steve-in-kville

Thanks for all the replies. I am convinced that addiction goes hand in hand with mental health. I have something buried pretty deep and I need professional help to peel back the layers of the onion.

zjw- still got big plans. I've been slacking on the bike the last few weeks!

And some of you are right.... drinking is more premeditated than we think. It starts off with "perhaps I will try drinking in moderation this weekend" and goes from there.

Gottalife

Premeditated implies choice. I lost the power of choice. I simply could not make the sane choice because the factors that make up the reasoning process, like past experience, were not present. All there was was the obsession that this time will be ok, if there was any thought at all. I was incapable of making a sane choice.

It is why AA refers to the lack of an effective mental defence against the first drink. We talk a lot of the insanity of the first drink. That is what alcoholism is, the inability to do the right thing no matter how great the wish.

steve-in-kville

Yeah, this is most likely a large part of my problem. Gotta figure everything out on my own.

FBL

I played all sorts of mental games for many years regarding my drinking. It was only when I admitted to myself that alcohol had totally and utterly defeated me that I was able to start the recovery process. Bottom line: I had to want to be sober more than I wanted to be drunk. You can do this Steve, but you've really got to want it.

BullDog777

Respectfully, I think this applies to the alcoholic who has not sought help or is currently drinking. Not the one who utilized all the tools at their fingertips. This, imo implies we are helpless no matter what we do which is simply not the case once we get sober.

entropy1964

Steve
I can't remember if you've tried AA or if you're open to that. The steps are a great way to get to the root causes of mal-adaptive behavior. Not just drinking, but other issues as well.

I have found that addicts, on the whole, are pretty smart people. And a good percentage are very smart. Thinking, thinking, thinking. And stubborn. I have to learn it may way, in my own time, on my own terms. That was me. And I thought, intellectualized, theorized, philosophized my way into a corner (not to mention a complete mess). I was totally beat. No amount of thinking was going to get me out of this corner. Faith got me out. Thinking is exhausting. Especially about something over which I had no control. Unfortunately I had to learn this for myself.

I was not incapable of seeing other alcoholics as my crystal ball to what would come for me if I kept drinking. For me it was faith or die.

ScottFromWI

I would agree that mental health goes hand in hand with addiction, it did for me. It's also very important to realize though that you must treat it as a separate and distinct issue. AKA - if you are an alcoholic who also has depression or anxiety, treating the anxiety and depression isn't going to solve the addiction too.

Seeing a therapist would be a very wise decision - I waited 40 plus years of my life before doing so, I really wish I would have much sooner. It's not what you would imagine either...no magic potions/spells or secret methods "change" your brain. It's really about learning about yourself and how to make yourself better. A therapist is really more of a "guide" to your life than anything - they help you figure out where you are, where you want to be, and how to get there. But you do most of the work along the way.

tomsteve

that doesn't read to work too good for ya,stevie. in fact, figuring it out on your own seems to get ya drunk.
AND this comment contradicts what you said here:

and I need professional help to peel back the layers of the onion.

James 2:14-18
14 What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and filled,” but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit? 17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.

18 But someone will say, “You have faith, and I have works.” Show me your faith without your[a] works, and I will show you my faith by my works

nothing changes is nothing changes.
doing the same thing over and over expecting different results is insanity.


sure hope youre ready to get into action.

zjw

they the line "you dont have a drinking problem you have a thinking problem" comes to mind. I know i was pretty far gone in my thoughts.

to tomsteves point I know for me i had to get up every day and start the sobriety process all over again it seemed like. every day it took a great deal of work and effort to do what i had to do in order to remain sober. I can see how one could sorta subconciously just wonder into a liquor store get a bottle and drink. I could see myself getting complacent and doing something like that I guess I just try to keep the finger on the pulse of my alcoholism each day so that I dont wonder off and do soemthing like that or slip down a slippery slope etc...

many days in the beginning i felt where crap and crappier cuase i couldnt sovle them with booze. now I just realize that some days are just crap the booze part of the equation is irrelevant. The only thing booze will do to a crap day is make it crappier. and to a good day make it crappier. I guess the point is in the begining there was a lot of "UGG IF ONLY I COULD JUST DRINK !!! GRRRR" now that really doesnt happen and if it does its a fairly mild sensation that is easily just shrugged off.

Gottalife

Respectfully in reply, my experience is that until an alcoholic of my type has found an effective 24/7 defence against the first drink, the obsession can and does return.

The AA program is about permanent recovery which means staying stopped, not stopping for a spell. And the spell can be significant, sometimes ten years or more. I've seen it happen far too often.

If the insanity of the first drink returns, we are as helpless as the guy who never stopped. My friend Zac is a case in point. Drank after ten years. I thought all his AA experience would save him. I couldnt have been more wrong. He was dead in three months. Helpless and hopeless.

If we are sober today, certainly we have the opportunity to take whatever action is needed to remain that way. But if we don't take the action, if we delay or avoid, we can pay an awful price.

JeffreyAK

Addiction may go hand in hand with mental health issues in your case, but in general it doesn't and it doesn't have to. Addiction specialists call addiction a primary illness, meaning it's not secondary to anything else or caused by anything else except too much drink for too long.

We can really spin ourselves up, and cause great harm to ourselves and others, when we convince ourselves that our problem isn't really addiction, or that we need to fix some other issue before we can stop drinking. That's a lie that the reptilian addict voice tells us, to help us justify continuing to drink or serial relapsing. We may need to put more real work into recovery, maybe even going to support group meetings three times a day for six months if that's what it takes to get on to stable ground, but we don't need to peel back any layers of any onions to stop drinking. That's very cerebral, and addiction isn't a cerebral illness. Actions matter, not thinking.

SoberCAH

I completely agree that staying sober is a daily commitment, coupled with prayer to God for help.

I also have the AA program that I try to work hard on a daily basis.

In recovery, we can't take a day off.

When I was in treatment, I was looking (and hoping) for something more empirical and scientific than the 12 Steps to help me stay sober, but that was all they offered to me and I was rather light on options.

It's worked, on a daily basis, ever since.

I hope that Steve gets the help he needs to get and stay sober.

My sobriety is the biggest gift I have ever received.

I cherish and protect it everyday.

thomas11

Maybe don't make it any more complicated than it is. I spent a lot of damn time trying to figure it out, and in the end, I couldn't. I had to accept. I don't drink like a normal person, and it harms me, therefore I am one of those who chooses not to drink.

BullDog777

I think we're saying the same thing. AA states "if you are willing to go to any length to get it"

Any length doesn't imply not staying in front of the addiction. Time under your belt is meaningless if no growth persists.

This is why there is a huge distinction made between "white knuckling" and "living sober" in the big book.

We can agree to disagree in splitting hairs. but in the end, the choice is always ours to live sober. Nobody is pouring it down our throats.

steve-in-kville

Thanks for all the replies. I was reading them throughout the day but could only reply now.

Behappy1

Hi Steve, no wise words from me, but just wanted you to know you're not alone. One drink for me turned into a 3 day bender with today being day one.

steve-in-kville

Like some above posts have mentioned, I keep over thinking it. Almost like I should be able to put my finger on it, point to something in my head and have an "aha" moment. I need to protect my sobriety, not toy with the idea I will be able to drink "normally" at some point in the future!

Gottalife

Perhaps you are getting the second part of the first step directions. "The delusion that we are like other peolple, or presently maybe, has to be smashed".

That delusion will always undermine any effort at recovery. Why go to any lengths when we still hold on to the old idea that one day we will be able to drink normally?