ever did for myself. I finally became selfish for a good reason.
All that being said, my point is that you know you can't drink. You've made it two weeks without it so you CAN do it. Now do you want it or not?
Member
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Chicago
Posts: 605
To add to my previous statement. I've had my wife and others close to me ask if I think I will ever be able to have one or two someday. I thought about it for a second and said. I'll never know because even IF I could I'll never take the chance that I'll end up where I was a year ago.
I say that because I think it is real important to remember WHY you quit. I hated everything about who I had become and I never want to be that person again.
I say that because I think it is real important to remember WHY you quit. I hated everything about who I had become and I never want to be that person again.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,109
My AV is very real and even after 8 months IT still tells me how nice a beer would be. That voice is how my addiction manifests in my consciousness and it was born from abusing drugs and alcohol. It's not a sign of weakness, but of how I've inadvertently permanently altered my brain. I've learned to accept IT's presence in my in my thoughts and how to filter out IT's voice from my own rational mind. That voice always says drink and my own rational self aways says no.
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