anxiety and panic
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anxiety and panic
this morning while on a phone call with the bank about a refi i was worried about what they wanted to speak to me about. I started to panic and hyper ventalate while waiting for this guy to spit it out. In the whole scheme of things its really not that big of a deal but then i proceded to start shaking and could barely hold the phone etc.. I have not had a drink in over 4 years!!
Just discouraging that here I am 4 years sober still having moments like these. Now i'm trying to calm my nerves back down. I'll be fine its no big deal but just discouraging..
There was a time i could handle a call like this like it was nothing. cause really all it was was oh we still need you to do this and this ok no biggie but i paniced over this?
*sigh*
Just discouraging that here I am 4 years sober still having moments like these. Now i'm trying to calm my nerves back down. I'll be fine its no big deal but just discouraging..
There was a time i could handle a call like this like it was nothing. cause really all it was was oh we still need you to do this and this ok no biggie but i paniced over this?
*sigh*
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I know the feeling ZJW. I'm several years in too and my anxiety still kicks into high gear now and then, it did again just a week or so ago for no apparent reason. I have found that accepting my anxiety for what it is, and treating it as a completely separate issue has helped a lot. For a long time I thought that since I quit drinking, the anxiety should eventually just "go away". But it never did and i finally realized that I needed to treat it accordingly. Have you ever done so with a therapist?
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Well, some of us are simply anxiety-prone, drinking or not. We drink to self-medicate, and in the long run it makes it much worse... I am definitely one and I very much relate to your post. So quitting alcohol helps tons, but will certainly not resolve it as the problem was there to start with and is unlikely to go away magically. I am with Scott's question: what sorts of healthy treatments and interventions have you tried? There are so many things one can do for anxiety, both as self help strategies and getting external help for it.
For me, it includes simply just accepting that I have anxiety that comes and goes and that it's biochemical fluctuations in my brain, not caused by external events mostly. This kind of acceptance and view really helps me to not freak out in many situations. And sometimes we just need to go with the flow and handle it, in my experience it comes in waves and always dissipates after a while -- a bit like cravings for alcohol in early sobriety. One of the worst "strategies" to deal with anxiety for me is to allow me to put things on hold, procrastinate, shy away from tackling tasks and problems head-on. That way I only exacerbate it for myself and the intrinsic, biological predisposition becomes situational as well, accumulates and drives me crazy. Often what works best is to break down initially frightening tasks into smaller fragments and deal with them step-by-step. Make sure that I do some of this on a daily basis really tends to help keep a peace of mind, and also not beating up myself when I occasionally do not succeed. I know that you already live quite a healthy lifestyle (eat well, exercise etc) so I am not getting into that area. For me it's all about trying to find a balanced combination of consistent action, relaxation, and supportive, good relationships. Many people also benefit from medication -- I personally choose not to take anything because I don't think my issue is severe enough and would merit that sort of intervention, but it can be a life saver for some. So many options!
For me, it includes simply just accepting that I have anxiety that comes and goes and that it's biochemical fluctuations in my brain, not caused by external events mostly. This kind of acceptance and view really helps me to not freak out in many situations. And sometimes we just need to go with the flow and handle it, in my experience it comes in waves and always dissipates after a while -- a bit like cravings for alcohol in early sobriety. One of the worst "strategies" to deal with anxiety for me is to allow me to put things on hold, procrastinate, shy away from tackling tasks and problems head-on. That way I only exacerbate it for myself and the intrinsic, biological predisposition becomes situational as well, accumulates and drives me crazy. Often what works best is to break down initially frightening tasks into smaller fragments and deal with them step-by-step. Make sure that I do some of this on a daily basis really tends to help keep a peace of mind, and also not beating up myself when I occasionally do not succeed. I know that you already live quite a healthy lifestyle (eat well, exercise etc) so I am not getting into that area. For me it's all about trying to find a balanced combination of consistent action, relaxation, and supportive, good relationships. Many people also benefit from medication -- I personally choose not to take anything because I don't think my issue is severe enough and would merit that sort of intervention, but it can be a life saver for some. So many options!
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Originally Posted by ScottFromWI 
I know the feeling ZJW. I'm several years in too and my anxiety still kicks into high gear now and then, it did again just a week or so ago for no apparent reason. I have found that accepting my anxiety for what it is, and treating it as a completely separate issue has helped a lot. For a long time I thought that since I quit drinking, the anxiety should eventually just "go away". But it never did and i finally realized that I needed to treat it accordingly. Have you ever done so with a therapist?
No I have not seen a therapist for so many reasons. Mainly i feel as if I"ve exhausted every option that doesnt involve meds. I still explore new options and such and work with what i've learned to help me cope etc..
I feel like a therapist wouldnt do much more then offer meds. and believe me some days meds are DANG tempting. but I dont want to end up dependant on them or worse addicted etc..
I do notice that I have lots of socialization issues. and probems interacting with others. Its to long to write about here but I'm aware that I do now relate with others in say a normal fashion all the time. I think this can lead to issues for me. I'm aware of this and just continually try and work on it etc..
one day i'll get there I dunno. or it could just be something I have to deal with all my days.
I'm ok with it. But it can be frustratinga nd even debilitating at times.
One example of how its knocked me down a notch or 10 is how i work in the corporate world. I have a difficult time managing work and anxiety if that makes any sense. I'm not as productive as I could be because its like 1 hour of work requires 1 hour of calm my nerves that sort of thing.
I know going forward a new line of work will probably help me out. But untill then I make due.
I'll be alright but it was pretty intense today and that got me off guard.
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Exactly what Scott said about treating it as a separate issue I still get panic attacks they are really annoying and I'm treating mine with guided self help therapy and reading up on it I have started to set myself goals as part of therapy I'm actually waiting on a call now about it
Therapy is a good option
Therapy is a good option
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Originally Posted by zjw
I feel like a therapist wouldnt do much more then offer meds. and believe me some days meds are DANG tempting. but I dont want to end up dependant on them or worse addicted etc..
My therapist has been very helpful and most of what I've done has been talk therapy and I'm also utilizing mindfulness/meditation. It's very helpful - so if you have the means, don't rule it out as an option until you've tried it.
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I second Scott again. Some therapists are more into suggesting medical interventions even if they are not qualified to prescribe, but that's not the function of talk therapy. There are also many different approaches professionals use and that one can explore.
I had this experience myself: there was a therapist I saw only twice and it was clear to me he wasn't one I wanted to work with. Then I was seeing someone for ~a year who had quite a few genuine similarities in thinking and behavior to myself (why the initial appeal), we had many terrific conversations and he was very helpful with some issues involving practical things, but seeing him did not have a positive effect on my anxiety level, actually sometimes made it worse and this did not change over time. Which was interesting to investigate why, but at some point I did not feel it was beneficial anymore and I wanted to work in a different way that he was not very good at (and probably qualified for), so I looked for one that was clearly interested in what I wanted. And bumm, magic happens
I actually looked at my current therapist in the first place as well, but back then he did not seem the most interesting, I think I needed that "intermediate" step as an experience, it's been definitely a process. My current therapist is quite on the anti-med side, I think coming from his own personal experience with psych meds, and pills are definitely not the first interventions he tends to suggest to someone.
You mention problems with socialization and interactions -- well certain forms of therapy are kinda designed to put such issues under the microscope and use the therapeutic relationship to investigate/improve interactions and how we relate to others, others are less interested in/focused on this. I see all this similarly to recovery in general: each person needs to find what works best for us.
I had this experience myself: there was a therapist I saw only twice and it was clear to me he wasn't one I wanted to work with. Then I was seeing someone for ~a year who had quite a few genuine similarities in thinking and behavior to myself (why the initial appeal), we had many terrific conversations and he was very helpful with some issues involving practical things, but seeing him did not have a positive effect on my anxiety level, actually sometimes made it worse and this did not change over time. Which was interesting to investigate why, but at some point I did not feel it was beneficial anymore and I wanted to work in a different way that he was not very good at (and probably qualified for), so I looked for one that was clearly interested in what I wanted. And bumm, magic happens
I actually looked at my current therapist in the first place as well, but back then he did not seem the most interesting, I think I needed that "intermediate" step as an experience, it's been definitely a process. My current therapist is quite on the anti-med side, I think coming from his own personal experience with psych meds, and pills are definitely not the first interventions he tends to suggest to someone. You mention problems with socialization and interactions -- well certain forms of therapy are kinda designed to put such issues under the microscope and use the therapeutic relationship to investigate/improve interactions and how we relate to others, others are less interested in/focused on this. I see all this similarly to recovery in general: each person needs to find what works best for us.
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thanks just dont see myself seeing a therapist at this point. everytime i think about it i opt against it. I read a lot of books and participate here and elsewhere.
Some times I think its a lack of trust issue. I also dont feel like rehashin a bunch of stuff to a therapist only to find out down the road that this therapist isnt working out for me etc..
I dunno i've had bad luck with doctors in general. Go to one get misdiagnosed or not helped or told to take meds when simple dietary changes will do etc..
I know it shouldnt be that difficult to get medical care but sadly it is anymore. thats just the tip of the iceburg too.
Ok i'm ranting at this point lol. I"m going to keep doing what i'm doing my anxiety and panic is much better then it used to be and I have ways to manage it. its just going to take time is all. I'm ok with that.
Some times I think its a lack of trust issue. I also dont feel like rehashin a bunch of stuff to a therapist only to find out down the road that this therapist isnt working out for me etc..
I dunno i've had bad luck with doctors in general. Go to one get misdiagnosed or not helped or told to take meds when simple dietary changes will do etc..
I know it shouldnt be that difficult to get medical care but sadly it is anymore. thats just the tip of the iceburg too.
Ok i'm ranting at this point lol. I"m going to keep doing what i'm doing my anxiety and panic is much better then it used to be and I have ways to manage it. its just going to take time is all. I'm ok with that.
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Originally Posted by zjw
thanks just dont see myself seeing a therapist at this point. everytime i think about it i opt against it. I read a lot of books and participate here and elsewhere.
Some times I think its a lack of trust issue. I also dont feel like rehashin a bunch of stuff to a therapist only to find out down the road that this therapist isnt working out for me etc..
I dunno i've had bad luck with doctors in general. Go to one get misdiagnosed or not helped or told to take meds when simple dietary changes will do etc..
I know it shouldnt be that difficult to get medical care but sadly it is anymore. thats just the tip of the iceburg too.
Ok i'm ranting at this point lol. I"m going to keep doing what i'm doing my anxiety and panic is much better then it used to be and I have ways to manage it. its just going to take time is all. I'm ok with that.
Some times I think its a lack of trust issue. I also dont feel like rehashin a bunch of stuff to a therapist only to find out down the road that this therapist isnt working out for me etc..
I dunno i've had bad luck with doctors in general. Go to one get misdiagnosed or not helped or told to take meds when simple dietary changes will do etc..
I know it shouldnt be that difficult to get medical care but sadly it is anymore. thats just the tip of the iceburg too.
Ok i'm ranting at this point lol. I"m going to keep doing what i'm doing my anxiety and panic is much better then it used to be and I have ways to manage it. its just going to take time is all. I'm ok with that.
You might want to look into some self help books on mindfulness and meditation - that has really helped me out a lot and it's something I can do on my own.
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Okay, guys. Z has said he's not into therapy. Give it a rest.
I agree that some people are not going to benefit from talk therapy. If he's not into it, let it go. Z has come a very long way and he has his own journey to make in the way that suits him. I think someone who has severe social anxiety needs some other approach. No way I would go to a therapist - and it's not because of social anxiety. I know myself - and only I know myself, I have it within myself to heal what is wrong - when I am ready.
*and, breathe*
A hobby is what makes sense to me. A way to meet people in a non-threatening way and who share interests. Or even volunteering. When I volunteered in animal care, I met a lot of people who were out and enjoying life. Volunteering in animal care allows for gentle social interaction without negative consequences. Added benefit, animals are very therapeutic
I agree that some people are not going to benefit from talk therapy. If he's not into it, let it go. Z has come a very long way and he has his own journey to make in the way that suits him. I think someone who has severe social anxiety needs some other approach. No way I would go to a therapist - and it's not because of social anxiety. I know myself - and only I know myself, I have it within myself to heal what is wrong - when I am ready.
*and, breathe*
A hobby is what makes sense to me. A way to meet people in a non-threatening way and who share interests. Or even volunteering. When I volunteered in animal care, I met a lot of people who were out and enjoying life. Volunteering in animal care allows for gentle social interaction without negative consequences. Added benefit, animals are very therapeutic
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Originally Posted by biminiblue
Okay, guys. Z has said he's not into therapy. Give it a rest.
I've also provided some alternatives I have used ( outside of therapy ). ZJW is perfectly capable of taking or leaving advice as needed.
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lol no i get the therapy approach. I think if the time is right i'll do it. I think the time just hasnt been right yet. years ago i did it it never got me anywhere but more trouble really. So I do have a bit of a sour taste in my mouth about it as well.
the cost is an obstacle. But I know i'd figure a way to make it happen if i felt real good about the choice. for example I'm going to see a chiropracter now about some other issues after vehimatly being agasint the idea for I dunno 2 years that my wifes told me "maybe you should see a chiropractor!" I finally am giving in to the idea because I have the money at the moment. and if it will really truely help me get over this pain and take my running to the next level I'm gonna shovel out the money for it. I have a feeling he's going to tell me sorry this is just how your made too bad. BUT i read a book about a guy with a very simlier issue to mine and a couple trips to the chiropractor and he was running ultra's so maybe it'll work.
As far as a hobby goes or volunteering goes. I do what i can when i can. I'm really terrible about socializing and really bad about raising my hand to volunteer. Thats not to say i wont contribute I will and do but how do i put it ... it has to feel right for me to jump on it. For example a few weeks ago after thinking it over for I dunno years? i talked to one local farmer and asked if i could help them harvest or plant or whatever. why? I wanna be out there. I wanna help I wanna learn and well I like dirt! I garden a lot and a dream of mine is to own my own farm one day so I feel like this is a good step for me. even if i only help them a few times I'm sure it'll be rewarding.
the cost is an obstacle. But I know i'd figure a way to make it happen if i felt real good about the choice. for example I'm going to see a chiropracter now about some other issues after vehimatly being agasint the idea for I dunno 2 years that my wifes told me "maybe you should see a chiropractor!" I finally am giving in to the idea because I have the money at the moment. and if it will really truely help me get over this pain and take my running to the next level I'm gonna shovel out the money for it. I have a feeling he's going to tell me sorry this is just how your made too bad. BUT i read a book about a guy with a very simlier issue to mine and a couple trips to the chiropractor and he was running ultra's so maybe it'll work.
As far as a hobby goes or volunteering goes. I do what i can when i can. I'm really terrible about socializing and really bad about raising my hand to volunteer. Thats not to say i wont contribute I will and do but how do i put it ... it has to feel right for me to jump on it. For example a few weeks ago after thinking it over for I dunno years? i talked to one local farmer and asked if i could help them harvest or plant or whatever. why? I wanna be out there. I wanna help I wanna learn and well I like dirt! I garden a lot and a dream of mine is to own my own farm one day so I feel like this is a good step for me. even if i only help them a few times I'm sure it'll be rewarding.
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Originally Posted by soberwolf
Bim in agoraphobic and have have anxiety issues no one was pressuring zjw to see a therapist ?
It's not like you bim to be so rude ?
It's not like you bim to be so rude ?
My gripe is i put it here to see what others thoughts are not to get suggestions of therapy tho I do appreciate those as well.
I'm ok I know everyone means well its not a big deal. I dont think bim was being rude at least from my perspective anyhow.
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Originally Posted by zjw
As far as a hobby goes or volunteering goes. I do what i can when i can. I'm really terrible about socializing and really bad about raising my hand to volunteer. Thats not to say i wont contribute I will and do but how do i put it ... it has to feel right for me to jump on it. For example a few weeks ago after thinking it over for I dunno years? i talked to one local farmer and asked if i could help them harvest or plant or whatever. why? I wanna be out there. I wanna help I wanna learn and well I like dirt! I garden a lot and a dream of mine is to own my own farm one day so I feel like this is a good step for me. even if i only help them a few times I'm sure it'll be rewarding.
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It's funny (well...): I had a small medical procedure last week, and the anxiety knocked me off my socks for 3 days afterwards. And then I was beating myself up a bit for still being so vulnerable after 3 years plus...
So I'm watching this thread. Oh yes!
So I'm watching this thread. Oh yes!
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Originally Posted by ChiefBromden
It's funny (well...): I had a small medical procedure last week, and the anxiety knocked me off my socks for 3 days afterwards. And then I was beating myself up a bit for still being so vulnerable after 3 years plus...
So I'm watching this thread. Oh yes!
So I'm watching this thread. Oh yes!
ok no problem I won on sat. but then today BAM this.
Its that right there in that moment and your scrambling for your toolbox to combat it before it gets any worse sorta thing.
and while iw as trying to calm myself I missed the opportunity to score a few points in the discussion per say becuase i was busy trying to calm myself rather then remaning focused on the topic at hand.
I'm terrible at multi tasking!
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Are you familiar with what's often called a "Farm Stay"? Many people like it for a little vacation. One of my colleagues is actually doing a form of it this week. I also did a few times in Europe, it was indeed very peaceful, relaxing, and actually also quite cheap as a break.
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Originally Posted by Aellyce
Are you familiar with what's often called a "Farm Stay"? Many people like it for a little vacation. One of my colleagues is actually doing a form of it this week. I also did a few times in Europe, it was indeed very peaceful, relaxing, and actually also quite cheap as a break.
there is another farm south of me the guy offers some programs to teach people. I know a lot of what he's doing as is but I'm sure i could benefit from the hands on stuff he has. But he's about 6 hours away so its tough for me to figure out how to fit this in.
I got a few things like this on my list. Like i said its a dream of mind to own a farm. I'm not sure how to get from point A to point B but in the mean time I'm learning all I can etc.. I figure If i just work in that direction i'll get there sooner or later.
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something about farming and such. i have a large garden. now I dunno if anyones seen the movie field of dreams how he steps on that field and its like a whole new ballgame etc..
thats how it is for me. I step into my garden and bam inner peace i'm in another realhm of sorts. I could learn all i need to know about life just by sitting in my garden and watching what goes on.
thats how it is for me. I step into my garden and bam inner peace i'm in another realhm of sorts. I could learn all i need to know about life just by sitting in my garden and watching what goes on.
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