Go Back  SoberRecovery : Alcoholism Drug Addiction Help and Information > Alcoholism Information > Alcoholism
Reload this Page >

For those tortured by PAWS (Post Acute Withdrawal Symptoms) and who fear they might go mad



Notices

For those tortured by PAWS (Post Acute Withdrawal Symptoms) and who fear they might go mad

Old 12-09-2020, 05:25 PM
  # 481 (permalink)  
Administrator
 
Dee74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,043
Hi wildbill

I think month 2 might be a little early to expect a massive turnaround. I was 3 months before my fatigue lifted for example. I think it's really easy to underestimate the effect drinking like we did has on on our brain and body.

Its really important to remind ourselves that not everyone gets PAWS and not everyone suffers like the folks in this thread... and not everyone suffers for years until things get better.

I had irritable bowel but never had stomach pains. Eat sensibly and smaller portions helped there.
I'd definitely want to find a doctor who took that seriously.

D
Dee74 is offline  
Old 12-10-2020, 07:51 AM
  # 482 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Posts: 200
Hey Wild Bill,

In my experience, at 2 months, I was just starting to get into the thick of the fight with PAWS, the first corner that I turned came after about 90 days of not drinking, so hang on because it might get tougher yet for you before it gets better. If you're anything like me, you will be feeling strange, scary and unfamiliar feelings. They will subside!

You've covered your bases by having a doctor check you out so now there is nothing else to be done but to wait this out.

I cannot talk about the stomach issue passing because I still get stomach aches on the lower right side, same place as I had them when I was drinking. My blood tests came back fine though. I am guessing we have both irritated our digestive systems and perhaps changed the chemical balance of the guts to some degree. Those, as I understand, will return to normal with time and diet.
Graceful123 is offline  
Old 12-10-2020, 11:50 AM
  # 483 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Posts: 213
I think you done just brilliantly wildbill to reach two months sober. But in recovery that is very early days. A lot can happen in the near term I think. I have my fingers crossed for you. Keep going!
ant385 is offline  
Old 12-10-2020, 03:13 PM
  # 484 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2020
Posts: 9
Thanks for the advice everyone

Thanks for the advice everyone It’s good to know that I’m not alone I thought I was going crazy for a second every night I feel like death or I have some other ailment the fatigue is terrible and just that feeling of crappy ness it’s good to know it gets better I thought withdrawals only lasted two weeks I had no idea the symptoms can carry on
wildbill3285455 is offline  
Old 12-10-2020, 03:42 PM
  # 485 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Posts: 200
Originally Posted by wildbill3285455 View Post
Thanks for the advice everyone It’s good to know that I’m not alone I thought I was going crazy for a second every night I feel like death or I have some other ailment the fatigue is terrible and just that feeling of crappy ness it’s good to know it gets better I thought withdrawals only lasted two weeks I had no idea the symptoms can carry on
I will say that for me until about day 90 is only got worse and worse. The panic attacks, anxiety, feeling completely off, dizziness, you name it. You are not alone and I remember how scared I felt that I was damaged goods. Hang in there. After day 90 day-by-day it will get a little bit better and eventually you will start having days and weeks that are symptom free.

One thing I can tell you is that if anything good comes out of this, is that every day life stressors will seem trivial afterwards. I've never been more resistant to stress than I am after what I've gone thru the first 3 months of withdrawals.
Graceful123 is offline  
Old 12-14-2020, 02:47 AM
  # 486 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Posts: 67
Good afternoon all, it has been a while since I posted on here. I hope you are all doing much better and welcome the new comers! I went back to the chemists about three weeks ago absolutely determined that I could find a combination to ease my symptoms and thought a few days later that I had!

A combination of a cognitive vitamin, a vitamin B, D3, Magnesium and Zinc...I felt a lot better for three weeks and now here we are again...with the brain fog, feeling like an idiot in a conversation that goes longer than one minute, like I am in some other alternate universe, muscle pains, headache, the breathing thing which is not actually a breathing thing ( I hope)... moodier than a pregnant lady that has found out she is about to have triplets and no one gets the moods..It's really unreal. I went to a party the other day for a friend who celebrated the end of sober October - hysterical, been to loads of social events actually - not drinking not an issue for me - not drinking and feeling all those symptoms still looking like a jittery mess- problem for me. I passed the one year mark at the beginning of December.I feel like I've done my time and am getting really, really, really frustrated. Some sites say PAWS lasts one year, other sites say PAWS lasts for up to two years...these are sites that would not stand to benefit in any way on playing PAWS down...either way .. I'm pretty upset that I'm now in my second year... I can't imagine what paws must be like for people who have abused alcohol for 40 years...who would want to spend years and years like this? Who could?

Paws to me seems to be like a complete nervous breakdown - where your body cannot handle the amount of stress you have in your life and deal with what you are putting in to your body....and if you are overweight with a poor diet and lifestyle choices like me...it just makes it worse...But here is the kicker - this year I have lost nearly 20 kilos and have not had one drink and in a way actually feel worse!
But booze gets all the blame every time. I'm my worst critic..but I know I should be back together by now.

I am now on about day 380...for everyone out there on good days and bad days...it has not been like that for me at all...there have been many really bad days, some days that were pretty bad, and a few days which were kind of normal but not....
drycucumber77 is offline  
Old 12-14-2020, 06:38 AM
  # 487 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Posts: 213
I can bet my bottom dollar that those 3 good weeks is not because you had taken vitamin tablets. You had a window dry and it lasted 3 weeks because you have gone far into the healing process. You are now entering a wave and yes it feels like you are back at square one but I promise you are not. You will be well again. The fact you went 3 weeks feeling good is testament to this. Your brain can balance itself again and it will.
ant385 is offline  
Old 12-14-2020, 06:43 AM
  # 488 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Posts: 200
Originally Posted by ant385 View Post
I can bet my bottom dollar that those 3 good weeks is not because you had taken vitamin tablets. You had a window dry and it lasted 3 weeks because you have gone far into the healing process. You are now entering a wave and yes it feels like you are back at square one but I promise you are not. You will be well again. The fact you went 3 weeks feeling good is testament to this. Your brain can balance itself again and it will.
100% agreed with Ant385. In my experience no vitamins and supplements can help rebalance your brain chemistry, and it seems to me like you're seeming more and more good windows. It is well known (and I've noticed it too) that PAWS comes and goes in cycles. Looks like you just left your window. You will be back more and more often with longer and longer stretches. Even at my 5.5 months I'm noticing tiny improvements every day.

Stay strong!
Graceful123 is offline  
Old 12-14-2020, 05:27 PM
  # 489 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Posts: 18
Hey dry, I’m stuggling at 1 year also. No desire to drink, no cravings, just PAWs. My life was well put together before I quit and now I struggle mightily. No history of mental issues before quitting. Derealization is the symptom I struggle with the most, and anxiety. And just that horrible feeling of everything feeling off. It sucks man. I’m in therapy, I’m starting to meditate, I work out, I eat perfect. I’m doing all the **** you are supposed to. I just want you to know you aren’t alone and we are going to find a way to beat this beast one way or another. Let’s stay strong, keep fighting and do everything possible to beat this thing. I’m really working on my anxiety and trying to accept where I am now and remind myself that I didn’t become mentally ill overnight, my brain is just taking it’s time, healing at it’s own pace. Hit me up if you need any support from someone in a very similar situation as yours. I can definitely commiserate.
SaberK33 is offline  
Old 12-14-2020, 05:28 PM
  # 490 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Posts: 18
Hey dry, I’m stuggling at 1 year also. No desire to drink, no cravings, just PAWs. My life was well put together before I quit and now I struggle mightily. No history of mental issues before quitting. Derealization is the symptom I struggle with the most, and anxiety. And just that horrible feeling of everything feeling off. It sucks man. I’m in therapy, I’m starting to meditate, I work out, I eat perfect. I’m doing all the **** you are supposed to. I just want you to know you aren’t alone and we are going to find a way to beat this beast one way or another. Let’s stay strong, keep fighting and do everything possible to beat this thing. I’m really working on my anxiety and trying to accept where I am now and remind myself that I didn’t become mentally ill overnight, my brain is just taking it’s time, healing at it’s own pace. Hit me up if you need any support from someone in a very similar situation as yours. I can definitely commiserate.
SaberK33 is offline  
Old 12-15-2020, 10:46 AM
  # 491 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Posts: 213
I also had mixed results from therapy. I think if you have down regulated GABA receptors that won’t change if you do a bit of deep breathing or positive thinking. Having said that I did learn some good coping strategies. Ultimately it is time that will heal you.
ant385 is offline  
Old 12-15-2020, 12:22 PM
  # 492 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2020
Posts: 363
I have been lurking and while my symptoms aren’t as bad as some, I find myself really restless and physically anxious, and my heart pounds. I also seem to be getting more headaches than when I was drinking. I guess after 15+ years of dependency, it’s not surprising that I would get PAWS, but it sucks. I also have ADD, so getting things done right now is next to impossible. Fortunately haven’t had other symptoms, but I am only 3 months in, and the anxiety has gotten worse over the last month. I got out of rehab and found myself “self medicating” with a couple of shots on Sunday. Relieved the anxiety for a minute, but now the cravings are back. Trying to be positive, but feel so useless right now!
EllyB is offline  
Old 12-16-2020, 08:20 AM
  # 493 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Posts: 200
Originally Posted by EllyB View Post
I have been lurking and while my symptoms aren’t as bad as some, I find myself really restless and physically anxious, and my heart pounds. I also seem to be getting more headaches than when I was drinking. I guess after 15+ years of dependency, it’s not surprising that I would get PAWS, but it sucks. I also have ADD, so getting things done right now is next to impossible. Fortunately haven’t had other symptoms, but I am only 3 months in, and the anxiety has gotten worse over the last month. I got out of rehab and found myself “self medicating” with a couple of shots on Sunday. Relieved the anxiety for a minute, but now the cravings are back. Trying to be positive, but feel so useless right now!
Yes, this was the same experience as what I had. The week at about 90 days in was probably the worst week of PAWS for me. Stay strong, if your experience is anything like mine, you're just crossed the threshold and you should begin feeling that you're slowly healing very soon. All the symptoms will still be there for quite a while but you will start noticing they will become weaker and weaker with each passing week. Work helps to take your mind off things, no matter how trivial the task at hand is so try and do work. Video games also help a little bit to detach, but at the end of the day it's only time, time, time.
Graceful123 is offline  
Old 12-17-2020, 08:10 AM
  # 494 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2020
Posts: 363
Originally Posted by Graceful123 View Post
Yes, this was the same experience as what I had. The week at about 90 days in was probably the worst week of PAWS for me. Stay strong, if your experience is anything like mine, you're just crossed the threshold and you should begin feeling that you're slowly healing very soon. All the symptoms will still be there for quite a while but you will start noticing they will become weaker and weaker with each passing week. Work helps to take your mind off things, no matter how trivial the task at hand is so try and do work. Video games also help a little bit to detach, but at the end of the day it's only time, time, time.
Thank you for the support! I will get through this. I feel like I am disappointing my family by being almost WORSE than when I was while still drinking, but I know I can’t go back to drinking. I have to keep saying that I don’t drink anymore. A couple of things that do seem to help a little is meditation and yoga. Both are supposed to help shrink the amygdala and reduce anxiety. I was doing yoga most nights in the week when in rehab, and that helped me sleep.
EllyB is offline  
Old 12-17-2020, 09:06 PM
  # 495 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Posts: 67
Hey Saber 33 , thank you for your response. It really does suck. But I have to say I really don't get all of it. I mean I get that our brains are putting themselves back together and I understand some of the PAWS symptoms -despite how horrible they are - but what I don't get is how nearly 400 days after having a panic attack which in all honesty felt like something was violently attacking my body from out of the blue - I still have these episodes where I feel like my breathing is not regulated properly. When I watch carefully, I can see that I am breathing but it just does not feel right, like part of biophysical process that normally takes part in breathing is not functioning properly, I then think I am making myself breathe manually and then fear that I might just stop breathing. I worry that my body learnt to breathe differently and frankly that terrifies me. Yesterday i walked five minutes to my car and had air hunger for no reason - I am hyper aware and hyper sensitive about this which can't help. I also smoke which does not make the feeling worse which is interesting but does elevate heart rate ect and thus anxiety ect. I don't have shortness of breath upon exertion or anything like that, it's not really shortness of breath, more like someone or something is grabbing hold of my oxygen - feels like some sinister dark spell as mad as that may sound!
I have derealization constantly and then brain fog is there most of the day as well. No fun. I have a lot of responsibility on my shoulders in my job and if the people who I have to speak to knew that I completely zone out after 15 seconds I would be in serious trouble!! What sort of therapy if I may ask? Does it help? I have no real support at all - I just kind of thought I did a year alone and that it would now get easier - somehow - but I could do with an aid. I would really love to see some of the people who have struggled and overcome PAWS come back on here and tell us how great they are feeling now.
drycucumber77 is offline  
Old 12-17-2020, 09:15 PM
  # 496 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Posts: 67
Hi ant385,
How are you feeling these days? How far a long are you? Thank god you are on this journey with me. You think within a year we might be feeling great and fantastic for once?!!

drycucumber77 is offline  
Old 12-18-2020, 09:49 AM
  # 497 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Posts: 200
Originally Posted by drycucumber77 View Post
Hey Saber 33 , thank you for your response. It really does suck. But I have to say I really don't get all of it. I mean I get that our brains are putting themselves back together and I understand some of the PAWS symptoms -despite how horrible they are - but what I don't get is how nearly 400 days after having a panic attack which in all honesty felt like something was violently attacking my body from out of the blue - I still have these episodes where I feel like my breathing is not regulated properly. When I watch carefully, I can see that I am breathing but it just does not feel right, like part of biophysical process that normally takes part in breathing is not functioning properly, I then think I am making myself breathe manually and then fear that I might just stop breathing. I worry that my body learnt to breathe differently and frankly that terrifies me. Yesterday i walked five minutes to my car and had air hunger for no reason - I am hyper aware and hyper sensitive about this which can't help. I also smoke which does not make the feeling worse which is interesting but does elevate heart rate ect and thus anxiety ect. I don't have shortness of breath upon exertion or anything like that, it's not really shortness of breath, more like someone or something is grabbing hold of my oxygen - feels like some sinister dark spell as mad as that may sound!
I have derealization constantly and then brain fog is there most of the day as well. No fun. I have a lot of responsibility on my shoulders in my job and if the people who I have to speak to knew that I completely zone out after 15 seconds I would be in serious trouble!! What sort of therapy if I may ask? Does it help? I have no real support at all - I just kind of thought I did a year alone and that it would now get easier - somehow - but I could do with an aid. I would really love to see some of the people who have struggled and overcome PAWS come back on here and tell us how great they are feeling now.
Maybe I can help,

I drank very heavily but it seems I didn't drink as long as some people on this forum and my recovery seems to be a little shorter (SEEMS being the key word, I am by no means out of the woods yet and I still experience PAWS symptoms). For timeline purposes I can tell you that I had my last heavy drink was on July 6th, 2020. I've gone through severe PAWS for the first 3 months and am now in what I consider to be the recovery phase. I've had all the same symptoms as you, derealization, depersonalization, constant brain fog, excruciating anxiety and panic attacks where I couldn't even function for hours and hours, constant feeling like there is nothing in my head except howling wind (insert joke about me being an airhead here). I did not, however, have the breathing issue. But everything else I can offer my insight into.

My PAWS kicked in right on time, a week or two after the initial withdrawal has passed. As I said in one of my previous posts, the first 3 months were horrible. I think the only thing keeping me going was my own pride and ego and the thought that I won't let this thing beat me. After the first 90 days of PAWS, thing VERY SLOWLY but surely started to improve. I felt a tiny improvement every week. The first symptom to go away was insomnia, I started sleeping better and better. Appetite began to return. The lasting symptoms that took a while and are still present is the anxiety. I still got panic attacks well into the 4th and 5th month of recovery. It has now, however, been a few weeks since I've had a panic attack. My quality of life is improving. I have days where I don't notice any symptoms. Today, for example, I didn't even have my usual morning dizziness walking to work. Typically when I have my walk to my workplace I have a spinning head feeling and a general sense of lightheadedness. Today I barely noticed it, being too preoccupied with thoughts of work projects. I am DEFINITELY, DEFINITELY on the road to feeling good.

I am not an expert but based on my limited information from your posts and posts of others on similar forums, I would guess you've drank for quite a few years. Your recovery will most likely, as I would understand, go the same route as mine but over a longer period of time. Which is why I think I feel much better 6 months in and you're still struggling (although I still definitely struggle as well). The depersonalization/derealization WILL go away. Those are tied into your anxiety which is tied into your unbalanced GABA receptors. Depers/Derea (yes, that is what I call them in the little spreadsheet of symptoms I keep) is your body's way of handling overwhelming, raw feelings that you're going through in your new-found sober life. You take everything personally and everything scares you during the initial recovery (when I say "you" I mean a generic person, not you specifically). That will go away with time as your GABA receptors slowly return to normal operations and you learn to live a sober life. Everything for me has hugely subsided although I'm not in the clear yet. If I had to rate my symptoms I would say in the first 30 days it was 10/10 (peak) intensity and is now 3.5/10 intensity.

This brings me to my last few sentences and to answer your question:
IT DOES GET BETTER! Much better! And with time I think I, and most people here, will return to their pre-drinking normal if they completely.
Recovery is worth it. And remember: not even a single beer. In my experience any amount of alcohol sets your recovery back a bit.
Graceful123 is offline  
Old 12-18-2020, 10:26 AM
  # 498 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Posts: 213
Thanks dry.
I have been pretty crap lately. I had 2 months of feeling ok (with a few bad days) to now a 6 week wave with only a few good days. It is so hard to guess what will happen next with PAWS. Truly is non linear. I just hope that healing is still happening. If there is one plus I have not got totally upset with this wave nor have I taken Valium. It’s like a moderate simmer of awfulness.
ant385 is offline  
Old 12-18-2020, 11:38 AM
  # 499 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2020
Posts: 363
Originally Posted by Graceful123 View Post
And remember: not even a single beer. In my experience any amount of alcohol sets your recovery back a bit.
Telling myself THIS. When stressful situations coincide with Day 90, it’s all I can do to stay away from the liquor store.
EllyB is offline  
Old 12-18-2020, 03:06 PM
  # 500 (permalink)  
Administrator
 
Dee74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,043
We usually close threads at around 500 posts or so and then start a Part 2
Join us here for Part 2 of this thread

https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...-part-2-a.html (For those tortured by PAWS (Post Acute Withdrawal Symptoms) and who fear they might go mad Part 2)
D
Dee74 is offline  

Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off




All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:55 PM.