Hedonism
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Join Date: Aug 2015
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Hedonism
I'm just curious on if anyone has any advice or information on maybe having a life style of hedonism and maybe finding a way to overcome it? I don't know if it's the right concept I am looking for, When I have issues with drinking I've been noticing that even though there's an extreme amount of negatives I still have the "screw it" attitude. And I noticed this is a trend in a lot of my daily life. I constantly want to be stimulated by something. When I'm in the shower and get ready I have the radio on, and when I'm driving I have the radio, when I walk Podcasts and when I come home I eat horrible foods and watch TV and play video games a lot. And I've done this for most of my life. It's also because my roommate is out of the house and I live alone for the time, but I am wondering if this hedonistic attitude and lifestyle is what I need to work on next to kill my addiction to alcohol. It's gotten better, but I keep slipping, even if I have a list of negatives and great advice from you guys.
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Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 2,872
I was the same way.
I think one needs to step out of ones self and see the world, and the people in it, and try and understand it on a more empathetic and open mind.
It took me to realize the world doesn't revolve around me. That I, as well as everyone else, is dispensable.
I got out of myself which had turned into a self serving, dark place.
I put myself in others shoes. I had to learn to be kind because I was not brought up that way. No one cared about me, but me. And there lay the trap. I did what I wanted to, when I wanted to. And most of that was as you describe. And, of course, this involved drinking as my main justification for being so self centered.
This led me to become and alcoholic. For many years. I looked at it as it was my right to drink. As much as I could whenever I wanted to. This led to a mostly solitary life of drunkenness. I never expected to live to be thirty. And didn't care.
I've been around the block a few times, I'm no spring chicken. I just ignored the world and sought only of the things to satisfy myself. I was not a good person. You wouldn't have wanted to know me.
But, I didn't die at thirty. I had no plan what to do then. Then, I saw the light. I was a drunken self-serving mess. I couldn't quit drinking, as much as I tried.
I found out what suffering was. In a big way. Wracked with fear, anxiety and shame. I tried to turn my life around by seeking the help of others. I came here. I went to AA, and found people who understood. Some were like me, some not. But I opened my mind for the first time.
I found I could be of service to others. That my experiences could help others.
I was born again into a world suddenly full of possibilities if I didn't take that first drink. Recovery. When I say born again, I don't mean it in a religious way, it was being saved from booze. A whole new life opened up once I got sober.
I was of the world and part of it. It didn't revolve around me.
There are unfortunates in this world that need help and if I can I try and help them. The other benefit is being able to do so. I do it as much for myself as for me. Selfish, maybe, but it is a joy.
That's me. There's a whole big world out there just waiting for you to join it, and I hope you do.
I think one needs to step out of ones self and see the world, and the people in it, and try and understand it on a more empathetic and open mind.
It took me to realize the world doesn't revolve around me. That I, as well as everyone else, is dispensable.
I got out of myself which had turned into a self serving, dark place.
I put myself in others shoes. I had to learn to be kind because I was not brought up that way. No one cared about me, but me. And there lay the trap. I did what I wanted to, when I wanted to. And most of that was as you describe. And, of course, this involved drinking as my main justification for being so self centered.
This led me to become and alcoholic. For many years. I looked at it as it was my right to drink. As much as I could whenever I wanted to. This led to a mostly solitary life of drunkenness. I never expected to live to be thirty. And didn't care.
I've been around the block a few times, I'm no spring chicken. I just ignored the world and sought only of the things to satisfy myself. I was not a good person. You wouldn't have wanted to know me.
But, I didn't die at thirty. I had no plan what to do then. Then, I saw the light. I was a drunken self-serving mess. I couldn't quit drinking, as much as I tried.
I found out what suffering was. In a big way. Wracked with fear, anxiety and shame. I tried to turn my life around by seeking the help of others. I came here. I went to AA, and found people who understood. Some were like me, some not. But I opened my mind for the first time.
I found I could be of service to others. That my experiences could help others.
I was born again into a world suddenly full of possibilities if I didn't take that first drink. Recovery. When I say born again, I don't mean it in a religious way, it was being saved from booze. A whole new life opened up once I got sober.
I was of the world and part of it. It didn't revolve around me.
There are unfortunates in this world that need help and if I can I try and help them. The other benefit is being able to do so. I do it as much for myself as for me. Selfish, maybe, but it is a joy.
That's me. There's a whole big world out there just waiting for you to join it, and I hope you do.
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 17
I think a thing that I have struggled with is that I have helped a lot of people in the past and I strive to be a good person, but then I came to the conclusion that you can't fix people with trying to help, everything has to click in time.
I have kind of convinced myself that it's pointless and that was a motivator for years for me. Just to help people in general. I think since I needed so much help in the past few years that I have grown bitter because I'm not receiving the same support. Sounds selfish, but I don't know how else to feel about it. Also, I have asked for help when it comes to my situation, it's just that people don't really know how to deal with this stuff in their lives. It sounds like something from a movie most of the time. And when it comes down to it, no one knows what to do. Everyone has their own things going on.
I have kind of convinced myself that it's pointless and that was a motivator for years for me. Just to help people in general. I think since I needed so much help in the past few years that I have grown bitter because I'm not receiving the same support. Sounds selfish, but I don't know how else to feel about it. Also, I have asked for help when it comes to my situation, it's just that people don't really know how to deal with this stuff in their lives. It sounds like something from a movie most of the time. And when it comes down to it, no one knows what to do. Everyone has their own things going on.
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Wisconsin, USA
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Instant gratification...many of us seek it. And when we give up alcohol we still seek it, sometimes in other unhealthy ways. Mindfulness helps me a lot, but I personally feel that we all have a basic survival instict that is selfish by design. I don't mean that acting selfishly is OK, but we do naturally try to do whatever we can to survive and flourish. Learning how to use that instinct in positive ways is the key.
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Join Date: Aug 2015
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I found some information that kind of clears up what I was trying to say, it's from choosehelp:
Self-Pity and the Sense of Entitlement
Alcoholics often have a bizarre sense of entitlement. They reason that having such a difficult/stressful/demanding life entitles them to act in ways that are immature, irresponsible, and selfish. To observe their behavior is to conclude a belief that the world must owe them something. The active alcoholic wallows in self-pity and concludes that they are a victim of life. As they demand more from the world they expect less and less from themselves.
Appearance over Substance
The quickest route to self destruction for alcoholics are the words, “Screw it.” This is a declaration that everything is already screwed so they might as well drink. When people decide to stop drinking we encourage them to notice that “It” is actually, “Me.” This is evident in, “It’s not worth it.” On some level the alcoholic always knows the truth and they are usually working hard not to know it. They pretend and demand that those close to them buy into the fantasy that all is well. Life becomes progressively less about anything substantive and progressively more about maintaining appearances. This is well explained in Pink’s song, “Family Portrait.” “In our family portrait we look pretty happy. We look pretty normal…”
Self-Pity and the Sense of Entitlement
Alcoholics often have a bizarre sense of entitlement. They reason that having such a difficult/stressful/demanding life entitles them to act in ways that are immature, irresponsible, and selfish. To observe their behavior is to conclude a belief that the world must owe them something. The active alcoholic wallows in self-pity and concludes that they are a victim of life. As they demand more from the world they expect less and less from themselves.
Appearance over Substance
The quickest route to self destruction for alcoholics are the words, “Screw it.” This is a declaration that everything is already screwed so they might as well drink. When people decide to stop drinking we encourage them to notice that “It” is actually, “Me.” This is evident in, “It’s not worth it.” On some level the alcoholic always knows the truth and they are usually working hard not to know it. They pretend and demand that those close to them buy into the fantasy that all is well. Life becomes progressively less about anything substantive and progressively more about maintaining appearances. This is well explained in Pink’s song, “Family Portrait.” “In our family portrait we look pretty happy. We look pretty normal…”
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Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: NYC
Posts: 19,021
Hi Jack 
I completely empathize. My sense of self was wrapped up around being an outsider since as near as I can figure I was 7 years old, and early on that outsider thing progressed to rebel, contrary, and rejecter of the "normal" in favor of the wild. As I got older, I had to show conventional attitudes in order to work and to parent, and when I was outside those roles I was even more self-indulgent, out of the continued feeling of not fitting in and resentment about the perception that I had to change for others, against my own inclination. So I expressed my "hedonistic" impulses in ways I thought were safe or at least secret.... but I nurtured them all the time.
I know I can't change some things about myself. I'm a little bit of an oddity and I don't relate to "normal" very successfully. What I strive for now is to be honest and contribute where I can, and not do things that are self-destructive or harmful to others. Or at least, to do them more and more rarely.
For some things, like listening to punk rock, I give myself a break. No one will ever make me like pretty music.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1I4A5yazr4
I completely empathize. My sense of self was wrapped up around being an outsider since as near as I can figure I was 7 years old, and early on that outsider thing progressed to rebel, contrary, and rejecter of the "normal" in favor of the wild. As I got older, I had to show conventional attitudes in order to work and to parent, and when I was outside those roles I was even more self-indulgent, out of the continued feeling of not fitting in and resentment about the perception that I had to change for others, against my own inclination. So I expressed my "hedonistic" impulses in ways I thought were safe or at least secret.... but I nurtured them all the time.
I know I can't change some things about myself. I'm a little bit of an oddity and I don't relate to "normal" very successfully. What I strive for now is to be honest and contribute where I can, and not do things that are self-destructive or harmful to others. Or at least, to do them more and more rarely.
For some things, like listening to punk rock, I give myself a break. No one will ever make me like pretty music.
All about that Personality Crisis you got it while it was hot
But now frustration and heartache is what you got
But now frustration and heartache is what you got
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1I4A5yazr4
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I know I can't change some things about myself. I'm a little bit of an oddity and I don't relate to "normal" very successfully.
I really like that. It's true. I try to fit in, but when I get weird or over describe something people just can't relate. I don't know I just feel like I have a lot going on in my head and I can't imagine what it's like to have a normal brain that just enjoys the day-to-day. I'm constantly thinking and day dreaming. So I also fail to relate to normal. Very cool way of putting it lol.
I really like that. It's true. I try to fit in, but when I get weird or over describe something people just can't relate. I don't know I just feel like I have a lot going on in my head and I can't imagine what it's like to have a normal brain that just enjoys the day-to-day. I'm constantly thinking and day dreaming. So I also fail to relate to normal. Very cool way of putting it lol.
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 873
Regarding constant stimulation: you were drinking before and maybe that suppressed the normal activity level of your brain. Like it's normally going 95 and the booze took it down to 60. I wouldn't worry about that at all, in fact it could be a good sign, that your mind is active and needs something to engage it.
It can be frustrating and unsettling, I guess, but needing the radio, podcasts, video games and TV is a hell of a lot better than relying on alcohol to kill your brain's need for stimulation. Right?
It can be frustrating and unsettling, I guess, but needing the radio, podcasts, video games and TV is a hell of a lot better than relying on alcohol to kill your brain's need for stimulation. Right?
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Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 6,902
For me, that journey away from hedonistic, extrinsic relief, towards inner peace came through working the 12 step program in AA.
For the first time in my adult life, I am now content to be alone. No radio. No TV. Phone off. It's a strange kind of happiness, and completely different to the kind of happiness (excitement / buzz) I had always sought out prior to sobriety.
For the first time in my adult life, I am now content to be alone. No radio. No TV. Phone off. It's a strange kind of happiness, and completely different to the kind of happiness (excitement / buzz) I had always sought out prior to sobriety.
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Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 6,902
Originally Posted by JackRaynes 
I know I can't change some things about myself. I'm a little bit of an oddity and I don't relate to "normal" very successfully.
I really like that. It's true. I try to fit in, but when I get weird or over describe something people just can't relate. I don't know I just feel like I have a lot going on in my head and I can't imagine what it's like to have a normal brain that just enjoys the day-to-day. I'm constantly thinking and day dreaming. So I also fail to relate to normal. Very cool way of putting it lol.
I really like that. It's true. I try to fit in, but when I get weird or over describe something people just can't relate. I don't know I just feel like I have a lot going on in my head and I can't imagine what it's like to have a normal brain that just enjoys the day-to-day. I'm constantly thinking and day dreaming. So I also fail to relate to normal. Very cool way of putting it lol.
I could see peace instead of this
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Canada, eh
Posts: 2,360
I'm enjoying this discussion.
I don't feel like I relate to "normal" either. My rebelliousness, especially working in an office environment, made things harder for me than they needed to be. I don't like to always fit in and follow the crowd or be a sheep. I used to be conformist in some respects but then I started questioning everything in my life and the world and disagreeing with a lot of it. I'm also one for having to always be distracted, either by indulging in the internet, playing video games, being busy in general and at the same time not accomplishing much.
So maybe or maybe not ironically, it's in my 12-step program where I really feel like I fit in and it's been a big answer to what I was looking for.
Through practicing the 12 steps, like others have said already here, I've also found peace, contentment and this feeling of satisfaction I never had before. (For the most part anyway, unless I let my tendency for negative thinking railroad me and I still have a tendency to overindulge in other things if I don't pay attention). But it's like I know my place in the world now and my experiences can be useful. I don't go out trying to save anyone; I simply share my "experience, strength and hope".
I'm also learning to slow down and just "be". It's not easy and I think that was one thing that set me off on my disturbed mood last weekend--too much "sitting still" and not enough distraction. However, I have noticed that I don't have obsessive thoughts much at all anymore and don't worry anywhere near the way I used to. Reading and learning more about mindfulness and my ego/addiction is helping with this and have led me on a fascinating path of spiritual exploration. Eckhart Tolle's writings as well as the Tao of Pooh which I'm finally now reading come to mind at the moment, but there are many others.
I don't feel like I relate to "normal" either. My rebelliousness, especially working in an office environment, made things harder for me than they needed to be. I don't like to always fit in and follow the crowd or be a sheep. I used to be conformist in some respects but then I started questioning everything in my life and the world and disagreeing with a lot of it. I'm also one for having to always be distracted, either by indulging in the internet, playing video games, being busy in general and at the same time not accomplishing much.
So maybe or maybe not ironically, it's in my 12-step program where I really feel like I fit in and it's been a big answer to what I was looking for.
Through practicing the 12 steps, like others have said already here, I've also found peace, contentment and this feeling of satisfaction I never had before. (For the most part anyway, unless I let my tendency for negative thinking railroad me and I still have a tendency to overindulge in other things if I don't pay attention). But it's like I know my place in the world now and my experiences can be useful. I don't go out trying to save anyone; I simply share my "experience, strength and hope".
I'm also learning to slow down and just "be". It's not easy and I think that was one thing that set me off on my disturbed mood last weekend--too much "sitting still" and not enough distraction. However, I have noticed that I don't have obsessive thoughts much at all anymore and don't worry anywhere near the way I used to. Reading and learning more about mindfulness and my ego/addiction is helping with this and have led me on a fascinating path of spiritual exploration. Eckhart Tolle's writings as well as the Tao of Pooh which I'm finally now reading come to mind at the moment, but there are many others.
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Arizona
Posts: 135
I really liked this topic. I can relate completely to you OP.
I'm still pretty early but I found that need for stimulation has pretty much left me. A big +1 to what Joanne B said, that's my exact feeling as well.
I did not work on feeling that way or trying to get rid of that need for stimulation, it just happened on its own but its been great and flowed into my life in other ways.
For example, now I eat smaller portions and healthier food. I also buy less. I just don't chase the gratification, so I have more money and lost weight. Again, no conscious effort, it seems to be a side affect of getting sober.
Maybe its a side effect of not feeling sick every day, IDK.
CJ
I'm still pretty early but I found that need for stimulation has pretty much left me. A big +1 to what Joanne B said, that's my exact feeling as well.
I did not work on feeling that way or trying to get rid of that need for stimulation, it just happened on its own but its been great and flowed into my life in other ways.
For example, now I eat smaller portions and healthier food. I also buy less. I just don't chase the gratification, so I have more money and lost weight. Again, no conscious effort, it seems to be a side affect of getting sober.
Maybe its a side effect of not feeling sick every day, IDK.
CJ
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 17
Jeepers, you guys gave me a lot to work with.
The mindfulness is something I need to start focusing on. Just like you guys were saying about allowing myself to just "be". I think that's been the hardest thing to work on because I want the good things now and I want to forget the bad.
Today I joined a gym and because I wanted to go into it with the mindset that obviously I'm not going to be ripped and have my weight gone today. Before I had the whole "what's the point" attitude about it because it seemed too hard to do. Just like quitting drinking.
With that I realized I have never worked on anything and that I've been distracting myself like you guys have mentioned. Distracting myself from actually trying to achieve the things I want with alcohol and other things like music, film, video games, etc. Which the last three are acceptable past times, but I'm constantly seeking them to keep myself entertained, which takes away from working on myself and focusing if that makes sense.
Also the concept of "future me" is what is kind of driving it. Before it was the "now now now" and that version of myself didn't get me anywhere.
The mindfulness is something I need to start focusing on. Just like you guys were saying about allowing myself to just "be". I think that's been the hardest thing to work on because I want the good things now and I want to forget the bad.
Today I joined a gym and because I wanted to go into it with the mindset that obviously I'm not going to be ripped and have my weight gone today. Before I had the whole "what's the point" attitude about it because it seemed too hard to do. Just like quitting drinking.
With that I realized I have never worked on anything and that I've been distracting myself like you guys have mentioned. Distracting myself from actually trying to achieve the things I want with alcohol and other things like music, film, video games, etc. Which the last three are acceptable past times, but I'm constantly seeking them to keep myself entertained, which takes away from working on myself and focusing if that makes sense.
Also the concept of "future me" is what is kind of driving it. Before it was the "now now now" and that version of myself didn't get me anywhere.
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Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 2,872
I just joined a gym, too. It's a great way to release some energy and is a great stress reliever. Plus, the obvious benefits of helping the health.
It is hard for me to go, too. I've become inherently lazy. I force myself to go, and take baby steps there, just like I did when I quit drinking.
I'm with you, I'm not going to be ripped or lose the weight right away but I'm already reaping the benefits in just a month.
I think you're sounding great. You've realized a problem and you're doing something about it.
Take it easy on yourself, Jack, Rome wasn't built in a day.
It is hard for me to go, too. I've become inherently lazy. I force myself to go, and take baby steps there, just like I did when I quit drinking.
I'm with you, I'm not going to be ripped or lose the weight right away but I'm already reaping the benefits in just a month.
I think you're sounding great. You've realized a problem and you're doing something about it.
Take it easy on yourself, Jack, Rome wasn't built in a day.
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